[DeTomaso] Pantera Tach Shows 0 at Cold Idle
Doug Braun
doug351c at gmail.com
Wed Dec 30 14:49:38 EST 2020
Mike,
I see that you tried a second tach ground already but where did you make
your connections?
I recommend you have a helper touch one end of a wire directly to the
battery's (-) terminal while you touch the other end to the tach's case.
Doug Braun
blue 73L #5505
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 8:58 AM Mike Reilly <reillyms at live.com> wrote:
> Hi all. Thanks for the input. I suspect a ground issue somewhere in
> the circuit which I'll try to run down. Although I did try giving the
> tach it's own ground wire but that didn't change the behavior. I did
> install a new fuse box and ignition switch controller (ISC) from Jon
> Haas so I may have caused some grounding issue as I moved wires
> around. I did trouble shoot with Jon months ago but all his products
> seemed to be working as designed. It was doing this before I switch to
> the new fuse box. I was hoping the new fuse box would help. It hadn't
> done it before the ISC was installed but I also had a no start issue
> then due to a bad ignition switch. So I was touching lots of wiring
> then.
>
>
> I'll have some detective work to do here and may need to trace the
> circuit and check everything as folks have suggested. I'll probably
> reach out to Jon for any further suggestions as well. Fun with decades
> old wiring : )
>
>
> Dennis, I have a DuraSpark distributor and electronic ignition system
> that's been in the car since 1992 and it didn't require a tach
> adaptor. I only recently had this problem come up so I don't think
> it's my ignition system : (
>
>
> Thanks, Mike
>
>
> From: [1]dennis617 at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2020 6:44 AM
> To: [2]reillyms at live.com; [3]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Pantera Tach Shows 0 at Cold Idle
>
>
> Hi Mike,
>
> I've been having a similar problem with my tach, although, I've never
> tried the the window switch trick. When my car sits idle for a long
> period I find that my tach stops working until I drive it for a few
> minutes or if it gets a chance to really warm up. I haven't solved the
> problem yet, but I suspect that it is the tach adapter that was
> installed when the engine was totally redone and I changed over to the
> FAST EZ 2.0 EFI and a mallory ignition system. I never had any
> problems with my tach until the adapter was added to the system. Are
> you using an adapter as well?
>
> Dennis
>
>
> [cid:image002.png at 01D6DE89.F5A25270]
>
> On Tuesday, December 29, 2020 Mike Reilly <reillyms at live.com> wrote:
>
> Hi all. I've been having a weird tach problem for a few months now.
>
> When I cold start the car the tach sits at zero but will respond when
> I
>
> give it gas and go to 2000 RPMs for example. When I let off the gas
> it
>
> goes back to zero yet the car is idling fine at around 900 RPMs. Now
>
> when I push up on both window switches then the tach will respond and
>
> read at idle speed but when I let go of the window switches the tach
>
> goes back to zero. However, once the car is warmed up then the tach
>
> works fine and shows idle speed etc. without ever going down to zero
>
> unless the motor is turned off. If I restart the car when warm the
>
> tack works fine. I think somehow I'm not getting enough voltage to
> the
>
> tack when the car is cold.
>
>
>
> Videos of the problem:
>
> * Cold start and playing with the windows (you can hear me
> describing
>
> what I'm doing near the end of this video)
>
> ([1][4]https://youtu.be/yIFtsp0ljzk)
>
> * Example of revving the motor when cold
>
> ([2][5]https://youtu.be/kWaRfGfj2HU)
>
> * Warm running and every thing works fine
>
> ([3][6]https://youtu.be/X1RY4VwmSmA)
>
>
>
> Jon Haas rebuilt my tach as I thought that might have been the
> problem
>
> but it was doing this behavior both before and after Jon's rebuild.
>
> (By the way he does great work on rebuilds and found some cracked
>
> resistors in my tach that were about to fail). I also converted to
> his
>
> new alternator to replace my stock rebuilt alternator thinking that
>
> would be the issue but the tach idle problem remained. This new
>
> alternator has a built in voltage regulator.
>
>
>
> I measured the various voltages coming to the tach and per my comms
>
> with Jon these are correct voltages when the engine is running:
>
> * Voltage at the tach (+terminal) light blue wire = 14.84V
>
> * Voltage at the +coil wire = 14V
>
> * Voltage at the +Duraspark = 14V
>
>
>
> My Pantera is #7366 and is a 74L running a DuraSpark electronic
>
> ignition. My battery is strong, new and kept on a trickle charger
>
>
>
> Any ideas as to why when the motor is cold the tach won't register at
>
> idle speed but does once the car is at operating temp? It's also
>
> strange that it will come back to life when cold if I push up on both
>
> window switches when the windows are already closed thus adding some
>
> load to the car's electrical circuit.
>
>
>
> Thanks, Mike Reilly
>
>
> References
>
>
> 1. [7]https://youtu.be/yIFtsp0ljzk
>
> 2. [8]https://youtu.be/kWaRfGfj2HU
>
> 3. [9]https://youtu.be/X1RY4VwmSmA
>
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>
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-------------- next part --------------
Mike,
I see that you tried a second tach ground already but where did you
make your connections?
I recommend you have a helper touch one end of a wire directly to the
battery's (-) terminal while you touch the other end to the tach's
case.
Doug Braun
blue 73L #5505
On Wed, Dec 30, 2020 at 8:58 AM Mike Reilly <[1]reillyms at live.com>
wrote:
A A Hi all.A Thanks for the input.A I suspect a ground issue
somewhere in
A A the circuit which I'll try to run down.A Although I did try
giving the
A A tach it's own ground wire but that didn't change the
behavior.A I did
A A install a new fuse box and ignition switch controller (ISC)
from Jon
A A Haas so I may have caused some grounding issue as I moved wires
A A around.A I did trouble shoot with Jon months ago but all his
products
A A seemed to be working as designed.A It was doing this before I
switch to
A A the new fuse box.A I was hoping the new fuse box would help.A
It hadn't
A A done it before the ISC was installed but I also had a no start
issue
A A then due to a bad ignition switch.A So I was touching lots of
wiring
A A then.
A A I'll have some detective work to do here and may need to trace
the
A A circuit and check everything as folks have suggested.A I'll
probably
A A reach out to Jon for any further suggestions as well.A Fun
with decades
A A old wiring : )
A A Dennis, I have a DuraSpark distributor and electronic ignition
system
A A that's been in the car since 1992 and it didn't require a tach
A A adaptor.A I only recently had this problem come up so I don't
think
A A it's my ignition system : (
A A Thanks, Mike
A A From: [1][2]dennis617 at aol.com
A A Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2020 6:44 AM
A A To: [2][3]reillyms at live.com;
[3][4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A A Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Pantera Tach Shows 0 at Cold Idle
A A Hi Mike,
A A I've been having a similar problem with my tach, although, I've
never
A A tried the the window switch trick.A When my car sits idle for
a long
A A period I find that my tach stops working until I drive it for a
few
A A minutes or if it gets a chance to really warm up.A I haven't
solved the
A A problem yet, but I suspect that it is the tach adapter that was
A A installed when the engine was totally redone and I changed over
to the
A A FAST EZ 2.0 EFI and a mallory ignition system.A I never had
any
A A problems with my tach until the adapter was added to the
system.A Are
A A you using an adapter as well?
A A Dennis
A A [cid:image002.png at 01D6DE89.F5A25270]
A A On Tuesday, December 29, 2020 Mike Reilly
<[5]reillyms at live.com> wrote:
A A A Hi all.A I've been having a weird tach problem for a few
months now.
A A A When I cold start the car the tach sits at zero but will
respond when
A A I
A A A give it gas and go to 2000 RPMs for example.A When I let
off the gas
A A it
A A A goes back to zero yet the car is idling fine at around 900
RPMs.A Now
A A A when I push up on both window switches then the tach will
respond and
A A A read at idle speed but when I let go of the window switches
the tach
A A A goes back to zero.A However, once the car is warmed up then
the tach
A A A works fine and shows idle speed etc. without ever going down
to zero
A A A unless the motor is turned off.A If I restart the car when
warm the
A A A tack works fine.A I think somehow I'm not getting enough
voltage to
A A the
A A A tack when the car is cold.
A A A Videos of the problem:
A A A A * Cold start and playing with the windows (you can hear
me
A A describing
A A A A A what I'm doing near the end of this video)
A A A A A ([1][4][6]https://youtu.be/yIFtsp0ljzk)
A A A A * Example of revving the motor when cold
A A A A A ([2][5][7]https://youtu.be/kWaRfGfj2HU)
A A A A * Warm running and every thing works fine
A A A A A ([3][6][8]https://youtu.be/X1RY4VwmSmA)
A A A Jon Haas rebuilt my tach as I thought that might have been
the
A A problem
A A A but it was doing this behavior both before and after Jon's
rebuild.
A A A (By the way he does great work on rebuilds and found some
cracked
A A A resistors in my tach that were about to fail).A I also
converted to
A A his
A A A new alternator to replace my stock rebuilt alternator
thinking that
A A A would be the issue but the tach idle problem remained.A
This new
A A A alternator has a built in voltage regulator.
A A A I measured the various voltages coming to the tach and per
my comms
A A A with Jon these are correct voltages when the engine is
running:
A A A A * Voltage at the tach (+terminal) light blue wire =
14.84V
A A A A * Voltage at the +coil wire = 14V
A A A A * Voltage at the +Duraspark = 14V
A A A My Pantera is #7366 and is a 74L running a DuraSpark
electronic
A A A ignition.A My battery is strong, new and kept on a trickle
charger
A A A Any ideas as to why when the motor is cold the tach won't
register at
A A A idle speed but does once the car is at operating temp?A
It's also
A A A strange that it will come back to life when cold if I push
up on both
A A A window switches when the windows are already closed thus
adding some
A A A load to the car's electrical circuit.
A A A Thanks, Mike Reilly
A A References
A A A 1. [7][9]https://youtu.be/yIFtsp0ljzk
A A A 2. [8][10]https://youtu.be/kWaRfGfj2HU
A A A 3. [9][11]https://youtu.be/X1RY4VwmSmA
A A _______________________________________________
A A Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
A A Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A [10][12]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
A
A [11][13]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
A A To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.)
A A use the links above.
A A Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
forward any
A A message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
the
A A list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
archive
A A or approve the archiving of list messages.
References
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3. mailto:reillyms at live.com
4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. mailto:reillyms at live.com
6. https://youtu.be/yIFtsp0ljzk
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8. https://youtu.be/X1RY4VwmSmA
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11. https://youtu.be/X1RY4VwmSmA
12. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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15. mailto:reillyms at live.com
16. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
17. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FyIFtsp0ljzk&data=04%7C01%7C%7Cf5ad5439d0804304ac2808d8acd176ac%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637449362925781170%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=oArOd%2BUyxza6sQUyDcErITtVE2O1k00C8T9oHGD0N6Y%3D&reserved=0
18. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FkWaRfGfj2HU&data=04%7C01%7C%7Cf5ad5439d0804304ac2808d8acd176ac%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637449362925791167%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=z4RrWM5bC0Wphu7C9mk5Pu%2FtpeTEu7m%2BOBlsF%2BiT3Y4%3D&reserved=0
19. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FX1RY4VwmSmA&data=04%7C01%7C%7Cf5ad5439d0804304ac2808d8acd176ac%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637449362925801158%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=vC6ux7G%2F%2F6JXPilQt1CrS5iMz2rQ9Y3kBC%2BHgruBy68%3D&reserved=0
20. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FyIFtsp0ljzk&data=04%7C01%7C%7Cf5ad5439d0804304ac2808d8acd176ac%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637449362925801158%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=QFW1uIu52STY3da9GrCDzITfmin7O4EzhgPRsfqnMJA%3D&reserved=0
21. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FkWaRfGfj2HU&data=04%7C01%7C%7Cf5ad5439d0804304ac2808d8acd176ac%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637449362925811157%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=C6cjno%2BMdL1SXeJ5%2Bc3Auxl9yz6acZ8oFl3Z46VHkmI%3D&reserved=0
22. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FX1RY4VwmSmA&data=04%7C01%7C%7Cf5ad5439d0804304ac2808d8acd176ac%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637449362925821152%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=djUHBWVGhOozhgSp7CQgd9RXm2Py94EbDzXNAY5mGVs%3D&reserved=0
23. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
24. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=04%7C01%7C%7Cf5ad5439d0804304ac2808d8acd176ac%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637449362925821152%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=gxxRiI0i0SR2NbYiNyXX5ah5PlGiVGeKINrHXscNVRs%3D&reserved=0
25. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
26. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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