[DeTomaso] Email Forum Opportunity
Asa Jay Laughton
asajay at asajay.com
Wed Apr 20 01:21:52 EDT 2016
When you (privately) apparently encouraged me to try and hack the new web site when it comes out, I ignored you. I don't hack web sites, I'm too busy managing several others for people and businesses that PAY me.
But when you publicly attempt to encourage me to hack the new web site as if it's something I'd go out of my way to do in order to prove you wrong, I take umbrage to that. I don't hack web sites. I don't want or wish for you to be proven wrong with regard to securith, I'm simply stating that no web site is invulnerable, no matter how much you think it is, and that hosting a forum invites trouble, most of which can be controlled, and that's what POCA will be paying these guys to do.
And this email forum is as much part of the POCA website and server as anything else. You have insinuated on more than one occasion that the server is the problem, that the site is crap by way of how much better it will be when replaced, that the email forum is being hacked constantly.
Perfect marketing; show how crappy the old thing is by painting a super-shiny picture of what you could have instead; and that's exactly what you've been doing, you need to sell this shiny new marble as hard as you can....but the sad part is you don' t really need to. You don't need to consistently insult the people who originally did a lot of hard volunteer work (at least until we got tired of it) to get it to where it was before the original hack, and all the hard work put into it afterward to get it back to some semblance of order. The new site will sell itself.
Instead of constantly berating what "is", you should be praising it as a stepping stone to the future. Yes, things will change, yes POCA is trying to leverage the past to make a better future, yes members will see a lot more content, and a lot new and cool things. You just need to stop being a high pressure used car salesman in the process.
"Whatever," as you say. You and I already had that discussion, I turned down your offer of managing the new web site months ago and actually provided encouragement to use the service you recommended. I thought it would be good. I also encouraged you to email this very list and let them know what the plan was for this very list. Thank you for doing that, now all the non-POCA members will know what happened. And I'm glad to see someone step up to take it over if necessary.
And I have seen the new web site, or at least parts of it, some of it, certainly not the grandiose all-encompassing site it will be later in May (still more work to be done), but no.... I have not seen the underlying technology, I haven't seen the server and I don't know how it's going to be run. I don't really care; it's for someone else to manage. I only care to the extent that the new web site provides all that's being promised. Otherwise I don't really give a rats rear.
But I'll tell you..... no.... I won't. I'm done here.
Asa Jay
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
Michael Shortt <michaelsavga at gmail.com> wrote:
>Whatever, we are talking about the email list.
>
>Your response only confirms the problem. "At GoDaddy rejecting".
>
>Ed works on the problems all the time to constantly add people back in who are kicked off.
>
>When the new website debuts, people will quickly, as in instantaneous ly see the difference in the old and the new.
>
>Given that you have never seen it, know nothing about its security or much else connected to it, your assessment seems a bit premature. By all means, when it comes out, try to hack it, Id personally appreciate it if you can find a weakness that needs to be addressed.
>
>Nobody has mentioned anything about the existing website, not one word. Not even the haters on the email list issue have said anything about the website. Maybe because few of them have used it.
>
>It's unfortunate that my "grandiose posturing" pisses you off, if you were helping in any way whatsoever - you wouldn't have time to be pissed and you would know more about it.
>
>I'm too busy,
>
>Aside from
>Creating the new website
>The new membership brochure
>The recruiting drive
>Growing the club by 8% in 3 months
>Building an entirely new member database with
>online billing
>Planning an East Coast Rally
>Building an online POCA store that works
>Conducting open BOD meetings,
>Meeting with the chapter Presidents every month
>Plus more that isn't public yet
>
>All with the incredible help and support of a BOD that cares about the future of the club,
>
>I'm just too damned busy to be pissed.
>
>Michael Shortt
>
>
>
>
>On Apr 19, 2016 10:42 PM, "Asa Jay Laughton" <asajay at asajay.com> wrote:
>
>WTF are you talking about Michael? I don't think you have a deep understanding of the server or it's security.
>
>
>The forum is constantly failing and kicking people off? List members Infecting the server weekly? WTF are you talking about? The last time that I recall the server got hacked was over three years ago. Are attempts made? Oh you betcha, but so are attempts made to just about -any- server on the internet but they don't come through the list.
>
>
>If a member -is- causing a problem, it needs to be figured out. But I'll tell you right now the POCA server is NOT the server bouncing emails causing mass unsubscribes. It's a server down the line at GoDaddy rejecting the outgoing traffic for EITHER "spam" or "virus" attachments. Unfortunately they don't tell us which one, so we assume a bad attachment since the "let-through" has been pretty flawless for years. Someone should troubleshoot that.
>
>
>Magnet for spam and robots? Yes, any website out there, especially ones hosting forums are targets. The new POCA forum will be a target too. But let me ask you, when was the last time this email list sent you spam? When?
>
>We turned ON attachments a while ago to help share more stuff. Prior to turning ON attachments, the forum never, ever, had a problem and it is the primary reason Mailman encourages -not- to turn on attachments.
>
>
>Now with that said, parsing all incoming mail through something like a Barracuda spam and virus firewall server would probably catch those virus attachments -before- they got to the POCA server.
>
>
>And the search engine bots are crawling it all the time looking for updates so they can return meaningful results when searched.
>
>
>It keeps three people busy every day? Really? The busiest I get is going to read the emails. I've not done any serious troubleshooting on the server for months. I could probably figure out what's causing the problem but thought it would be a good challenge for someone else to troubleshoot in order to help them learn. But that point is moot since you'll be standing up a new forum anyway. NOT TO MENTION THE FACT THAT I'VE BEEN LOCKED OUT OF THE SERVER FOR WHO KNOWS HOW LONG AND ALL ACCESS PASSWORDS HAVE BEEN CHANGED. I couldn't be helping POCA even if I was asked to. Working on it daily? Hardly.
>
>
>And finally, you're making the new service sound like Fort Knox. I seriously doubt that; I've seen that story before. Better security than now? Most likely and I'm sure it's something to look forward to, but you're trying to make if sound nuclear-proof.
>
>
>I've become sick of your grandiose posturing making it sound like the present web site is constantly being hacked and providing nothing but a security problem to the members and that it's taking constant work to keep it from causing harm, or that this email forum is antiquated and a dying dinosaur. It must be, otherwise why would there still be thousands of Mailman email lists still out there and the software still updated?
>
>
>...or that the only way to get new members is to restrict most content to locked away member only access areas. Good luck with that but I guess it's the new paradigm.
>
>
>Oh, and Corey was banned from the PI forum (did you miss that part), not this one. Because the PI forum is moderated and sometimes the forum moderator manages to get pissed off at subscribers.
>
>
>I was on-board with the move to a new web site and even on board to POCA paying a reasonable amount to have it managed. But now your verbal posturing is just pissing me off.
>
>
>For those interested, I could probably stand up a replacement site with Mailman (brand new) in less than 24 hours.
>
>
>Asa Jay
>
>
>Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
>
>
>
>Michael Shortt <michaelsavga at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>Nobody has been banned from the forum.
>
>The forum is constantly failing and kicking people out, it is a magnet for
>spam and robots.
>It also spreads viruses faster than $10 hooker, because there are several
>of you that use it that do not have proper software and you guys infect the
>server and everybody else weekly.
>
>It literally keeps three people (Gerry Womack, Asa Jay and Ed Mendez) busy
>every day to keep it operational, we all owe them a huge debt for their
>service.
>
>The new website is pretty hack proof, has awesome security and best of all,
>a 24 hour tech support line.
>
>It will be a problem for somebody else now.
>
>We hope you visit the new forum.
>
>Michael
> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 6:23 PM, Corey Price <[1]coreyjprice at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Since I hadA my membership privileges removed from the PI forum
>
> ???
> Jeff
>
>References
>
> 1. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>
>Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>DeTomaso mailing list
>DeTomaso at poca.com
>http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use
>the links above.
>
> Nobody has been banned from the forum.
>
> The forum is constantly failing and kicking people out, it is a magnet
> for spam and robots.
> It also spreads viruses faster than $10 hooker, because there are
> several of you that use it that do not have proper software and you
> guys infect the server and everybody else weekly.
>
> It literally keeps three people (Gerry Womack, Asa Jay and Ed Mendez)
> busy every day to keep it operational, we all owe them a huge debt for
> their service.
>
> The new website is pretty hack proof, has awesome security and best of
> all, a 24 hour tech support line.
>
> It will be a problem for somebody else now.
>
> We hope you visit the new forum.
>
> Michael
>
> A A On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 6:23 PM, Corey Price
> <[1][1]coreyjprice at gmail.com>
> A A wrote:
> A A Since I hadA my membership privileges removed from the PI forum
> A A ???
> A A Jeff
> References
> A A 1. mailto:[2]coreyjprice at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [3]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [4]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
> use the links above.
>
>References
>
> 1. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
> 2. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
> 3. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
> 4. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>
>Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>DeTomaso mailing list
>DeTomaso at poca.com
>http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>
-------------- next part --------------
When you (privately) apparently encouraged me to try and hack the new
web site when it comes out, I ignored you. I don't hack web sites, I'm
too busy managing several others for people and businesses that PAY me.
But when you publicly attempt to encourage me to hack the new web site
as if it's something I'd go out of my way to do in order to prove you
wrong, I take umbrage to that. I don't hack web sites. I don't want
or wish for you to be proven wrong with regard to securith, I'm simply
stating that no web site is invulnerable, no matter how much you think
it is, and that hosting a forum invites trouble, most of which can be
controlled, and that's what POCA will be paying these guys to do.
And this email forum is as much part of the POCA website and server as
anything else. You have insinuated on more than one occasion that the
server is the problem, that the site is crap by way of how much better
it will be when replaced, that the email forum is being hacked
constantly.
Perfect marketing; show how crappy the old thing is by painting a
super-shiny picture of what you could have instead; and that's exactly
what you've been doing, you need to sell this shiny new marble as hard
as you can....but the sad part is you don' t really need to. You don't
need to consistently insult the people who originally did a lot of hard
volunteer work (at least until we got tired of it) to get it to where
it was before the original hack, and all the hard work put into it
afterward to get it back to some semblance of order. The new site will
sell itself.
Instead of constantly berating what "is", you should be praising it as
a stepping stone to the future. Yes, things will change, yes POCA is
trying to leverage the past to make a better future, yes members will
see a lot more content, and a lot new and cool things. You just need
to stop being a high pressure used car salesman in the process.
"Whatever," as you say. You and I already had that discussion, I
turned down your offer of managing the new web site months ago and
actually provided encouragement to use the service you recommended. I
thought it would be good. I also encouraged you to email this very
list and let them know what the plan was for this very list. Thank you
for doing that, now all the non-POCA members will know what happened.
And I'm glad to see someone step up to take it over if necessary.
And I have seen the new web site, or at least parts of it, some of it,
certainly not the grandiose all-encompassing site it will be later in
May (still more work to be done), but no.... I have not seen the
underlying technology, I haven't seen the server and I don't know how
it's going to be run. I don't really care; it's for someone else to
manage. I only care to the extent that the new web site provides all
that's being promised. Otherwise I don't really give a rats rear.
But I'll tell you..... no.... I won't. I'm done here.
Asa Jay
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
Michael Shortt <michaelsavga at gmail.com> wrote:
Whatever, we are talking about the email list.
Your response only confirms the problem. "At GoDaddy rejecting".
Ed works on the problems all the time to constantly add people back in
who are kicked off.
When the new website debuts, people will quickly, as in instantaneous
ly see the difference in the old and the new.
Given that you have never seen it, know nothing about its security or
much else connected to it, your assessment seems a bit premature.A By
all means, when it comes out, try to hack it, Id personally appreciate
it if you can find a weakness that needs to be addressed.
Nobody has mentioned anything about the existing website, not one word.
Not even the haters on the email list issue have said anything about
the website. Maybe because few of them have used it.
It's unfortunate that my "grandiose posturing" pisses you off, if you
were helping in any way whatsoever - you wouldn't have time to be
pissed and you would know more about it.
I'm too busy,
Aside from
Creating the new website
The new membership brochure
The recruiting drive
Growing the club by 8% in 3 months
Building an entirely new member database with
online billing
Planning an East Coast Rally
Building an online POCA store that works
Conducting open BOD meetings,
Meeting with the chapter Presidents every month
Plus more that isn't public yet
All with the incredible help and support of a BOD that cares about the
future of the club,
I'm just too damned busy to be pissed.
Michael Shortt
On Apr 19, 2016 10:42 PM, "Asa Jay Laughton" <[1]asajay at asajay.com>
wrote:
WTF are you talking about Michael?A I don't think you have a deep
understanding of the server or it's security.
TheA forum is constantly failing and kicking people off?A List
members Infecting the server weekly?A WTF are you talking about?A The
last time that I recall the server got hacked was over three years
ago.A Are attempts made?A Oh you betcha, but so are attempts made to
just about -any- server on the internet but they don't come through the
list.
If a member -is- causing a problem, it needs to be figured out.A But
I'll tell you right now the POCA server is NOT the server bouncing
emails causing mass unsubscribes.A It's a server down the line at
GoDaddy rejecting the outgoing traffic for EITHER "spam" or "virus"
attachments.A Unfortunately they don't tell us which one, so we assume
a bad attachment since the "let-through" has been pretty flawless for
years.A Someone should troubleshoot that.
Magnet for spam and robots?A Yes, any website out there, especially
ones hosting forums are targets.A The new POCA forum will be a target
too.A But let me ask you, when was the last time this email list sent
you spam?A When?A
We turned ON attachments a while ago to help share more stuff.A Prior
to turning ON attachments, the forum never, ever, had a problem and it
is the primary reason Mailman encourages -not- to turn on attachments.
Now with that said, parsing all incoming mail through something like a
Barracuda spam and virus firewall server would probably catch those
virus attachments -before- they got to the POCA server.
And the search engine bots are crawling it all the time looking for
updates so they can return meaningful results when searched.
It keeps three people busy every day?A Really?A The busiest I get is
going to read the emails.A I've not done any serious troubleshooting
on the server for months.A I could probably figure out what's causing
the problem but thought it would be a good challenge for someone else
to troubleshoot in order to help them learn.A But that point is moot
since you'll be standing up a new forum anyway. NOT TO MENTION THE FACT
THAT I'VE BEEN LOCKED OUT OF THE SERVER FOR WHO KNOWS HOW LONG AND ALL
ACCESS PASSWORDS HAVE BEEN CHANGED.A I couldn't be helping POCA even
if I was asked to.A Working on it daily?A Hardly.
And finally, you're making the new service sound like Fort Knox.A I
seriously doubt that; I've seen that story before.A Better security
than now?A Most likely and I'm sure it's something to look forward to,
but you're trying to make if sound nuclear-proof.
I've become sick of your grandiose posturing making it sound like the
present web site is constantly being hacked and providing nothing but a
security problem to the members and that it's taking constant work to
keep it from causing harm, or that this email forum is antiquated and a
dying dinosaur.A It must be, otherwise why would there still be
thousands of Mailman email lists still out there and the software still
updated?
...or that the only way to get new members is to restrict most content
to locked away member only access areas.A Good luck with that but I
guess it's the new paradigm.
Oh, and Corey was banned from the PI forum (did you miss that part),
not this one.A A Because the PI forum is moderated and sometimes the
forum moderator manages to get pissed off at subscribers.
I was on-board with the move to a new web site and even on board to
POCA paying a reasonable amount to have it managed.A But now your
verbal posturing is just pissing me off.
For those interested, I could probably stand up a replacement site with
Mailman (brand new) in less than 24 hours.
AsaA Jay
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
Michael Shortt <[2]michaelsavga at gmail.com> wrote:
Nobody has been banned from the forum.
The forum is constantly failing and kicking people out, it is a
magnet for
spam and robots.
It also spreads viruses faster than $10 hooker, because there are
several
of you that use it that do not have proper software and you guys
infect the
server and everybody else weekly.
It literally keeps three people (Gerry Womack, Asa Jay and Ed
Mendez) busy
every day to keep it operational, we all owe them a huge debt for
their
service.
The new website is pretty hack proof, has awesome security and best
of all,
a 24 hour tech support line.
It will be a problem for somebody else now.
We hope you visit the new forum.
Michael
A A On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 6:23 PM, Corey Price
<[1][3]coreyjprice at gmail.com>
A A wrote:
A A Since I hadA my membership privileges removed from the PI forum
A A ???
A A Jeff
References
A A 1. mailto:[4]coreyjprice at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
DeTomaso mailing list
[5]DeTomaso at poca.com
[6]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
the links above.
A A Nobody has been banned from the forum.
A A The forum is constantly failing and kicking people out, it is a
magnet
A A for spam and robots.
A A It also spreads viruses faster than $10 hooker, because there
are
A A several of you that use it that do not have proper software and
you
A A guys infect the server and everybody else weekly.
A A It literally keeps three people (Gerry Womack, Asa Jay and Ed
Mendez)
A A busy every day to keep it operational, we all owe them a huge
debt for
A A their service.
A A The new website is pretty hack proof, has awesome security and
best of
A A all, a 24 hour tech support line.
A A It will be a problem for somebody else now.
A A We hope you visit the new forum.
A A Michael
A A AA A On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 6:23 PM, Corey Price
A A <[1][1][7]coreyjprice at gmail.com>
A A AA A wrote:
A A AA A Since I hadA my membership privileges removed from the PI
forum
A A AA A ???
A A AA A Jeff
A A References
A A AA A 1. mailto:[2][8]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A _______________________________________________
A A Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
A A Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A [3][9]DeTomaso at poca.com
A A [4][10]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
A A To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.)
A A use the links above.
References
A A 1. mailto:[11]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A 2. mailto:[12]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A 3. mailto:[13]DeTomaso at poca.com
A A 4. [14]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
_______________________________________________
Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
DeTomaso mailing list
[15]DeTomaso at poca.com
[16]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use the links above.
References
1. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
2. mailto:michaelsavga at gmail.com
3. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
4. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
5. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
6. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
7. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
8. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
9. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
10. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
11. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
12. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
13. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
14. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
15. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
16. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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