[DeTomaso] Daytona update

jderyke at aol.com jderyke at aol.com
Mon Nov 7 21:42:47 EST 2022 

Just some observations by a now-too-old wanna-be racer, Steve. But it seemed like EVERY time Ford tried to 'improve' on the ZF in the old GT-40 days, their experience was the same as yours. They spent hundreds of thousands of $ needlessly with their "fixes" from the best of Ford Engineering, that invariably broke, blew up or otherwise malfunctioned, in multiple years of pro road racing with the GT-40s. The last failure may have killed Ken Miles- still controversy there. 

Ford Engineering even questioned the quality of steel used in ZF gears. ZF sent them some gears and a mainshaft for analysis. Ford tested them repeatedly to SAE specs and found that ZF's steel was BETTER than the stuff Ford was currently using in their NASCAR and NHRA top loader trannys. That part is in published Ford papers in POCA's Archives. 

As for the rest, a member -Jr Wilson- ran a production ZF in a Pantera behind a bored & stroked 427 Fontana, then finally a 548-inch Boss 429 that was estimated to deliver over 850 bhp, with god-knows how much torque. The only ZF failure Jr had in a 5 yr period of contesting many SS events was in a Silver State race, when he 'got air' at over 200 mph while not letting off the throttle. He never was good at slowing down.... On landing still at full throttle, the shock snapped the mainshaft in the necked down area behind the clutch splines. I think Lloyd Butfoy warranteed the part....  Jr is still around in Salinas, CA.  I wouldn't spend much more effort with Quaife out of your own pocket. IMHO you've done enough unpaid development work for them. Best of luck- J DeRyke

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Lisa <stevelisa at patentit.com>
To: Gray Gregory <rgg at gregorycook.com>
Cc: List DeTomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Mon, Nov 7, 2022 5:28 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Daytona update

  No doubt.A  I hope that someday we get there with Pantera. We had a
  good west coast run, but ran the ZF.A  I did not think the ZF was a
  good call for Daytona and Sebring (we planned both before shit hit the
  fan).
  I still think the Quaife will work....I have gone through a ton of
  motors in testing during my real racing days....just part.of getting
  right, even tho disappointing.A  I do believe the Quaife will work.
  I sat around not doing much Sunday, so rooting for you. Having the
  privilege to race against you in the DP02, I know you are a great
  driver and VERY tough competitor, and it was fun.
  I might take a break from Daytona and run the Norma at COTA F1 next
  year.A  We will triage the cars and see whereA it goes.A  Any interest
  in COTA with Master's Endurance Legends?
  Still, absolutely great race for you ... Well deserved.
  Regards,A
  Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
  The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
  Email: SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
  Direct:A 480-442-0297
  [1]www.PatentIt.com
  Scottsdale OfficeA |A P:A 480.535.6656A  |A A F:A 480.535.6628A
  |A A A:A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
  Chicago OfficeA |A P:A 312.752.4357A  |A A F:A 312.896.5633A
  |A A A:A 55 E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
  This email is intended only for the recipient above and may contain
  confidential and privileged information. If you received this email in
  error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to me. Thank
  you.

  On Mon, Nov 7, 2022, 6:00 PM Gray Gregory <[2]rgg at gregorycook.com>
  wrote:

    Thanks Steve!
    This was the 3rd Daytona win. One win in group A in my B16 and this
    was number 2 in group B for the B26.
    The other 3 wins were at Sebring all in the B26.
    These are my favorite events so to win one is pretty special!
    Gray
    -----Original Message-----
    From: DeTomaso <[3]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> On
    Behalf Of Steve Lisa
    Sent: Monday, November 7, 2022 4:16 PM
    To: List DeTomaso Forum <[4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
    Subject: [DeTomaso] Daytona update
    Not sure I got it right.A  Photos are coming in from
    photographers.A  This time the Panoz.A  Will update with Pantera
    pics when/if they arrive.
    And, we all need to recognize Gray Gregory's win in the Chevron.A  I
    think it is his 5th or 6th win.A  He has it nailed.
    Regards,
    Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
    The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
    Email: SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
    Direct: 480-442-0297
    [5]www.PatentIt.com
    Scottsdale Office | P: 480.535.6656A  |A  F: 480.535.6628A  |A  A:
    7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
    Chicago Office | P: 312.752.4357A  |A  F: 312.896.5633A  |A  A: 55
    E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
    This email is intended only for the recipient above and may contain
    confidential and privileged information. If you received this email
    in error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to me.
    Thank you.

References

  1. http://www.PatentIt.com/
  2. mailto:rgg at gregorycook.com
  3. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  5. http://www.PatentIt.com/
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-------------- next part --------------
   Just some observations by a now-too-old wanna-be racer, Steve. But it
   seemed like EVERY time Ford tried to 'improve' on the ZF in the old
   GT-40 days, their experience was the same as yours. They spent hundreds
   of thousands of $ needlessly with their "fixes" from the best of Ford
   Engineering, that invariably broke, blew up or otherwise malfunctioned,
   in multiple years of pro road racing with the GT-40s. The last failure
   may have killed Ken Miles- still controversy there.
   Ford Engineering even questioned the quality of steel used in ZF gears.
   ZF sent them some gears and a mainshaft for analysis. Ford tested them
   repeatedly to SAE specs and found that ZF's steel was BETTER than the
   stuff Ford was currently using in their NASCAR and NHRA top loader
   trannys. That part is in published Ford papers in POCA's Archives.
   As for the rest, a member -Jr Wilson- ran a production ZF in a
   Pantera behind a bored & stroked 427 Fontana, then finally a 548-inch
   Boss 429 that was estimated to deliver over 850 bhp, with god-knows how
   much torque. The only ZF failure Jr had in a 5 yr period of contesting
   many SS events was in a Silver State race, when he 'got air' at over
   200 mph while not letting off the throttle. He never was good at
   slowing down.... On landing still at full throttle, the shock snapped
   the mainshaft in the necked down area behind the clutch splines. I
   think Lloyd Butfoy warranteed the part....  Jr is still around in
   Salinas, CA.  I wouldn't spend much more effort with Quaife out of your
   own pocket. IMHO you've done enough unpaid development work for them.
   Best of luck- J DeRyke
   -----Original Message-----
   From: Steve Lisa <stevelisa at patentit.com>
   To: Gray Gregory <rgg at gregorycook.com>
   Cc: List DeTomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Sent: Mon, Nov 7, 2022 5:28 pm
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Daytona update
     No doubt.A  I hope that someday we get there with Pantera. We had a
     good west coast run, but ran the ZF.A  I did not think the ZF was a
     good call for Daytona and Sebring (we planned both before shit hit
   the
     fan).
     I still think the Quaife will work....I have gone through a ton of
     motors in testing during my real racing days....just part.of getting
     right, even tho disappointing.A  I do believe the Quaife will work.
     I sat around not doing much Sunday, so rooting for you. Having the
     privilege to race against you in the DP02, I know you are a great
     driver and VERY tough competitor, and it was fun.
     I might take a break from Daytona and run the Norma at COTA F1 next
     year.A  We will triage the cars and see whereA it goes.A  Any
   interest
     in COTA with Master's Endurance Legends?
     Still, absolutely great race for you ... Well deserved.
     Regards,A
     Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
     The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
     Email: [1]SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
     Direct:A 480-442-0297
     [1]www.PatentIt.com
     Scottsdale OfficeA |A P:A 480.535.6656A  |A A F:A 480.535.6628A
     |A A A:A 7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
     Chicago OfficeA |A P:A 312.752.4357A  |A A F:A 312.896.5633A
     |A A A:A 55 E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
     This email is intended only for the recipient above and may contain
     confidential and privileged information. If you received this email
   in
     error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to me.
   Thank
     you.
     On Mon, Nov 7, 2022, 6:00 PM Gray Gregory <[2][2]rgg at gregorycook.com>
     wrote:
       Thanks Steve!
       This was the 3rd Daytona win. One win in group A in my B16 and this
       was number 2 in group B for the B26.
       The other 3 wins were at Sebring all in the B26.
       These are my favorite events so to win one is pretty special!
       Gray
       -----Original Message-----
       From: DeTomaso <[3][3]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> On
       Behalf Of Steve Lisa
       Sent: Monday, November 7, 2022 4:16 PM
       To: List DeTomaso Forum <[4][4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
       Subject: [DeTomaso] Daytona update
       Not sure I got it right.A  Photos are coming in from
       photographers.A  This time the Panoz.A  Will update with Pantera
       pics when/if they arrive.
       And, we all need to recognize Gray Gregory's win in the Chevron.A
   I
       think it is his 5th or 6th win.A  He has it nailed.
       Regards,
       Steven G. Lisa, Esq.
       The Law Offices of Lisa & Lesko, LLC
       Email: [5]SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
       Direct: 480-442-0297
       [5]www.PatentIt.com
       Scottsdale Office | P: 480.535.6656A  |A  F: 480.535.6628A  |A  A:
       7689 East Paradise Lane, Suite 2, Scottsdale, AZ 85260
       Chicago Office | P: 312.752.4357A  |A  F: 312.896.5633A  |A  A: 55
       E. Monroe Street, Suite 3800, Chicago, IL 60603
       This email is intended only for the recipient above and may contain
       confidential and privileged information. If you received this email
       in error please destroy it and indicate such by return email to me.
       Thank you.
   References
     1. [6]http://www.PatentIt.com/
     2. mailto:[7]rgg at gregorycook.com
     3. mailto:[8]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
     4. mailto:[9]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     5.
   [10]http://www.PatentIt.com/
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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References

   1. mailto:SteveLisa at PatentIt.comA
   2. mailto:rgg at gregorycook.com
   3. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   5. mailto:SteveLisa at PatentIt.com
   6. http://www.patentit.com/
   7. mailto:rgg at gregorycook.com
   8. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   9. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  10. http://www.patentit.com/
  11. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  12. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso

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