June 2016 - DeTomaso - detomasolist.com

Sider marker lens needed
by B Hower 02 Jun '16

02 Jun '16

Anyone have a right rear side marker lens they would part with? If so please contact me off line. I see I have one missing from Lolita. Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not be ! ) Anyone have a right rear side marker lens they would part with? If so please contact me off line. I see I have one missing from Lolita. Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not be ! )

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Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side?
by Tomas Gunnarsson 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

You have me a little confused here with "RH thread on the right/driver side and a LH thread on the left/pax side# :-D Tomas <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> From: Guido deTomaso [guido_detomaso(a)prodigy.net] Sent: 29/5/2016 10:38:21 PM To: guson@home.se;MikeLDrew@aol.com Cc: detomaso(a)detomasolist.com Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? "I'm pretty sure it's the other way around. Left side of the car, RH thread." Don't go all Jack DeRyke on me, lest I put a video on YouTube, I've got the VW hardware at my fingertips. Visualize the front wheel bearing following the wheel on the left side of the car viewed from the rear, a LH thread tightens if the nut follows the wheel and spinning bearing. This would only come into play only after successive prior failures, that was the analogy to the axle nut. Similarly I believe the handed Pantera axle nut would only serve a purpose if the spline were to fail and the drive flange spun about the axle, that would tighten the axle nut on both sides if there's a RH thread on the right/driver side and a LH thread on the left/pax side. I do not believe there is any self-tightening effect at work on the Pantera axle nut(s), but am open to other ideas ( not momentum ) Thanks, GD _____ From: Tomas Gunnarsson <guson(a)home.se> To: MikeLDrew(a)aol.com Cc: detomaso(a)detomasolist.com Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2016 3:01 PM Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? I should have said: My bad, I didn't follow the thread from the start and replied to an off subject piece of info. Tomas I was replying to Guidos post that read: Witness every VW and Porsche I'm aware of, they put a LH thread on the left side front spindle. I was not clear on that I admit. Tomas <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> From: Mike Drew [ MikeLDrew(a)aol.com <mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com> ] Sent: 28/5/2016 11:23:00 PM To: guson(a)home.se <mailto:guson@home.se> Cc: forestg(a)att.net <mailto:forestg@att.net> ; detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? Tomas, Uh, no, we're not. Remember I'm the guy that started the thread by asking the question in the first place. We are talking about the axles. There are no axles in the front, only spindles. :) Mike Sent from my iPhone On May 28, 2016, at 13:23, "Tomas Gunnarsson" < guson(a)home.se <mailto:guson@home.se> > wrote: > We're talking about front wheel bearing nuts here. > > Tomas > <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> > From: Forest Goodhart [ forestg(a)att.net <mailto:forestg@att.net> ] > Sent: 28/5/2016 3:34:04 AM > To: detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? > I do not think it matters which side the axle is on. I've worked on > cars with two lefts and also cars with two rights. Neither ever had any > issue with axle nuts coming loose, they are torqued to 360 lb/ft plus > or minus > From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso < detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> > > To: Tomas Gunnarsson < guson(a)home.se <mailto:guson@home.se> > > Cc: "< detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> >" < detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> > > Sent: Friday, May 27, 2016 5:36 PM > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? > Tomas, > You have to remove the driveshaft to see the nut.... > Mike > Sent from my iPhone > On May 27, 2016, at 15:51, "Tomas Gunnarsson" <[1] guson(a)home.se <mailto:guson@home.se> > > wrote: > I'll check next time my car has its wheels off! :-D > Tomas > <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> > From: Mike Drew [[2] MikeLDrew(a)aol.com <mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com> ] > Sent: 27/5/2016 9:43:52 PM > To: [3] guson(a)home.se <mailto:guson@home.se> > Cc: [4] guido_detomaso(a)prodigy.net <mailto:guido_detomaso@prodigy.net> ;[5] detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? > Tomas, > I started this thread and the overwhelming response is that the > original setup had the LH threads on the LH side of the car. I don't > really want to know why, just wanted to know what was done > originally.... > Cheers! > Mike > Sent from my iPad >> On May 27, 2016, at 12:35 PM, Tomas Gunnarsson <[6] guson(a)home.se <mailto:guson@home.se> > > wrote: >> >> I'm pretty sure it's the other way around. Left side of the car, RH >> thread. >> >> Tomas >> <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> >> From: Guido deTomaso [[7] guido_detomaso(a)prodigy.net <mailto:guido_detomaso@prodigy.net> ] >> Sent: 27/5/2016 8:23:20 PM >> To: > > [8] b.hower3400(a)yahoo.com <mailto:b.hower3400@yahoo.com> ;[9] vinh.d.ly(a)gmail.com <mailto:vinh.d.ly@gmail.com> ;[10] larrys@panteraparts <mailto:larrys@panteraparts> > .com >> Cc: [11] MikeLDrew(a)aol.com <mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com> ;[12] detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? >> Late to this party. >> Pretty hard to imagine skidding to a stop and having the left side > lug >> nuts spin off because of angular momentum, the hub stopped but the > lugs >> kept spinning. Similarly hard to imagine the lightweight Pantera > axle >> nut continuing to spin even if not tightened since it has a > friction >> feature. Any fastener tightened at all is going to produce enough >> friction to be impervious to angular momentum / angular velocity >> changes. >> The self-tightening phenomenon is somewhat easy to predict where >> there's a rotating load and a thread. A bicycle pedal is a good >> example, if you can visualize the weight of the rider's foot going >> around a loose thread, visualize the male thread of the pedal shaft >> "walking" around the female thread of the crank arm, you may be > able > to >> predict which side will be self-tightening with a LH thread. >> Similarly British car knock off caps, if the hubs are put on the > wrong >> side of the car, or the car is towed backwards, good chance the > wheels >> will fall off, hasn't happened to me but I've heard several 1st > person >> accounts. Again if you look at the weight of the car, visualize it >> walking around the thread, you can predict that the right side of > the >> car will get the LH thread. ( Hit the top of the knock off toward > the >> rear of the car to tighten ). LH threaded lug nuts, still used I >> believe on heavy-duty trucks, same principle. >> Other times reverse thread seems to be there only in case of >> catastrophe: Witness every VW and Porsche I'm aware of, they put a > LH >> thread on the left side front spindle. Now this has no weight on > the >> thread ... in order for the nut to want to turn, first the outside >> bearing would have to start spinning on the spindle, then the > d-shape >> washer would have to fail, and the cotter pin or clamping feature > would >> have to fail, ONLY THEN the reverse thread would save the day, > until >> the heat build up snaps the spindle anyway. >> On the Pantera ... I don't see any path for the weight of the car > to >> walk around the thread of the axle nut ... maybe it's there but I > can't >> see it. However if under acceleration the flange spline failed, the >> nuts would tighten if they followed the flange, yes ? Perhaps this > is >> the only reason for the handed thread in this application. >> Or so it seems to me, I could be wrong. >> GD >> From: B Hower via DeTomaso <[13] detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> > >> To: Vinh Ly <[14] vinh.d.ly(a)gmail.com <mailto:vinh.d.ly@gmail.com> >; Larry Stock >> <[15] larrys(a)panteraparts.com <mailto:larrys@panteraparts.com> > >> Cc: Mike Drew <[16] MikeLDrew(a)aol.com <mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com> >; > "[17] detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> " >> <[18] detomaso(a)detomasolist.com <mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com> > >> Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2016 12:44 PM >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? >> You would probably never notice a problem. >> Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not >> be >> ! ) >> __________________________________________________________________ >> From: Vinh Ly <[19]<a href="mailto:vinh.d.ly@gmail.com" ymailto="m<br><br>=== message truncated ===</font></td></tr></table></div> You have me a little confused here with "RH thread on the right/driver side and a LH thread on the left/pax side# :-D Tomas <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> From: Guido deTomaso [guido_detomaso(a)prodigy.net] Sent: 29/5/2016 10:38:21 PM To: guson@home.se;MikeLDrew@aol.com Cc: detomaso(a)detomasolist.com Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? "I'm pretty sure it's the other way around. Left side of the car, RH thread." Don't go all Jack DeRyke on me, lest I put a video on YouTube, I've got the VW hardware at my fingertips. Visualize the front wheel bearing following the wheel on the left side of the car viewed from the rear, a LH thread tightens if the nut follows the wheel and spinning bearing. This would only come into play only after successive prior failures, that was the analogy to the axle nut. Similarly I believe the handed Pantera axle nut would only serve a purpose if the spline were to fail and the drive flange spun about the axle, that would tighten the axle nut on both sides if there's a RH thread on the right/driver side and a LH thread on the left/pax side. I do not believe there is any self-tightening effect at work on the Pantera axle nut(s), but am open to other ideas ( not momentum ) Thanks, GD __________________________________________________________________ From: Tomas Gunnarsson <guson(a)home.se> To: MikeLDrew(a)aol.com Cc: detomaso(a)detomasolist.com Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2016 3:01 PM Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? I should have said: My bad, I didn't follow the thread from the start and replied to an off subject piece of info. Tomas I was replying to Guidos post that read: Witness every VW and Porsche I'm aware of, they put a LH thread on the left side front spindle. I was not clear on that I admit. Tomas <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> From: Mike Drew [[1]MikeLDrew(a)aol.com] Sent: 28/5/2016 11:23:00 PM To: [2]guson(a)home.se Cc: [3]forestg@att.net;[4]detomaso@detomasolist.com Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? Tomas, Uh, no, we're not. Remember I'm the guy that started the thread by asking the question in the first place. We are talking about the axles. There are no axles in the front, only spindles. :) Mike Sent from my iPhone On May 28, 2016, at 13:23, "Tomas Gunnarsson" <[5]guson(a)home.se> wrote: > We're talking about front wheel bearing nuts here. > > Tomas > <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> > From: Forest Goodhart [[6]forestg(a)att.net] > Sent: 28/5/2016 3:34:04 AM > To: [7]detomaso(a)detomasolist.com > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? > I do not think it matters which side the axle is on. I've worked on > cars with two lefts and also cars with two rights. Neither ever had any > issue with axle nuts coming loose, they are torqued to 360 lb/ft plus > or minus > From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[8]detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com> > To: Tomas Gunnarsson <[9]guson(a)home.se> > Cc: "<[10]detomaso(a)detomasolist.com>" <[11]detomaso(a)detomasolist.com> > Sent: Friday, May 27, 2016 5:36 PM > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? > Tomas, > You have to remove the driveshaft to see the nut.... > Mike > Sent from my iPhone > On May 27, 2016, at 15:51, "Tomas Gunnarsson" <[1][12]guson(a)home.se> > wrote: > I'll check next time my car has its wheels off! :-D > Tomas > <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> > From: Mike Drew [[2][13]MikeLDrew(a)aol.com] > Sent: 27/5/2016 9:43:52 PM > To: [3][14]guson(a)home.se > Cc: [4][15]guido_detomaso@prodigy.net;[5][16]detomaso@detomasolist.com > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? > Tomas, > I started this thread and the overwhelming response is that the > original setup had the LH threads on the LH side of the car. I don't > really want to know why, just wanted to know what was done > originally.... > Cheers! > Mike > Sent from my iPad >> On May 27, 2016, at 12:35 PM, Tomas Gunnarsson <[6][17]guson(a)home.se> > wrote: >> >> I'm pretty sure it's the other way around. Left side of the car, RH >> thread. >> >> Tomas >> <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> >> From: Guido deTomaso [[7][18]guido_detomaso(a)prodigy.net] >> Sent: 27/5/2016 8:23:20 PM >> To: > > [8][19]b.hower3400@yahoo.com;[9][20]vinh.d.ly@gmail.com;[10][21]larrys@ panteraparts > .com >> Cc: [11][22]MikeLDrew@aol.com;[12][23]detomaso@detomasolist.com >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? >> Late to this party. >> Pretty hard to imagine skidding to a stop and having the left side > lug >> nuts spin off because of angular momentum, the hub stopped but the > lugs >> kept spinning. Similarly hard to imagine the lightweight Pantera > axle >> nut continuing to spin even if not tightened since it has a > friction >> feature. Any fastener tightened at all is going to produce enough >> friction to be impervious to angular momentum / angular velocity >> changes. >> The self-tightening phenomenon is somewhat easy to predict where >> there's a rotating load and a thread. A bicycle pedal is a good >> example, if you can visualize the weight of the rider's foot going >> around a loose thread, visualize the male thread of the pedal shaft >> "walking" around the female thread of the crank arm, you may be > able > to >> predict which side will be self-tightening with a LH thread. >> Similarly British car knock off caps, if the hubs are put on the > wrong >> side of the car, or the car is towed backwards, good chance the > wheels >> will fall off, hasn't happened to me but I've heard several 1st > person >> accounts. Again if you look at the weight of the car, visualize it >> walking around the thread, you can predict that the right side of > the >> car will get the LH thread. ( Hit the top of the knock off toward > the >> rear of the car to tighten ). LH threaded lug nuts, still used I >> believe on heavy-duty trucks, same principle. >> Other times reverse thread seems to be there only in case of >> catastrophe: Witness every VW and Porsche I'm aware of, they put a > LH >> thread on the left side front spindle. Now this has no weight on > the >> thread ... in order for the nut to want to turn, first the outside >> bearing would have to start spinning on the spindle, then the > d-shape >> washer would have to fail, and the cotter pin or clamping feature > would >> have to fail, ONLY THEN the reverse thread would save the day, > until >> the heat build up snaps the spindle anyway. >> On the Pantera ... I don't see any path for the weight of the car > to >> walk around the thread of the axle nut ... maybe it's there but I > can't >> see it. However if under acceleration the flange spline failed, the >> nuts would tighten if they followed the flange, yes ? Perhaps this > is >> the only reason for the handed thread in this application. >> Or so it seems to me, I could be wrong. >> GD >> From: B Hower via DeTomaso <[13][24]detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com> >> To: Vinh Ly <[14][25]vinh.d.ly(a)gmail.com>; Larry Stock >> <[15][26]larrys(a)panteraparts.com> >> Cc: Mike Drew <[16][27]MikeLDrew(a)aol.com>; > "[17][28]detomaso(a)detomasolist.com" >> <[18][29]detomaso(a)detomasolist.com> >> Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2016 12:44 PM >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Which axles on which side? >> You would probably never notice a problem. >> Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not >> be >> ! ) >> __________________________________________________________________ >> From: Vinh Ly <[19]<a href="mailto:vinh.d.ly@gmail.com" ymailto="m<br><br>=== message truncated ===</font></td></tr></table></div> References 1. mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com 2. mailto:guson@home.se 3. mailto:forestg@att.net 4. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com 5. mailto:guson@home.se 6. mailto:forestg@att.net 7. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com 8. mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com 9. mailto:guson@home.se 10. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com 11. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com 12. mailto:guson@home.se 13. mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com 14. mailto:guson@home.se 15. mailto:guido_detomaso@prodigy.net 16. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com 17. mailto:guson@home.se 18. mailto:guido_detomaso@prodigy.net 19. mailto:b.hower3400@yahoo.com 20. mailto:vinh.d.ly@gmail.com 21. mailto:larrys@panteraparts 22. mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com 23. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com 24. mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com 25. mailto:vinh.d.ly@gmail.com 26. mailto:larrys@panteraparts.com 27. mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com 28. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com 29. mailto:detomaso@detomasolist.com

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Re: [DeTomaso] Fw: Fwd: BERLIN EXPRESS
by cengles＠cox.net 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

Dear Ken, Wonderful story and adventure for Capt Overstreet. Thanks for sharing. The painting of the 109 and the P51 under the Eiffel Tower is extraordinary and gripping. Warmest regards, Chuck Engles On Wed, Jun 1, 2016 at 4:30 PM, Ken Green via DeTomaso wrote: > I know this is old news that someone forwarded to me, but I bet this > guy would have enjoyed driving a Pantera: > > > > > > The fighter pilot who flew through the Eiffel Tower in 1944 has died. > > In the spring of 1944 Bill Overstreet and his P-51C, the 'Berlin > Express'were near Paris when the scene that is immortalized in > theartwork by Len Krenzler of Action Art that leads this articletook > place. Bill had followed a German Bf109 from thebombers he was > escorting when most of the Germanfighters left. The two planes had > been in a running dogfight. > The German pilot flew over Paris hoping that the heavy > German anti-aircraft artillery would solve his problem and > eliminate Overstreet and the 'Berlin Express', though Bill > managed to get some hits in at about 1500 feet. > The German's engine was hit, and Bill stayed on his tailbraving the > intense enemy flak. His desperation undoubtedlygrowing, the German > pilot aimed his plane at the Eiffel Towerand in a surprising maneuver, > flew beneath it. Undeterred, Bill followed right behind him, scoring > severalmore hits in the process. The German plane crashed andBill > escaped the heavy flak around Paris by flying low andfull throttle > over the river until he had cleared the city'sheavy anti-aircraft > batteries.WWII fighter pilot who flew THROUGH the Eiffel Tower to take > down aGerman plane dies in Virginia aged 92. William Overstreet Jr., > a former > captain in the U.S. Air Corps, passed away on Sunday at a hospital > inRoanoke, Virginia. > He famously flew his plane beneath the Eiffel Tower in > Nazi-occupiedParis in 1944, lifting the spirits of French troops on > the ground. > In 2009, he was presented France's Legion of Honor. > Hero: World War II > Aviator Bill Overstreet Jr., best known for flying beneath the > Eiffel Tower in pursuit of a German plane, is pictured in his > military days. Before the ceremony, Overstreet had previously said > that, if he lived long enoughto receive the Legion of Honor, he would > be accepting it in memory of his fallenbrothers. In particular, he > wanted to pay tribute to a friend, Eddy Simpson, whodied fighting the > Nazis on the ground so his comrades, including Overstreet,could > escape. > After the award was pinned to his lapel, Overstreet said:'If I said, > "Thank you," it wouldn't be enough,' before adding:'What more than > "thank you" do you need?' > He was born in Clifton Forge, Virginia in 1921 and after Pearl Harbor, > he > enlisted in the Air Corps as a fighter pilot. > By February 1942, he was a private and sent to California for flight > training; there, his instructors prepared him for the unexpected > mid-flight by cutting the engine as he landed. > > Aircraft: Overstreet is pictured by his P-51 'Berlin Express', the > plane he flew > beneath the Eiffel Tower. 'He was always humble. Whenever the press > interviewed him, he said,"I didn't do anything. We were a team".'RIP > Bill Overstreet. > GOD BLESS AMERICA > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > > Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes > DeTomaso mailing list > DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com > http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso > > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) > use the links above. > > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the > list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive > or approve the archiving of list messages.

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Fw: Fwd: BERLIN EXPRESS
by Ken Green 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

I know this is old news that someone forwarded to me, but I bet this guy would have enjoyed driving a Pantera: The fighter pilot who flew through the Eiffel Tower in 1944 has died. In the spring of 1944 Bill Overstreet and his P-51C, the 'Berlin Express'were near Paris when the scene that is immortalized in theartwork by Len Krenzler of Action Art that leads this articletook place. Bill had followed a German Bf109 from thebombers he was escorting when most of the Germanfighters left. The two planes had been in a running dogfight. The German pilot flew over Paris hoping that the heavy German anti-aircraft artillery would solve his problem and eliminate Overstreet and the 'Berlin Express', though Bill managed to get some hits in at about 1500 feet. The German's engine was hit, and Bill stayed on his tailbraving the intense enemy flak. His desperation undoubtedlygrowing, the German pilot aimed his plane at the Eiffel Towerand in a surprising maneuver, flew beneath it. Undeterred, Bill followed right behind him, scoring severalmore hits in the process. The German plane crashed andBill escaped the heavy flak around Paris by flying low andfull throttle over the river until he had cleared the city'sheavy anti-aircraft batteries.WWII fighter pilot who flew THROUGH the Eiffel Tower to take down aGerman plane dies in Virginia aged 92. William Overstreet Jr., a former captain in the U.S. Air Corps, passed away on Sunday at a hospital inRoanoke, Virginia. He famously flew his plane beneath the Eiffel Tower in Nazi-occupiedParis in 1944, lifting the spirits of French troops on the ground. In 2009, he was presented France's Legion of Honor. Hero: World War II Aviator Bill Overstreet Jr., best known for flying beneath the Eiffel Tower in pursuit of a German plane, is pictured in his military days. Before the ceremony, Overstreet had previously said that, if he lived long enoughto receive the Legion of Honor, he would be accepting it in memory of his fallenbrothers. In particular, he wanted to pay tribute to a friend, Eddy Simpson, whodied fighting the Nazis on the ground so his comrades, including Overstreet,could escape. After the award was pinned to his lapel, Overstreet said:'If I said, "Thank you," it wouldn't be enough,' before adding:'What more than "thank you" do you need?' He was born in Clifton Forge, Virginia in 1921 and after Pearl Harbor, he enlisted in the Air Corps as a fighter pilot. By February 1942, he was a private and sent to California for flight training; there, his instructors prepared him for the unexpected mid-flight by cutting the engine as he landed. Aircraft: Overstreet is pictured by his P-51 'Berlin Express', the plane he flew beneath the Eiffel Tower. 'He was always humble. Whenever the press interviewed him, he said,"I didn't do anything. We were a team".'RIP Bill Overstreet. GOD BLESS AMERICA I know this is old news that someone forwarded to me, but I bet this guy would have enjoyed driving a Pantera: The fighter pilot who flew through the Eiffel Tower in 1944 has died. In the spring of 1944 Bill Overstreet and his P-51C, the 'Berlin Express' were near Paris when the scene that is immortalized in the artwork by Len Krenzler of Action Art that leads this article took place. Bill had followed a German Bf109 from the bombers he was escorting when most of the German fighters left. The two planes had been in a running dogfight. The German pilot flew over Paris hoping that the heavy German anti-aircraft artillery would solve his problem and eliminate Overstreet and the 'Berlin Express', though Bill managed to get some hits in at about 1500 feet. The German's engine was hit, and Bill stayed on his tail braving the intense enemy flak. His desperation undoubtedly growing, the German pilot aimed his plane at the Eiffel Tower and in a surprising maneuver, flew beneath it. Undeterred, Bill followed right behind him, scoring several more hits in the process. The German plane crashed and Bill escaped the heavy flak around Paris by flying low and full throttle over the river until he had cleared the city's heavy anti-aircraft batteries. cid:1.757669496@web160605.mail.bf1.yahoo.com WWII fighter pilot who flew THROUGH the Eiffel Tower to take down a German plane dies in Virginia aged 92. William Overstreet Jr., a former captain in the U.S. Air Corps, passed away on Sunday at a hospital in Roanoke, Virginia. He famously flew his plane beneath the Eiffel Tower in Nazi-occupied Paris in 1944, lifting the spirits of French troops on the ground. In 2009, he was presented France's Legion of Honor. cid:2.757669496@web160605.mail.bf1.yahoo.com Hero: World War II Aviator Bill Overstreet Jr., best known for flying beneath the Eiffel Tower in pursuit of a German plane, is pictured in his military days. Before the ceremony, Overstreet had previously said that, if he lived long enough to receive the Legion of Honor, he would be accepting it in memory of his fallen brothers. In particular, he wanted to pay tribute to a friend, Eddy Simpson, who died fighting the Nazis on the ground so his comrades, including Overstreet, could escape. After the award was pinned to his lapel, Overstreet said: 'If I said, "Thank you," it wouldn't be enough,' before adding: 'What more than "thank you" do you need?' He was born in Clifton Forge, Virginia in 1921 and after Pearl Harbor, he enlisted in the Air Corps as a fighter pilot. By February 1942, he was a private and sent to California for flight training; there, his instructors prepared him for the unexpected mid-flight by cutting the engine as he landed. cid:4.757669496@web160605.mail.bf1.yahoo.com Aircraft: Overstreet is pictured by his P-51 'Berlin Express', the plane he flew beneath the Eiffel Tower. 'He was always humble. Whenever the press interviewed him, he said,"I didn't do anything. We were a team".' RIP Bill Overstreet. GOD BLESS AMERICA

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Thanks
by Joel Montero 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

I'm not sure who is responsible for recreating this Pantera List Serve, but whoever you are, THANK YOU! Joel Montero I'm not sure who is responsible for recreating this Pantera List Serve, but whoever you are, THANK YOU!A Joel Montero

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Re: [DeTomaso] Nice Pantera on Bring A Trailer on-line auction
by cengles＠cox.net 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

Dear Tom, Ah, I know that car. It is a good solid Pantera. To my knowledge, no problems. Warmest regards, Chuck Engles On Wed, Jun 1, 2016 at 8:58 AM, Tom Shinrock via DeTomaso wrote: > http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1972-detomaso-pantera-5/ > > > Tom > 5186 > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > > Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes > DeTomaso mailing list > DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com > http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso > > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) > use the links above. > > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the > list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive > or approve the archiving of list messages.

1 0

Re: [DeTomaso] Sider marker lens needed
by Tomas Gunnarsson 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

The lenses are the same side to side, the bezels are unique to each corner. Good to know if you get offered one from the "wrong" side. Tomas <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> From: B Hower via DeTomaso [detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com] Sent: 1/6/2016 5:46:01 AM To: detomaso(a)detomasolist.com Subject: [DeTomaso] Sider marker lens needed Anyone have a right rear side marker lens they would part with? If so please contact me off line. I see I have one missing from Lolita. Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not be ! ) The lenses are the same side to side, the bezels are unique to each corner. Good to know if you get offered one from the "wrong" side. Tomas <-----Ursprungligt Meddelande-----> From: B Hower via DeTomaso [detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com] Sent: 1/6/2016 5:46:01 AM To: detomaso(a)detomasolist.com Subject: [DeTomaso] Sider marker lens needed Anyone have a right rear side marker lens they would part with? If so please contact me off line. I see I have one missing from Lolita. Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not be ! )

1 0

Nice Pantera on Bring A Trailer on-line auction
by Tom Shinrock 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1972-detomaso-pantera-5/ Tom 5186 http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1972-detomaso-pantera-5/ Tom 5186

2 1

Pantera Palooza 2016 June 12!
by scottcouchman＠yahoo.com 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

Pantera Palooza 2016, the premier one-day deTomaso event of the year is Sunday, June 12th at Mason Regional Park in Irvine, California. Join us for a day in the sun, just a few short miles from the Pacific Ocean on the big grass lawn for a great day of cars, music, deTomaso book signing, the POCA Store, jewelry (yes ladies!) and much more! Registration is way ahead of last year and on pace for approximately 50 Panteras along with 4 Mangustas celebrating the 50th anniversary of the 'Goose! Pre-registration discounts for show entry and hot Mexican buffet continue through Memorial Day weekend. Free Coffee & Donuts, water, sodas and snacks for all, compliments of Team Pantera OC. If your Pantera can't make the Palooza this year, stop-by and enjoy the epic display of cars and join us for a picnic lunch on the lawn amongst these great cars. Spectators are free (OC Parks charges $5/carload to enter the park). Car Show Entry and Lunch Reservation form and more info is available at ocpanteras.com. Look forward to seeing you in two weeks at the Palooza!

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Re: [DeTomaso] POCA Membership Dues Analysis
by cengles＠cox.net 01 Jun '16

01 Jun '16

Dear Scott and Chris, I, too, agree. I am an anachronism. I tend towards internal combustion engines, manual transmissions, carburetors and paper media for *important* publications. Warmest regards, Chuck Engles On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 10:31 PM, Christopher Kimball wrote: > I agree! > > Sent from my Windows Phone > ________________________________ > From: scottcouchman(a)yahoo.com<mailto:scottcouchman@yahoo.com> > Sent: ‎5/‎31/‎2016 8:03 PM > To: Christopher Kimball<mailto:chrisvkimball@msn.com> > Cc: Effie Richards<mailto:erichards@zogob.sdcoxmail.com>; > fastgrandma<mailto:fastgrandma@aol.com>; > detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] POCA Membership Dues Analysis > > Christopher, we polled our Chapter members and only found one member > that wanted the newsletter by email. I'm a member of a Mustang Club > also. They distribute a printed copy of their newsletter at the > monthly meeting. If you don't attend the monthly general meeting, it > is posted to their website a month later. You can then read it on-line > or download it and print it yourself. I enjoy the hard copy I get at > the general meeting and read it pretty much front to back. But if I > miss the meeting, I never print out the PDF. Could I? Yes.....do I? > No. Sounds like maybe we're both old school, but our survey of members > showed we have lots of old school members. Scott > > > >> On May 30, 2016, at 7:51 AM, Christopher Kimball >> <chrisvkimball(a)msn.com> wrote: >> >> Although I agree online issues of the newsletter should be >> available, >> even the norm, I really prefer getting printed copies. I pass them >> along to a mechanic friend of mine. I know if I had to print them >> out >> myself I simply wouldn't do it. >> Thanks to the POCA board and leadership for helping to keep the >> club >> moving forward! >> Sincerely, >> Chris >> Sent from my Windows Phone >> >> __________________________________________________________________ >> >> From: [1]Effie Richards >> Sent: 5/29/2016 9:44 PM >> To: [2]fastgrandma >> Cc: [3]detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] POCA Membership Dues Analysis >> >> My husband, for one, does not "do" computer, which is why I become >> his >> voice! I would of course print for him, but what about when I'm not >> around any longer? Things happen... >> Sent from Effie's iPad >>> On May 29, 2016, at 7:19 PM, fastgrandma <fastgrandma(a)aol.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>> You have to realize that not everyone has a computer and some that >>> do >> absolutely do not want their Newsletter online. The Newsletter has >> been >> sent as a pdf to the Eruopeans and members in Canada for some time >> now >> but even there, a couple want paper copies and that should be their >> absolute right since that is the one thing that the club does for >> its >> members: the publications! >>> >>> At the Rally we heard from several who had various reasons for >> wanting printed publications only and it would be very wrong to >> deny >> that. Maybe those 'other' clubs might do that but that is a good >> reason >> to not belong to them. >>> >>> Judy >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Pantdino via DeTomaso <detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com> >>> To: erichards <erichards(a)zogob.sdcoxmail.com>; marshallgsmith >> <marshallgsmith(a)sbcglobal.net> >>> Cc: detomaso <detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com> >>> Sent: Sun, May 29, 2016 5:30 pm >>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] POCA Membership Dues Analysis >>> >>> I thought the newsletter was going to be online only (hence will be >>> color for free) , while only the Profiles will on paper and mailed. >>> No? >>> >>> >>> >>> I don't see why anyone would not renew their membership-- with all >> the >>> old publications online and an improved website the club has more to >>> offer than ever. >>> >>> >>> >>> Jim Oddie >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Effie Richards <erichards(a)zogob.sdcoxmail.com> >>> To: marshallgsmith <marshallgsmith(a)sbcglobal.net> >>> Cc: detomaso <detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com> >>> Sent: Sun, May 29, 2016 5:08 pm >>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] POCA Membership Dues Analysis >>> Well said Marshall! Many Kudos to Jack DeRyke from me too! We love >> your >>> work! >>> Sent from Effie's iPad >>>>> On May 29, 2016, at 4:05 PM, marshallgsmith >>>> <[1]marshallgsmith(a)sbcglobal.net> wrote: >>>> >>>> Now wait a minute Dick, what you write here is WAY too level-headed >>> for >>>> this forum! >>>> >>>> Who is this really?? >>>> >>>> All joking aside, I obtain multiple bids for every one of a >> 'number' >>> of >>>> projects that I need to conduct every year. If I found a company >> that >>>> could save me $8,000 a year on a particular project, I would have >>> felt >>>> like I won the lottery! >>>> >>>> Sure, every once in a while the new company who submitted the >> lowest >>>> bid does not do as good of a job of the old one but when that >>> happens, >>>> I go back to the next bid which sometimes was the same company I >> used >>>> previously and all is back to normal. >>>> >>>> $8,000 a year is an awful lot of money just to stay with the >> company >>>> that you have and had comfort with. >>>> >>>> The statement of adding color to the newsletter would of course >> cost >>> a >>>> bit more money but when you consider that we would be saving $8,000 >>> off >>>> the top, we have a touch more money to play with and the savings >>> would >>>> still be very sizable. >>>> >>>> Plus, if any car club newsletter in this country is worthy of >> several >>>> color pages, it absolutely would be Jack DeRyke's!! This club is >> and >>>> will be indebted to you forever Jack! Thanks for the wonderful work >>> you >>>> do to keep our colorful jalopies on the road!! >>>> >>>> Marshall >>>> >>>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone >>>> >>>> -------- Original message -------- >>>> From: Dick Koch <[2]redcatman74(a)gmail.com> >>>> Date: 05/29/2016 9:57 AM (GMT-08:00) >>>> To: Ed Mendez <[3]edducati(a)mac.com> >>>> Cc: [4]detomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] POCA Membership Dues Analysis >>>> Ed, thanks for the clarification of the misinformation and >>>> non-productive >>>> comments that have been made in recent weeks, many very personal >> and >>>> vindictive, and quite frankly detrimental to the club. >>>> It is good to have different points of view on club business. But >> to >>>> present one's point of view in a negative and personal manner, does >>>> nothing but diminish that person's potentially valued point, and >>> their >>>> persona in the eyes of others. >>>> From some of the comments made, it appears obvious to me that many >> of >>>> the >>>> detractors do not have much experience in running a business. And >>> make >>>> no >>>> mistake POCA is a business, albeit a non-profit one. To thrive, >> this >>>> club >>>> must not stand on it's laurels, but continue to enhance it's value >>> add >>>> to >>>> it's customers. >>>> As far as looking at the printer used for the production of the >>>> newsletter, >>>> for the board to not look for less expensive options, as with any >>> other >>>> expense, with better offerings, is irresponsible. >>>> I can only wonder what is going on behind the scenes that would >> have >>>> folks >>>> want to stay with a service provider that is noncompetitive and >>>> provides >>>> less for much more money. We have enough cronyism in our >> government. >>>> Hopefully that is not the case here, and there has been a reason >> for >>>> keeping a more expensive service that provides less. >>>> I won't bother to comment on the absurdity of continuing to mail >> the >>>> newsletter, that can be printed by anyone that is not to lazy to >> take >>>> 3 >>>> minutes to print it, since that may be construed as negative. >>>> As regards to a point Ed stated, the club is not run by one person. >>>> Each >>>> person on the board has a say, with a majority required to decide >> on >>>> every >>>> issue. Pointing ones frustration at one person is just that, >>> pointless. >>>> Items approved by the board, were "sold" to the board by a member >> of >>>> the >>>> board to the other members of the board, showing how approving that >>>> item >>>> would benefit the club member's experience, with the underlying >>>> financial >>>> implications outlined that would strengthen the clubs long term >>>> financial >>>> health. >>>> Constructive criticism is just that: criticism presented in a >>>> constructive >>>> manner, with negative comments of a personal nature irrelevant and >>>> therefore non-constructive. >>>> I for one think the new POCA board is doing a fantastic job, and to >>>> think >>>> they are doing their job for free. What a deal... >>>> By the way, if someone feels they want to get personal with their >>>> comments, >>>> take it out on me. I deserve it for letting 6831 sit idle with a >>> blown >>>> header gasket for years. >>>> Peace, fellow "cat" owners. >>>> Dick Koch - Atlanta >>>> Still one of the few remaining original Pantera owners still lucky >>>> enough >>>> to be on the sunny side of the grass. >>>>> On May 29, 2016 2:12 AM, "Ed Mendez" <[5]edducati(a)mac.com> wrote: >>>>> See below. >>>>> >>>>>> On 28/05/2016, at 11:53, Rod Kunishige >> <[6]rkunishige(a)hotmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> It is interesting that this President changed a generous grace >>>> period >>>>>> without notice. >>>>> >>>>> False it's in the bylaws and has been for some time now. Warning >> at >>>> 30 >>>>> days, at 60 days the membership expires, check the Fiat club, >>> Ferrari >>>> club, >>>>> Porsche club, they all have similar rules. >>>>>> >>>>>> The so-called "shortfall" is created in part by the $10 increased >>>>>> rebate to the chapters that was NOT requested in the first place. >>>> The >>>>>> return of this sum places the club at nearly breakeven. Simply, >>>> use >>>>>> the money to pay for our publication costs. >>>>> False - check your facts, the rebate was welcome by the majority >>>> chapter >>>>> presidents. >>>>> >>>>>> PROPOSED: $75 dues less $15 to chapters yields $60 to fund the >>>> $62.52 >>>>>> publication estimate per MS. >>>>> >>>>> That is true, and that is why we are trying to get competitive >>> quotes >>>> for >>>>> printing to try and save money. MS found a printer that is $8000 >> per >>>> year >>>>> cheaper than the one we are currently using. >>>>>> >>>>>> Our $100,000 reserve would easily fund the $2.52 per year. >>>> Carrying >>>>>> 853 members at $2.52 is $2,149.56 per year. Divide that into >>>> 100,000 >>>>>> means funding covers 46.5 YEARS. >>>>> False - check your facts, most non profits have two year reserve >> in >>>> the >>>>> bank, the Ferrari and Porsche clubs have $1,000,000 each in >> reserve. >>>> You >>>>> can google there income statements. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> OPINION: >>>>>> >>>>>> I do recognize that Mr. Shortt controls the Board by a 5 to 4 >> vote >>>> but >>>>>> there I think that this is a better solution than what MS has >>>>>> proposed. Finally, kudos goes to him for at least publishing the >>>>>> actions he intends to take so we may make positive suggestions >> for >>>>> >>>>> False, if you look at the meeting minutes of the BOD, most things >> we >>>> have >>>>> coated on have been either unanimous vote or close to it, in fact >>>> there >>>>> very few times it was 5-4. Again we vote in the best interest of >> the >>>> club >>>>> >>>>> This forum is supposed to be about DeTomaso, hence the name; and >>>> should >>>>> not be used for POCA bashing, it really makes us all look bad. If >>> you >>>> have >>>>> an issue talk with someone about your concern, preferably your >>>> chapter >>>>> president, they are your representative as in any organization. >> It's >>>> very >>>>> easy to simply pick up the phone instead of using this email list >> as >>>> a >>>>> podium for your disdain of MS. It's obvious, we get it. Please >> take >>>> it >>>>> offline. >>>>> >>>>> If you think you can do a better job than volunteer as I did, and >>>> many >>>>> others before me, and run for office. >>>>> >>>>> Kind regards >>>>> >>>>>> (Information taken from the Presidents Blog.) >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list >>>>>> [7]DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>>>>> [8]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>>>> >>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >>>> etc.) >>>>> use the links above. >>>>>> >>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to >> forward >>>> any >>>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the >>>> list. >>>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive >> or >>>> approve >>>>> the archiving of list messages. >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>>>> DeTomaso mailing list >>>>> [9]DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>>>> [10]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>>> >>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >>> etc.) >>>> use >>>>> the links above. >>>>> >>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward >>>> any >>>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the >>>> list. >>>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive >> or >>>> approve >>>>> the archiving of list messages. >>>> Ed, thanks for the clarification of the misinformation and >>>> non-productive comments that have been made in recent weeks, many >>>> very >>>> personal and vindictive, and quite frankly detrimental to the club. >>>> It is good to have different points of view on club business. But >> to >>>> present one's point of view in a negative and personalA manner, >>>> does >>>> nothing but diminish that person's potentially valued point, and >>>> their >>>> persona in the eyes of others. >>>> From some of the comments made, it appears obvious to me that many >>>> of >>>> the detractors do not have much experience in running a business. >>>> And >>>> make no mistake POCA is a business, albeit a non-profit one. To >>>> thrive, >>>> this club must not stand on it's laurels, but continue to enhance >>>> it's >>>> value add to it's customers. >>>> As far as looking at the printer used for the production of the >>>> newsletter, for the board to not look for less expensive options, >> as >>>> with any other expense, with better offerings, is irresponsible. >>>> I can only wonder what is going on behind the scenes that would >> have >>>> folks want to stay with a service provider that is noncompetitive >>>> and >>>> provides less for much more money.A We have enough cronyism in our >>>> government. Hopefully that is not the case here, and there has been >>>> a >>>> reason for keeping a more expensive service that provides less. >>>> I won't bother to comment on the absurdity of continuing to mail >> the >>>> newsletter, that can be printed by anyoneA that is not to lazy to >>>> take >>>> 3 minutes to print it, since that may be construed as negative. >>>> As regards to a point Ed stated, the club is not run by one >> person.A >>>> Each person on the board has a say, with a majority required to >>>> decide >>>> on every issue. Pointing ones frustration at one person is just >>>> that, >>>> pointless. >>>> Items approved by the board, were "sold" to the board by a member >> of >>>> the board to the other members of the board, showing how approving >>>> that >>>> item would benefit the club member's experience, with the >> underlying >>>> financial implications outlined that would strengthen the clubs >> long >>>> term financial health. >>>> Constructive criticism is just that: criticism presented in a >>>> constructive manner, with negative comments of a personal nature >>>> irrelevant and therefore non-constructive. >>>> I for one think the new POCA board is doing a fantastic job, and to >>>> think they are doing their job for free. What a deal... >>>> By the way, if someone feels they want to get personal with their >>>> comments, take it out on me.A I deserve it for letting 6831 sit >>>> idle >>>> with a blown header gasket for years. >>>> Peace, fellow "cat" owners. >>>> Dick Koch - Atlanta >>>> Still one of the few remaining original Pantera owners still lucky >>>> enough to be on the sunny side of the grass. >>>>> On May 29, 2016 2:12 AM, "Ed Mendez" <[1][11]edducati(a)mac.com> >>> wrote: >>>>> See below. >>>>> On 28/05/2016, at 11:53, Rod Kunishige >>>> <[2][12]rkunishige(a)hotmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> A It is interesting that this President changed a generous grace >>>> period >>>>> A without notice. >>>> False it's in the bylaws and has been for some time now. Warning >>>> at >>>> 30 days, at 60 days the membership expires, check the Fiat club, >>>> Ferrari club, Porsche club, they all have similar rules. >>>>> >>>>> A The so-called "shortfall" is created in part by the $10 >>>> increased >>>>> A rebate to the chapters that was NOT requested in the first >>>> place.A The >>>>> A return of this sum places the club at nearly breakeven.A >>>> Simply, use >>>>> A the money to pay for our publication costs. >>>> False - check your facts, the rebate was welcome by the majority >>>> chapter presidents. >>>>> A PROPOSED:A $75 dues less $15 to chapters yields $60 to fund >>>> the >>>> $62.52 >>>>> A publication estimate per MS. >>>> That is true, and that is why we are trying to get competitive >>>> quotes for printing to try and save money. MS found a printer that >>>> is $8000 per year cheaper than the one we are currently using. >>>>> >>>>> A Our $100,000 reserve would easily fund the $2.52 per year.A >>>> Carrying >>>>> A 853 members at $2.52 is $2,149.56 per year.A Divide that into >>>> 100,000 >>>>> A means funding covers 46.5 YEARS. >>>> False - check your facts, most non profits have two year reserve >>>> in >>>> the bank, the Ferrari and Porsche clubs have $1,000,000 each in >>>> reserve. You can google there income statements. >>>>> A OPINION: >>>>> >>>>> A I do recognize that Mr. Shortt controls the Board by a 5 to 4 >>>> vote but >>>>> A there I think that this is a better solution than what MS has >>>>> A proposed.A Finally, kudos goes to him for at least publishing >>>> the >>>>> A actions he intends to take so we may make positive suggestions >>>> for >>>> False, if you look at the meeting minutes of the BOD, most things >>>> we >>>> have coated on have been either unanimous vote or close to it, in >>>> fact there very few times it was 5-4. Again we vote in the best >>>> interest of the club >>>> This forum is supposed to be about DeTomaso, hence the name; and >>>> should not be used for POCA bashing, it really makes us all look >>>> bad. If you have an issue talk with someone about your concern, >>>> preferably your chapter president, they are your representative as >>>> in any organization. It's very easy to simply pick up the phone >>>> instead of using this email list as a podium for your disdain of >>>> MS. >>>> It's obvious, we get it. Please take it offline. >>>> If you think you can do a better job than volunteer as I did, and >>>> many others before me, and run for office. >>>> Kind regards >>>>> A (Information taken from the Presidents Blog.) >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>>>> DeTomaso mailing list >>>>> [3][13]DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>>>> [4][14]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>>> >>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >>>> etc.) use the links above. >>>>> >>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to >>>> forward >>>> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of >>>> the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an >>>> archive or approve the archiving of list messages. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>>> DeTomaso mailing list >>>> [5][15]DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>>> [6][16]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >>>> etc.) use the links above. >>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward >>>> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of >>>> the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an >>>> archive or approve the archiving of list messages. >>>> References >>>> 1. [17]mailto:edducati@mac.com >>>> 2. [18]mailto:rkunishige@hotmail.com >>>> 3. [19]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>>> 4. [20]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>> 5. [21]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>>> 6. [22]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>>> DeTomaso mailing list >>>> [23]DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>>> [24]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >> etc.) >>>> use the links above. >>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward >>> any >>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the >>>> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an >>> archive >>>> or approve the archiving of list messages. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> >>>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>>> DeTomaso mailing list >>>> [25]DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>>> [26]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>>> >>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >> etc.) >>> use the links above. >>>> >>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward >>> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of >> the >>> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an >> archive >>> or approve the archiving of list messages. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>> DeTomaso mailing list >>> [27]DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>> [28]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >>> etc.) >>> use the links above. >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward >> any >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the >>> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an >> archive >>> or approve the archiving of list messages. >>> >>> References >>> >>> 1. [4]mailto:marshallgsmith@sbcglobal.net >>> 2. [5]mailto:redcatman74@gmail.com >>> 3. [6]mailto:edducati@mac.com >>> 4. [7]mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 5. [8]mailto:edducati@mac.com >>> 6. [9]mailto:rkunishige@hotmail.com >>> 7. [10]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 8. [11]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 9. [12]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 10. [13]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 11. [14]mailto:edducati@mac.com >>> 12. [15]mailto:rkunishige@hotmail.com >>> 13. [16]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 14. [17]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 15. [18]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 16. [19]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 17. [20]mailto:edducati@mac.com? >>> 18. [21]mailto:rkunishige@hotmail.com? >>> 19. [22]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com? >>> 20. [23]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 21. [24]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com? >>> 22. [25]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 23. [26]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 24. [27]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 25. [28]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 26. [29]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> 27. [30]mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >>> 28. [31]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >>> DeTomaso mailing list >>> DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >>> [32]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>> >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, >>> etc.) >> use the links above. >>> >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward >> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of >> the >> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an >> archive >> or approve the archiving of list messages. >> >> References >> >> 1. mailto:erichards@zogob.sdcoxmail.com >> 2. mailto:fastgrandma@aol.com >> 3. mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 4. mailto:marshallgsmith@sbcglobal.net >> 5. mailto:redcatman74@gmail.com >> 6. mailto:edducati@mac.com >> 7. mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 8. mailto:edducati@mac.com >> 9. mailto:rkunishige@hotmail.com >> 10. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 12. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 14. mailto:edducati@mac.com >> 15. mailto:rkunishige@hotmail.com >> 16. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 17. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 18. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 19. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 20. mailto:edducati@mac.com? >> 21. mailto:rkunishige@hotmail.com? >> 22. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com? >> 23. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 24. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com? >> 25. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 26. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 27. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 28. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 29. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 30. mailto:DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com >> 31. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 32. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes >> DeTomaso mailing list >> DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com >> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) >> use the links above. >> >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward >> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of >> the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an >> archive or approve the archiving of list messages. > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > > Detomaso Forum NO LONGER Managed by POCA > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes > DeTomaso mailing list > DeTomaso(a)server.detomasolist.com > http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso > > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) > use the links above. > > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the > list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive > or approve the archiving of list messages.

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