[DeTomaso] Wheel bearing check

Sun Jun 30 15:34:12 EDT 2019

Hi Robert,
The stock bearing manufacture, SKF, recommends .0002 to .0005 inner press fit onto the axle. The stock axle came .0002 oversize, right on the minimum recommendation for the bearing. So when they spin on the axle when they begin to wear out, it doesn't take much to wear the axle undersize to require a $450 axle change out with the bearings. It usually doesn't stop there if left to spin, it then takes out the two bearing spacers as well. We make our billet axles .0005 oversize, so they are a bear to press on, but they don't let the bearing spin ever again, thus longer bearing life. I put these in my Pantera and competed in dozens of road and open road race events, pulling 2.5G's on corners, and topped 200 MPH on highway events, and never had a rear wheel bearing problem in 20 years. Enough said about the bearing design, it's all about the axle. Go ahead and drive, then send me your uprights to rebuild, and we will replace with some solid billet axles with new bearings and you will be good. 
Larry@ Pantera Parts Connection 1-800-DeTomaso, (338-6627)

On 6/30/19, 8:48 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Julian Kift" <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of julian_kift at hotmail.com> wrote:

       Robert,

       If it were me I would probably take the trip and fix after, I would not
       tell my wife!

       I am not familiar with your car, is it a 71-74 or post Ford 9000
       series? The later cars with the stepped axle do seem to have minor play
       even when new/rebuilt.

       I believe there are two types of front spindle nut, one standard with a
       slip over keeper (micro lock) that one bends the tab over into the axle
       groove and a later style that is more a traditional castellated nut and
       cotter pin. In either case you should not require new front spindle
       nuts to re-torque the front wheel bearings. I normally tighten mine
       while rotating the wheel to verify no bind, typically I use 15ft/lb to
       seat the taper bearing and then back off a flat for a roughly 0.001"
       end play.

       I think I'm right in saying the earlier spindles are left and right
       hand threaded and at some point changed to all right hand.

       Julian
         __________________________________________________________________

       From: Robert Stroj <npdrs at maui.net>
       Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2019 5:14 AM
       To: 'Mike Drew'; 'Julian Kift'
       Cc: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
       Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Wheel bearing check

       Hi Mike, Julian,

       OK, I think it is clear, it must be a wheel bearing.

       With wheels off the ground I can hear light click-click when moving
       wheel up-down in 12/6 o'clock direction.

       On left side I can also just detect tiny movement as well.

       Question; got a 500-600km trip scheduled next week; is it OK to use the
       car like this and change bearings after the trip?

       If I were to replace inner bearing with the double row as Mike
       suggests, what parts should I order?

       Other than bearings and special tool to un-do the nut, any other parts
       I need to order?

       For the front, should I only get the new nuts so I can just retighten
       the bearings?

       Thanks, Robert

       From: Mike Drew [mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com]
       Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2019 5:03 AM
       To: Julian Kift
       Cc: Robert Stroj; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
       Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Wheel bearing check

       Julian,

       But axle wear would manifest as play throughout 360 degrees, not just
       at 12/6 o'clock?  The only thing I could think of that might explain it
       is a bad upper ball joint? But I've never heard of an upper ball joint
       really going bad like that?

       Or, loose lug nuts?

       It will take one person moving the wheels around while another peers at
       the suspension from the back side in order to find the problem.

       Mike

       Sent from my iPad

       On Jun 29, 2019, at 07:15, Julian Kift <[1]julian_kift at hotmail.com>
       wrote:

       The vertical direction is typically wear in the wheel bearings/axle and
       any side to side indicative that the lower bushings in the bearing
       carrier are worn. The latter is fairly uncommon, however it is quite
       common for the lower shaft to seize in the bushings and bind the hub
       carrier from arcing correctly through suspension travel.

       Julian

        _____________________________________________________________________

       From: DeTomaso <[2]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
       of Robert Stroj <[3]npdrs at maui.net>
       Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2019 2:07 AM
       To: Mike Drew
       Cc: [4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
       Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Wheel bearing check

       Hi Mike,
       Thanks a lot for precise instructions!
       Checked all 4 wheels and only little play I was able to detect was on
       rear passenger wheel.
       Strange is that it had absolutely no play side to side (3/9 o'clock
       positions) but only small amount in vertical direction (12/6 o'clock).
       Would this indicate a bearing wear or something else?
       It can move only about 1mm measured at the tire; what is the acceptable
       range?
       Thanks a lot, Robert
       > On Jun 28, 2019, at 8:53 AM, Mike Drew <[5]MikeLDrew at aol.com> wrote:
       >
       >
       >
       > Sent from my iPad
       >
       >> On Jun 27, 2019, at 17:24, Jack DeRyke via DeTomaso
       <[6]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
       >>
       >>  The time-honored way to check rear wheel bearings is to remove the
       tub,
       >>  and with a knowlegable person helping you, throw a haunch into the
       rear
       >>  fender approximately above the center of the rear wheel cutout
       area, in
       >>  line with the wheel center.
       >
       >>>> Uh....no. That is the time-honored way to pound a big dent in your
       fender.  No reasonable person would ever check for a bad axle that way.
       Saying "Don't do it so hard that you dent the fender" is crazy. How
       hard are you supposed to smash into the side of your car??? Who knows
       the answer to that question? The only way to know for sure is to do it
       too hard. And then you have a dented fender.
       >
       > All you have to do is gently jack the rear of the car so the rear
       wheels are off the ground. Grasp the tire at 3 and 9 o'clock and try to
       wiggle it in and out. There should be NO movement. Axle wear (despite
       how it feels and how people describe it, invariably the bearings are
       fine and instead it's the axle that's trashed) manifests itself with
       notable play accompanied by an audible clunking. A little play and
       clunking is bad, and should be dealt with in a reasonably timely
       manner. A lot of play can be catastrophic, and leads to this:
       >
       > <image1.jpeg>
       >
       >
       > Most everything else Jack said is reasonably accurate.
       >
       > It's worth mentioning that a tiny amount of play can be caused not by
       the axle/bearing interface, but rather by the lower shaft interface
       with the bearings in the lower part of the cast iron hub carrier. Those
       bearings can wear which can allow unwanted movement that mimics an axle
       going bad. Look for the source of the movement on the inside of the
       wheel, and also check for movement with your hands at 12 and 6 o'clock.
       If it moves both horizontally and vertically, it's almost assuredly the
       axle. If it moves side to side but not up and down, it's probably the
       upright/lower shaft bearings, not the axle.
       >
       > I am a staunch advocate of replacing the stock inner bearing with a
       double-row bearing, which spreads the load over a much greater portion
       of the axle. It's not a perfect solution because part of the OD of the
       bearing is unsupported by the hub carrier. But it's still better than
       the narrow single bearing, and costs virtually nothing more.
       >
       > Also, when pressing the hub carriers apart, support the brake rotor
       using a large piece of iron pipe.  If you only support part of the
       rotor in the press, the rotor can easily be shattered. I've seen it
       happen and it ain't pretty.....
       >
       > Mike
       >
       >
       >
       >>
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    References

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