[DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS

Boyd Casey boyd411 at gmail.com
Thu Apr 17 11:13:01 EDT 2014


To paraphrase Clint Eastwood " You have to ask yourself , Do you really
want to have your nuts welded?, well do ya punk?"


On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 11:09 AM, Boyd Casey <boyd411 at gmail.com> wrote:

> My car is a 1973 L # 5783 and it does not have welded nuts so I believe it
> was probably done on Asa's car by a previous owner. I own a pressure
> bleeder and although I have used it on my brakes I have not tried it on the
> clutch master . I didn't have the necessary attachment to use it on the
> clutch master and the speed bleeder is less expensive then the power
> bleeder attachment and works so well I didn't see the benefit in using the
> power bleeder ,( which can be messy and requires a substantial amount of
> hydraulic fluid ( 1 quart plus  of which the majority is wasted.) The power
> bleeder needs over a quart to work and the master only uses a few ounces
> and all the extra fluid needed to use the power bleeder  needs to be
> disposed of after you bleed the system. I suppose if you had a shop where
> you bleed brakes and clutches everyday it might make economical sense ( if
> all the cars you did used the same brake fluid) but for me a SS speed
> bleeder  is a superior choice. A SS speed bleeder costs around  $15 and
> with a plastic tube and catch bottle it  doesn't make any type of mess . If
> you have speed bleeders installed you can bleed your clutch or brakes
> anywhere, and by yourself , in just a few minutes  with no other tools
> other then the appropriate bleed screw wrench and a bottle of brake fluid.
> If you believe in the concept of "keep it simple" it doesn't get much
> simpler then this!
> I have to give credit to Bob Levitt ( President of the Long Island POCA
> group and known for his participation  in the "Gumball" event) who turned
> me on to the use of speed bleeders.
> Boyd
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> I agree with Will - you could limp along just fine. I lost a clutch slave
>> cylinder on the first day of a 3-day supercar event 2 years ago. I spent
>> the
>> whole weekend driving without the clutch. It wasn't quick driving like
>> that,
>> nor was it a lot of fun but it could be done. The worst was coming to a
>> stoplight :-(
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of Will
>> Kooiman
>> Sent: jueves, 17 de abril de 2014 15:55
>> To: Asa Jay Laughton
>> Cc: detomaso at poca.com
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
>>
>> I would not attempt a clutch master swap on the road.  It is generally
>> easy
>> enough to drive without a clutch.
>>
>> I once lost the clutch in my 68 mustang.  I drove 200 miles without it.  I
>> think the synchros are better in a top loader, but I would hope I could
>> shift a ZF clutch less.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On Apr 17, 2014, at 9:42 AM, Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi Chuck,
>> >
>> > My Pantera is THPNNP05533.  It's been a few years since I was under the
>> > dash, but a I recall it looked like a home job of welding.  But then
>> > again, factory welding might look the same.  However; I would think if
>> > it had been a factory job, more folks would have noticed in their cars.
>> >
>> > I've been busy of late and was hoping to locate the O2 sensor this
>> > weekend, pull the exhaust on that side and have my friend drill for the
>> > bung and weld in the bung and then I could begin testing.  I also picked
>> > up some tools that might help me look at ignition pulses; I have to get
>> > in the garage and test that too.
>> >
>> > This weekend was supposed to be free enough to begin all that but I
>> > think things are already piling in that are non-car related.  <sigh>
>> >
>> > Asa  Jay
>> >
>> > Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>> > & Shelley Marie
>> > Spokane, WA
>> > ******************************
>> > http://www.racingagainstautism.com
>> > http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>> > http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
>> >
>> >
>> >> On 4/17/2014 5:35 AM, cengles at cox.net wrote:
>> >> Dear Asa,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>                 Hmmm.   You have an L model Pantera.  What is the
>> >> VIN?   I wonder if that is an Italian assembly line spontaneous
>> >> variation, a standard feature of the late model Pantera L or the
>> >> aftermath of a previous job.   My Panteras are 7000 series VINs and I
>> >> hope that they have the welding.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>                                   Warmest regards,  Chuck Engles
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> PS: how is the Innovate field testing going?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 10:21 PM, Asa Jay Laughton wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I believe on mine, when I went to install the wrench under the dash I
>> >>> found the nuts welded.  One man job from the outside.
>> >>>
>> >>> Asa  Jay
>> >>>
>> >>> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>> >>> & Shelley Marie
>> >>> Spokane, WA
>> >>> ******************************
>> >>> http://www.racingagainstautism.com
>> >>> http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>> >>> http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> On 4/16/2014 7:32 PM, Charles Engles wrote:
>> >>>> Dear Boyd,
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>             I do understand that it is a very unpleasant job.   I
>> >> do have a Pantera reference from Scandanavia, IIRC, which shows a
>> >> modification that uses a hole saw to cut an access hole in the
>> >> passenger side of the box about three inches in diameter.  From what I
>> >> understand, it permits sight and access to the dreaded inaccessible
>> >> dark recess behind the dash.   I have not done this job nor have I
>> >> done this mod, but from what I think I know, it could make the task a
>> >> darn sight easier.   The original author reported that once the hole
>> >> is made and used and the job is done, then it can be plugged,
>> >> tastefully, with a common commercially available plastic plug.
>> >> Perhaps someone has first hand experience with this trick?
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>                       Clutch master cylinder rookie,  Chuck Engles
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> -----Original Message-----
>> >>>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of
>> >> Boyd Casey
>> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 9:18 PM
>> >>>> To: mike Drew
>> >>>> Cc: detomaso at poca.com; Bob Benson
>> >>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Changing a slave is no big deal , but I don't know how I would
>> >> change a clutch master on the side of the road, it's a two person job
>> >> ( one to hold a wrench under the dash and one the install the master)
>> >> and even then unless you have  a dwarf with you getting under the dash
>> >> and attaching the push rod and getting access to the bolts is a
>> >> nightmare. If there is some "Trick" to installing the clutch master I
>> >> wish someone would share it with me!
>> >>>> Boyd
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 7:49 PM, <MikeLDrew at aol.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>   In a message dated 4/16/14 15 49 50, rcbsons1 at aol.com writes:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>     New Pantera protocol is to carry a spare
>> >>>>>     Clutch master and slave.. that is what I am
>> >>>>>     doing now..  I have one of Rich's square ones
>> >>>>>     because original makes no difference to me...
>> >>>>>     need to remember to pack some brake fluid also
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> If, as he says, they need to be modified to fit, better
>> >> modify it
>> >>>>>   now rather than when you're stuck on the side of the road! :>)
>> >>>>>   Mike
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> >>>>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> >>>>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >>>>
>> >>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> >>>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> >>>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> -----
>> >>>> No virus found in this message.
>> >>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> >>>> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date:
>> >> 04/16/14
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>
>> >>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >>>
>> >>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> >>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> >>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>> >>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>
>> >> No virus found in this message.
>> >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
>> >> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date: 04/16/14
>> >>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> >
>> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >
>> > DeTomaso mailing list
>> > DeTomaso at poca.com
>> > http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
   To paraphrase Clint Eastwood " You have to ask yourself , Do you really
   want to have your nuts welded?, well do ya punk?"A

   On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 11:09 AM, Boyd Casey <[1]boyd411 at gmail.com>
   wrote:

   My car is a 1973 L # 5783 and it does not have welded nuts so I believe
   it was probably done on Asa's car by a previous owner. I own a pressure
   bleeder and although I have used it on my brakes I have not tried it on
   the clutch master . I didn't have the necessary attachment to use it on
   the clutch master and the speed bleeder is less expensive then the
   power bleeder attachment and works so well I didn't see the benefit in
   using the power bleeder ,( which can be messy and requires a
   substantial amount of hydraulic fluid ( 1 quart plus A of which the
   majority is wasted.) The power bleeder needs over a quart to work and
   the master only uses a few ounces and all the extra fluid needed to use
   the power bleeder A needs to be disposed of after you bleed the system.
   I suppose if you had a shop where you bleed brakes and clutches
   everyday it might make economical sense ( if all the cars you did used
   the same brake fluid) but for me a SS speed bleeder A is a superior
   choice. A SS speed bleeder costs around A $15 and with a plastic tube
   and catch bottle it A doesn't make any type of mess . If you have speed
   bleeders installed you can bleed your clutch or brakes anywhere, and by
   yourself , in just a few minutes A with no other tools other then the
   appropriate bleed screw wrench and a bottle of brake fluid. If you
   believe in the concept of "keep it simple" it doesn't get much simpler
   then this!
   I have to give credit to Bob Levitt ( President of the Long Island POCA
   group and known for his participation A in the "Gumball" event) who
   turned me on to the use of speed bleeders.
   Boyd

   On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Charles McCall
   <[2]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:

     I agree with Will - you could limp along just fine. I lost a clutch
     slave
     cylinder on the first day of a 3-day supercar event 2 years ago. I
     spent the
     whole weekend driving without the clutch. It wasn't quick driving
     like that,
     nor was it a lot of fun but it could be done. The worst was coming
     to a
     stoplight :-(

   -----Original Message-----
   From: DeTomaso [mailto:[3]detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of Will
   Kooiman
   Sent: jueves, 17 de abril de 2014 15:55
   To: Asa Jay Laughton
   Cc: [4]detomaso at poca.com
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
   I would not attempt a clutch master swap on the road. A It is generally
   easy
   enough to drive without a clutch.
   I once lost the clutch in my 68 mustang. A I drove 200 miles without
   it. A I
   think the synchros are better in a top loader, but I would hope I could
   shift a ZF clutch less.
   Sent from my iPhone
   > On Apr 17, 2014, at 9:42 AM, Asa Jay Laughton <[5]asajay at asajay.com>
   wrote:
   >
   > Hi Chuck,
   >
   > My Pantera is THPNNP05533. A It's been a few years since I was under
   the
   > dash, but a I recall it looked like a home job of welding. A But then
   > again, factory welding might look the same. A However; I would think
   if
   > it had been a factory job, more folks would have noticed in their
   cars.
   >
   > I've been busy of late and was hoping to locate the O2 sensor this
   > weekend, pull the exhaust on that side and have my friend drill for
   the
   > bung and weld in the bung and then I could begin testing. A I also
   picked
   > up some tools that might help me look at ignition pulses; I have to
   get
   > in the garage and test that too.
   >
   > This weekend was supposed to be free enough to begin all that but I
   > think things are already piling in that are non-car related. A <sigh>
   >
   > Asa A Jay
   >
   > Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   > & Shelley Marie
   > Spokane, WA
   > ******************************
   > [6]http://www.racingagainstautism.com
   > [7]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   > [8]http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
   >
   >
   >> On 4/17/2014 5:35 AM, [9]cengles at cox.net wrote:
   >> Dear Asa,
   >>
   >>
   >>
   >> A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  Hmmm. A  You have an L model Pantera. A What
   is the
   >> VIN? A  I wonder if that is an Italian assembly line spontaneous
   >> variation, a standard feature of the late model Pantera L or the
   >> aftermath of a previous job. A  My Panteras are 7000 series VINs and
   I
   >> hope that they have the welding.
   >>
   >>
   >>
   >> A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  Warmest regards,
   A Chuck Engles
   >>
   >>
   >>
   >> PS: how is the Innovate field testing going?
   >>
   >>
   >>
   >>
   >>
   >>
   >>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 10:21 PM, Asa Jay Laughton wrote:
   >>>
   >>> I believe on mine, when I went to install the wrench under the dash
   I
   >>> found the nuts welded. A One man job from the outside.
   >>>
   >>> Asa A Jay
   >>>
   >>> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   >>> & Shelley Marie
   >>> Spokane, WA
   >>> ******************************
   >>> [10]http://www.racingagainstautism.com
   >>> [11]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   >>> [12]http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
   >>>
   >>>
   >>>> On 4/16/2014 7:32 PM, Charles Engles wrote:
   >>>> Dear Boyd,
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>> A  A  A  A  A  A  I do understand that it is a very unpleasant
   job. A  I
   >> do have a Pantera reference from Scandanavia, IIRC, which shows a
   >> modification that uses a hole saw to cut an access hole in the
   >> passenger side of the box about three inches in diameter. A From
   what I
   >> understand, it permits sight and access to the dreaded inaccessible
   >> dark recess behind the dash. A  I have not done this job nor have I
   >> done this mod, but from what I think I know, it could make the task
   a
   >> darn sight easier. A  The original author reported that once the
   hole
   >> is made and used and the job is done, then it can be plugged,
   >> tastefully, with a common commercially available plastic plug.
   >> Perhaps someone has first hand experience with this trick?
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>> A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  A  Clutch master cylinder rookie,
   A Chuck Engles
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>> -----Original Message-----
   >>>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:[13]detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of
   >> Boyd Casey
   >>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 9:18 PM
   >>>> To: mike Drew
   >>>> Cc: [14]detomaso at poca.com; Bob Benson
   >>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
   >>>>
   >>>> Changing a slave is no big deal , but I don't know how I would
   >> change a clutch master on the side of the road, it's a two person
   job
   >> ( one to hold a wrench under the dash and one the install the
   master)
   >> and even then unless you have A a dwarf with you getting under the
   dash
   >> and attaching the push rod and getting access to the bolts is a
   >> nightmare. If there is some "Trick" to installing the clutch master
   I
   >> wish someone would share it with me!
   >>>> Boyd
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 7:49 PM, <[15]MikeLDrew at aol.com> wrote:
   >>>>>
   >>>>> A  In a message dated 4/16/14 15 49 50, [16]rcbsons1 at aol.com
   writes:
   >>>>>
   >>>>> A  A  New Pantera protocol is to carry a spare
   >>>>> A  A  Clutch master and slave.. that is what I am
   >>>>> A  A  doing now.. A I have one of Rich's square ones
   >>>>> A  A  because original makes no difference to me...
   >>>>> A  A  need to remember to pack some brake fluid also
   >>>>>
   >>>>>>>> If, as he says, they need to be modified to fit, better
   >> modify it
   >>>>> A  now rather than when you're stuck on the side of the road! :>)
   >>>>> A  Mike
   >>>>>
   >>>>> _______________________________________________
   >>>>>
   >>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
   >>>>>
   >>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>>>> [17]DeTomaso at poca.com
   >>>>> [18]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
   >>>>>
   >>>>>
   >>>>
   >>>> _______________________________________________
   >>>>
   >>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
   >>>>
   >>>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>>> [19]DeTomaso at poca.com
   >>>> [20]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>> -----
   >>>> No virus found in this message.
   >>>> Checked by AVG - [21]www.avg.com
   >>>> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date:
   >> 04/16/14
   >>>>
   >>>>
   >>>
   >>> _______________________________________________
   >>>
   >>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
   >>>
   >>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>> [22]DeTomaso at poca.com
   >>> [23]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
   >>
   -----------------------------------------------------------------------
   -
   >>
   >> No virus found in this message.
   >> Checked by AVG - [24]www.avg.com <[25]http://www.avg.com>
   >> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date:
   04/16/14
   >>
   >
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
   >
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [26]DeTomaso at poca.com
   > [27]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [28]DeTomaso at poca.com
   [29]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [30]DeTomaso at poca.com
   [31]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com

References

   1. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
   2. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   3. mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com
   4. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
   5. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
   6. http://www.racingagainstautism.com/
   7. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   8. http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
   9. mailto:cengles at cox.net
  10. http://www.racingagainstautism.com/
  11. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  12. http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
  13. mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com
  14. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
  15. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
  16. mailto:rcbsons1 at aol.com
  17. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
  18. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
  19. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
  20. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
  21. http://www.avg.com/
  22. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
  23. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
  24. http://www.avg.com/
  25. http://www.avg.com/
  26. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
  27. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
  28. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
  29. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
  30. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
  31. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com


More information about the DeTomaso mailing list