[DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine... and Rockets
Daniel C Jones
daniel.c.jones2 at gmail.com
Fri May 16 19:53:01 EDT 2014
> They were strong onto inventing the Atomic Bomb
The German nuclear bomb effort appears to have been crippled by a couple of
serious mistakes. First, the Germans concluded that graphite (carbon) was
inadequate as neutron moderator and chose to go instead with heavy water.
In the United States, Enrico Fermi and Leo Szilard figured out the problem
with graphite was impurities and were able to use a purified boron-free
graphite as a moderator and successfully achieve a chain reaction. Second,
Heisnberg apparently miscalculated the critical mass required for a uranium
fission bomb. When asked by War Minister Speer if an atomic bomb was
feasible, Heisenberg said it was but that the time required to produce the
U-235 was not practical, prompting Speer to shut the German atomic bomb
project down in 1943.
Ironically, one of Heisenberg's students got the calculation right. I
forget the student's name but he was Jewish and had escaped to England.
Because he was not an English citizen, he was not allowed to work on highly
classified projects like RADAR, so he kept busy thinking about making an
atomic bomb. He correctly calculated the amount of material required (a
sphere only a few inches in diameter versus the several feet diameter
Heisenberg had assumed). Apparently, it was this bit of information that
lit a fire under the U.S. effort. If Heisenberg's student could do it,
then certainly Heisenberg could and the Germans had a substantial head
start ... or so the Allies thought.
Declassified tapes and Bohr's personal journals make it pretty clear that
Heisenberg had gotten it wrong. Heisenberg and several other German
scientists were captured and taken to the Farm Hill house in England, where
they were secretly audio-taped for 6 months. When we dropped the first
A-bomb on Japan, Heisenberg and the other scientists initially believed it
was a hoax because there was no way the U.S. could come up with the
required material in such a short time. When it became apparent the A-bomb
was a reality, Heisenberg asked how we had come up with so much material.
In one conversation with fellow physicist Otto Hahn, Heisenberg said he had
never actually calculated the critical mass required for an atomic bomb
because he didn't believe they would never get enough pure U-235.
The Japanese also had an atomic bomb program there were basically two
projects. The first was a Navy program on one of the home islands, which
apparently was on the right track theoretically but had only a couple of
professors and little funding. The other one was much larger and situated
at Chosan in Korea. Chosan was Japan's equivalent to Oak Ridge but little
came of it. The Chosan facility was captured by the Soviet Army at the end
of the war and the equipment sent to Mother Russia.
Dan Jones
On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 10:08 AM, Himes, Terry (397C) <
terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
> Not entirely true. WvB resisted the Nazi's and was even thrown in
> prison towards the end of the war. It was
> Heinrich Himmler and Kammler who ordered the use of forced labor. WvB
> was under surveillance since 1943
> by the Nazi's. WvB and his top engineers, Riedel & Grottrup were
> expressing deep regret that they were building
> instruments of war and not spaceships. A young female dentist who was
> an SS spy reported their private conversations
> and WvB was put in a Gestapo cell in Stettin. Dornberger was able to
> obtain his conditional release from Hitler himself.
> Orders to terminate WvB and his engineers was given if the war efforts
> started failing.
> This was all reported by French historian and a survivor of the
> Mittelbau-Dora concentration camp.
> After his defection to the US WvB worked with Pickering (JPL Dir) and
> Jack Parsons to combine the power of the V2 and
> our command & guidance systems. By early 1957 they were ready to
> launch a satellite into space. But Eisenhower told them
> to "Stand-Down" and gave the contract to the Navy (Vanguard) systems.
> Brilliant!! Total failure! Meanwhile, the
> Russians beat us into space with Sputnik. Eisenhower knew he screwed
> up, and told Pickering to go ahead. We (JPL/Caltech)
> launched Explorer 1 in Jan 1958. Nasa was formed in 1958.
> WvB was made head of NASA in 1960. WvB was a hero and got us to the
> moon, along with lots and lots of other American
> engineers.
> So you have to ask yourself. What would you do if someone put a gun to
> your head?
>
> "Sometimes I think the surest signs that intelligent life
>
> exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried
>
> to contact us!"
>
> Terry W. Himes
>
> JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory
>
> Deep Impact Sequence Team Lead
>
> Deep Impact Spacecraft Engineer & Activity Lead
>
> Rosetta/MEX/VEX Sequence Team Lead
>
> Phone: (818) 393-6261
>
> Cell: (818) 653-8213
>
> Fax: (818) 393-3147
>
> [1]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
>
> From: Pantdino <[2]pantdino at aol.com>
> Date: Thursday, May 15, 2014 11:06 PM
> To: Terry Himes <[3]Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov>,
> "[4]lotus0005 at hotmail.com" <[5]lotus0005 at hotmail.com>,
> "[6]detomaso at poca.com" <[7]detomaso at poca.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine... and Rockets
>
> "Defection" of vB? Because he used slave labor to build his V2
> rockets, which in themselves were designed to kill civilians, he should
> have been tried as a war criminal. But because we needed his expertise
> he became a great American hero.
>
> Just like Klaus Barbie, who tortured French Resistance fighters to
> death, got a pass from us because we needed his knowledge of where
> commies were active.
>
>
>
> Jim Oddie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Himes, Terry (397C) (397C) <[8]terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov>
> To: Bill Lewis <[9]lotus0005 at hotmail.com>; detomaso
> <[10]detomaso at poca.com>
> Sent: Thu, May 15, 2014 11:20 am
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine... and Rockets
> If you attend the JPL Tour on June 2nd, right after the Run Rally, I
> will be giving a short talk about the
> history of JPL/Caltech/NASA. Which includes the defection of Werner
> von Braun, 120 of the top German
> engineers, 300 train-car loads of rocket parts and 62 V2's. While the
> V2's were powerful, the Germans
> did not have the guidance & control. That came from JPL. Very
> interesting stuff.
>
> "Sometimes I think the surest signs that intelligent life
>
> exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried
>
> to contact us!"
>
> Terry W. Himes
>
> JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory
>
> Deep Impact Sequence Team Lead
>
> Deep Impact Spacecraft Engineer & Activity Lead
>
> Rosetta/MEX/VEX Sequence Team Lead
>
> Phone: (818) 393-6261
>
> Cell: (818) 653-8213
>
> Fax: (818) 393-3147
>
> [1][11]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
>
> From: Bill Lewis <[2][12]lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
> Date: Thursday, May 15, 2014 10:56 AM
> To: "[3][13]detomaso at poca.com" <[4][14]detomaso at poca.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine...
>
> The little that I have learned from watching the military channel, it
> seems that Germany was about a year away from winning the war - BIG
> Time! When VictoryEurope occurred, they already had jet plane fighters
> flying. They were strong onto inventing the Atomic Bomb - and many
> other military machines. Their downfall (among others) was invading
> Russia. Ironic how many of their top scientists were pure Jewish, or
> mixed blood, certainly German by nationality. ---BILL Lewis
> Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 15:32:46 -0400
> From: [5][15]boyd411 at gmail.com
> To: [6][16]detomaso at poca.com
> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine...
> NPC: Very Interesting info about Japanese I 400 submarines
> *Japanese WWII Submarine...*
> *If you haven't seen the attached info before, it is mind boggling!*
> [7][17]http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
> _______________________________________________
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [8][18]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [9][19]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
> References
>
> 1. [20]mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
> 2. [21]mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
> 3. [22]mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 4. [23]mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 5. [24]mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
> 6. [25]mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 7. [26]http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
> 8. [27]mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
> 9. [28]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [29]DeTomaso at poca.com[30]
> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
> References
>
> 1. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
> 2. mailto:pantdino at aol.com
> 3. mailto:Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov
> 4. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
> 5. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
> 6. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 7. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 8. mailto:terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov
> 9. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
> 10. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 11. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
> 12. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
> 13. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 14. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 15. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
> 16. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 17. http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
> 18. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
> 19. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> 20. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov?
> 21. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com?
> 22. mailto:detomaso at poca.com?
> 23. mailto:detomaso at poca.com?
> 24. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com?
> 25. mailto:detomaso at poca.com?
> 26. http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
> 27. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com?
> 28. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> 29. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
> 30. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at poca.com
> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
> They were strong onto inventing the Atomic Bomb
The German nuclear bomb effort appears to have been crippled by a
couple of serious mistakes.A First, the Germans concluded that
graphite (carbon) was inadequate as neutron moderator and chose to go
instead with heavy water.A In the United States, Enrico Fermi and Leo
Szilard figured out the problem with graphite was impurities and were
able to use a purified boron-free graphite as a moderator and
successfully achieve a chain reaction.A Second, Heisnberg apparently
miscalculated the critical mass required for a uranium fission bomb.A
When asked by War Minister Speer if an atomic bomb was feasible,
Heisenberg said it was but that the time required to produce the U-235
was not practical, prompting Speer to shut the German atomic bomb
project down in 1943.
Ironically, one of Heisenberg's students got the calculation right.A A
I forget the student's name but he was Jewish and had escaped to
England.A Because he was not an English citizen, he was not allowed to
work on highly classified projects like RADAR, so he kept busy thinking
about making an atomic bomb.A He correctly calculated the amount of
material required (a sphere only a few inches in diameter versus the
several feet diameter Heisenberg had assumed).A Apparently, it was
this bit of information that lit a fire under the U.S. effort.A If
Heisenberg's student could do it, then certainly Heisenberg could and
the Germans had a substantial head start ... or so the Allies thought.
Declassified tapes and Bohr's personal journals make it pretty clear
that Heisenberg had gotten it wrong.A Heisenberg and several other
German scientists were captured and taken to the Farm Hill house in
England, where they were secretly audio-taped for 6 months.A When we
dropped the first A-bomb on Japan, Heisenberg and the other scientists
initially believed it was a hoax because there was no way the U.S.
could come up with the required material in such a short time.A When
it became apparent the A-bomb was a reality, Heisenberg asked how we
had come up with so much material. In one conversation with fellow
physicist Otto Hahn, Heisenberg said he had never actually calculated
the critical mass required for an atomic bomb because he didn't believe
they would never get enough pure U-235.
The Japanese also had an atomicA bomb program there were basically two
projects. The first was a Navy program on one of the home islands,
which apparently was on the right track theoretically but had only a
couple of professors and little funding. The other one was much larger
and situated at Chosan in Korea.A Chosan was Japan's equivalent to Oak
Ridge but little came of it.A The Chosan facility was captured by the
Soviet Army at the end of the war and the equipment sent to Mother
Russia.
Dan Jones
On Fri, May 16, 2014 at 10:08 AM, Himes, Terry (397C)
<[1]terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
A A Not entirely true. A WvB resisted the Nazi's and was even
thrown in
A A prison towards the end of the war. A It was
A A Heinrich Himmler and Kammler who ordered the use of forced
labor. A WvB
A A was under surveillance since 1943
A A by the Nazi's. A WvB and his top engineers, Riedel & Grottrup
were
A A expressing deep regret that they were building
A A instruments of war and not spaceships. A A young female dentist
who was
A A an SS spy reported their private conversations
A A and WvB was put in a Gestapo cell in Stettin. A Dornberger was
able to
A A obtain his conditional release from Hitler himself.
A A Orders to terminate WvB and his engineers was given if the war
efforts
A A started failing.
A A This was all reported by French historian and a survivor of the
A A Mittelbau-Dora concentration camp.
A A After his defection to the US WvB worked with Pickering (JPL
Dir) and
A A Jack Parsons to combine the power of the V2 and
A A our command & guidance systems. A By early 1957 they were ready
to
A A launch a satellite into space. A But Eisenhower told them
A A to "Stand-Down" and gave the contract to the Navy (Vanguard)
systems.
A A Brilliant!! A Total failure! A Meanwhile, the
A A Russians beat us into space with Sputnik. A Eisenhower knew he
screwed
A A up, and told Pickering to go ahead. A We (JPL/Caltech)
A A launched Explorer 1 in Jan 1958. A Nasa was formed in 1958.
A A WvB was made head of NASA in 1960. A WvB was a hero and got us
to the
A A moon, along with lots and lots of other American
A A engineers.
A A So you have to ask yourself. A What would you do if someone put
a gun to
A A your head?
A A "Sometimes I think the surest signs that intelligent life
A A A exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried
A A A to contact us!"
A A Terry W. Himes
A A JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory
A A Deep Impact Sequence Team Lead
A A Deep Impact Spacecraft Engineer & Activity Lead
A A Rosetta/MEX/VEX Sequence Team Lead
A A Phone: (818) 393-6261
A A Cell: A A (818) 653-8213
A A Fax: A A (818) 393-3147
A A [1][2]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
A A From: Pantdino <[2][3]pantdino at aol.com>
A A Date: Thursday, May 15, 2014 11:06 PM
A A To: Terry Himes <[3][4]Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov>,
A A "[4][5]lotus0005 at hotmail.com" <[5][6]lotus0005 at hotmail.com>,
A A "[6][7]detomaso at poca.com" <[7][8]detomaso at poca.com>
A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine... and
Rockets
A A "Defection" of vB? A Because he used slave labor to A build his
V2
A A rockets, which in themselves were designed to kill civilians,
he should
A A have been tried as a war criminal. A But because we needed his
expertise
A A he became a great American hero.
A A Just like Klaus Barbie, who tortured French Resistance fighters
to
A A death, got a pass from us because we needed his knowledge of
where
A A commies were active.
A A Jim Oddie
A A -----Original Message-----
A A From: Himes, Terry (397C) (397C) <[8][9]terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov>
A A To: Bill Lewis <[9][10]lotus0005 at hotmail.com>; detomaso
A A <[10][11]detomaso at poca.com>
A A Sent: Thu, May 15, 2014 11:20 am
A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine... and
Rockets
A A If you attend the JPL Tour on June 2nd, right after the Run Rally,
I
A A will be giving a short talk about the
A A history of JPL/Caltech/NASA. A Which includes the defection of
Werner
A A von Braun, 120 of the top German
A A engineers, 300 train-car loads of rocket parts and 62 V2's.
A While the
A A V2's were powerful, the Germans
A A did not have the guidance & control. A That came from JPL. A Very
A A interesting stuff.
A A "Sometimes I think the surest signs that intelligent life
A A A exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried
A A A to contact us!"
A A Terry W. Himes
A A JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory
A A Deep Impact Sequence Team Lead
A A Deep Impact Spacecraft Engineer & Activity Lead
A A Rosetta/MEX/VEX Sequence Team Lead
A A Phone: (818) 393-6261
A A Cell: A A (818) 653-8213
A A Fax: A A (818) 393-3147
A A [1][11][12]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
A A From: Bill Lewis <[2][12][13]lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
A A Date: Thursday, May 15, 2014 10:56 AM
A A To: "[3][13][14]detomaso at poca.com"
<[4][14][15]detomaso at poca.com>
A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine...
A A The little that I have learned from watching the military channel,
it
A A seems that Germany was about a year away from winning the war -
BIG
A A Time! A When VictoryEurope occurred, they already had jet plane
fighters
A A flying. A They were strong onto inventing the Atomic Bomb - and
many
A A other military machines. A Their downfall (among others) was
invading
A A Russia. A Ironic how many of their top scientists were pure
Jewish, or
A A mixed blood, certainly German by nationality. A A ---BILL Lewis
A A Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 15:32:46 -0400
A A From: [5][15][16]boyd411 at gmail.com
A A To: [6][16][17]detomaso at poca.com
A A Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: Japanese WWII Submarine...
A A NPC: Very Interesting info about Japanese I 400 submarines
A A *Japanese WWII Submarine...*
A A A *If you haven't seen the attached info before, it is mind
boggling!*
A A A
[7][17][18]http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
A A _______________________________________________
A A Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A [8][18][19]DeTomaso at poca.com
A A [9][19][20]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
References
A A 1. [20]mailto:[21]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
A A 2. [21]mailto:[22]lotus0005 at hotmail.com
A A 3. [22]mailto:[23]detomaso at poca.com
A A 4. [23]mailto:[24]detomaso at poca.com
A A 5. [24]mailto:[25]boyd411 at gmail.com
A A 6. [25]mailto:[26]detomaso at poca.com
A A 7. [26][27]http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
A A 8. [27]mailto:[28]DeTomaso at poca.com
A A 9. [28][29]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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References
A A 1. mailto:[32]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
A A 2. mailto:[33]pantdino at aol.com
A A 3. mailto:[34]Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov
A A 4. mailto:[35]lotus0005 at hotmail.com
A A 5. mailto:[36]lotus0005 at hotmail.com
A A 6. mailto:[37]detomaso at poca.com
A A 7. mailto:[38]detomaso at poca.com
A A 8. mailto:[39]terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov
A A 9. mailto:[40]lotus0005 at hotmail.com
A 10. mailto:[41]detomaso at poca.com
A 11. mailto:[42]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
A 12. mailto:[43]lotus0005 at hotmail.com
A 13. mailto:[44]detomaso at poca.com
A 14. mailto:[45]detomaso at poca.com
A 15. mailto:[46]boyd411 at gmail.com
A 16. mailto:[47]detomaso at poca.com
A 17. [48]http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
A 18. mailto:[49]DeTomaso at poca.com
A 19. [50]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
A 20. mailto:[51]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov?
A 21. mailto:[52]lotus0005 at hotmail.com?
A 22. mailto:[53]detomaso at poca.com?
A 23. mailto:[54]detomaso at poca.com?
A 24. mailto:[55]boyd411 at gmail.com?
A 25. mailto:[56]detomaso at poca.com?
A 26. [57]http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
A 27. mailto:[58]DeTomaso at poca.com?
A 28. [59]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
A 29. mailto:[60]DeTomaso at poca.com
A 30. [61]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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References
1. mailto:terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov
2. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
3. mailto:pantdino at aol.com
4. mailto:Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov
5. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
6. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
7. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
8. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
9. mailto:terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov
10. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
11. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
12. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
13. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
14. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
15. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
16. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
17. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
18. http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
19. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
20. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
21. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
22. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
23. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
24. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
25. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
26. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
27. http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
28. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
29. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
30. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
31. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
32. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
33. mailto:pantdino at aol.com
34. mailto:Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov
35. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
36. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
37. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
38. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
39. mailto:terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov
40. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
41. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
42. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
43. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
44. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
45. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
46. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
47. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
48. http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
49. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
50. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
51. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
52. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
53. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
54. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
55. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
56. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
57. http://www.operationstormbook.com/i400_images.html
58. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
59. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
60. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
61. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
62. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
63. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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