[DeTomaso] NPC: Calf title paperwork

Sat Sep 19 01:22:43 EDT 2015

I am not familiar with shippers evaluating items as to their representation.. The buyer has to arrange for local inspection and evaluation and the shipper only moves it without damage 

In Ca dealers do not own vehicles in the sense that they pay purchase tax on them and register them in their name. Ca extracts a 9% or so tax every time a car officially changes ownership and dealers do not have to do that

I think the paperwork is in order

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

-----Original Message-----
From: audionut <audionut at hushmail.com>
To: Pantdino <pantdino at aol.com>; detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
Sent: Fri, Sep 18, 2015 04:39 PM
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: Calf title paperwork

<div id="AOLMsgPart_2_1be04e39-009c-4c4a-b806-a131eb88ca1e">
<div class="aolReplacedBody">
 <span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 13px;">I am not saying that I've had sellers release property without being paid.
  <div>

I have done out-of-state purchases with private parties with deposit paid up front and then balance paid when MY shipper verifies that the vehicle is in the condition I expect it to be in.  The shipper I hire has final payment in hand made out to the seller.  I did this with a motorcycle purchase in FL and the seller still managed to burn me for about 1,000.00 since my shipper did not detect certain missing/damaged parts.  (the guy was selling 2 identical bikes, one of them a parts bike in boxes he claimed was complete, but it turned out to be nowhere near complete.)

With an out-of-state dealer demanding paperwork nonsense like this, I haven't a clue.  Sounds like he's got Larry over a barrel because the title isn't clear.  My advice would be try to get your money back, Larry.  Failing that, jump through the hoops and hope for the best.

Out-of-state transactions are always VERY risky.  There are lots of ways that a buyer can get burned.  If this dealer doesn't clear the title first without involving Larry, he is a crook.

   <div>

 Sent using Hushmail

On September 18, 2015 at 2:43 PM, "Pantdino" <<a href="mailto:pantdino at aol.com">pantdino at aol.com</a>> wrote:
    <blockquote style="border-left:solid 1px #ccc;margin-left:10px;padding-left:10px;">

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

-----Original Message-----

From: audionut <<a href="mailto:audionut at hushmail.com">audionut at hushmail.com</a>>

To: Larry - Ohio Time <<a href="mailto:larry at ohiotimecorp.com">larry at ohiotimecorp.com</a>>; detomaso <<a href="mailto:detomaso at poca.com">detomaso at poca.com</a>>

Sent: Thu, Sep 17, 2015 02:34 PM

Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: Calf title paperwork

     <div id="aolmail_AOLMsgPart_1.2_b9428a41-be5e-4926-930c-3c03e771026c" style="font-size:12px;color:#000;background-color:#fff;margin:0;"> 
      <pre style="font-family:Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:9pt;"><tt>Hey Larry--

Audio nut are you saying you have had sellers allow you to ship a car out of state to you before you paid them?  </tt></pre>
      <pre style="font-size:9pt;"><span style="font-size:9pt;">If so they are more trusting than a reasonable person would be</span></pre>
      <pre style="font-size:9pt;"><span style="font-family:Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:9pt;">Usually a car doesn't move until the seller has had funds wired to his account  </span>
</pre>
      <pre style="font-family:Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:9pt;"><tt>
   Do you have possession of the car and a bill of sale?  If
yes, read on.
   (If not, you are in a pickle and hopefully you haven't paid
any money).

   Never mind DMV CA or NV or the used car dealer.  As long
as you have
   the car in Ohio, you can ignore them.  It is up to the seller to
report
   the vehicle as sold and you have no obligation to a former state
DMV.
   What matters is what Ohio requires to plate it.   As long as you have
a
   bill of sale you should be fine.  Check with your local DMV and ask

them how you title a car you bought "bill of sale only".

   In CA I have
purchased cars, motorcycles with screwed-up paperwork from
   other states or
no official paperwork at all.  All I do is toss the
   out-of-state paperwork
and take a handwritten bill of sale to the DMV,
   fill out their "bill of
sale" form and pay their fees.  Never had a
   problem getting a plate and
sticker right then and there.  Sometimes
   they need to look at the VIN,
sometimes they don't.

   This always works because documentation carried by
owners is commonly
   lost or destroyed.  Sometimes a seller will slack-off and
not report a
   vehicle being sold either.  All DMV's have a procedure for
dealing with
   this.  A bill of sale between you and the seller indicating VIN
#
   should be all you need.

   What any DMV is really looking out for is
that the vehicle has not been
   reported stolen and it would appear that you
are in the clear.

   Sent using Hushmail
   On September 17, 2015 at 9:32
AM, "Larry - Ohio Time"
   <<a>Larry at ohiotimecorp.com</a>> wrote:

     Ok guys I
pulled the trigger and bought a Jaguar from California and
     paid
     for
it. Today I get a packet of paperwork from the used car dealer.
     Boy this

is not how we do it in the grand old state of Ohio. Look at this
     mess.

1. I get a Nevada title for the car in the name of the lady who
     traded

it to a Honda dealer in Las Vegas. The back of the title is signed
     over
to
     California Auto Auction. Nothing is notarized.
     2. I get a small
form from Cal DMV "vehicle auction wholesale report
     of
     sale". It
shows the auction name and the used car dealer's name as
     buyer.

Nothing is notarized.
     3. I get a form from Cal DMV, "vehicle/vessel
transfer and
     reassignment
     form". Looks to be a bill of sale from the
auction company to the
     used car
     dealer.
     4. I get a form from
Cal DMV, "vehicle/vessel transfer and
     reassignment
     form" Looks to be
a bill of sale from the used car dealer to me. It
     is
     asking for my
signature and returned to them. It also asks for my
     signature
     to
appoint the used car dealer to be my power of attorney to
     complete

necessary paperwork and transfer ownership. Hmmmm.
     5. I get a form
"contract cancellation option agreement" looking for
     my
     signature to
decline it.
     Is any of this normal? We call this skipping a title here and
it is
     not a
     legal thing to do. Do I just sign all this before the
car gets here?
     Did he
     really ship it yet?
     In Ohio a dealer
buys a car. He gets a title that has the back
     filled in
     with his
name, miles and a notarized signature of the seller. The
     dealer

transfers the tile into there name and get a new title. When it is
     sold
the
     same thing happens.simple.
     Larry (lost) - Cleveland
</tt></pre> 

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      <pre style="font-size:9pt;"><tt>_______________________________________________

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    </blockquote>
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-------------- next part --------------
   I am not familiar with shippers evaluating items as to their
   representation.. The buyer has to arrange for local inspection and
   evaluation and the shipper only moves it without damage

   In Ca dealers do not own vehicles in the sense that they pay purchase
   tax on them and register them in their name. Ca extracts a 9% or so tax
   every time a car officially changes ownership and dealers do not have
   to do that

   I think the paperwork is in order
   Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
   -----Original Message-----
   From: audionut <audionut at hushmail.com>
   To: Pantdino <pantdino at aol.com>; detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
   Sent: Fri, Sep 18, 2015 04:39 PM
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: Calf title paperwork
   I am not saying that I've had sellers release property without being
   paid.

   I have done out-of-state purchases with private parties with deposit
   paid up front and then balance paid when MY shipper verifies that the
   vehicle is in the condition I expect it to be in.  The shipper I hire
   has final payment in hand made out to the seller.  I did this with a
   motorcycle purchase in FL and the seller still managed to burn me for
   about 1,000.00 since my shipper did not detect certain missing/damaged
   parts.  (the guy was selling 2 identical bikes, one of them a parts
   bike in boxes he claimed was complete, but it turned out to be nowhere
   near complete.)

   With an out-of-state dealer demanding paperwork nonsense like this, I
   haven't a clue.  Sounds like he's got Larry over a barrel because the
   title isn't clear.  My advice would be try to get your money back,
   Larry.  Failing that, jump through the hoops and hope for the best.

   Out-of-state transactions are always VERY risky.  There are lots of
   ways that a buyer can get burned.  If this dealer doesn't clear the
   title first without involving Larry, he is a crook.
   Sent using Hushmail
   On September 18, 2015 at 2:43 PM, "Pantdino" <[1]pantdino at aol.com>
   wrote:

     Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
     -----Original Message-----
     From: audionut <[2]audionut at hushmail.com>
     To: Larry - Ohio Time <[3]larry at ohiotimecorp.com>; detomaso
     <[4]detomaso at poca.com>
     Sent: Thu, Sep 17, 2015 02:34 PM
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: Calf title paperwork

Hey Larry--

Audio nut are you saying you have had sellers allow you to ship a car out of sta
te to you before you paid them?
If so they are more trusting than a reasonable person would be
Usually a car doesn't move until the seller has had funds wired to his account

   Do you have possession of the car and a bill of sale?  If
yes, read on.
   (If not, you are in a pickle and hopefully you haven't paid
any money).

   Never mind DMV CA or NV or the used car dealer.  As long
as you have
   the car in Ohio, you can ignore them.  It is up to the seller to
report
   the vehicle as sold and you have no obligation to a former state
DMV.
   What matters is what Ohio requires to plate it.   As long as you have
a
   bill of sale you should be fine.  Check with your local DMV and ask

them how you title a car you bought "bill of sale only".

   In CA I have
purchased cars, motorcycles with screwed-up paperwork from
   other states or
no official paperwork at all.  All I do is toss the
   out-of-state paperwork
and take a handwritten bill of sale to the DMV,
   fill out their "bill of
sale" form and pay their fees.  Never had a
   problem getting a plate and
sticker right then and there.  Sometimes
   they need to look at the VIN,
sometimes they don't.

   This always works because documentation carried by
owners is commonly
   lost or destroyed.  Sometimes a seller will slack-off and
not report a
   vehicle being sold either.  All DMV's have a procedure for
dealing with
   this.  A bill of sale between you and the seller indicating VIN
#
   should be all you need.

   What any DMV is really looking out for is
that the vehicle has not been
   reported stolen and it would appear that you
are in the clear.

   Sent using Hushmail
   On September 17, 2015 at 9:32
AM, "Larry - Ohio Time"
   <Larry at ohiotimecorp.com> wrote:

     Ok guys I
pulled the trigger and bought a Jaguar from California and
     paid
     for
it. Today I get a packet of paperwork from the used car dealer.
     Boy this

is not how we do it in the grand old state of Ohio. Look at this
     mess.

1. I get a Nevada title for the car in the name of the lady who
     traded

it to a Honda dealer in Las Vegas. The back of the title is signed
     over
to
     California Auto Auction. Nothing is notarized.
     2. I get a small
form from Cal DMV "vehicle auction wholesale report
     of
     sale". It
shows the auction name and the used car dealer's name as
     buyer.

Nothing is notarized.
     3. I get a form from Cal DMV, "vehicle/vessel
transfer and
     reassignment
     form". Looks to be a bill of sale from the
auction company to the
     used car
     dealer.
     4. I get a form from
Cal DMV, "vehicle/vessel transfer and
     reassignment
     form" Looks to be
a bill of sale from the used car dealer to me. It
     is
     asking for my
signature and returned to them. It also asks for my
     signature
     to
appoint the used car dealer to be my power of attorney to
     complete

necessary paperwork and transfer ownership. Hmmmm.
     5. I get a form
"contract cancellation option agreement" looking for
     my
     signature to
decline it.
     Is any of this normal? We call this skipping a title here and
it is
     not a
     legal thing to do. Do I just sign all this before the
car gets here?
     Did he
     really ship it yet?
     In Ohio a dealer
buys a car. He gets a title that has the back
     filled in
     with his
name, miles and a notarized signature of the seller. The
     dealer

transfers the tile into there name and get a new title. When it is
     sold
the
     same thing happens.simple.
     Larry (lost) - Cleveland

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References

   1. mailto:pantdino at aol.com
   2. mailto:audionut at hushmail.com
   3. mailto:larry at ohiotimecorp.com
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