[DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
Boyd Casey
boyd411 at gmail.com
Thu Apr 17 11:13:01 EDT 2014
To paraphrase Clint Eastwood " You have to ask yourself , Do you really
want to have your nuts welded?, well do ya punk?"
On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 11:09 AM, Boyd Casey <boyd411 at gmail.com> wrote:
> My car is a 1973 L # 5783 and it does not have welded nuts so I believe it
> was probably done on Asa's car by a previous owner. I own a pressure
> bleeder and although I have used it on my brakes I have not tried it on the
> clutch master . I didn't have the necessary attachment to use it on the
> clutch master and the speed bleeder is less expensive then the power
> bleeder attachment and works so well I didn't see the benefit in using the
> power bleeder ,( which can be messy and requires a substantial amount of
> hydraulic fluid ( 1 quart plus of which the majority is wasted.) The power
> bleeder needs over a quart to work and the master only uses a few ounces
> and all the extra fluid needed to use the power bleeder needs to be
> disposed of after you bleed the system. I suppose if you had a shop where
> you bleed brakes and clutches everyday it might make economical sense ( if
> all the cars you did used the same brake fluid) but for me a SS speed
> bleeder is a superior choice. A SS speed bleeder costs around $15 and
> with a plastic tube and catch bottle it doesn't make any type of mess . If
> you have speed bleeders installed you can bleed your clutch or brakes
> anywhere, and by yourself , in just a few minutes with no other tools
> other then the appropriate bleed screw wrench and a bottle of brake fluid.
> If you believe in the concept of "keep it simple" it doesn't get much
> simpler then this!
> I have to give credit to Bob Levitt ( President of the Long Island POCA
> group and known for his participation in the "Gumball" event) who turned
> me on to the use of speed bleeders.
> Boyd
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> I agree with Will - you could limp along just fine. I lost a clutch slave
>> cylinder on the first day of a 3-day supercar event 2 years ago. I spent
>> the
>> whole weekend driving without the clutch. It wasn't quick driving like
>> that,
>> nor was it a lot of fun but it could be done. The worst was coming to a
>> stoplight :-(
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of Will
>> Kooiman
>> Sent: jueves, 17 de abril de 2014 15:55
>> To: Asa Jay Laughton
>> Cc: detomaso at poca.com
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
>>
>> I would not attempt a clutch master swap on the road. It is generally
>> easy
>> enough to drive without a clutch.
>>
>> I once lost the clutch in my 68 mustang. I drove 200 miles without it. I
>> think the synchros are better in a top loader, but I would hope I could
>> shift a ZF clutch less.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On Apr 17, 2014, at 9:42 AM, Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi Chuck,
>> >
>> > My Pantera is THPNNP05533. It's been a few years since I was under the
>> > dash, but a I recall it looked like a home job of welding. But then
>> > again, factory welding might look the same. However; I would think if
>> > it had been a factory job, more folks would have noticed in their cars.
>> >
>> > I've been busy of late and was hoping to locate the O2 sensor this
>> > weekend, pull the exhaust on that side and have my friend drill for the
>> > bung and weld in the bung and then I could begin testing. I also picked
>> > up some tools that might help me look at ignition pulses; I have to get
>> > in the garage and test that too.
>> >
>> > This weekend was supposed to be free enough to begin all that but I
>> > think things are already piling in that are non-car related. <sigh>
>> >
>> > Asa Jay
>> >
>> > Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>> > & Shelley Marie
>> > Spokane, WA
>> > ******************************
>> > http://www.racingagainstautism.com
>> > http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>> > http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
>> >
>> >
>> >> On 4/17/2014 5:35 AM, cengles at cox.net wrote:
>> >> Dear Asa,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hmmm. You have an L model Pantera. What is the
>> >> VIN? I wonder if that is an Italian assembly line spontaneous
>> >> variation, a standard feature of the late model Pantera L or the
>> >> aftermath of a previous job. My Panteras are 7000 series VINs and I
>> >> hope that they have the welding.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> PS: how is the Innovate field testing going?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 10:21 PM, Asa Jay Laughton wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I believe on mine, when I went to install the wrench under the dash I
>> >>> found the nuts welded. One man job from the outside.
>> >>>
>> >>> Asa Jay
>> >>>
>> >>> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>> >>> & Shelley Marie
>> >>> Spokane, WA
>> >>> ******************************
>> >>> http://www.racingagainstautism.com
>> >>> http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>> >>> http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> On 4/16/2014 7:32 PM, Charles Engles wrote:
>> >>>> Dear Boyd,
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I do understand that it is a very unpleasant job. I
>> >> do have a Pantera reference from Scandanavia, IIRC, which shows a
>> >> modification that uses a hole saw to cut an access hole in the
>> >> passenger side of the box about three inches in diameter. From what I
>> >> understand, it permits sight and access to the dreaded inaccessible
>> >> dark recess behind the dash. I have not done this job nor have I
>> >> done this mod, but from what I think I know, it could make the task a
>> >> darn sight easier. The original author reported that once the hole
>> >> is made and used and the job is done, then it can be plugged,
>> >> tastefully, with a common commercially available plastic plug.
>> >> Perhaps someone has first hand experience with this trick?
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Clutch master cylinder rookie, Chuck Engles
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> -----Original Message-----
>> >>>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of
>> >> Boyd Casey
>> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 9:18 PM
>> >>>> To: mike Drew
>> >>>> Cc: detomaso at poca.com; Bob Benson
>> >>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Changing a slave is no big deal , but I don't know how I would
>> >> change a clutch master on the side of the road, it's a two person job
>> >> ( one to hold a wrench under the dash and one the install the master)
>> >> and even then unless you have a dwarf with you getting under the dash
>> >> and attaching the push rod and getting access to the bolts is a
>> >> nightmare. If there is some "Trick" to installing the clutch master I
>> >> wish someone would share it with me!
>> >>>> Boyd
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 7:49 PM, <MikeLDrew at aol.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> In a message dated 4/16/14 15 49 50, rcbsons1 at aol.com writes:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> New Pantera protocol is to carry a spare
>> >>>>> Clutch master and slave.. that is what I am
>> >>>>> doing now.. I have one of Rich's square ones
>> >>>>> because original makes no difference to me...
>> >>>>> need to remember to pack some brake fluid also
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> If, as he says, they need to be modified to fit, better
>> >> modify it
>> >>>>> now rather than when you're stuck on the side of the road! :>)
>> >>>>> Mike
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> >>>>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> >>>>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >>>>
>> >>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> >>>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> >>>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> -----
>> >>>> No virus found in this message.
>> >>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> >>>> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date:
>> >> 04/16/14
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>
>> >>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >>>
>> >>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> >>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> >>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>> >>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>
>> >> No virus found in this message.
>> >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
>> >> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date: 04/16/14
>> >>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> >
>> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> >
>> > DeTomaso mailing list
>> > DeTomaso at poca.com
>> > http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
To paraphrase Clint Eastwood " You have to ask yourself , Do you really
want to have your nuts welded?, well do ya punk?"A
On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 11:09 AM, Boyd Casey <[1]boyd411 at gmail.com>
wrote:
My car is a 1973 L # 5783 and it does not have welded nuts so I believe
it was probably done on Asa's car by a previous owner. I own a pressure
bleeder and although I have used it on my brakes I have not tried it on
the clutch master . I didn't have the necessary attachment to use it on
the clutch master and the speed bleeder is less expensive then the
power bleeder attachment and works so well I didn't see the benefit in
using the power bleeder ,( which can be messy and requires a
substantial amount of hydraulic fluid ( 1 quart plus A of which the
majority is wasted.) The power bleeder needs over a quart to work and
the master only uses a few ounces and all the extra fluid needed to use
the power bleeder A needs to be disposed of after you bleed the system.
I suppose if you had a shop where you bleed brakes and clutches
everyday it might make economical sense ( if all the cars you did used
the same brake fluid) but for me a SS speed bleeder A is a superior
choice. A SS speed bleeder costs around A $15 and with a plastic tube
and catch bottle it A doesn't make any type of mess . If you have speed
bleeders installed you can bleed your clutch or brakes anywhere, and by
yourself , in just a few minutes A with no other tools other then the
appropriate bleed screw wrench and a bottle of brake fluid. If you
believe in the concept of "keep it simple" it doesn't get much simpler
then this!
I have to give credit to Bob Levitt ( President of the Long Island POCA
group and known for his participation A in the "Gumball" event) who
turned me on to the use of speed bleeders.
Boyd
On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Charles McCall
<[2]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
I agree with Will - you could limp along just fine. I lost a clutch
slave
cylinder on the first day of a 3-day supercar event 2 years ago. I
spent the
whole weekend driving without the clutch. It wasn't quick driving
like that,
nor was it a lot of fun but it could be done. The worst was coming
to a
stoplight :-(
-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:[3]detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of Will
Kooiman
Sent: jueves, 17 de abril de 2014 15:55
To: Asa Jay Laughton
Cc: [4]detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
I would not attempt a clutch master swap on the road. A It is generally
easy
enough to drive without a clutch.
I once lost the clutch in my 68 mustang. A I drove 200 miles without
it. A I
think the synchros are better in a top loader, but I would hope I could
shift a ZF clutch less.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 17, 2014, at 9:42 AM, Asa Jay Laughton <[5]asajay at asajay.com>
wrote:
>
> Hi Chuck,
>
> My Pantera is THPNNP05533. A It's been a few years since I was under
the
> dash, but a I recall it looked like a home job of welding. A But then
> again, factory welding might look the same. A However; I would think
if
> it had been a factory job, more folks would have noticed in their
cars.
>
> I've been busy of late and was hoping to locate the O2 sensor this
> weekend, pull the exhaust on that side and have my friend drill for
the
> bung and weld in the bung and then I could begin testing. A I also
picked
> up some tools that might help me look at ignition pulses; I have to
get
> in the garage and test that too.
>
> This weekend was supposed to be free enough to begin all that but I
> think things are already piling in that are non-car related. A <sigh>
>
> Asa A Jay
>
> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [6]http://www.racingagainstautism.com
> [7]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
> [8]http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
>
>
>> On 4/17/2014 5:35 AM, [9]cengles at cox.net wrote:
>> Dear Asa,
>>
>>
>>
>> A A A A A A A A Hmmm. A You have an L model Pantera. A What
is the
>> VIN? A I wonder if that is an Italian assembly line spontaneous
>> variation, a standard feature of the late model Pantera L or the
>> aftermath of a previous job. A My Panteras are 7000 series VINs and
I
>> hope that they have the welding.
>>
>>
>>
>> A A A A A A A A A A A A A A A A A Warmest regards,
A Chuck Engles
>>
>>
>>
>> PS: how is the Innovate field testing going?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 10:21 PM, Asa Jay Laughton wrote:
>>>
>>> I believe on mine, when I went to install the wrench under the dash
I
>>> found the nuts welded. A One man job from the outside.
>>>
>>> Asa A Jay
>>>
>>> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>>> & Shelley Marie
>>> Spokane, WA
>>> ******************************
>>> [10]http://www.racingagainstautism.com
>>> [11]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>>> [12]http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 4/16/2014 7:32 PM, Charles Engles wrote:
>>>> Dear Boyd,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> A A A A A A I do understand that it is a very unpleasant
job. A I
>> do have a Pantera reference from Scandanavia, IIRC, which shows a
>> modification that uses a hole saw to cut an access hole in the
>> passenger side of the box about three inches in diameter. A From
what I
>> understand, it permits sight and access to the dreaded inaccessible
>> dark recess behind the dash. A I have not done this job nor have I
>> done this mod, but from what I think I know, it could make the task
a
>> darn sight easier. A The original author reported that once the
hole
>> is made and used and the job is done, then it can be plugged,
>> tastefully, with a common commercially available plastic plug.
>> Perhaps someone has first hand experience with this trick?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> A A A A A A A A A A A Clutch master cylinder rookie,
A Chuck Engles
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:[13]detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of
>> Boyd Casey
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 9:18 PM
>>>> To: mike Drew
>>>> Cc: [14]detomaso at poca.com; Bob Benson
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] CLUTCH MASTERS
>>>>
>>>> Changing a slave is no big deal , but I don't know how I would
>> change a clutch master on the side of the road, it's a two person
job
>> ( one to hold a wrench under the dash and one the install the
master)
>> and even then unless you have A a dwarf with you getting under the
dash
>> and attaching the push rod and getting access to the bolts is a
>> nightmare. If there is some "Trick" to installing the clutch master
I
>> wish someone would share it with me!
>>>> Boyd
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 7:49 PM, <[15]MikeLDrew at aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> A In a message dated 4/16/14 15 49 50, [16]rcbsons1 at aol.com
writes:
>>>>>
>>>>> A A New Pantera protocol is to carry a spare
>>>>> A A Clutch master and slave.. that is what I am
>>>>> A A doing now.. A I have one of Rich's square ones
>>>>> A A because original makes no difference to me...
>>>>> A A need to remember to pack some brake fluid also
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If, as he says, they need to be modified to fit, better
>> modify it
>>>>> A now rather than when you're stuck on the side of the road! :>)
>>>>> A Mike
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>
>>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>>>>
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> [17]DeTomaso at poca.com
>>>>> [18]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>
>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>>>
>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>> [19]DeTomaso at poca.com
>>>> [20]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----
>>>> No virus found in this message.
>>>> Checked by AVG - [21]www.avg.com
>>>> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date:
>> 04/16/14
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>>
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> [22]DeTomaso at poca.com
>>> [23]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
-
>>
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [24]www.avg.com <[25]http://www.avg.com>
>> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6852 - Release Date:
04/16/14
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [26]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [27]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
_______________________________________________
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DeTomaso mailing list
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[29]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
_______________________________________________
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DeTomaso mailing list
[30]DeTomaso at poca.com
[31]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
References
1. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
2. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
3. mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com
4. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
5. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
6. http://www.racingagainstautism.com/
7. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
8. http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
9. mailto:cengles at cox.net
10. http://www.racingagainstautism.com/
11. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
12. http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
13. mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com
14. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
15. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
16. mailto:rcbsons1 at aol.com
17. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
18. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
19. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
20. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
21. http://www.avg.com/
22. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
23. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
24. http://www.avg.com/
25. http://www.avg.com/
26. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
27. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
28. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
29. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
30. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
31. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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