[DeTomaso] NW brothers-engine work

Julian Kift julian_kift at hotmail.com
Sun Jan 29 12:59:49 EST 2017 

John,


Thanks, all good points of clarification, I must focus to not interchange brass and bronze (and perhaps refrain from posting until after at least my first cup of coffee), they are as you say quite different alloys.


The availability for under size syncros is another very valid point and I have no qualms with Dennis or his ability to rebuild ZF's.


Julian

________________________________
From: jtaphorn at kingwoodcable.com <jtaphorn at kingwoodcable.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2017 9:11 AM
To: Julian Kift; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com; Stephen; 'Matt'
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NW brothers-engine work

Julian

I believe that Dennis offers syncro rings in a choice of steel or bronze (not brass).  I have rebuilt ZFs for others and have offered them their choice of material and used both.

I understand that the ZF is unusual in that the syncro body/cone and the syncro ring are both made of the same material - steel.  As such, the two wear out together. Other transmissions apply a softer material syncro ring to preserve the syncro body.   Having the ring made of bronze preserves the syncro cone which is much more expensive to replace.  An additional benefit to the bronze syncro ring is that Dennis also manufactures them with an undersize ID that allows one to recover tolerances with a worn synro cone.  This can mean substantial financial savings.  I recognize that the bronze ring will wear out faster.  Have you heard stories of failure or excessive wear?

I have bronze syncros in my ZFs and I have not had an issue with them.
My car isn't a daily driver but had seen track time and I have driven as far as Houston to the Phoenix Fun Rally where I had it on the Drag Strip.

My point is don't steer clear of Quella because he offers the bronze syncro ring as an option.  He will put steel in should that be your preference.

JT
---- Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com> wrote:

=============
My ZF was done by Dennis and has performed well, but for the sake of full disclosure I understand Dennis uses brass syncro rings, whereas Llloyd owning all the rights to the ZF transaxle uses oem spec steel. Some folks have expressed concern over the brass syncros in the past.


Julian

________________________________
From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Stephen <steve at snclocks.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2017 8:39 AM
To: 'Matt'; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NW brothers-engine work

Good morning Matt.  I can't really tell - are you looking for a shop to do all the work?  To me, the most important part is to get the engine seriously right - so I would focus on finding a shop that can do the best possible for a 351C.   I chose Aldridge Motorsports here in Vancouver, WA.  http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/  He is very good with these engines and can likely do what you want done on the car.  And do it well.  On the transaxle - I talked to Byron Sanborn about doing my ZF - he was honest enough to say it would be a loooong time before he could get to it.  Sent mine to Dennis at Pantera Performance - He is just plain good, and turned it quickly.
Welcome to Aldridge Motorsports<http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/>
www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com
For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it’s knowledge and given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products for better results!



Welcome to Aldridge Motorsports<http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/>
Welcome to Aldridge Motorsports<http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/>
www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com
For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it’s knowledge and given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products for better results!



www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com<http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com>
Welcome to Aldridge Motorsports<http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/>
www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com
For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it’s knowledge and given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products for better results!



For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it's knowledge and given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products for better results!




If you decide to go with Denny Aldridge, I can lend you the shipping container I used to send my ZF to Dennis.

Hope this helps...  If you are ever down in Vancouver - stop on by!

Stephen Nelson



-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf Of Matt
Sent: Friday, January 27, 2017 3:54 PM
To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: [DeTomaso] NW brothers-engine work

This is mostly for the NW clan, but I'm reaching out to all for any advice.
My engine is starting to smoke slightly. Mostly coming out of the passenger side exhaust. Not white smoke, just the light grey oil kind. More on initial startup then tapering off. I would then suspect maybe valve guides are the issue, correct?
Regardless I have wanted to rebuild it for some time due to some pissy oil leaks and general lack of performance. Plus I've wanted to have the ZF inspected since I've bought it (I know,bad me).
It's got about 60,000 miles, stock 351C 4V. Not the original motor.
I've changed it out to E.I.(Duraspark2) but nothing else internally.
I'm also in the process of converting to a Kirk Evans flat firewall kit and need some A/C help to finish that. Oh yeah and some suspension work!
The paint sucks but I like not having to worry about it and I'll let the next guy strip it down. But of course if the price is right...
For now I like it as a driver and would just be happy to make it go, stop and handle like it should. I do not have the facilities,tools nor the knowledge to do what this car deserves. I know just enough to be dangerous and I want it to be done right.

Soooo, my question to you fine folks is can anyone recommend a shop or person qualified to help me out located somewhere in the NW territory?
Thank you for your time and any direction you can point me, Matt
3584

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-------------- next part --------------
   John,

   Thanks, all good points of clarification, I must focus to not
   interchange brass and bronze (and perhaps refrain from posting until
   after at least my first cup of coffee), they are as you say quite
   different alloys.

   The availability for under size syncros is another very valid point and
   I have no qualms with Dennis or his ability to rebuild ZF's.

   Julian
     __________________________________________________________________

   From: jtaphorn at kingwoodcable.com <jtaphorn at kingwoodcable.com>
   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2017 9:11 AM
   To: Julian Kift; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com; Stephen; 'Matt'
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NW brothers-engine work

   Julian
   I believe that Dennis offers syncro rings in a choice of steel or
   bronze (not brass).  I have rebuilt ZFs for others and have offered
   them their choice of material and used both.
   I understand that the ZF is unusual in that the syncro body/cone and
   the syncro ring are both made of the same material - steel.  As such,
   the two wear out together. Other transmissions apply a softer material
   syncro ring to preserve the syncro body.   Having the ring made of
   bronze preserves the syncro cone which is much more expensive to
   replace.  An additional benefit to the bronze syncro ring is that
   Dennis also manufactures them with an undersize ID that allows one to
   recover tolerances with a worn synro cone.  This can mean substantial
   financial savings.  I recognize that the bronze ring will wear out
   faster.  Have you heard stories of failure or excessive wear?
   I have bronze syncros in my ZFs and I have not had an issue with them.
   My car isn't a daily driver but had seen track time and I have driven
   as far as Houston to the Phoenix Fun Rally where I had it on the Drag
   Strip.
   My point is don't steer clear of Quella because he offers the bronze
   syncro ring as an option.  He will put steel in should that be your
   preference.
   JT
   ---- Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com> wrote:
   =============
   My ZF was done by Dennis and has performed well, but for the sake of
   full disclosure I understand Dennis uses brass syncro rings, whereas
   Llloyd owning all the rights to the ZF transaxle uses oem spec steel.
   Some folks have expressed concern over the brass syncros in the past.
   Julian
   ________________________________
   From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
   Stephen <steve at snclocks.com>
   Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2017 8:39 AM
   To: 'Matt'; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NW brothers-engine work
   Good morning Matt.  I can't really tell - are you looking for a shop to
   do all the work?  To me, the most important part is to get the engine
   seriously right - so I would focus on finding a shop that can do the
   best possible for a 351C.   I chose Aldridge Motorsports here in
   Vancouver, WA.  [1]http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/  He is very
   good with these engines and can likely do what you want done on the
   car.  And do it well.  On the transaxle - I talked to Byron Sanborn
   about doing my ZF - he was honest enough to say it would be a loooong
   time before he could get to it.  Sent mine to Dennis at Pantera
   Performance - He is just plain good, and turned it quickly.
   [2]Welcome to Aldridge Motorsports
   www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com
   For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it's knowledge and
   given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products
   for better results!
   Welcome to Aldridge
   Motorsports<[3]http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/>
   [4]Welcome to Aldridge Motorsports
   www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com
   For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it's knowledge and
   given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products
   for better results!
   [5]www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com
   [6]Welcome to Aldridge Motorsports
   www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com
   For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it's knowledge and
   given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products
   for better results!
   For over 52 years, Aldridge Motorsports has shared it's knowledge and
   given great customer service. Our goal is to sell you better products
   for better results!
   If you decide to go with Denny Aldridge, I can lend you the shipping
   container I used to send my ZF to Dennis.
   Hope this helps...  If you are ever down in Vancouver - stop on by!
   Stephen Nelson
   -----Original Message-----
   From: DeTomaso [[7]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
   Behalf Of Matt
   Sent: Friday, January 27, 2017 3:54 PM
   To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   Subject: [DeTomaso] NW brothers-engine work
   This is mostly for the NW clan, but I'm reaching out to all for any
   advice.
   My engine is starting to smoke slightly. Mostly coming out of the
   passenger side exhaust. Not white smoke, just the light grey oil kind.
   More on initial startup then tapering off. I would then suspect maybe
   valve guides are the issue, correct?
   Regardless I have wanted to rebuild it for some time due to some pissy
   oil leaks and general lack of performance. Plus I've wanted to have the
   ZF inspected since I've bought it (I know,bad me).
   It's got about 60,000 miles, stock 351C 4V. Not the original motor.
   I've changed it out to E.I.(Duraspark2) but nothing else internally.
   I'm also in the process of converting to a Kirk Evans flat firewall kit
   and need some A/C help to finish that. Oh yeah and some suspension
   work!
   The paint sucks but I like not having to worry about it and I'll let
   the next guy strip it down. But of course if the price is right...
   For now I like it as a driver and would just be happy to make it go,
   stop and handle like it should. I do not have the facilities,tools nor
   the knowledge to do what this car deserves. I know just enough to be
   dangerous and I want it to be done right.
   Soooo, my question to you fine folks is can anyone recommend a shop or
   person qualified to help me out located somewhere in the NW territory?
   Thank you for your time and any direction you can point me, Matt
   3584
   _______________________________________________
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   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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References

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   2. http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/
   3. http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/
   4. http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/
   5. http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/
   6. http://www.aldridgemotorsportsinc.com/
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