[DeTomaso] Daytona Update
Steve Lisa
stevelisa at patentit.com
Sun Nov 6 21:34:44 EST 2022
Jack,
We didnt have time to add a tranny temp guage, so weuse temp tape on 3-4
locations on the gearbox and monitored them immediately after each
session. We will of course be adding a temp guage now, since we have time.
We are also considering gear oil levels. Because the fill hole is upside
down, we were too low when we ran at Road America. We added the cooler and
fans for Daytona, and filled it higher. It ran cool for testing before
Daytona, but we added some along the way during the Daytona test and Sprint
race days. There was not a drop in the overflow after our long run in the
first leg of the 24, but it did run hotter than the Sprint races. I am
not sure if the team added even more before the second run when it heated
up quickly and started to shift like crap within a few laps. So this could
be a combination of issues.
This whole engineering project has been interesting but expensive. Quaiffe
should have cut the gear correctly in the first place and put a proper fill
hole for the upside down configuration. We shouldn't be testing this by
failure while racing.
I will say, it shifted well for the first few days, much better than a ZF.
So, we are not giving up.
On Sun, Nov 6, 2022, 13:51 <jderyke at aol.com> wrote:
> Steve, years ago I was curious as to how hot the ZF was getting on long
> runs. so the next time the ZF was out, I drilled & tapped the cases on the
> right side (due to ring gear load direction) for a second temp sensor. Then
> I used a 3 position switch so the engine oil temp (left) ZF temp (rt side)
> or Off (center) could be checked on the fly with a single gauge.
>
> That said, don't write your Quaife off just yet. It sorta sounds like the
> tranny was maybe overfilled a bit during the usual before-event thrash?
> Don't know how you'd verify that at this late date.
> Cheers- J DeRyke (only at Daytona for the bike races)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steve Lisa <stevelisa at patentit.com>
> To: Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>
> Cc: MICHAEL DREW <mikeldrew at aol.com>; List DeTomaso Forum <
> detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Sent: Sat, Nov 5, 2022 6:36 pm
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Daytona Update
>
> Sorry guys, We are done.A A
> The Quaife started overheating on the second lap and I stopped on lap
> 6-7 when it started spewing tranny fluid out the overflow onto the rear
> window.A A
> We don't know enough to identify what changed between session 1 and
> session 2.A Our temp markers (we don't have a tranny temp gauge)
> indicated it got to 290 degrees during Tony's race, even though we have
> a huge cooler on it, then sat and heat soaked for 5 hours.A
> A Something changed in that period.A The gearbox was immediately
> difficult to shift and the decided not to shift at all.A A
> Sorry guys, we hoped to do better.A This is a bummer weekend.A
> We have a long trip home.A A
> We are done, I will let you know moreA
> Regards,A
> Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
> The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
> Email: SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
> Direct:A 480-442-0297
> [1]www.PatentIt.com
> Scottsdale OfficeA |A P:A 480.535.6656A |A A F:A 480.535.6628A
> |A A A:A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
> Chicago OfficeA |A P:A 312.752.4357A |A A F:A 312.896.5633A
> |A A A:A 55 E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
> This email is intended only for the recipient above and may contain
> confidential and privileged information. If you received this email in
> error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to me. Thank
> you.
>
> On Sat, Nov 5, 2022, 8:53 PM Asa Jay Laughton <[2]asajay at asajay.com>
> wrote:
>
> Thumbs up, glad to hear itas going well.
> AsaA Jay
> Sent via radio waves
> > On Nov 5, 2022, at 13:34, Steve Lisa <[3]stevelisa at patentit.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > i>>?A A Stage 1 done, started last and moved up a bit.AA Tony
> drove moderately
> >A A hard, turned our fastest lap of the weekend, we put in 5
> gallons at the
> >A A pit stop, and he finished moderately hard.AA We did 18 laps,
> and pumped
> >A A 8.5 gallons out when we were done.AA So, we didn't need to
> fuel.AA We
> >A A had 3.5 gallons left.AA So we will just pit and sit for our
> mandatory
> >A A three minutes.
> >A A Regards,A
> >A A Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
> >A A The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
> >A A Email: SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
> >A A Direct:A 480-442-0297
> >A A [1][4]www.PatentIt.com
> >A A Scottsdale OfficeA |A P:A 480.535.6656AA |A A F:A
> 480.535.6628A
> >A A |A A A:A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ
> 85260
> >A A Chicago OfficeA |A P:A 312.752.4357AA |A A F:A 312.896.5633A
> >A A |A A A:A 55 E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
> >A A This email is intended only for the recipient above and may
> contain
> >A A confidential and privileged information. If you received this
> email in
> >A A error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to
> me. Thank
> >A A you.
> >
> >A A On Sat, Nov 5, 2022, 3:10 PM Charles Engles
> <[2][5]cengles at cox.net> wrote:
> >
> >A A A Dear Steve,
> >A A A AA AA AA AA AA A Egad.AA Your predicament makes
> current vintage
> >A A A racing resemble a chess game!.AA Who knew it was so
> complicated?A
> >A A A AA AA AA AA AA A Good luck.
> >A A A AA AA AA AA AA AA AA AA AA AA AA AA AA AA
> Warmest regards, Chuck
> >A A A Engles
> >A A A -----Original Message-----
> >A A A From: DeTomaso
> [mailto:[3][6]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
> >A A A On Behalf Of Steve Lisa
> >A A A Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2022 8:33 AM
> >A A A To: Scott Couchman
> >A A A Cc: MICHAEL DREW; List DeTomaso Forum
> >A A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Daytona Update
> >A A A An interesting strategy issue came up.AA Our 19 gallon
> fuel cell
> >A A A actually (due to foam) only holds 18.5 gallons.AA We are
> burning
> >A A A "about" 1 gallon per lap on average through the first 5
> sessions of
> >A A A the weekend.AA And, at our race pace, we will run at.most
> 19 laps in
> >A A A a session (with no cautions etc).
> >A A A We have a mandatory 3 minute pit stop each leg of the
> 24-hour, and
> >A A A the driver has to get out of the car for fueling.AA There
> is about
> >A A A 40 seconds of pit lane "in-out" time, leaving about 2:20
> for driver
> >A A A to stop, exit, the crew to fuel, and the driver to get back
> in, belt
> >A A A up and get going.AA The Pantera is not set up for a dump
> can (as was
> >A A A not intended to run this 24-hour event).AA It's a very
> slow fuel.A
> >A A A Plus, the driver cant be getting in the car while the crew
> is
> >A A A fueling.AA Since I have issued at my age getting in over
> the driver
> >A A A bars and reaching belts etc., we figure I will need an
> extra 60-90
> >A A A seconds over the 3 minutes for an old fart like me to get
> out/back
> >A A A in the car and buckled up and going, in addition to fueling
> even a
> >A A A few gallons, plus pit in/out time. In short, we will lose
> the
> >A A A equivalent of average 4-5 seconds in average lap time for
> the
> >A A A session due to a pit stop over 3 minutes when I am driving.
> >A A A If we run our race pace, we will run 19.5 laps, surely
> running out
> >A A A of fuel if we don't add fuel at the stop.AA If we slow
> down 3
> >A A A seconds a lap we will run 18 laps, and we should make
> it.AA If we
> >A A A get a yellow, we are good.
> >A A A Our current decision is to run the first session at a
> reduced pace
> >A A A and not fuel it during the 3 minute stop, hopefully making
> it
> >A A A through with gas/car preservation mode.AA Then, we will
> see what gas
> >A A A we have left after the first session (if we don't run
> out).AA Even
> >A A A if we run out, we will lose at me at one lap ...less then
> screwing
> >A A A around with me getting in and out.
> >A A A But, our best guess is that we should make it, the car will
> be
> >A A A happier at the slower pace, and we will learn as we go,
> adjusting
> >A A A for the next three sessions if we continue to make it.
> >A A A On my son' Tony's stints, he can get in and out way faster
> than me,
> >A A A so we can cut him loose a bit and actually throw a few
> gallons in
> >A A A the car at the mandatory pit and not lose time.
> >A A A I guess that's another reason to go on a diet and start
> doing yoga.
> >A A A It's been fun trying to figure out last minute the move
> from the
> >A A A sprint races to the 24.
> >A A A The guys that finished this year at LeMans we're actually
> an
> >A A A inspiration for us moving the car to the 24.AA It was an
> amazing run
> >A A A for them.AA We hope to have good news tomorrow...
> >A A A Regards,
> >A A A Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
> >A A A The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
> >A A A Email: SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
> >A A A Direct: 480-442-0297
> >A A A [4][7]www.PatentIt.com
> >A A A Scottsdale Office | P: 480.535.6656AA |AA F:
> 480.535.6628AA |AA A:
> >A A A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
> >A A A Chicago Office | P: 312.752.4357AA |AA F: 312.896.5633AA
> |AA A: 55
> >A A A E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
> >A A A This email is intended only for the recipient above and may
> contain
> >A A A confidential and privileged information. If you received
> this email
> >A A A in error please destroy it and indicate such by return
> email to me.
> >A A A Thank you.
> >>A A A On Sat, Nov 5, 2022, 8:28 AM Scott Couchman via DeTomaso <
> >>A A A [5][8]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
> >> Mike, Thanks for setting the record straight, and congratulations
> >A A A to
> >> these winners!
> >>
> >>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 8:36 PM, MICHAEL DREW
> <[6][9]mikeldrew at aol.com>
> >A A A wrote:
> >>>
> >>> i>>?a|and in fact, these guys:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> came in FIRST IN CLASS at Le Mans Classic this year, in a
> >A A A factory
> >>> Gr4
> >> car.
> >>>
> >>> Since the event started in 2004, far more than half the Panteras
> >>> entered
> >> have finished each year, on average. So it is highly
> disrespectful
> >A A A of
> >> their collective efforts to claim that none have ever finished at
> >A A A all.
> >>>
> >>> Mike
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>
> >>>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 22:15, MICHAEL DREW
> <[7][10]mikeldrew at aol.com>
> >A A A wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> i>>?Scott,
> >>>>
> >>>> You need to pay more attention! Plenty of Panteras have
> >A A A finished at
> >>>> LMC
> >> including this year.
> >>>>
> >>>> Mike
> >>>>
> >>>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>>
> >>>>>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 18:24, Scott Couchman via DeTomaso <
> >> [8][11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> i>>?All the LeMans Classics Iave attended, as far as I know,
> >A A A no
> >>>>> Pantera
> >> has finished the entire event. I hope you have much better
> >A A A success!
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 1:03 PM, Mike & Elizabeth
> >>>>>>> <[9][12]mbefthomas2 at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> i>>?Good luck!AA Thanks for keeping us in the loop.
> >>>>>> Mike Thomas
> >>>>>> Panteras Northwest
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>>> From: DeTomaso
> <[10][13]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>
> >A A A On
> >>>>>> Behalf
> >> Of Steve Lisa
> >>>>>> Sent: Friday, November 4, 2022 10:50 AM
> >>>>>> To: List DeTomaso Forum
> >A A A <[11][14]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> >>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] Daytona Update
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> All,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We have called the Pantera up to run the 24-hour race, taking
> >A A A the
> >> place of the Panoz.AA We were having issues with the new Panoz
> >A A A motor,
> >> and the motor finally let fo.AA So, are here and going to run
> the
> >> Pantera in the Classic 24-hour instead.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The Pantera has already run 5 sessions this weekend in the
> >A A A HSR
> >>>>>> Sprint
> >> races, with it's fasted time at 2:11.5.AA Because we didn't run
> >A A A the
> >> qualifying events for the Classic 24-hour event we will be
> >A A A starting
> >> from the back of Group A (pre-73, early FIA Group 3 and 4 cars, I
> >> believe in the GTO class) for the Classic 24, which is fine for a
> >A A A long
> >> event.AA We will be driving conservatively with goal of
> finishing
> >A A A the event.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> In addition, Goodwood sent some reporters over from England
> >A A A to
> >>>>>> cover
> >> the Daytona event.AA They enjoyed seeing the Pantera race, and
> >A A A filmed
> >> the car on track and a fun 15 minute interview about the car.A
> >> Goodwood also mounted an in-car camera for the upcoming 24-hour
> >A A A race.A
> >> They are planning a short feature on the Pantera, which is really
> >A A A nice
> >> of them, but who knows if it will ever get done.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Anyway, I will post updates and results starting tomorrow.A
> >A A A There
> >>>>>> are
> >> six groups, so we rotate out every six hours (i.e., four one-hour
> >> races every six hours).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Fingers crossed.....we are asked a lot from the car.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Regards,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
> >>>>>> The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
> >>>>>> Email: SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
> >>>>>> Direct: 480-442-0297
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> [12][15]www.PatentIt.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Scottsdale Office | P: 480.535.6656AA |AA F: 480.535.6628A
> >A A A |AA A:
> >>>>>> 7689
> >> East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Chicago Office | P: 312.752.4357AA |AA F: 312.896.5633AA
> |A
> >A A A A: 55 E.
> >> Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> This email is intended only for the recipient above and may
> >>>>>> contain
> >> confidential and privileged information. If you received this
> >A A A email in
> >> error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to me.
> >A A A Thank you.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>
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> > References
> >
> >A A 1. [22]http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> >A A 2. mailto:[23]cengles at cox.net
> >A A 3. mailto:[24]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >A A 4. [25]http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> >A A 5. mailto:[26]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >A A 6. mailto:[27]mikeldrew at aol.com
> >A A 7. mailto:[28]mikeldrew at aol.com
> >A A 8. mailto:[29]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >A A 9. mailto:[30]mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
> >A 10. mailto:[31]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >A 11. mailto:[32]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >A 12. [33]http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> >A 13. mailto:[34]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >A 14. [35]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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> References
>
> 1. http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> 2. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
> 3. mailto:stevelisa at patentit.com
> 4. http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> 5. mailto:cengles at cox.net
> 6. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> 7. http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> 8. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 9. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
> 10. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
> 11. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 12. mailto:mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
> 13. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> 14. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 15. http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> 16. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 17. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> 18. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 19. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> 20. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 21. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> 22. http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> 23. mailto:cengles at cox.net
> 24. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> 25. http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> 26. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 27. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
> 28. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
> 29. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 30. mailto:mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
> 31. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> 32. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 33. http://www.PatentIt.com/ <http://www.patentit.com/>
> 34. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 35. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> 36. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 37. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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> 39. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> 40. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 41. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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-------------- next part --------------
Jack,
We didnt have time to add a tranny temp guage, so weuse temp tape on
3-4 locations on the gearbox and monitored them immediately after each
session.A We will of course be adding a temp guage now, since we have
time.
We are also considering gear oil levels.A Because the fill hole is
upside down, we were too low when we ran at Road America.A We added
the cooler and fans for Daytona, and filled it higher.A It ran cool
for testing before Daytona, but we added some along the way during the
Daytona test and Sprint race days. There was not a drop in the overflow
after our long run in the first leg of the 24, but it did run hotter
than the Sprint races.A A I am not sure if the team added even more
before the second run when it heated up quickly and started to shift
like crap within a few laps.A So this could be a combination of
issues.
This whole engineering project has been interesting but expensive.A
Quaiffe should have cut the gear correctly in the first place and put a
proper fill hole for the upside down configuration.A A We shouldn't be
testing this by failure while racing.A A
I will say, it shifted well for the first few days, much better than a
ZF.A So, we are not giving up.A A
On Sun, Nov 6, 2022, 13:51 <[1]jderyke at aol.com> wrote:
Steve, years ago I was curious as to how hot the ZF was getting on long
runs. so the next time the ZF was out, I drilled & tapped the cases on
the right side (due to ring gear load direction) for a second temp
sensor. Then I used a 3 position switch so the engine oil temp (left)
ZF temp (rt side) or Off (center) could be checked on the fly with a
single gauge.A
That said, don't write your Quaife off just yet. It sorta sounds like
the tranny was maybe overfilled a bit during the usual before-event
thrash? Don't know how you'd verify that at this late date.
Cheers- J DeRykeA (only at Daytona for the bike races)
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Lisa <[2]stevelisa at patentit.com>
To: Asa Jay Laughton <[3]asajay at asajay.com>
Cc: MICHAEL DREW <[4]mikeldrew at aol.com>; List DeTomaso Forum
<[5]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Sat, Nov 5, 2022 6:36 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Daytona Update
A Sorry guys, We are done.A A
A The Quaife started overheating on the second lap and I stopped on
lap
A 6-7 when it started spewing tranny fluid out the overflow onto the
rear
A window.AA A
A We don't know enough to identify what changed between session 1 and
A session 2.AA Our temp markers (we don't have a tranny temp gauge)
A indicated it got to 290 degrees during Tony's race, even though we
have
A a huge cooler on it, then sat and heat soaked for 5 hours.A
A A Something changed in that period.AA The gearbox was immediately
A difficult to shift and the decided not to shift at all.A A
A Sorry guys, we hoped to do better.AA This is a bummer weekend.A
A We have a long trip home.A A
A We are done, I will let you know moreA
A Regards,A
A Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
A The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
A Email: [6]SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
A Direct:A 480-442-0297
A [1][7]www.PatentIt.com
A Scottsdale OfficeA |A P:A 480.535.6656AA |A A F:A 480.535.6628A
A |A A A:A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
A Chicago OfficeA |A P:A 312.752.4357AA |A A F:A 312.896.5633A
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A This email is intended only for the recipient above and may contain
A confidential and privileged information. If you received this email
in
A error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to me.
Thank
A you.
A On Sat, Nov 5, 2022, 8:53 PM Asa Jay Laughton
<[2][8]asajay at asajay.com>
A wrote:
A A Thumbs up, glad to hear itas going well.
A A AsaAA Jay
A A Sent via radio waves
A A > On Nov 5, 2022, at 13:34, Steve Lisa
<[3][9]stevelisa at patentit.com>
A A wrote:
A A >
A A > i>>?AA A Stage 1 done, started last and moved up a bit.AAA
Tony
A A drove moderately
A A >AA A hard, turned our fastest lap of the weekend, we put in 5
A A gallons at the
A A >AA A pit stop, and he finished moderately hard.AAA We did 18
laps,
A A and pumped
A A >AA A 8.5 gallons out when we were done.AAA So, we didn't need
to
A A fuel.AAA We
A A >AA A had 3.5 gallons left.AAA So we will just pit and sit for
our
A A mandatory
A A >AA A three minutes.
A A >AA A Regards,A
A A >AA A Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
A A >AA A The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
A A >AA A Email: [10]SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
A A >AA A Direct:A 480-442-0297
A A >AA A [1][4][11]www.PatentIt.com
A A >AA A Scottsdale OfficeA |A P:A 480.535.6656AAA |A A F:A
A A 480.535.6628A
A A >AA A |A A A:A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ
A A 85260
A A >AA A Chicago OfficeA |A P:A 312.752.4357AAA |A A F:A
312.896.5633A
A A >AA A |A A A:A 55 E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL
60603
A A >AA A This email is intended only for the recipient above and
may
A A contain
A A >AA A confidential and privileged information. If you received
this
A A email in
A A >AA A error please destroy it and indicate such by return email
to
A A me. Thank
A A >AA A you.
A A >
A A >AA A On Sat, Nov 5, 2022, 3:10 PM Charles Engles
A A <[2][5][12]cengles at cox.net> wrote:
A A >
A A >AA AA A Dear Steve,
A A >AA AA A AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA A Egad.AAA Your predicament
makes
A A current vintage
A A >AA AA A racing resemble a chess game!.AAA Who knew it was so
A A complicated?A
A A >AA AA A AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA A Good luck.
A A >AA AA A AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA AAA
AAA AAA AA
A A Warmest regards, Chuck
A A >AA AA A Engles
A A >AA AA A -----Original Message-----
A A >AA AA A From: DeTomaso
A A [mailto:[3][6][13]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
A A >AA AA A On Behalf Of Steve Lisa
A A >AA AA A Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2022 8:33 AM
A A >AA AA A To: Scott Couchman
A A >AA AA A Cc: MICHAEL DREW; List DeTomaso Forum
A A >AA AA A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Daytona Update
A A >AA AA A An interesting strategy issue came up.AAA Our 19
gallon
A A fuel cell
A A >AA AA A actually (due to foam) only holds 18.5 gallons.AAA We
are
A A burning
A A >AA AA A "about" 1 gallon per lap on average through the first
5
A A sessions of
A A >AA AA A the weekend.AAA And, at our race pace, we will run
at.most
A A 19 laps in
A A >AA AA A a session (with no cautions etc).
A A >AA AA A We have a mandatory 3 minute pit stop each leg of the
A A 24-hour, and
A A >AA AA A the driver has to get out of the car for fueling.AAA
There
A A is about
A A >AA AA A 40 seconds of pit lane "in-out" time, leaving about
2:20
A A for driver
A A >AA AA A to stop, exit, the crew to fuel, and the driver to get
back
A A in, belt
A A >AA AA A up and get going.AAA The Pantera is not set up for a
dump
A A can (as was
A A >AA AA A not intended to run this 24-hour event).AAA It's a
very
A A slow fuel.A
A A >AA AA A Plus, the driver cant be getting in the car while the
crew
A A is
A A >AA AA A fueling.AAA Since I have issued at my age getting in
over
A A the driver
A A >AA AA A bars and reaching belts etc., we figure I will need an
A A extra 60-90
A A >AA AA A seconds over the 3 minutes for an old fart like me to
get
A A out/back
A A >AA AA A in the car and buckled up and going, in addition to
fueling
A A even a
A A >AA AA A few gallons, plus pit in/out time. In short, we will
lose
A A the
A A >AA AA A equivalent of average 4-5 seconds in average lap time
for
A A the
A A >AA AA A session due to a pit stop over 3 minutes when I am
driving.
A A >AA AA A If we run our race pace, we will run 19.5 laps, surely
A A running out
A A >AA AA A of fuel if we don't add fuel at the stop.AAA If we
slow
A A down 3
A A >AA AA A seconds a lap we will run 18 laps, and we should make
A A it.AAA If we
A A >AA AA A get a yellow, we are good.
A A >AA AA A Our current decision is to run the first session at a
A A reduced pace
A A >AA AA A and not fuel it during the 3 minute stop, hopefully
making
A A it
A A >AA AA A through with gas/car preservation mode.AAA Then, we
will
A A see what gas
A A >AA AA A we have left after the first session (if we don't run
A A out).AAA Even
A A >AA AA A if we run out, we will lose at me at one lap ...less
then
A A screwing
A A >AA AA A around with me getting in and out.
A A >AA AA A But, our best guess is that we should make it, the car
will
A A be
A A >AA AA A happier at the slower pace, and we will learn as we
go,
A A adjusting
A A >AA AA A for the next three sessions if we continue to make it.
A A >AA AA A On my son' Tony's stints, he can get in and out way
faster
A A than me,
A A >AA AA A so we can cut him loose a bit and actually throw a few
A A gallons in
A A >AA AA A the car at the mandatory pit and not lose time.
A A >AA AA A I guess that's another reason to go on a diet and
start
A A doing yoga.
A A >AA AA A It's been fun trying to figure out last minute the
move
A A from the
A A >AA AA A sprint races to the 24.
A A >AA AA A The guys that finished this year at LeMans we're
actually
A A an
A A >AA AA A inspiration for us moving the car to the 24.AAA It
was an
A A amazing run
A A >AA AA A for them.AAA We hope to have good news tomorrow...
A A >AA AA A Regards,
A A >AA AA A Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
A A >AA AA A The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
A A >AA AA A Email: [14]SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
A A >AA AA A Direct: 480-442-0297
A A >AA AA A [4][7][15]www.PatentIt.com
A A >AA AA A Scottsdale Office | P: 480.535.6656AAA |AAA F:
A A 480.535.6628AAA |AAA A:
A A >AA AA A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
A A >AA AA A Chicago Office | P: 312.752.4357AAA |AAA F:
312.896.5633AA
A A |AAA A: 55
A A >AA AA A E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
A A >AA AA A This email is intended only for the recipient above
and may
A A contain
A A >AA AA A confidential and privileged information. If you
received
A A this email
A A >AA AA A in error please destroy it and indicate such by return
A A email to me.
A A >AA AA A Thank you.
A A >>AA AA A On Sat, Nov 5, 2022, 8:28 AM Scott Couchman via
DeTomaso <
A A >>AA AA A [5][8][16]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
A A >> Mike, Thanks for setting the record straight, and
congratulations
A A >AA AA A to
A A >> these winners!
A A >>
A A >>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 8:36 PM, MICHAEL DREW
A A <[6][9][17]mikeldrew at aol.com>
A A >AA AA A wrote:
A A >>>
A A >>> i>>?a|and in fact, these guys:
A A >>>
A A >>>
A A >>>
A A >>> came in FIRST IN CLASS at Le Mans Classic this year, in a
A A >AA AA A factory
A A >>> Gr4
A A >> car.
A A >>>
A A >>> Since the event started in 2004, far more than half the
Panteras
A A >>> entered
A A >> have finished each year, on average. So it is highly
A A disrespectful
A A >AA AA A of
A A >> their collective efforts to claim that none have ever finished
at
A A >AA AA A all.
A A >>>
A A >>> Mike
A A >>>
A A >>> Sent from my iPhone
A A >>>
A A >>>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 22:15, MICHAEL DREW
A A <[7][10][18]mikeldrew at aol.com>
A A >AA AA A wrote:
A A >>>>
A A >>>> i>>?Scott,
A A >>>>
A A >>>> You need to pay more attention! Plenty of Panteras have
A A >AA AA A finished at
A A >>>> LMC
A A >> including this year.
A A >>>>
A A >>>> Mike
A A >>>>
A A >>>> Sent from my iPhone
A A >>>>
A A >>>>>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 18:24, Scott Couchman via DeTomaso <
A A >> [8][11][19]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
A A >>>>>
A A >>>>> i>>?All the LeMans Classics Iave attended, as far as I
know,
A A >AA AA A no
A A >>>>> Pantera
A A >> has finished the entire event. I hope you have much better
A A >AA AA A success!
A A >>>>>
A A >>>>>>> On Nov 4, 2022, at 1:03 PM, Mike & Elizabeth
A A >>>>>>> <[9][12][20]mbefthomas2 at gmail.com>
A A >> wrote:
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> i>>?Good luck!AAA Thanks for keeping us in the loop.
A A >>>>>> Mike Thomas
A A >>>>>> Panteras Northwest
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
A A >>>>>> From: DeTomaso
A A <[10][13][21]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>
A A >AA AA A On
A A >>>>>> Behalf
A A >> Of Steve Lisa
A A >>>>>> Sent: Friday, November 4, 2022 10:50 AM
A A >>>>>> To: List DeTomaso Forum
A A >AA AA A <[11][14][22]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
A A >>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] Daytona Update
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> All,
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> We have called the Pantera up to run the 24-hour race,
taking
A A >AA AA A the
A A >> place of the Panoz.AAA We were having issues with the new
Panoz
A A >AA AA A motor,
A A >> and the motor finally let fo.AAA So, are here and going to
run
A A the
A A >> Pantera in the Classic 24-hour instead.
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> The Pantera has already run 5 sessions this weekend in the
A A >AA AA A HSR
A A >>>>>> Sprint
A A >> races, with it's fasted time at 2:11.5.AAA Because we didn't
run
A A >AA AA A the
A A >> qualifying events for the Classic 24-hour event we will be
A A >AA AA A starting
A A >> from the back of Group A (pre-73, early FIA Group 3 and 4
cars, I
A A >> believe in the GTO class) for the Classic 24, which is fine
for a
A A >AA AA A long
A A >> event.AAA We will be driving conservatively with goal of
A A finishing
A A >AA AA A the event.
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> In addition, Goodwood sent some reporters over from
England
A A >AA AA A to
A A >>>>>> cover
A A >> the Daytona event.AAA They enjoyed seeing the Pantera race,
and
A A >AA AA A filmed
A A >> the car on track and a fun 15 minute interview about the car.A
A A >> Goodwood also mounted an in-car camera for the upcoming
24-hour
A A >AA AA A race.A
A A >> They are planning a short feature on the Pantera, which is
really
A A >AA AA A nice
A A >> of them, but who knows if it will ever get done.
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> Anyway, I will post updates and results starting
tomorrow.A
A A >AA AA A There
A A >>>>>> are
A A >> six groups, so we rotate out every six hours (i.e., four
one-hour
A A >> races every six hours).
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> Fingers crossed.....we are asked a lot from the car.
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> Regards,
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
A A >>>>>> The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
A A >>>>>> Email: [23]SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
A A >>>>>> Direct: 480-442-0297
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> [12][15][24]www.PatentIt.com
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> Scottsdale Office | P: 480.535.6656AAA |AAA F:
480.535.6628A
A A >AA AA A |AAA A:
A A >>>>>> 7689
A A >> East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> Chicago Office | P: 312.752.4357AAA |AAA F:
312.896.5633AA
A A |A
A A >AA AA A A: 55 E.
A A >> Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> This email is intended only for the recipient above and
may
A A >>>>>> contain
A A >> confidential and privileged information. If you received this
A A >AA AA A email in
A A >> error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to
me.
A A >AA AA A Thank you.
A A >>>>>>
A A >>>>>> _______________________________________________
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A A > References
A A >
A A >AA A 1. [22][31]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A A >AA A 2. mailto:[23][32]cengles at cox.net
A A >AA A 3. mailto:[24][33]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >AA A 4. [25][34]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A A >AA A 5. mailto:[26][35]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >AA A 6. mailto:[27][36]mikeldrew at aol.com
A A >AA A 7. mailto:[28][37]mikeldrew at aol.com
A A >AA A 8. mailto:[29][38]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >AA A 9. mailto:[30][39]mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
A A >AA 10. mailto:[31][40]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >AA 11. mailto:[32][41]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >AA 12. [33][42]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A A >AA 13. mailto:[34][43]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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[35][44]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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References
A 1. [51]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A 2. mailto:[52]asajay at asajay.com
A 3. mailto:[53]stevelisa at patentit.com
A 4. [54]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A 5. mailto:[55]cengles at cox.net
A 6. mailto:[56]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A 7. [57]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A 8. mailto:[58]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 9. mailto:[59]mikeldrew at aol.com
A 10. mailto:[60]mikeldrew at aol.com
A 11. mailto:[61]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 12. mailto:[62]mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
A 13. mailto:[63]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A 14. mailto:[64]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 15. [65]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A 16. mailto:[66]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 17. [67]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A 18. mailto:[68]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 19. [69]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A 20. mailto:[70]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 21. [71]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A 22. [72]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A 23. mailto:[73]cengles at cox.net
A 24. mailto:[74]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A 25. [75]http://www.PatentIt.com/
A 26. mailto:[76]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 27. mailto:[77]mikeldrew at aol.com
A 28. mailto:[78]mikeldrew at aol.com
A 29. mailto:[79]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 30. mailto:[80]mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
A 31. mailto:[81]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A 32. mailto:[82]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A 33. [83]http://www.PatentIt.com/
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References
1. mailto:jderyke at aol.com
2. mailto:stevelisa at patentit.com
3. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
4. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
5. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
6. mailto:SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
7. http://www.PatentIt.com/
8. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
9. mailto:stevelisa at patentit.com
10. mailto:SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
11. http://www.PatentIt.com/
12. mailto:cengles at cox.net
13. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
14. mailto:SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
15. http://www.PatentIt.com/
16. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
17. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
18. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
19. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
20. mailto:mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
21. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
22. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
23. mailto:SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
24. http://www.PatentIt.com/
25. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
26. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
27. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
28. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
29. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
30. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
31. http://www.patentit.com/
32. mailto:cengles at cox.net
33. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
34. http://www.patentit.com/
35. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
36. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
37. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
38. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
39. mailto:mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
40. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
41. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
42. http://www.patentit.com/
43. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
44. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
45. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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47. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
48. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
49. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
50. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
51. http://www.patentit.com/
52. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
53. mailto:stevelisa at patentit.com
54. http://www.patentit.com/
55. mailto:cengles at cox.net
56. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
57. http://www.patentit.com/
58. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
59. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
60. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
61. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
62. mailto:mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
63. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
64. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
65. http://www.patentit.com/
66. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
67. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
68. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
69. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
70. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
71. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
72. http://www.patentit.com/
73. mailto:cengles at cox.net
74. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
75. http://www.patentit.com/
76. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
77. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
78. mailto:mikeldrew at aol.com
79. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
80. mailto:mbefthomas2 at gmail.com
81. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
82. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
83. http://www.patentit.com/
84. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
85. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
86. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
87. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
88. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
89. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
90. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
91. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
92. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
93. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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