[DeTomaso] Future of the email list
Jeff Detrich
jjdetrich at gmail.com
Wed Apr 20 19:35:17 EDT 2016
I'm sorry to have to continue this but when I see such obvious
mistatements, I gotta respond.
Jeff
6559
"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all
the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time. Abraham
Lincoln said that."
A quote from Bob Dylan
On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Michael Shortt <michaelsavga at gmail.com>
wrote:
BECAUSE THEY BOTH CAN NOT EXIST AS THEY ARE NOW.
>
> They can if the email forum is moved, which it will be.
>
>>> That is true physically but hides the fact that POCA could continue to
support the email list easily by putting it on a different server under a
different URL. You make it sound like POCA just can't do it which is not
true. I don't know why you are so adamant about changing the system,
especially since it has been tried so often in the past by POCA and failed
so badly. Seems like you are taking a big, unnecessary risk. Ask Bob Reid.
>
>
>
>> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Michael
>> ShorttA <[2]michaelsavga at gmail.com>A wrote:
>>
>> A Its time the club stop operating in the red,
>>
>> The club has always made a profit,
>>
>
> FALSE
>
>>>Who are you kidding, the Financial Statements show that the club made a
small profit last year, as it should, and made big profits in previous
years and has made profits for a long as I can remember, which is way
before you became a member. Bob Reid, when was the last time the club
didn't show a profit?
>
>
>
>> that's why we have such a huge cash
>> balance - over $100,000.
>>
>
> FALSE
>
>>> Well how come the Financial Statements show a balance over $100,000 for
the end of 2015 and 2016. And with money coming in for the Fun Rally and
all the new members I find it hard to believe it is below $100k right now.
And even if it is, it's just barely below. Unless of course, you are
spending big money modifying the new web site.
>
>
>> And now that Profiles is being published
>> electronically,
>>
>
>
> FALSE
>
>
>> it will save the club a good $20,000 per year.
>>
>
>
> FALSE
>
>>> Hmm, you still aren't delivering it electronically. I have to ask why
especially considering it is such a big expense that could be reduced. (You
have a fiduciary responsibility to take good care of the Member's money.)
The technology is in place, Jack has been doing it for the International
Members for a year now. Maybe you are waiting for the new website to get up
and running. That doesn't change the fact that when you do start sending
them out electronically, it will save a good $20,000 per year. Those saving
are based on Bob Reid's numbers.
>
>
>> Where will that go? True the website will cost ~$2400/year and will
>> continue
>> year after year because you are using a "canned" hosting site where you
>> have to conform to their design and you pay each year based on the
>> number of members.
>>
>
>
> FALSE
>
>
>
>> I also hear that you are doing a lot of modifications but those will only
>> be maintenance requirements (that
>> cost more money) in the future every time the hosting service
>> updates their design.
>>
>
>
> FALSE
>
>>> The $2400 comes from the Club Express website. If it's off it can't be
off by too much. So you say you aren't doing modifications or other
supplemental programming to add capabilities to their website. I hope that
is true cause it can be a can of worms. But is it really so? You say FALSE,
I've looked at the features of their site and it ain't much except for the
online membership part and the pretty pictures.
>
>
>> I support it, however, because it's a something we desperately need. But
>> it's nowhere close to the $20,000 per year savings.
>>
>
> FALSE
>
>
>> (At least it better not be because we could build a site that
>> meets our needs exactly for less than that. And there wouldn't be the
>> yearly fee.)
>>
>
> FALSE
>
>>> ???
>
>
>
>>
>>
>> It's time that somebody call out the vendors who do not buy any ads in
>> the newsletter or Profiles
>>
>> I think we need to stop "calling out" anybody and put on a persuasion
>> effort. One of the main goals of the club is to enhance DeTomaso
>> awareness. If everything you've promised is good for the vendors and
>> for Pantera owners, they will buy ads and renew memberships. It's time
>> to start selling benefits and overcoming objections with reasoned and
>> non-confrontational rationale.
>>
>
> That has been what we were doing until this ignorance started
>
>>> Hey, you were the one used the "calling out" words, not me. You keep
decrying the fact that the email forum emails about club issues are bad for
the club's image. I hate to say it but most of the conversation has been
pretty calm and straight forward and well reasoned. You are the one who
makes it sound so bad. Go back and look at your emails. No one else
responds so strongly. No facts, just wild accusations and name calling. You
must be taking lessons from our VP Mike Burnett.
>
>
>> ***Here's a suggestion, when the new site becomes operational and
>> stable, open it up to everyone in the world for a short time so they
>> can experience the benefits. If it's as good as you say it is,
>> non-members will sign up in droves! Think about it.***
>>
>
> While I like the concept, there are privacy concerns by many members which
> make that impossible to do. Why buy the cow if you can get the milk for
> free,
>
>>> Actually to change the metaphor, I was suggesting using the "puppy dog"
close. Once they have it, they won't want to give it up if it's anything as
good as you say it is. I kind of doubt it, however, since there has been no
real effort to provide the needed metadata that will make searching the
archives of tech articles, Profiles stories, etc., meaningful.
>
> If somebody has a $60,000-$400,000 toy far and* they are too cheap to
> join the club, they need to sell the car.*
>
>>
>>
>
>>> See what I'm talking about. There you go again. You'd be better served
if you appointed a spokesman for the club.
>
>> $50 a year in dues and the cars are now worth $60,000 to $400,000 is a
>> bargain by any measure.
>>
>> Have you reduced the dues to $50 for all of us?
>>
>
>
> The Club POCA retains $50, the Chapter gets $25. from domestic dues.
>
> International Members will be paying $50 with digital newsletters and
> digital Profiles.
>
>
>> Personally, I think that is way too much of a decrease but a decrease is
>> surely due with
>> the $20,000 savings
>>
>
> FALSE and FALSE
>
>>> A slight twist of the words here. What you say is true but doesn't
change my point.
😀
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
I'm sorry to have to continue this but when I see such obvious
mistatements, I gotta respond.A
Jeff
6559
"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people
all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time. Abraham
LincolnA saidA that."
A A quote from Bob Dylan
On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Michael Shortt
<[1]michaelsavga at gmail.com> wrote:
BECAUSE THEY BOTH CAN NOT EXIST AS THEY ARE NOW.
They can if the email forum is moved, which it will be.
>>> That is true physically but hides the fact that POCA could continue
to support the email list easily by putting it on a different server
under a different URL. You make it sound like POCA just can't do it
which is not true. I don't know why you are so adamant about changing
the system, especially since it has been tried so often in the past by
POCA and failed so badly. Seems like you are taking a big, unnecessary
risk. Ask Bob Reid.
A
A A On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Michael
A A ShorttA <[2][2]michaelsavga at gmail.com>A wrote:
A A A Its time the club stop operating in the red,
A A The club has always made a profit,
FALSE
>>>Who are you kidding, the Financial Statements show that the club
made a small profit last year, as it should, and made big profits in
previous years and has made profits for a long as I can remember, which
is way before you became a member. Bob Reid, when was the last time the
club didn't show a profit?
A
that's why we have such a huge cash
A A balance - over $100,000.
A
A
FALSE
>>> Well how come the Financial Statements show a balance over $100,000
for the end of 2015 and 2016. And with money coming in for the Fun
Rally and all the new members I find it hard to believe it is below
$100k right now. And even if it is, it's just barely below. Unless of
course, you are spending big money modifying the new web site.
A
And now that Profiles is being published
A A electronically,
FALSE
A
it will save the club a good $20,000 per year.
FALSE
>>> Hmm, you still aren't delivering it electronically. I have to ask
why especially considering it is such a big expense that could be
reduced. (You have a fiduciary responsibility to take good care of the
Member's money.) The technology is in place, Jack has been doing it for
the International Members for a year now. Maybe you are waiting for the
new website to get up and running. That doesn't change the fact that
when you do start sending them out electronically, it will save a good
$20,000 per year. Those saving are based on Bob Reid's numbers.A
A
A
WhereA will that go? True the website will cost ~$2400/year and will
continue
A A year after year because you are using a "canned" hosting site
where you
A A have to conform to their design and you pay each year based on the
A A number of members.
FALSE
A
I also hear that you are doing a lot ofA modifications but those will
only be maintenance requirements (that
A A cost more money) in the future every time the hosting service
updatesA their design.
FALSE
>>> The $2400 comes from the Club Express website. If it's off it can't
be off by too much. So you say you aren't doing modifications or other
supplemental programming to add capabilities to their website. I hope
that is true cause it can be a can of worms. But is it really so? You
say FALSE, I've looked at the features of their site and it ain't much
except for the online membership part and the pretty pictures.A
A
I support it, however, because it's a something weA desperately need.
But it's nowhere close to the $20,000 per yearA savings.
FALSE
A
(At least it better not be because we could build a site that
A A meets our needs exactly for less than that. And there wouldn't be
the
A A yearly fee.)
FALSE
>>> A ???A
A
A A
A A It's time that somebody call out the vendors who do not buy any
ads in
A A the newsletter or Profiles
A A I think we need to stop "calling out" anybody and put on a
persuasion
A A effort. One of the main goals of the club is to enhance DeTomaso
A A awareness. If everything you've promised is good for the vendors
and
A A for Pantera owners, they will buy ads and renew memberships. It's
time
A A to start selling benefits and overcoming objections with reasoned
and
A A non-confrontational rationale.
That has been what we were doing until this ignorance started
>>> Hey, you were the one used the "calling out" words, not me. You
keep decrying the fact that the email forum emails about club issues
are bad for the club's image. I hate to say it but most of the
conversation has been pretty calm and straight forward and well
reasoned. You are the one who makes it sound so bad. Go back and look
at your emails. No one else responds so strongly. No facts, just wild
accusations and name calling.A You must be taking lessons from our VP
Mike Burnett.A
A A
A
A A ***Here's a suggestion, when the new site becomes operational and
A A stable, open it up to everyone in the world for a short time so
they
A A can experience the benefits. If it's as good as you say it is,
A A non-members will sign up in droves! Think about it.***
While I like the concept, there are privacy concerns by many members
which make that impossible to do. Why buy the cow if you can get the
milk for free,
>>> Actually to change the metaphor, I was suggesting using the "puppy
dog" close. Once they have it, they won't want to give it up if it's
anything as good as you say it is. I kind of doubt it, however, since
there has been no real effort to provide the needed metadata that will
make searching the archives of tech articles, Profiles stories, etc.,
meaningful.
If somebody has a $60,000-$400,000 toy far and they are too cheap to
join the club, they need to sell the car.
A A
>>> See what I'm talking about. There you go again. You'd be better
served if you appointed a spokesman for the club.A
A A $50 a year in dues and the cars are now worth $60,000 to
$400,000A is a bargain by any measure.
A A Have you reduced the dues to $50 for all of us?
The Club POCA retains $50, the Chapter gets $25. from domestic dues.
International Members will be paying $50 with digital newsletters and
digital Profiles.
A
Personally, I thinkA that is way too much of a decrease but a decrease
is surely due with
A A the $20,000 savings
FALSE and FALSE
>>> A slight twist of the words here. What you say is true but doesn't
change my point.A
d-
A
References
1. mailto:michaelsavga at gmail.com
2. mailto:michaelsavga at gmail.com
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