[DeTomaso] F1 Drivers at Indy
Dave
dave at damardirect.com
Thu Jun 19 12:22:02 EDT 2014
All did well except Nigel. I remember his accident, he backed the car into the wall very hard fracturing his back at Phoenix.. Something might have broken and not driver error, I don't remember..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5AOAx59J8W0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk8BA6kIcyA
Williams had neglected to tell Mansell that Prost had signed for 1993<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Formula_One_season> at only the second race of the 1992 season in Mexico, a position that Mansell felt would be similar to their days together at Ferrari. To boot, Williams had Senna offering to drive the second car for free (although Senna found later he could not because of Prost's clause in his contract allowing him to veto the move) and decided that there was little sense in paying the high fees Mansell went on to demand. With the original offer revoked, Mansell with no teams near the competitiveness of Williams decided that enough was enough. An eleventh hour offer was made to him at the Italian Grand Prix, but by then the damage was done; Mansell retired from F1.
Mansell consequently left to join the Newman/Haas CART<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champ_Car> team in 1993. He took over the seat of Michael Andretti<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Andretti>, who coincidentally had left CART to race in Formula One<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formula_One> for McLaren<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McLaren_(racing)>. At the season opener at Surfers Paradise<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surfers_Paradise>, Australia, he became the first "rookie" to take pole position and win his first race. A few weeks later however, he suffered a substantial crash at the Phoenix International Raceway<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenix_International_Raceway>, severely injuring his back. At the 1993 Indianapolis 500<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Indianapolis_500>, Mansell would lead the race only to finish third after losing the lead to Emerson Fittipaldi<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emerson_Fittipaldi> and Arie Luyendyk<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arie_Luyendyk> after a poor restart. On his 40th birthday, however, Mansell would avenge his loss at Indianapolis to score a 500-mile race victory at Michigan, considered by many a tougher 500 mile race to win. He would go on to score five wins for the 1993 CART season, which, with more high-placed finishes, was good enough to earn him the championship. This enabled Mansell to become the only driver in history to hold both the Formula One and CART championships at the same time, because when he won the 1993 CART championship he was still the reigning F1 world champion, with the 1993 F1 championship not yet having been decided.
Following this successful season in CART, Mansell received several awards, including a Gold Medal from the Royal Automobile Club<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Automobile_Club> and the 1993 ESPY Award<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESPY_Award> for Best Driver.
His Newman/Haas car was much less reliable the following year, 1994, and results suffered. It was during this season that Mansell "wore out his welcome" in the United States with glimpses of rude behaviour, particularly after he was knocked out of the Indianapolis 500<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indianapolis_500>. After the crash, he stormed out of the track hospital, and refused medical care. When reporter Dr. Jerry Punch<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Punch> asked Mansell if he had spoken with Dennis Vitolo<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Vitolo>, the driver who had crashed into him, Mansell replied, "You speak to him" and shoved the camera away. Subsequently, Mansell was due to sign autographs at a K-mart<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kmart> store (the primary sponsor of his car), but because of a lack of demand the event was cancelled. Mansell was also the catalyst for the breakdown in the relationship between himself and Mario Andretti<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_Andretti>. Mario has since remarked "I guess if Ronnie Peterson<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronnie_Peterson> was the best team-mate I ever had, Nigel Mansell was the worst" and "I had a lot of respect for him as a driver, but not as a man".[23]<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Mansell#cite_note-23>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Mansell
This was interesting:
NASCAR, IndyCar and Formula One collide in this 2003 video featuring Jeff Gordon
http://www.autoweek.com/article/20140206/nascar01/140209894
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yaCqriUgXI&feature=kp
From: LS [mailto:lashdeep at yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 11:47 AM
To: Dave
Cc: John Donahue; Boyd Casey; detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: F1 Drivers at Indy
Indeed and there was much discussion prior to the first F1 race there about how fast the speeds would be on the straight. The eventual downforce package on the infield dampened that speculation a bit.
How do F1 drivers do on the ovals? Emo, Mario and Nigel did just fine...
Are they the extreme examples? I guess Justin Wilson made the transition well enough.
It is a shame we can't see pro drivers cross over into other series like the good old days (that I wasn't old enough to experience).
LS
central
wines-spirits est 1934
625 e street nw
washington, dc 20004
centralwines.com<http://centralwines.com/>
facebook.com/CentralLiquors<http://facebook.com/CentralLiquors>
202-737-2800
________________________________
From: Dave <dave at damardirect.com<mailto:dave at damardirect.com>>
To: LS <lashdeep at yahoo.com<mailto:lashdeep at yahoo.com>>
Cc: John Donahue <demongusta at me.com<mailto:demongusta at me.com>>; Boyd Casey <boyd411 at gmail.com<mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com>>; "detomaso at poca.com<mailto:detomaso at poca.com>" <detomaso at poca.com<mailto:detomaso at poca.com>>
Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 11:06 AM
Subject: RE: F1 Drivers at Indy
When F1 was at Indy-IMS, the drivers were not fond of exiting the road course in the short chute between the conventional turns 1 & 2, exiting the traditional turn 1 (counterclockwise) and traveling down the front stretch. As I remember, it was fastest F1 cars traveled on any course, at the time. The front stretch is 0.625 miles. The F! cars did not travel the entire front stretch before ducking back into the road course.
IndyDave
-----Original Message-----
From: LS [mailto:lashdeep at yahoo.com<mailto:lashdeep at yahoo.com>]
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2014 8:59 PM
To: Dave
Cc: John Donahue; Boyd Casey; detomaso at poca.com<mailto:detomaso at poca.com>
Subject: F1 Drivers at Indy
I am a huge MS fan and wish him a recovery worthy of his accomplishments.
Dave's comment has me wondering...
We all know that F1 drivers don't always translate to NASCAR success. This is due to a lot of reasons.
What I want to discuss is whether F1 skill can translate into Indy success. On road courses, sure...Villeneuve, Montoya and Mansell all mixed both well.
Has that always been the case?
LS
> On Jun 18, 2014, at 16:03, Dave <dave at damardirect.com<mailto:dave at damardirect.com>> wrote:
>
> Not too adaptable to high speed ovals and concrete.
> IndyDave
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Donahue [mailto:demongusta at me.com<mailto:demongusta at me.com>]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2014 6:47 PM
> To: Boyd Casey
> Cc: detomaso at poca.com<mailto:detomaso at poca.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Michael Schumacher
>
> F-1 drivers are "special" people.
>
>> On Jun 17, 2014, at 1:41 PM, Boyd Casey <boyd411 at gmail.com<mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Like "they" say," it's not over until the fat lady sings" . Lots of people are quick to count people out. Schumacher is a fighter . Seeing him overcome the odds is an inspiration to people every where who are facing uphill battles. I wish him Gods Speed and a full recovery!
>>
>> Boyd
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 17, 2014 at 11:04 AM, John Donahue via DeTomaso <detomaso at poca.com<mailto:detomaso at poca.com>> wrote:
>> He is out of his coma and going to rehab. Remarkable!!!
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
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-------------- next part --------------
All did well except Nigel. I remember his accident, he backed the car
into the wall very hard fracturing his back at Phoenix.. Something
might have broken and not driver error, I don't remember..
[1]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5AOAx59J8W0
[2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk8BA6kIcyA
Williams had neglected to tell Mansell that Prost had signed for
[3]1993 at only the second race of the 1992 season in Mexico, a
position that Mansell felt would be similar to their days together at
Ferrari. To boot, Williams had Senna offering to drive the second car
for free (although Senna found later he could not because of Prost's
clause in his contract allowing him to veto the move) and decided that
there was little sense in paying the high fees Mansell went on to
demand. With the original offer revoked, Mansell with no teams near the
competitiveness of Williams decided that enough was enough. An eleventh
hour offer was made to him at the Italian Grand Prix, but by then the
damage was done; Mansell retired from F1.
Mansell consequently left to join the Newman/Haas [4]CART team in 1993.
He took over the seat of [5]Michael Andretti, who coincidentally had
left CART to race in [6]Formula One for [7]McLaren. At the season
opener at [8]Surfers Paradise, Australia, he became the first "rookie"
to take pole position and win his first race. A few weeks later
however, he suffered a substantial crash at the [9]Phoenix
International Raceway, severely injuring his back. At the [10]1993
Indianapolis 500, Mansell would lead the race only to finish third
after losing the lead to [11]Emerson Fittipaldi and [12]Arie Luyendyk
after a poor restart. On his 40th birthday, however, Mansell would
avenge his loss at Indianapolis to score a 500-mile race victory at
Michigan, considered by many a tougher 500 mile race to win. He would
go on to score five wins for the 1993 CART season, which, with more
high-placed finishes, was good enough to earn him the championship.
This enabled Mansell to become the only driver in history to hold both
the Formula One and CART championships at the same time, because when
he won the 1993 CART championship he was still the reigning F1 world
champion, with the 1993 F1 championship not yet having been decided.
Following this successful season in CART, Mansell received several
awards, including a Gold Medal from the [13]Royal Automobile Club and
the 1993 [14]ESPY Award for Best Driver.
His Newman/Haas car was much less reliable the following year, 1994,
and results suffered. It was during this season that Mansell "wore out
his welcome" in the United States with glimpses of rude behaviour,
particularly after he was knocked out of the [15]Indianapolis 500.
After the crash, he stormed out of the track hospital, and refused
medical care. When reporter [16]Dr. Jerry Punch asked Mansell if he had
spoken with [17]Dennis Vitolo, the driver who had crashed into him,
Mansell replied, "You speak to him" and shoved the camera away.
Subsequently, Mansell was due to sign autographs at a [18]K-mart store
(the primary sponsor of his car), but because of a lack of demand the
event was cancelled. Mansell was also the catalyst for the breakdown in
the relationship between himself and [19]Mario Andretti. Mario has
since remarked "I guess if [20]Ronnie Peterson was the best team-mate I
ever had, Nigel Mansell was the worst" and "I had a lot of respect for
him as a driver, but not as a man".^[21][23]
[22]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Mansell
This was interesting:
NASCAR, IndyCar and Formula One collide in this 2003 video featuring
Jeff Gordon
[23]http://www.autoweek.com/article/20140206/nascar01/140209894
[24]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yaCqriUgXI&feature=kp
From: LS [mailto:lashdeep at yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 11:47 AM
To: Dave
Cc: John Donahue; Boyd Casey; detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: F1 Drivers at Indy
Indeed and there was much discussion prior to the first F1 race there
about how fast the speeds would be on the straight. The eventual
downforce package on the infield dampened that speculation a bit.
How do F1 drivers do on the ovals? Emo, Mario and Nigel did just
fine...
Are they the extreme examples? I guess Justin Wilson made the
transition well enough.
It is a shame we can't see pro drivers cross over into other series
like the good old days (that I wasn't old enough to experience).
LS
central
wines-spirits est 1934
625 e street nw
washington, dc 20004
[25]centralwines.com
[26]facebook.com/CentralLiquors
202-737-2800
_______________________________________________________________________
From: Dave <[27]dave at damardirect.com>
To: LS <[28]lashdeep at yahoo.com>
Cc: John Donahue <[29]demongusta at me.com>; Boyd Casey
<[30]boyd411 at gmail.com>; "[31]detomaso at poca.com"
<[32]detomaso at poca.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2014 11:06 AM
Subject: RE: F1 Drivers at Indy
When F1 was at Indy-IMS, the drivers were not fond of exiting the road
course in the short chute between the conventional turns 1 & 2, exiting
the traditional turn 1 (counterclockwise) and traveling down the front
stretch. As I remember, it was fastest F1 cars traveled on any course,
at the time. The front stretch is 0.625 miles. The F! cars did not
travel the entire front stretch before ducking back into the road
course.
IndyDave
-----Original Message-----
From: LS [mailto:[33]lashdeep at yahoo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2014 8:59 PM
To: Dave
Cc: John Donahue; Boyd Casey; [34]detomaso at poca.com
Subject: F1 Drivers at Indy
I am a huge MS fan and wish him a recovery worthy of his
accomplishments.
Dave's comment has me wondering...
We all know that F1 drivers don't always translate to NASCAR success.
This is due to a lot of reasons.
What I want to discuss is whether F1 skill can translate into Indy
success. On road courses, sure...Villeneuve, Montoya and Mansell all
mixed both well.
Has that always been the case?
LS
> On Jun 18, 2014, at 16:03, Dave <[35]dave at damardirect.com> wrote:
>
> Not too adaptable to high speed ovals and concrete.
> IndyDave
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Donahue [mailto:[36]demongusta at me.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2014 6:47 PM
> To: Boyd Casey
> Cc: [37]detomaso at poca.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Michael Schumacher
>
> F-1 drivers are "special" people.
>
>> On Jun 17, 2014, at 1:41 PM, Boyd Casey <[38]boyd411 at gmail.com>
wrote:
>>
>> Like "they" say," it's not over until the fat lady sings" . Lots of
people are quick to count people out. Schumacher is a fighter . Seeing
him overcome the odds is an inspiration to people every where who are
facing uphill battles. I wish him Gods Speed and a full recovery!
>>
>> Boyd
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 17, 2014 at 11:04 AM, John Donahue via DeTomaso
<[39]detomaso at poca.com> wrote:
>> He is out of his coma and going to rehab. Remarkable!!!
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> [40]DeTomaso at poca.com
>> [41]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [42]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [43]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
References
1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5AOAx59J8W0
2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk8BA6kIcyA
3. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Formula_One_season
4. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champ_Car
5. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Andretti
6. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formula_One
7. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McLaren_(racing)
8. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surfers_Paradise
9. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenix_International_Raceway
10. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Indianapolis_500
11. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emerson_Fittipaldi
12. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arie_Luyendyk
13. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Automobile_Club
14. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESPY_Award
15. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indianapolis_500
16. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Punch
17. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Vitolo
18. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kmart
19. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_Andretti
20. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronnie_Peterson
21. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Mansell#cite_note-23
22. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Mansell
23. http://www.autoweek.com/article/20140206/nascar01/140209894
24. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yaCqriUgXI&feature=kp
25. http://centralwines.com/
26. http://facebook.com/CentralLiquors
27. mailto:dave at damardirect.com
28. mailto:lashdeep at yahoo.com
29. mailto:demongusta at me.com
30. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
31. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
32. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
33. mailto:lashdeep at yahoo.com
34. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
35. mailto:dave at damardirect.com
36. mailto:demongusta at me.com
37. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
38. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
39. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
40. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
41. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
42. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
43. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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