[DeTomaso] [] 302 attention Frank

[P. Rimov]

Evening Frank and any one else following this thread:

I can not send pics through the forum they would have to be sent to your
personal E-mail.

"were there any other issues with installing the 302:  water pump, routing
cooling lines, motor mounts, throttle linkage, header design, clearance
problems, etc."
There are a host of small problems that need addressing. A lot of them
depend on what you want and whether your are planning for  EFI or a Carb 
engine management. For example I wanted a
serpentine belt set up that cost a bunch more than just going with a pair of
conventional V-belts to drive the alternator and A/C. If you are going EFI
then there is all the additional wiring, senders, relays, sensors and the 
ECU its self
to work with. A conventional carb is very straightforward. I wanted an EFI
engine and I wanted the fuel pump to be in the tank were it should be so I
had to come up with a self contained bracket to hold the pump and
accommodate a high pressure return line and low pressure vapor line. A
carbed engine you simply run the existing fuel line to the mechanical fuel
pump on the engine then from the fuel pump to a fuel filter then to the
carb. Headers are big deal, because no one makes headers for a 302 for
Pantera and there is precious little space for proper length headers in the
engine bay. Some of the Pantera vendors have headers for 351w but they will
not even come close to fitting even though both engines use the same heads.
The first set I fashioned were simple shorties but after testing them out
and working with a cam specialist I realized I needed to double the primary
length of the headers for proper scavenging of the exhaust pulses and waves
for much improved performance and a broader power range. With that said
Stainlessworks can make additional sets for me but they are several times
more expensive than headers currently available for 351w and 351c for the
Pantera as they are hand made one at a time out of 304 stainless but not any
more expensive that if you wanted stainless headers for your new ZR1.

The 302, being smaller than the Cleveland actually fits better in the engine
bay and for the short time I had it running it ran a ton cooler due in part
I believe to the increase air space around the engine. The only real re-
routing of the cooling lines was upper radiator hose to the high pressure
tank and that was easily solved by using a water snout from a 69 cougar,
every thing else is about the same. No problems with the water pump and
there are lots to choose from. I had to have a custom throttle cable made
and fabricated my own brackets but again not much of a hurdle. If you go
with a Carb set up the stock throttle set up will work just fine.

Like I said from my earlier post the 302 bolts right up to the ZF transaxle
and even takes advantage of an additional bolt. The stock motor mount bolt
right up as well. Depending on whether you are going with a carb or EFI the
distributor cap of the TFI of the Ford distributor is really tight. If I
were to do it again I would use a DIS, EIDS and coil packs from a late model
5.0 Explorer and still may someday. Another, expense was the custom 10 quart
oil pan nothing less should ever be used in a Pantera with its handling
ability. But again now that I had Steffs made one they can made additional
ones quite easily.

To answer your question about the Dart block, money with standing, an
aluminum Dart block would be very good choice for a Pantera in my opinion,
but I am extremely unique in my thinking regarding putting anything other
than a Cleveland and a smaller motor to boot amongst the Pantera community
at large.I think the majority feel it sacrilege to power the car with any
thing other than a Cleveland unless it is a 427 or bigger, kinda like
putting spinners on your 360," whoa that's just not right".  The 302 is a
much lighter engine and even the majority of Pantera owners can not argue
that any thing you can do to shed weight especially from the rear improves
already amazing handling from a 35 year old car one of the additional
reasons I chose to pursue such an unorthodox engine swap. I think my only
saving grace from total ossification from my friends and the Pantera
community is that the engine is a Ford and I have and always will perform
all my own work regardless of the difficulty of the challenge. I would love
to have found a solid condition aluminum block and actually had one 
initially for this project
but it had some issues that I was not comfortable with and the price of new 
ones were too
cost prohibitive so I decided to work with the Cobra block I found.
I would be curious to know a little more about the block.

Cheers and let me know were you would like me to shoot you a few pics

Paul



----- Original Message ----- 
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Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2008 7:57 PM
Subject: [DeTomaso] [] 302


> paul,
> i'd love to see picts.  > i've just completed a project with a 302 and i'm
> working
> on another, both non pantera.  a friend owns a speed
> shop and he's offered me what seems like a very good
> deal on a  dart aluminum 302 block.  thought i would
> make a nice motor for a pantera if i can ever find one.
> just want to make sure it's not more trouble than
> it's worth.
> frank
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "fkhjr To: List-Subscribe:" 
<fkhjr at cox.netdetomaso@realbig.comhttp://list.realbig.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>; 
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Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2008 7:57 PM
Subject: [DeTomaso] [] 302


> paul,
> i'd love to see picts.  were there any other issues
> with installing the 302:  water pump, routing cooling
> lines, motor mounts, throttle linkage, header design,
> clearance problems, etc.
> i've just completed a project with a 302 and i'm working
> on another, both non pantera.  a friend owns a speed
> shop and he's offered me what seems like a very good
> deal on a  dart aluminum 302 block.  thought i would
> make a nice motor for a pantera if i can ever find one.
> just want to make sure it's not more trouble than
> it's worth.
> frank
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> Archive Search Engine Now Available at http://www.realbig.com/detomaso/
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at list.realbig.com
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