[DeTomaso] Tesla Drivers???
Konrad Szwab
kszwab at gmail.com
Mon Sep 5 20:34:24 EDT 2022
I am one of those nerd types, I used to do that on a much smaller scale to
fix my old laptop batteries/handheld vacuum cleaners that usually fail
within 2-5 years.
The issue is that even if you replace ONLY the bad cells, more will fail at
random times.
The only way these garbage batteries would work and you could swap easily*
only bad cells would be if:
1. They would be designed from the beginning for that
2. Each battery would be controlled independently by a monitoring circuit
that would flag which ones need to be replaced
3. Each would be spring loaded in a container that one could easily open to
replace the battery (think flashlight type enclosure). That of course would
create losses at contact point vs large currents, especially with corrosion
in time
4. Replacing only SOME of the batteries in a series circuit throws out of
whack the charging current for the older ones in series with the replaced
one.
We are talking of course high level electronics nerd type maintenance on
vehicles marketed to morons that need to be told not to drink battery
acid/coolant and can't remember to turn their headlights on when dusk comes
and which are not really qualified to ride a bicycle or goat if one would
be honestly appraised.
While talking about batteries, let's chat about the cursed LiPo ones and
those horrid pouches that get bloated if you do not use/use too much/just
use/blink at the unreliable crap batteries... I hate them more than I can
spew hatred today, especially when they swell and break screens and who
knows what else.
* - minimizing effort would drive up costs, of course
On Mon, Sep 5, 2022 at 4:01 PM Will Kooiman <will.kooiman at gmail.com> wrote:
> Going from memory, so don't shoot me if I get some of this wrong...
>
> My Insight had D Cell sized lithium iron batteries.
>
> They were soldered end-to-end to make a stick of 6 batteries.
>
> There was a temperature sensor on each stick.
>
> A battery pack had 20 sticks - so 120 D-cell sized batteries.
>
> The pack had fans, wiring, and all of the circuit boards to control it all.
>
> I never took any of this apart. When you replace "the battery", they
> actually ship a reconditioned battery pack, and you swap it. It takes 1-2
> hours.
>
> Some people go full-nerd and take it apart, test each battery, replace
> just what's having issues, and put it all together again. Not me. I have
> better things to do with my time.
>
>
>
> On 9/4/22, 8:06 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Jerry Knotts" <
> detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of knottsj at galstar.com>
> wrote:
>
> There is an industry of rebuilding battery packs and repurposing
> them.
> They cut and desolder each battery out of the main. They test each
> battery and throw away the bad ones. Resolder them into the needed
> grid. Then sell them at about one third of retail. A good friend has
> a
> set of sun panels on the roof of his hunting cabin. The batteries are
> fine but the controller leaves a bit to be desired. I think he bought
> his batter packs from a remanufacture in Navada.
>
> YMMV
>
> jerry knotts
>
> On 9/4/2022 3:13 PM, Mike Drew via DeTomaso wrote:
> > Way back when Tesla first started, Garth Rodericks’ late brother
> Todd was the chief battery engineer for Tesla, and he used to drive the
> development mule for the Tesla sports car (remember that? Two-seat
> mid-‘engine’ on a Lotus Elise chassis) to the PCNC meetings.
> >
> > He told me the battery pack was made by connecting about a billion
> 35mm camera batteries together. The problem was that if one failed there
> was no way to know which one it was.
> >
> > Todd was a super, super guy….:(
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> >> On Sep 4, 2022, at 13:06, Ken Green via DeTomaso <
> detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I have been told that the EV batteries are a bunch of little
> batteries
> >> in one housing. The bad batteries can be replaced. If we knew
> the
> >> failure mode this would mean a lot more.
> >>
> >> On Sunday, September 4, 2022 at 10:11:10 AM PDT, Bill Lewis
> >> <lotus0005 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> Will, what does "...the battery pack died...." mean.
> >> An ICE engine can be rebuilt with new parts, etc. So, the
> battery
> >> can't be rebuilt internally?? Maybe they will invent a new
> "potion"
> >> to
> >> pour into the battery? Possibly, that will be a whole new
> local
> >> industry, like a local auto repair shop?
> >> That is a lot of miles on a car, by the way! ---BILL L
> >>
> __________________________________________________________________
> >> From: DeTomaso <[1]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>
> on
> >> behalf of
> >> Will Kooiman <[2]will.kooiman at gmail.com>
> >> Sent: Sunday, September 4, 2022 12:38 PM
> >> To: Julian Kift <[3]julian_kift at hotmail.com>; Konrad Szwab
> >> <[4]kszwab at gmail.com>; Detomaso List
> >> <[5]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>;
> >> Larry Stock <[6]larrys at panteraparts.com>; Ken Green
> >> <[7]kenn_green at yahoo.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tesla Drivers???
> >> The batteries are a real problem.
> >> My 2001 Honda Insight got 73mpg when it was new. It drove
> like a
> >> typical compact.
> >> The battery pack died at 70K miles. The cost to replace was
> $4K at
> >> the
> >> dealer. I did it myself for $1.2K. As stated, you can buy a
> lot of
> >> gas for $1.2K.
> >> The second battery pack died after another 60K miles. This
> time I
> >> replaced it with a "better battery". It was $1K.
> >> The third battery pack died after another 60K miles. I
> replaced it
> >> one
> >> final time. This one lasted about 50K miles.
> >> We put 250K miles on the Insight. We loved the car. I just
> got
> >> turned
> >> off at having to change batteries, plus as they age, they take
> longer
> >> to charge. That's from my experience, anyway.
> >> Those doing math realize 70K + 60K + 60K + 50K = 240K. For
> the other
> >> 10K, we drove with a dead battery. Yes, you can do that on
> this type
> >> of hybrid. The battery only serves as to boost the engine
> under high
> >> load situations - acceleration, passing, etc. It's a real turd
> >> without
> >> the battery.
> >> Btw, I don't know if they're still doing it, but there was a
> company
> >> that converted Honda Insights to a Honda S2000 drivetrain -
> and they
> >> still got 40-45mpg!! So, a big part of the Insight's MPG is
> the
> >> aero,
> >> plus the weight. They were under 2,000 lbs.
> >> On 9/3/22, 7:56 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Julian Kift"
> >> <[8]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
> >> [9]julian_kift at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> Although EV batteries are expensive, the invoice is
> for a
> >> first-generation Chevy Volt NiMH battery, it's an
> antique for
> >> which GM
> >> no longer supports or manufacturers the battery. If
> you are
> >> determined
> >> to keep an old obsolete antique on the road it can add
> >> up.....!
> >> Some of the OEM's are developing swappable cells so
> there
> >> won't
> >> be a
> >> need to replace the whole unit for a defective cell.
> The
> >> average
> >> modern
> >> Li-ion battery has 3,500+ charge life, with a range of
> 400
> >> miles,
> >> that's 1.4M miles or 93 years for the average driver of
> >> 15,000
> >> miles
> >> annually.
> >> Julian
> >>
> __________________________________________________________________
> >> From: DeTomaso <[10]
> detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>
> >> on
> >> behalf of
> >> Ken Green via DeTomaso <[11]
> detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> >> Sent: Saturday, September 3, 2022 3:30 PM
> >> To: Konrad Szwab <[12]kszwab at gmail.com>; Detomaso List
> >> <[13]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>; Larry Stock
> >> <[14]larrys at panteraparts.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tesla Drivers???
> >> You can buy a lot of gas for $27,000:
> >> On Friday, September 2, 2022 at 01:57:05 PM PDT,
> Larry
> >> Stock
> >> <[15]larrys at panteraparts.com> wrote:
> >> I think Electric cars have their place in society just
> like
> >> Trucks and
> >> golf carts do.
> >> Larry
> >> On 9/2/22, 1:49 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Konrad
> Szwab"
> >> <[16]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on
> behalf of
> >> [17]kszwab at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> I think electric cars are the way of the future,
> for
> >> better or
> >> worse,
> >> due to governmental regulation. I hate my cars
> being
> >> demonized by
> >> these
> >> arrogant "holier than thou" hypocrites,
> personally,
> >> although at
> >> some
> >> point I do plan to get an electric car just to
> get used
> >> to
> >> it. I
> >> think
> >> as commuter cars for going to work they are
> great and
> >> that
> >> is
> >> about it.
> >> I still recall about a year ago the pissed off
> looks a
> >> Tesla
> >> driving
> >> dude was giving me when my now dead truck was
> idling
> >> nicely with
> >> the
> >> exhaust perfectly placed near his open window at
> a
> >> stoplight. The
> >> V8
> >> being a straight pipe the noise was an added
> factor for
> >> Konrad
> >> enjoying
> >> himself being a total ass :)
> >> On Fri, Sep 2, 2022 at 3:42 PM Julian Kift
> >> <[1][18]julian_kift at hotmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> A A Yes, I see that often now, there's a
> >> proliferation
> >> of
> >> Tesla's
> >> here in
> >> A A Reno with the Gigafactory close by.
> >> A A I drove my first Tesla about a month ago
> in
> >> Montreal,
> >> rental
> >> cars were
> >> A A in high demand, and all they had
> available was a
> >> Tesla 3.
> >> Once
> >> I
> >> A A figured out the card (key) swipe to make
> it work
> >> it
> >> was
> >> easy. I
> >> have to
> >> A A say that rush and pinning to the seat as
> you
> >> press
> >> the go
> >> pedal
> >> hard is
> >> A A exhilarating, but (and it's a big butt)
> >> everything
> >> else
> >> was
> >> just
> >> A A boring, there is literally nothing else
> to get
> >> excited
> >> about,
> >> it has no
> >> A A soul, it gets you from A to B in a
> utilitarian
> >> there's an
> >> 'app
> >> for
> >> A A that' kind of way. On the interaction
> side I
> >> found
> >> it
> >> annoying
> >> more
> >> A A than anything (in a kind of nagging wife
> way)
> >> and I
> >> ended
> >> up
> >> navigating
> >> A A using my iPhone for a more direct route.
> >> A A So, to answer your question, I think it's
> more
> >> of a
> >> case
> >> of the
> >> only
> >> A A pleasure one can derive from driving a
> Tesla is
> >> the
> >> instantaneous
> >> A A torque away from the lights, after that
> the
> >> battery
> >> efficiency
> >> warning
> >> A A light comes on and one is chastised into
> >> fictitiously
> >> saving
> >> the planet
> >> A A once more.
> >> A A Julian
> >> A A
> >> A
> >>
> __________________________________________________________________
> >> A A From: DeTomaso
> >> <[2][19]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on
> >> behalf of
> >> A A Corey Price <[3][20]coreyjprice at gmail.com
> >
> >> A A Sent: Friday, September 2, 2022 12:52 PM
> >> A A To: Detomaso List
> >> <[4][21]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> >> A A Subject: [DeTomaso] Tesla Drivers???
> >> A A So reading about Konrad's unfortunate
> >> experience,
> >> he
> >> mentioned
> >> A A something about Tesla drivers. I have had
> >> multiple
> >> Tesla
> >> drivers
> >> A A wanting to race me since I got my Pantera
> on the
> >> street.
> >> The
> >> first one
> >> A A was interesting and I let him go, not
> wanting to
> >> race on
> >> the
> >> street.
> >> A A The next few got annoying and I wanted
> nothing
> >> to
> >> do with
> >> that.
> >> I'll
> >> A A enjoy my car the way I want to, thank you.
> >> Anyone
> >> else
> >> experienced this
> >> A A sudden desire of Tesla owners to race you?
> >> A A Corey
> >> A A
> _______________________________________________
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> >> 2. [2]mailto:[42]
> detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 3. [3]mailto:[43]coreyjprice at gmail.com
> >> 4. [4]mailto:[44]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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> >>
> >>
> Unknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1ha
> >>
> >>
> WwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=jeEiMejv%2B85oshkKzBl2%2BHR
> >> O5VWNnUgmGzE%2B0tJtPno%3D&reserved=0
> >> 8.
> >>
> >> [8][48]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
> >> Fser
> >>
> >> ver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7
> >>
> >>
> C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa
> >>
> >>
> %7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwM
> >>
> >>
> DAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&s
> >>
> >>
> data=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 9. [9]mailto:[49]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 10.
> >>
> >> [10][50]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
> >> 2Fse
> >>
> >> rver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%
> >>
> >>
> 7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaa
> >>
> >>
> a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAw
> >>
> >>
> MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&
> >>
> >>
> sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 11.
> >>
> >> [11][51]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
> >> 2Fse
> >>
> >> rver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%
> >>
> >>
> 7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaa
> >>
> >>
> a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAw
> >>
> >>
> MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&
> >>
> >>
> sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 12.
> >>
> >> [12][52]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
> >> 2Fse
> >>
> >> rver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%
> >>
> >>
> 7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaa
> >>
> >>
> a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAw
> >>
> >>
> MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&
> >>
> >>
> sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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> >> [53]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> [13][54]
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> >> [55]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> [14][56]
> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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> >> 1. mailto:[57]julian_kift at hotmail.com
> >> 2. mailto:[58]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 3. mailto:[59]coreyjprice at gmail.com
> >> 4. mailto:[60]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 5. mailto:[61]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 6.
> >> [62]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> r
> >> 7.
> >> [63]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fve
> >> r.detomasolist.com
> %2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3
> >>
> d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnk
> >>
> nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwi
> >>
> LCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=jeEiMejv%2B85oshkKzBl2%2BHRO5VWNnU
> >> gmGzE%2B0tJtPno%3D&reserved=0
> >> 8.
> >> [64]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> rver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7
> >>
> C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C
> >>
> 1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAi
> >>
> LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JY
> >> njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 9. mailto:[65]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 10.
> >> [66]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> rver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7
> >>
> C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C
> >>
> 1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAi
> >>
> LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JY
> >> njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 11.
> >> [67]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> rver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7
> >>
> C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C
> >>
> 1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAi
> >>
> LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JY
> >> njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 12.
> >> [68]
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> rver.detomasolist.com
> %2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7
> >>
> C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C
> >>
> 1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAi
> >>
> LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JY
> >> njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 13. [69]
> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> 14. [70]
> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> >> DeTomaso mailing list
> >> [71]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> [72]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
> etc.)
> >> use the links above.
> >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
> forward any
> >> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
> the
> >> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
> archive
> >> or approve the archiving of list messages.
> >>
> >> References
> >>
> >> 1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 2. mailto:will.kooiman at gmail.com
> >> 3. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
> >> 4. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
> >> 5. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 6. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
> >> 7. mailto:kenn_green at yahoo.com
> >> 8. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 9. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
> >> 10. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 11. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 12. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
> >> 13. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 14. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
> >> 15. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
> >> 16. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 17. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
> >> 18. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
> >> 19. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 20. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
> >> 21. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 22. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 23. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%
> >> 24.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2F
> >> 25. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 26.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> 27. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
> >> 28. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 29. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
> >> 30. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 31. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 32.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
> >> 33.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fver
> >> 34.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
> >> 35. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 36.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> 37. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 38.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> 39. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 40.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> 41. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
> >> 42. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 43. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
> >> 44. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 45. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 46.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
> >> 47.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fver
> >> 48.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
> >> 49. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 50.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> 51.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> 52.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
> >> 53. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 54. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> 55. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 56. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> 57. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
> >> 58. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 59. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
> >> 60. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 61. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 62.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
> >> 63.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fver.detomasolist.com%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=jeEiMejv%2B85oshkKzBl2%2BHRO5VWNnUgmGzE%2B0tJtPno%3D&reserved=0
> >> 64.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 65. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 66.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 67.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 68.
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
> >> 69. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> 70. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> 71. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> 72. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >> _______________________________________________
> >>
> >>
> >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> >> DeTomaso mailing list
> >> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> >> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >>
> >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
> etc.) use the links above.
> >>
> >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
> approve the archiving of list messages.
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> >
> > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> > DeTomaso mailing list
> > DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> > http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> >
> > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
> etc.) use the links above.
> >
> > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
> approve the archiving of list messages.
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
> use the links above.
>
> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list.
> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve
> the archiving of list messages.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use
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>
> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
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> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve
> the archiving of list messages.
-------------- next part --------------
I am one of those nerd types, I used to do that on a much smaller scale
to fix my old laptop batteries/handheld vacuum cleaners that usually
fail within 2-5 years.
The issue is that even if you replace ONLY the bad cells, more will
fail at random times.
The only way these garbage batteries would work and you could swap
easily* only bad cells would be if:
1. They would be designed fromA the beginning for that
2. Each battery would be controlled independentlyA by a monitoring
circuit that would flag which ones need to be replacedA
3. Each would be spring loadedA in a container that one could easily
open to replace the battery (think flashlight type enclosure). That of
course would create losses at contact point vs largeA currents,
especially with corrosion in time
4. Replacing only SOME of the batteries in a series circuit throws out
of whack the charging current for the older ones in series with the
replaced one.
We are talking of course high level electronics nerd type maintenance
on vehicles marketed to morons that need to be told not to drink
battery acid/coolant and can't remember to turn their headlights on
when dusk comes and which are not really qualified to ride a bicycle or
goat if one would be honestly appraised.
While talking about batteries, let's chat about the cursed LiPo ones
and those horrid pouches that get bloated if you do not use/use too
much/just use/blink at the unreliable crap batteries... I hate them
more than I can spew hatred today, especially when they swell and break
screens and who knows what else.
* - minimizing effort would drive up costs, of course
On Mon, Sep 5, 2022 at 4:01 PM Will Kooiman <[1]will.kooiman at gmail.com>
wrote:
Going from memory, so don't shoot me if I get some of this wrong...
My Insight had D Cell sized lithium iron batteries.
They were soldered end-to-end to make a stick of 6 batteries.
There was a temperature sensor on each stick.
A battery pack had 20 sticks - so 120 D-cell sized batteries.
The pack had fans, wiring, and all of the circuit boards to control
it all.
I never took any of this apart.A When you replace "the battery",
they actually ship a reconditioned battery pack, and you swap it.A
It takes 1-2 hours.
Some people go full-nerd and take it apart, test each battery,
replace just what's having issues, and put it all together again.A
Not me.A I have better things to do with my time.
i>>?On 9/4/22, 8:06 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Jerry Knotts"
<[2]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
[3]knottsj at galstar.com> wrote:
A A There is an industry of rebuilding battery packs and
repurposing them.A
A A They cut and desolder each battery out of the main.A They
test each
A A battery and throw away the bad ones.A Resolder them into the
needed
A A grid.A Then sell them at about one third of retail.A A good
friend has a
A A set of sun panels on the roof of his hunting cabin.A The
batteries are
A A fine but the controller leaves a bit to be desired.A I think
he bought
A A his batter packs from a remanufacture in Navada.
A A YMMV
A A jerry knotts
A A On 9/4/2022 3:13 PM, Mike Drew via DeTomaso wrote:
A A > Way back when Tesla first started, Garth Rodericksa late
brother Todd was the chief battery engineer for Tesla, and he used
to drive the development mule for the Tesla sports car (remember
that? Two-seat mid-aenginea on a Lotus Elise chassis) to the PCNC
meetings.
A A >
A A > He told me the battery pack was made by connecting about a
billion 35mm camera batteries together. The problem was that if one
failed there was no way to know which one it was.
A A >
A A > Todd was a super, super guya|.:(
A A >
A A > Mike
A A >
A A > Sent from my iPad
A A >
A A >> On Sep 4, 2022, at 13:06, Ken Green via DeTomaso
<[4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
A A >>
A A >> i>>?A A I have been told that the EV batteries are a bunch
of little batteries
A A >>A A in one housing.A The bad batteries can be replaced.A
If we knew the
A A >>A A failure mode this would mean a lot more.
A A >>
A A >>A A On Sunday, September 4, 2022 at 10:11:10 AM PDT, Bill
Lewis
A A >>A A <[5]lotus0005 at hotmail.com> wrote:
A A >>A A A Will, what does "...the battery pack died...."
mean.
A A >>A A A An ICE engine can be rebuilt with new parts, etc.A
So, the battery
A A >>A A A can't be rebuilt internally?? Maybe they will
invent a new "potion"
A A >>A A to
A A >>A A A pour into the battery?A Possibly, that will be a
whole new local
A A >>A A A industry, like a local auto repair shop?
A A >>A A A That is a lot of miles on a car, by the way!A A
---BILL L
A A >>A A A A
__________________________________________________________________
A A >>A A A From: DeTomaso
<[1][6]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on
A A >>A A behalf of
A A >>A A A Will Kooiman <[2][7]will.kooiman at gmail.com>
A A >>A A A Sent: Sunday, September 4, 2022 12:38 PM
A A >>A A A To: Julian Kift <[3][8]julian_kift at hotmail.com>;
Konrad Szwab
A A >>A A A <[4][9]kszwab at gmail.com>; Detomaso List
A A >>A A <[5][10]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>;
A A >>A A A Larry Stock <[6][11]larrys at panteraparts.com>; Ken
Green
A A >>A A <[7][12]kenn_green at yahoo.com>
A A >>A A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tesla Drivers???
A A >>A A A The batteries are a real problem.
A A >>A A A My 2001 Honda Insight got 73mpg when it was new.A
It drove like a
A A >>A A A typical compact.
A A >>A A A The battery pack died at 70K miles.A The cost to
replace was $4K at
A A >>A A the
A A >>A A A dealer.A I did it myself for $1.2K.A As stated,
you can buy a lot of
A A >>A A A gas for $1.2K.
A A >>A A A The second battery pack died after another 60K
miles.A This time I
A A >>A A A replaced it with a "better battery".A It was $1K.
A A >>A A A The third battery pack died after another 60K
miles.A I replaced it
A A >>A A one
A A >>A A A final time.A This one lasted about 50K miles.
A A >>A A A We put 250K miles on the Insight.A We loved the
car.A I just got
A A >>A A turned
A A >>A A A off at having to change batteries, plus as they
age, they take longer
A A >>A A A to charge.A That's from my experience, anyway.
A A >>A A A Those doing math realize 70K + 60K + 60K + 50K =
240K.A For the other
A A >>A A A 10K, we drove with a dead battery.A Yes, you can
do that on this type
A A >>A A A of hybrid.A The battery only serves as to boost
the engine under high
A A >>A A A load situations - acceleration, passing, etc.A
It's a real turd
A A >>A A without
A A >>A A A the battery.
A A >>A A A Btw, I don't know if they're still doing it, but
there was a company
A A >>A A A that converted Honda Insights to a Honda S2000
drivetrain - and they
A A >>A A A still got 40-45mpg!!A So, a big part of the
Insight's MPG is the
A A >>A A aero,
A A >>A A A plus the weight.A They were under 2,000 lbs.
A A >>A A A On 9/3/22, 7:56 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Julian
Kift"
A A >>A A A <[8][13]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on
behalf of
A A >>A A A [9][14]julian_kift at hotmail.com> wrote:
A A >>A A A A A A A Although EV batteries are expensive,
the invoice is for a
A A >>A A A A A A A first-generation Chevy Volt NiMH
battery, it's an antique for
A A >>A A A which GM
A A >>A A A A A A A no longer supports or manufacturers the
battery. If you are
A A >>A A A determined
A A >>A A A A A A A to keep an old obsolete antique on the
road it can add
A A >>A A up.....!
A A >>A A A A A A A Some of the OEM's are developing
swappable cells so there
A A >>A A won't
A A >>A A A be a
A A >>A A A A A A A need to replace the whole unit for a
defective cell. The
A A >>A A average
A A >>A A A modern
A A >>A A A A A A A Li-ion battery has 3,500+ charge life,
with a range of 400
A A >>A A A miles,
A A >>A A A A A A A that's 1.4M miles or 93 years for the
average driver of
A A >>A A 15,000
A A >>A A A miles
A A >>A A A A A A A annually.
A A >>A A A A A A A Julian
A A >>A A A
__________________________________________________________________
A A >>A A A A A A A From: DeTomaso
<[10][15]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>
A A >>A A on
A A >>A A A behalf of
A A >>A A A A A A A Ken Green via DeTomaso
<[11][16]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
A A >>A A A A A A A Sent: Saturday, September 3, 2022 3:30
PM
A A >>A A A A A A A To: Konrad Szwab
<[12][17]kszwab at gmail.com>; Detomaso List
A A >>A A A A A A A
<[13][18]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>; Larry Stock
A A >>A A A A A A A <[14][19]larrys at panteraparts.com>
A A >>A A A A A A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Tesla
Drivers???
A A >>A A A A A A A You can buy a lot of gas for $27,000:
A A >>A A A A A A A A A On Friday, September 2, 2022 at
01:57:05 PM PDT, Larry
A A >>A A Stock
A A >>A A A A A A A <[15][20]larrys at panteraparts.com>
wrote:
A A >>A A A A A A A I think Electric cars have their place
in society just like
A A >>A A A Trucks and
A A >>A A A A A A A golf carts do.
A A >>A A A A A A A Larry
A A >>A A A A A A A On 9/2/22, 1:49 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf
of Konrad Szwab"
A A >>A A A A A A A
<[16][21]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
A A >>A A A A A A A [17][22]kszwab at gmail.com> wrote:
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A I think electric cars are the
way of the future, for
A A >>A A A better or
A A >>A A A A A A A worse,
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A due to governmental
regulation. I hate my cars being
A A >>A A A demonized by
A A >>A A A A A A A these
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A arrogant "holier than thou"
hypocrites, personally,
A A >>A A A although at
A A >>A A A A A A A some
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A point I do plan to get an
electric car just to get used
A A >>A A to
A A >>A A A it. I
A A >>A A A A A A A think
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A as commuter cars for going to
work they are great and
A A >>A A that
A A >>A A A is
A A >>A A A A A A A about it.
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A I still recall about a year
ago the pissed off looks a
A A >>A A A Tesla
A A >>A A A A A A A driving
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A dude was giving me when my now
dead truck was idling
A A >>A A A nicely with
A A >>A A A A A A A the
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A exhaust perfectly placed near
his open window at a
A A >>A A A stoplight. The
A A >>A A A A A A A V8
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A being a straight pipe the
noise was an added factor for
A A >>A A A Konrad
A A >>A A A A A A A enjoying
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A himself being a total ass :)
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A On Fri, Sep 2, 2022 at 3:42 PM
Julian Kift
A A >>A A A A A A A <[1][18][23]julian_kift at hotmail.com>
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A wrote:
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A Yes, I see that often
now, there's a
A A >>A A proliferation
A A >>A A A of
A A >>A A A A A A A Tesla's
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A here in
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A Reno with the
Gigafactory close by.
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A I drove my first
Tesla about a month ago in
A A >>A A A Montreal,
A A >>A A A A A A A rental
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A cars were
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A in high demand, and
all they had available was a
A A >>A A A Tesla 3.
A A >>A A A A A A A Once
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A I
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A figured out the card
(key) swipe to make it work
A A >>A A it
A A >>A A A was
A A >>A A A A A A A easy. I
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A have to
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A say that rush and
pinning to the seat as you
A A >>A A press
A A >>A A A the go
A A >>A A A A A A A pedal
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A hard is
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A exhilarating, but
(and it's a big butt)
A A >>A A everything
A A >>A A A else
A A >>A A A A A A A was
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A just
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A boring, there is
literally nothing else to get
A A >>A A A excited
A A >>A A A A A A A about,
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A it has no
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A soul, it gets you
from A to B in a utilitarian
A A >>A A A there's an
A A >>A A A A A A A 'app
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A for
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A that' kind of way. On
the interaction side I
A A >>A A found
A A >>A A A it
A A >>A A A A A A A annoying
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A more
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A than anything (in a
kind of nagging wife way)
A A >>A A and I
A A >>A A A ended
A A >>A A A A A A A up
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A navigating
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A using my iPhone for a
more direct route.
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A So, to answer your
question, I think it's more
A A >>A A of a
A A >>A A A case
A A >>A A A A A A A of the
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A only
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A pleasure one can
derive from driving a Tesla is
A A >>A A the
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A instantaneous
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A torque away from the
lights, after that the
A A >>A A battery
A A >>A A A A A A A efficiency
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A warning
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A light comes on and
one is chastised into
A A >>A A A fictitiously
A A >>A A A A A A A saving
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A the planet
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A once more.
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A Julian
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A A
A A >>A A A
__________________________________________________________________
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A From: DeTomaso
A A >>A A A A A A A
<[2][19][24]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A behalf of
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A Corey Price
<[3][20][25]coreyjprice at gmail.com>
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A Sent: Friday,
September 2, 2022 12:52 PM
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A To: Detomaso List
A A >>A A A <[4][21][26]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A Subject: [DeTomaso]
Tesla Drivers???
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A So reading about
Konrad's unfortunate
A A >>A A experience,
A A >>A A A he
A A >>A A A A A A A mentioned
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A something about Tesla
drivers. I have had
A A >>A A multiple
A A >>A A A Tesla
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A drivers
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A wanting to race me
since I got my Pantera on the
A A >>A A A street.
A A >>A A A A A A A The
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A first one
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A was interesting and I
let him go, not wanting to
A A >>A A A race on
A A >>A A A A A A A the
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A street.
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A The next few got
annoying and I wanted nothing
A A >>A A to
A A >>A A A do with
A A >>A A A A A A A that.
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A I'll
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A enjoy my car the way
I want to, thank you.
A A >>A A Anyone
A A >>A A A else
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A experienced this
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A sudden desire of
Tesla owners to race you?
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A Corey
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A A AA A
_______________________________________________
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aaa
A A >>
A A >>A A
%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLj
AwM
A A >>
A A >>A A
DAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&am
p;s
A A >>
A A >>A A
data=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved
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A A >>A A A A A A A A A A 9.
[9]mailto:[35][45]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A A A A A A A A 10.
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[10][36][46]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http
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aaa
A A >>
A A >>A A
a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wL
jAw
A A >>
A A >>A A
MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&a
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A A >>
A A >>A A
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aaa
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a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wL
jAw
A A >>
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MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&a
mp;
A A >>
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d=0
A A >>A A A A A A A A A To manage your subscription
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A A >>A A A A A A A DeTomaso mailing list
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aaa
A A >>
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a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wL
jAw
A A >>
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MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&a
mp;
A A >>
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[2]mailto:[42][55]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
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[3]mailto:[43][56]coreyjprice at gmail.com
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[4]mailto:[44][57]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A A A A A 5.
[5]mailto:[45][58]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A A A A A 6.
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[6][46][59]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%
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A A >>A A A A A A A 7.
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8da8dfb
A A >>
A A >>A A
ef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561
%7C
A A >>
A A >>A A
Unknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik
1ha
A A >>
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WwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=jeEiMejv%2B85oshkKzBl2%2
BHR
A A >>A A A O5VWNnUgmGzE%2B0tJtPno%3D&reserved=0
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aaa
A A >>
A A >>A A
%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLj
AwM
A A >>
A A >>A A
DAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&am
p;s
A A >>
A A >>A A
data=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved
=0
A A >>A A A A A A A 9.
[9]mailto:[49][64]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A A A A 10.
A A >>
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7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaa
aaa
A A >>
A A >>A A
a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wL
jAw
A A >>
A A >>A A
MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&a
mp;
A A >>
A A >>A A
sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserve
d=0
A A >>A A A A A A 11.
A A >>
A A >>A A
[11][51][67]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http
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7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaa
aaa
A A >>
A A >>A A
a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wL
jAw
A A >>
A A >>A A
MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&a
mp;
A A >>
A A >>A A
sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserve
d=0
A A >>A A A A A A 12.
A A >>
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[12][52][69]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http
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aaa
A A >>
A A >>A A
a%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wL
jAw
A A >>
A A >>A A
MDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&a
mp;
A A >>
A A >>A A
sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserve
d=0
A A >>A A A A A
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A A >>A A A A A Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
A A >>A A A A A Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
A A >>A A A A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A >>A A A A A [53][71]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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[13][54][72]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >>A A A A A To manage your subscription (change email
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A A >>A A archive
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A A >>A A A _______________________________________________
A A >>A A A Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
A A >>A A A Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
A A >>A A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A >>A A A [55][73]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A
[14][56][74]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >>A A A To manage your subscription (change email address,
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A A >>A A A use the links above.
A A >>A A A Members who post to this list grant license to the
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A A >>A A A message posted here to all past, current, or future
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A A >>A A archive
A A >>A A A or approve the archiving of list messages.
A A >>A A References
A A >>A A A 1. mailto:[57][75]julian_kift at hotmail.com
A A >>A A A 2.
mailto:[58][76]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A 3. mailto:[59][77]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A >>A A A 4. mailto:[60][78]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A 5. mailto:[61][79]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A A 6.
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A A >>A A r
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Unk
A A >>A A
nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1ha
Wwi
A A >>A A
LCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=jeEiMejv%2B85oshkKzBl2%2BHRO5VW
NnU
A A >>A A gmGzE%2B0tJtPno%3D&reserved=0
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C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa
%7C
A A >>A A
1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwM
DAi
A A >>A A
LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata
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njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
A A >>A A A 9. mailto:[65][85]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa
%7C
A A >>A A
1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwM
DAi
A A >>A A
LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata
=JY
A A >>A A
njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
A A >>A A A 11.
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[67][88]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%
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[89]rver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C
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A A >>A A
C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa
%7C
A A >>A A
1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwM
DAi
A A >>A A
LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata
=JY
A A >>A A
njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
A A >>A A A 12.
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[68][90]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%
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C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa
%7C
A A >>A A
1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwM
DAi
A A >>A A
LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata
=JY
A A >>A A
njWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
A A >>A A A 13.
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A A >>A A _______________________________________________
A A >>A A Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
A A >>A A Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
A A >>A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A >>A A [71][94]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A
[72][95]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >>A A To manage your subscription (change email address,
unsubscribe, etc.)
A A >>A A use the links above.
A A >>A A Members who post to this list grant license to the
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A A >>
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A A >>A A 1. mailto:[96]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 2. mailto:[97]will.kooiman at gmail.com
A A >>A A 3. mailto:[98]julian_kift at hotmail.com
A A >>A A 4. mailto:[99]kszwab at gmail.com
A A >>A A 5. mailto:[100]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 6. mailto:[101]larrys at panteraparts.com
A A >>A A 7. mailto:[102]kenn_green at yahoo.com
A A >>A A 8.
mailto:[103]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 9. mailto:[104]julian_kift at hotmail.com
A A >>A A 10.
mailto:[105]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 11. mailto:[106]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 12. mailto:[107]kszwab at gmail.com
A A >>A A 13. mailto:[108]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 14. mailto:[109]larrys at panteraparts.com
A A >>A A 15. mailto:[110]larrys at panteraparts.com
A A >>A A 16.
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A A >>A A 17. mailto:[112]kszwab at gmail.com
A A >>A A 18. mailto:[113]julian_kift at hotmail.com
A A >>A A 19.
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A A >>A A 20. mailto:[115]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A >>A A 21. mailto:[116]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 22. mailto:[117]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 23.
[118]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%
A A >>A A 24.
[119]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
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A A >>A A 25. mailto:[120]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 26.
[121]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
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A A >>A A 27. mailto:[122]julian_kift at hotmail.com
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A A >>A A 29. mailto:[124]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A >>A A 30. mailto:[125]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 31. mailto:[126]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 32.
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[129]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
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A A >>A A 35. mailto:[130]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 36.
[131]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fse
A A >>A A 37. mailto:[132]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 38.
[133]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fse
A A >>A A 39. mailto:[134]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 40.
[135]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fse
A A >>A A 41. mailto:[136]julian_kift at hotmail.com
A A >>A A 42.
mailto:[137]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 43. mailto:[138]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A >>A A 44. mailto:[139]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 45. mailto:[140]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 46.
[141]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fser
A A >>A A 47.
[142]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fver
A A >>A A 48.
[143]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fser
A A >>A A 49. mailto:[144]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 50.
[145]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fse
A A >>A A 51.
[146]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fse
A A >>A A 52.
[147]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fse
A A >>A A 53. mailto:[148]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 54.
[149]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >>A A 55. mailto:[150]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 56.
[151]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >>A A 57. mailto:[152]julian_kift at hotmail.com
A A >>A A 58.
mailto:[153]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 59. mailto:[154]coreyjprice at gmail.com
A A >>A A 60. mailto:[155]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 61. mailto:[156]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 62.
[157]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fser
A A >>A A 63.
[158]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fver.detomasolist.com%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da
8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C63797841047605
8561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJ
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zBl2%2BHRO5VWNnUgmGzE%2B0tJtPno%3D&reserved=0
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[159]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C
01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaa
aaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjo
iMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7
C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&res
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A A >>A A 65. mailto:[160]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 66.
[161]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C
01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaa
aaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjo
iMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7
C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&res
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[162]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C
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iMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7
C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&res
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A A >>A A 68.
[163]https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
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aaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjo
iMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7
C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&res
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[164]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >>A A 70.
[165]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >>A A 71. mailto:[166]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>A A 72.
[167]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A >> _______________________________________________
A A >>
A A >>
A A >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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A A >> DeTomaso mailing list
A A >> [168]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >>
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A A > _______________________________________________
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A A >
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A A > DeTomaso mailing list
A A > [170]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A >
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A A _______________________________________________
A A Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A [172]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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_______________________________________________
Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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DeTomaso mailing list
[174]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
[175]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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References
1. mailto:will.kooiman at gmail.com
2. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
3. mailto:knottsj at galstar.com
4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. mailto:lotus0005 at hotmail.com
6. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
7. mailto:will.kooiman at gmail.com
8. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
9. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
10. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
11. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
12. mailto:kenn_green at yahoo.com
13. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
14. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
15. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
16. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
17. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
18. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
19. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
20. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
21. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
22. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
23. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
24. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
25. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
26. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
27. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
28. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%
29. http://ver.detomasolist.com/
30. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
31. http://server.detomasolist.com/
32. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
33. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
34. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
35. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
36. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
37. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
38. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
39. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
40. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
41. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
42. http://detomasolist.com/
43. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
44. http://ver.detomasolist.com/
45. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
46. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
47. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
48. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
49. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
50. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
51. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
52. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
53. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
54. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
55. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
56. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
57. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
58. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
59. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
60. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
61. http://detomasolist.com/
62. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
63. http://ver.detomasolist.com/
64. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
65. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
66. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
67. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
68. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
69. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
70. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
71. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
72. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
73. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
74. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
75. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
76. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
77. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
78. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
79. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
80. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
81. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fve
82. http://r.detomasolist.com/
83. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
84. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
85. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
86. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
87. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
88. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
89. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
90. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
91. http://rver.detomasolist.com/
92. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
93. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
94. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
95. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
96. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
97. mailto:will.kooiman at gmail.com
98. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
99. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
100. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
101. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
102. mailto:kenn_green at yahoo.com
103. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
104. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
105. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
106. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
107. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
108. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
109. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
110. mailto:larrys at panteraparts.com
111. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
112. mailto:kszwab at gmail.com
113. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
114. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
115. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
116. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
117. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
118. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%
119. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2F
120. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
121. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
122. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
123. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
124. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
125. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
126. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
127. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
128. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fver
129. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
130. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
131. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
132. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
133. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
134. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
135. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
136. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
137. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
138. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
139. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
140. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
141. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
142. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fver
143. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
144. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
145. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
146. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
147. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fse
148. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
149. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
150. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
151. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
152. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
153. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
154. mailto:coreyjprice at gmail.com
155. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
156. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
157. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
158. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fver.detomasolist.com%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=jeEiMejv%2B85oshkKzBl2%2BHRO5VWNnUgmGzE%2B0tJtPno%3D&reserved=0
159. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
160. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
161. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
162. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
163. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C01%7C%7C30f3d92b1a94498f6c7108da8dfbef3d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637978410476058561%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JYnjWCKKY7watsvzg7%2BLs7Mpq85TuJ6IMoe%2FebfGgM8%3D&reserved=0
164. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
165. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
166. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
167. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
168. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
169. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
170. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
171. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
172. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
173. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
174. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
175. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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