[DeTomaso] BaT 1972 Pantera - Damaged during test drive
Pantdino
pantdino at aol.com
Thu Oct 4 12:45:07 EDT 2018
I think the insurance company could sue the driver if there were enough money involved to make it worth their while, but that wouldn't help you.
Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: MARK CHARLTON <pantera01826 at rogers.com>
To: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Cc: detomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Thu, Oct 4, 2018 8:48 am
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] BaT 1972 Pantera - Damaged during test drive
and Canada…Mark Charltonpantera01826 at rogers.com> On Oct 4, 2018, at 11:45 AM, Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:> > Jeff,> > Yup, that’s true everywhere in the US.> > Mike> > > > Sent from my iPad> >> On Oct 4, 2018, at 08:43, Jeff Detrich <jjdetrich at gmail.com> wrote:>> >> I don't know if this is specific to Texas or not, but here in Texas if>> a car is involved in an accident, the car carries the insurance>> regardless of who is driving. So if the guy says he has insurance, it>> doesn't matter, even if it's his fault. If you own the car, it's your>> insurance that pays.>> Jeff>> >> On Wed, Oct 3, 2018 at 3:27 PM Pantdino via DeTomaso>> <[1]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote:>> >> A A I think you can accomplish the same thing by instructing the>> owner />> A A driver to do what you'd do, ie stop with hands off the wheel,>> downshift>> A A to second at a certain speed to see if the synchros are>> working, apply>> A A throttle to see if the car changes direction, brake hard, etc.>> A A My impression is that with Ferraris the buyer does not drive>> the car>> A A until he has officially purchased it.A Too much money at risk.>> A A Jim>> A A -----Original Message----->> A A From: MARK CHARLTON <[2]pantera01826 at rogers.com>>> A A To: Himes, Terry (397C) (397C) <[3]Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov>>> A A Cc: DeTomaso Email List <[4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>;>> The>> A A DeTomaso Registry Guy <[5]detomasoregistry at gmail.com>>> A A Sent: Tue, Oct 2, 2018 12:19 pm>> A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] BaT 1972 Pantera - Damaged during test>> drive>> A A I agree that it seems like it would be dumb to buy a car>> without>> A A driving it, but on reflection, I have bought three collector>> cars>> A A without driving them (each for different reasons) before>> purchasing>> A A them. That includes two Panteras and a Longchamp. I definitely>> would>> A A never let someone I do not know or trust drive one of my cars>> until the>> A A deal is done (or at least a large deposit is in-hand). Mark>> Charlton>> A A [1][6]pantera01826 at rogers.com > On Oct 2, 2018, at 2:32 PM,>> Himes, Terry>> A A (397C) via DeTomaso <[2][7]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>>> wrote: > >>> A A Well said! > > Except for one thing... realistically, who would>> buy a>> A A car before they drove it?? > > > "A Purple Heart proves you>> were smart>> A A enough to hatch a plan, > stupid enough to try it and lucky>> enough to>> A A survive!" > > Terry W. Himes > JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory >>> Dawn>> A A Spacecraft Team > Rosetta Sequence Team Lead > Phone: (818)>> 393-6261 >>> A A Cell: (818) 653-8213 > [3][8]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov > d--od-, > >>>> i>>?On>> A A 10/2/18, 11:23 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Asa Jay Laughton">> A A <detomaso-[4][9]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of>> A A [5][10]asajay at asajay.com> wrote: > > I have to chime in here. I>> think there>> A A is a matter of "vetting" the potential buyer before letting>> them test>> A A drive. Yes, there are those who just want to burn the tires and>> see how>> A A fast the car goes; these you don't want driving the car. > > A>> real car>> A A guy who appreciates what they are looking to buy, will>> understand the>> A A concepts of horsepower and what it can do. They will understand>> the>> A A dynamic difference between mashing the throttle down and easing>> into>> A A it. They will know and feel if the engine is operating>> properly, if the>> A A secondaries for example are working or not. This what you>> discover by>> A A properly vetting the buyer. > > It's a mid-engine car. Have>> they driven>> A A anything like that before? With horsepower? > What do they do>> for a>> A A living? What are their hobbies? What other cars do they own?>> And more>> A A ... > > The idea is to get comfortable with the buyer. If you>> aren't>> A A comfortable with the buyer.... they don't get to drive it,>> until money>> A A is in hand and the title has been signed. > > Just my thoughts.>>> Asa>> A A Jay > > > a-L-Asa Jay Laughton, W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, retired >>> Sent>> A A using Jedi Mind Tricksa > > On Oct 2, 2018, 09:28, at 09:28,>> The>> A A DeTomaso Registry Guy <[6][11]detomasoregistry at gmail.com>>> wrote: >> >> When>> A A I bought my Pantera, The seller would not allow me to drive it.>>>>>> >> A A He said people could loose control of the car with its power.>>>>>> At>> A A the time I thought this was a little 'odd', but I still bought>> the >>>> A A car. >> >> Soon thereafter I found that he used the wrong carb>> cable>> A A bracket, and >> the secondaries were not opening. >> >> Yea,>> the car>> A A was a lot faster after that quick fix. >> >> Even if insurance>> covers>> A A the damage, there is still a loss in value >> with >> the car>> now>> A A having been in a wreck, minor as it may be. >> >> The driver>> owes the>> A A owner some money, like $10,000, part compensation >> and part>> A A punishment. >> >> Few truly honest people out there... so this>> won't>> A A happen. >> >> I am 'hired' occasionally to drive specialty>> cars. >> >>>> A A This is to diagnose problems, provide my opinion, or to give>> demo rides>> A A >> to perspective buyers. >> >> I was even asked to drive Bob>> Benson's>> A A Blue Beast at the DeAnza Auto-X >> ... Just to heat up the>> tires! >> >>>> A A Now that was FUN! >> >> Chuck >> >> >>>> A A _______________________________________________ >> >> >>>> Detomaso Email>> A A List is not managed by POCA >> Posted emails must not exceed>> 1.5>> A A Megabytes >> DeTomaso mailing list >>>> A A [7][12]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >>>> A A [8][13]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>>>>>> To>> A A manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,>> etc.) >>>> A A use the links above. >> >> Members who post to this list grant>> license>> A A to the list to forward any >> message posted here to all past,>> current,>> A A or future members of the >> list. 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They also grant the list owner permission>> to>> A A maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.>> A A _______________________________________________ Detomaso Email>> List is>> A A not managed by POCA Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes>> A A DeTomaso mailing list [11][16]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> A>> A [12][17]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> To manage>> A A your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use>> the>> A A links above. Members who post to this list grant license to the>> list to>> A A forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future>> members>> A A of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to>> maintain an>> A A archive or approve the archiving of list messages.>> References>> A A 1. mailto:[18]pantera01826 at rogers.com>> A A 2. mailto:[19]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> A A 3. mailto:[20]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov>> A A 4. mailto:[21]bounces at server.detomasolist.com>> A A 5. mailto:[22]asajay at asajay.com>> A A 6. mailto:[23]detomasoregistry at gmail.com>> A A 7. mailto:[24]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> A A 8. [25]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> A A 9. mailto:[26]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> A 10. [27]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> A 11. mailto:[28]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> A 12. [29]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> _______________________________________________>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes>> DeTomaso mailing list>> [30]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> [31]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,>> etc.) use the links above.>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward>> any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of>> the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an>> archive or approve the archiving of list messages.>> >> References>> >> 1. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 2. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com>> 3. mailto:Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov>> 4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 5. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com>> 6. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com>> 7. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 8. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov>> 9. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com>> 10. mailto:asajay at asajay.com>> 11. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com>> 12. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> 14. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 15. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> 16. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 17. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> 18. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com>> 19. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 20. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov>> 21. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com>> 22. mailto:asajay at asajay.com>> 23. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com>> 24. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 25. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> 26. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 27. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> 28. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 29. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> 30. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> 31. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> _______________________________________________>> >> >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes>> DeTomaso mailing list>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>> >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.>> >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.> > _______________________________________________> > > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes> DeTomaso mailing list> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso> > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.> > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. 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-------------- next part --------------
I think the insurance company could sue the driver if there were enough
money involved to make it worth their while, but that wouldn't help
you.
Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: MARK CHARLTON <pantera01826 at rogers.com>
To: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Cc: detomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Thu, Oct 4, 2018 8:48 am
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] BaT 1972 Pantera - Damaged during test drive
and Canadaa| Mark Charlton [1]pantera01826 at rogers.com > On Oct 4, 2018,
at 11:45 AM, Mike Drew via DeTomaso
<[2]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> wrote: > > Jeff, > > Yup, thatas
true everywhere in the US. > > Mike > > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On
Oct 4, 2018, at 08:43, Jeff Detrich <[3]jjdetrich at gmail.com> wrote: >>
>> I don't know if this is specific to Texas or not, but here in Texas
if >> a car is involved in an accident, the car carries the insurance
>> regardless of who is driving. So if the guy says he has insurance,
it >> doesn't matter, even if it's his fault. If you own the car, it's
your >> insurance that pays. >> Jeff >> >> On Wed, Oct 3, 2018 at 3:27
PM Pantdino via DeTomaso >> <[1][4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
wrote: >> >> A A I think you can accomplish the same thing by
instructing the >> owner / >> A A driver to do what you'd do, ie stop
with hands off the wheel, >> downshift >> A A to second at a certain
speed to see if the synchros are >> working, apply >> A A throttle to
see if the car changes direction, brake hard, etc. >> A A My impression
is that with Ferraris the buyer does not drive >> the car >> A A until
he has officially purchased it.A Too much money at risk. >> A A Jim >>
A A -----Original Message----- >> A A From: MARK CHARLTON
<[2][5]pantera01826 at rogers.com> >> A A To: Himes, Terry (397C) (397C)
<[3][6]Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov> >> A A Cc: DeTomaso Email List
<[4][7]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>; >> The >> A A DeTomaso
Registry Guy <[5][8]detomasoregistry at gmail.com> >> A A Sent: Tue, Oct
2, 2018 12:19 pm >> A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] BaT 1972 Pantera -
Damaged during test >> drive >> A A I agree that it seems like it would
be dumb to buy a car >> without >> A A driving it, but on reflection, I
have bought three collector >> cars >> A A without driving them (each
for different reasons) before >> purchasing >> A A them. That includes
two Panteras and a Longchamp. I definitely >> would >> A A never let
someone I do not know or trust drive one of my cars >> until the >> A A
deal is done (or at least a large deposit is in-hand). Mark >> Charlton
>> A A [1][6][9]pantera01826 at rogers.com > On Oct 2, 2018, at 2:32 PM,
>> Himes, Terry >> A A (397C) via DeTomaso
<[2][7][10]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com> >> wrote: > > >> A A Well
said! > > Except for one thing... realistically, who would >> buy a >>
A A car before they drove it?? > > > "A Purple Heart proves you >> were
smart >> A A enough to hatch a plan, > stupid enough to try it and
lucky >> enough to >> A A survive!" > > Terry W. Himes > JPL Jet
Propulsion Laboratory > >> Dawn >> A A Spacecraft Team > Rosetta
Sequence Team Lead > Phone: (818) >> 393-6261 > >> A A Cell: (818)
653-8213 > [3][8][11]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov > d--od-, > > >>> i>>?On >> A
A 10/2/18, 11:23 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Asa Jay Laughton" >> A A
<detomaso-[4][9][12]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of >> A A
[5][10][13]asajay at asajay.com> wrote: > > I have to chime in here. I >>
think there >> A A is a matter of "vetting" the potential buyer before
letting >> them test >> A A drive. Yes, there are those who just want
to burn the tires and >> see how >> A A fast the car goes; these you
don't want driving the car. > > A >> real car >> A A guy who
appreciates what they are looking to buy, will >> understand the >> A A
concepts of horsepower and what it can do. They will understand >> the
>> A A dynamic difference between mashing the throttle down and easing
>> into >> A A it. They will know and feel if the engine is operating
>> properly, if the >> A A secondaries for example are working or not.
This what you >> discover by >> A A properly vetting the buyer. > >
It's a mid-engine car. Have >> they driven >> A A anything like that
before? With horsepower? > What do they do >> for a >> A A living? What
are their hobbies? What other cars do they own? >> And more >> A A ...
> > The idea is to get comfortable with the buyer. If you >> aren't >>
A A comfortable with the buyer.... they don't get to drive it, >> until
money >> A A is in hand and the title has been signed. > > Just my
thoughts. >>> Asa >> A A Jay > > > a-L-Asa Jay Laughton, W7TSC, MSgt,
USAFR, retired > >> Sent >> A A using Jedi Mind Tricksa > > On Oct 2,
2018, 09:28, at 09:28, >> The >> A A DeTomaso Registry Guy
<[6][11][14]detomasoregistry at gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> When >> A A I
bought my Pantera, The seller would not allow me to drive it. >>>>>> >>
A A He said people could loose control of the car with its power.
>>>>>> At >> A A the time I thought this was a little 'odd', but I
still bought >> the >> >> A A car. >> >> Soon thereafter I found that
he used the wrong carb >> cable >> A A bracket, and >> the secondaries
were not opening. >> >> Yea, >> the car >> A A was a lot faster after
that quick fix. >> >> Even if insurance >> covers >> A A the damage,
there is still a loss in value >> with >> the car >> now >> A A having
been in a wreck, minor as it may be. >> >> The driver >> owes the >> A
A owner some money, like $10,000, part compensation >> and part >> A A
punishment. >> >> Few truly honest people out there... so this >> won't
>> A A happen. >> >> I am 'hired' occasionally to drive specialty >>
cars. >> >> >> A A This is to diagnose problems, provide my opinion, or
to give >> demo rides >> A A >> to perspective buyers. >> >> I was even
asked to drive Bob >> Benson's >> A A Blue Beast at the DeAnza Auto-X
>> ... Just to heat up the >> tires! >> >> >> A A Now that was FUN! >>
>> Chuck >> >> >> >> A A
_______________________________________________ >> >> >> >> Detomaso
Email >> A A List is not managed by POCA >> Posted emails must not
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post to this list grant >> license >> A A to the list to forward any >>
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of the >> list. They also grant the list >> owner >> A A permission to
maintain an archive >> or approve the archiving >> of list >> A A
messages. > > > _______________________________________________ >>>>>
>> A A Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA > Posted emails must
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_______________________________________________ Detomaso Email >> List
is >> A A not managed by POCA Posted emails must not exceed 1.5
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or approve the archiving of list messages. >> References >> A A 1.
[21]mailto:[18]pantera01826 at rogers.com >> A A 2.
[22]mailto:[19]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> A A 3.
[23]mailto:[20]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov >> A A 4.
[24]mailto:[21]bounces at server.detomasolist.com >> A A 5.
[25]mailto:[22]asajay at asajay.com >> A A 6.
[26]mailto:[23]detomasoregistry at gmail.com >> A A 7.
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[25][28]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> A A
9. [29]mailto:[26]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> A 10.
[27][30]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> A
11. [31]mailto:[28]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> A 12.
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[35]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 2.
[36]mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com >> 3.
[37]mailto:Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov >> 4.
[38]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 5.
[39]mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com >> 6.
[40]mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com >> 7.
[41]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 8.
[42]mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov >> 9.
[43]mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com >> 10.
[44]mailto:asajay at asajay.com >> 11.
[45]mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com >> 12.
[46]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 13.
[47]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 14.
[48]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 15.
[49]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 16.
[50]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 17.
[51]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 18.
[52]mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com >> 19.
[53]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 20.
[54]mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov >> 21.
[55]mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com >> 22.
[56]mailto:asajay at asajay.com >> 23.
[57]mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com >> 24.
[58]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 25.
[59]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 26.
[60]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 27.
[61]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 28.
[62]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 29.
[63]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >> 30.
[64]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com >> 31.
[65]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso >>
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References
1. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com
2. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
3. mailto:jjdetrich at gmail.com
4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com
6. mailto:Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov
7. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
8. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com
9. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com
10. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
11. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
12. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
13. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
14. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com
15. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
16. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
17. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
18. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
19. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
20. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
21. mailto:[18]pantera01826 at rogers.com?
22. mailto:[19]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
23. mailto:[20]thimes at jpl.nasa.gov?
24. mailto:[21]bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
25. mailto:[22]asajay at asajay.com?
26. mailto:[23]detomasoregistry at gmail.com?
27. mailto:[24]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
28. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
29. mailto:[26]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
30. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
31. mailto:[28]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
32. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
33. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
34. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
35. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
36. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com?
37. mailto:Terry.Himes at jpl.nasa.gov?
38. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
39. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com?
40. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com?
41. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
42. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov?
43. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
44. mailto:asajay at asajay.com?
45. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com?
46. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
47. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
48. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
49. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
50. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
51. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
52. mailto:pantera01826 at rogers.com?
53. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
54. mailto:thimes at jpl.nasa.gov?
55. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
56. mailto:asajay at asajay.com?
57. mailto:detomasoregistry at gmail.com?
58. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
59. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
60. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
61. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
62. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
63. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
64. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
65. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
66. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
67. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
68. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
69. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
70. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
71. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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