[DeTomaso] REPLACMENT CARB ?
jderyke at aol.com
jderyke at aol.com
Tue Jan 25 19:08:26 EST 2022
Back in the day, it was widely reported that changing from a 600 Holley to a 750 in a Pantera would pick up an average of 40 bhp with no other changes. And drop 4 mpg avg, also with no changes. So it depends on what's most important to the owner at the time. Those numbers came from the era of $1/gal 100 octane on every street corner. Today at Costco, 89 octane was $3.39/gal and 100 octane only comes from race gas suppliers in gold wrapped 5 gal cans.
-----Original Message-----
From: Rich Hoppe <richbhoppe at gmail.com>
To: B Hower <b.hower3400 at yahoo.com>
Cc: jderyke at aol.com; lplugw at hotmail.com; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com; flatbeds78 at yahoo.com; kenn_green at yahoo.com; Will Kooiman <will.kooiman at gmail.com>
Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2022 2:45 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] REPLACMENT CARB ?
Bud
What rpm do you run.
To me a carb is sized to how high of an rpm you expect to run at.
I always ran a 750 Holley and would rev to 6500rpms. It ran good.
If you don’t run that high you can go to a smaller carb.
Rich
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 25, 2022, at 3:19 PM, B Hower via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Ian,
> I may be a little "Old School" but, I run a 600cfm Holley on an
> Edelbrock F351 4V. I have done some road racing and cross country
> street trips. I have GPS recorded 157 mph with that set up on a .030
> overbore, hydraulic lifters, 68cc closed chamber heads, an Isky 431282
> cam and roller rockers. I am happy with the all around performance.
> Just for a reverence,
> Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not be!
> )
>
> On Tuesday, January 25, 2022, 02:59:13 PM CST, Will Kooiman
> <will.kooiman at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Ian,
> As Ken said, you need to solve the spreadbore vs. squarebore problem
> first. If you're running a stock intake, you need an adapter to run a
> squarebore carburetor. Or, you can change the manifold too - as most
> people do.
> Hot Rod Engine Masters did a comparison between cheap and expensive
> carburetors. They essentially found no difference in performance. The
> only notable difference was the Edelbrock carburetor made less power,
> but they said that was likely due to the way they were rated. An
> Edelbrock 600cfm carburetor very likely flows less than a 600cfm
> Holley. In other words, the power difference wasn't due to the design,
> but rather due to the flow ratings.
> So, you're really buying a carburetor based on size, looks, and ease of
> tuning.
> I wouldn't personally run anything smaller than a 650cfm on a 351C, and
> honestly, I'd probably run a 750DP - model# 4779 - even on a stock
> 351C. A smaller carburetor might have better throttle response, but
> "It has a 750 double-pumper" sounds more manly than "It has a 650."
> Plus, when you decide to add a larger cam or do other mods, the 750DP
> can handle the airflow - so room for growth.
> Some PNs:
> Manual Choke 650DP 0-4777C
> No Choke 750DP 0-80528-2 <-- what I would run
> Manual Choke 750DP 0-4779C
> I'm not saying I'm right. This is just my opinion. And you'll likely
> get several of them on a subject like this.
> Will.
> i>>?On 1/25/22, 3:11 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Jack DeRyke via
> DeTomaso" <[1]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
> [2]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
> For a long time, the carb of choice for mostly-stock Panteras was
> the
> 600 cfm vacuum-secondary Holley 1850. Since that was in the
> previous
> century and Holley has been sold twice, plus the SMOG lawbooks
> are now
> hundreds of pages long, not sure what the 2022 analog of that
> carb is.
> But a few of Holley's later offerings were designed to be smog
> compliant in CA and as such, were only narrowly tunable if you
> got the
> urge to adjust later. Holley's Avenger series was one such to be
> avoided. If you're stubborn and persistent, there are places in
> the US
> that will work on your Motorcraft 4300-D (fewer still will touch
> the
> even earlier Autolite). Maybe the early Mustang Club has info.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Larry Weston <[3]lplugw at hotmail.com>
> To: Detomaso List <[4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>; Ian
> Deffebach
> <[5]flatbeds78 at yahoo.com>; Ken Green <[6]kenn_green at yahoo.com>
> Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2022 8:31 am
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] REPLACMENT CARB ?
> most importantly, are you going to use the stock spread bore
> manifold
> or change out to a square bore manifold?
>
> __________________________________________________________________
> From: DeTomaso <[1][7]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>
> on
> behalf of
> Ken Green via DeTomaso <[2][8]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2022 11:28 AM
> To: Detomaso List <[3][9]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>; Ian
> Deffebach
> <[4][10]flatbeds78 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] REPLACMENT CARB ?
> Probably depends on use and the rest of the engine, original
> cam,
> etc.
> On Tuesday, January 25, 2022, 08:10:59 AM PST, Ian
> Deffebach via
> DeTomaso <[5][11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
> Do you know what the carb of choice is when replacing the
> original
> Motorcraft on a 74 ? Holley Avenger ? what CFM ? Model # ?
> Ian Deffebach
> Owner, Deffebach Trucking
> 818-472-9655
> | "An asset based company."
> [7243690c-3537-43c1-be25-d8471a8633b7.png]
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-------------- next part --------------
Back in the day, it was widely reported that changing from a 600 Holley
to a 750 in a Pantera would pick up an average of 40 bhp with no other
changes. And drop 4 mpg avg, also with no changes. So it depends on
what's most important to the owner at the time. Those numbers came from
the era of $1/gal 100 octane on every street corner. Today at Costco,
89 octane was $3.39/gal and 100 octane only comes from race gas
suppliers in gold wrapped 5 gal cans.
-----Original Message-----
From: Rich Hoppe <richbhoppe at gmail.com>
To: B Hower <b.hower3400 at yahoo.com>
Cc: jderyke at aol.com; lplugw at hotmail.com;
detomaso at server.detomasolist.com; flatbeds78 at yahoo.com;
kenn_green at yahoo.com; Will Kooiman <will.kooiman at gmail.com>
Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2022 2:45 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] REPLACMENT CARB ?
Bud
What rpm do you run.
To me a carb is sized to how high of an rpm you expect to run at.
I always ran a 750 Holley and would rev to 6500rpms. It ran good.
If you donat run that high you can go to a smaller carb.
Rich
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 25, 2022, at 3:19 PM, B Hower via DeTomaso
<[1]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
>
> i>>? Hi Ian,
> I may be a little "Old School" but, I run a 600cfm Holley on an
> Edelbrock F351 4V. I have done some road racing and cross country
> street trips. I have GPS recorded 157 mph with that set up on a .030
> overbore, hydraulic lifters, 68cc closed chamber heads, an Isky
431282
> cam and roller rockers. I am happy with the all around performance.
> Just for a reverence,
> Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not
be!
> )
>
> On Tuesday, January 25, 2022, 02:59:13 PM CST, Will Kooiman
> <[2]will.kooiman at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Ian,
> As Ken said, you need to solve the spreadbore vs. squarebore problem
> first. If you're running a stock intake, you need an adapter to run
a
> squarebore carburetor. Or, you can change the manifold too - as
most
> people do.
> Hot Rod Engine Masters did a comparison between cheap and expensive
> carburetors. They essentially found no difference in performance.
The
> only notable difference was the Edelbrock carburetor made less
power,
> but they said that was likely due to the way they were rated. An
> Edelbrock 600cfm carburetor very likely flows less than a 600cfm
> Holley. In other words, the power difference wasn't due to the
design,
> but rather due to the flow ratings.
> So, you're really buying a carburetor based on size, looks, and ease
of
> tuning.
> I wouldn't personally run anything smaller than a 650cfm on a 351C,
and
> honestly, I'd probably run a 750DP - model# 4779 - even on a stock
> 351C. A smaller carburetor might have better throttle response, but
> "It has a 750 double-pumper" sounds more manly than "It has a 650."
> Plus, when you decide to add a larger cam or do other mods, the
750DP
> can handle the airflow - so room for growth.
> Some PNs:
> Manual Choke 650DP 0-4777C
> No Choke 750DP 0-80528-2 <-- what I would run
> Manual Choke 750DP 0-4779C
> I'm not saying I'm right. This is just my opinion. And you'll
likely
> get several of them on a subject like this.
> Will.
> i>>?On 1/25/22, 3:11 PM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Jack DeRyke via
> DeTomaso" <[1][3]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf
of
> [2][4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:
> For a long time, the carb of choice for mostly-stock Panteras
was
> the
> 600 cfm vacuum-secondary Holley 1850. Since that was in the
> previous
> century and Holley has been sold twice, plus the SMOG lawbooks
> are now
> hundreds of pages long, not sure what the 2022 analog of that
> carb is.
> But a few of Holley's later offerings were designed to be smog
> compliant in CA and as such, were only narrowly tunable if you
> got the
> urge to adjust later. Holley's Avenger series was one such to
be
> avoided. If you're stubborn and persistent, there are places
in
> the US
> that will work on your Motorcraft 4300-D (fewer still will
touch
> the
> even earlier Autolite). Maybe the early Mustang Club has info.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Larry Weston <[3][5]lplugw at hotmail.com>
> To: Detomaso List <[4][6]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>;
Ian
> Deffebach
> <[5][7]flatbeds78 at yahoo.com>; Ken Green
<[6][8]kenn_green at yahoo.com>
> Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2022 8:31 am
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] REPLACMENT CARB ?
> most importantly, are you going to use the stock spread bore
> manifold
> or change out to a square bore manifold?
>
> __________________________________________________________________
> From: DeTomaso
<[1][7][9]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>
> on
> behalf of
> Ken Green via DeTomaso
<[2][8][10]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2022 11:28 AM
> To: Detomaso List
<[3][9][11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>; Ian
> Deffebach
> <[4][10][12]flatbeds78 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] REPLACMENT CARB ?
> Probably depends on use and the rest of the engine, original
> cam,
> etc.
> On Tuesday, January 25, 2022, 08:10:59 AM PST, Ian
> Deffebach via
> DeTomaso <[5][11][13]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
wrote:
> Do you know what the carb of choice is when replacing
the
> original
> Motorcraft on a 74 ? Holley Avenger ? what CFM ? Model # ?
> Ian Deffebach
> Owner, Deffebach Trucking
> 818-472-9655
> | "An asset based company."
> [7243690c-3537-43c1-be25-d8471a8633b7.png]
> _______________________________________________
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [6][12][14]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>
>
[1][7][13][15]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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unsubscribe,
> etc.)
> use the links above.
> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
> forward
> any
> message posted here to all past, current, or future members
of
> the
> list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain
an
> archive
> or approve the archiving of list messages.
> References
> 1.
> [8][14][16]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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