[DeTomaso] DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 21

Mon Apr 22 12:08:38 EDT 2024

Thanks for all of the inquiries, the tumbler and key were purchased immediately after I posted.

Sent from Krek's iPhone

> On Apr 22, 2024, at 11:00 AM, detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com wrote:
> 
> Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to
>    detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> 
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>    http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>    detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com
> 
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>    detomaso-owner at server.detomasolist.com
> 
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..."
> 
> 
> Daily Detomaso List Digest
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. 74 on Bat - with MUDFLAPS Arghhhhhhhh!! (Larry Finch)
>   2. Concorso 2024 (Larry Finch)
>   3. Re: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 18 (William Schauer)
>   4. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Bill Lewis)
>   5. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Dave Londry)
>   6. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
>   7. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2024 09:14:57 -0700
> From: Larry Finch <fresnofinches at aol.com>
> To: Email List Address For Posting <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: [DeTomaso] 74 on Bat - with MUDFLAPS Arghhhhhhhh!!
> Message-ID: <2E4B3FEC-DB61-43BC-A6FF-826C0468F29B at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> Maybe it would look better with these from a DeTomaso mini.
> 
> Larry
> 
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> 
> 
> Sent from me using a magic, handheld electronic gizmo.
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2024 09:29:53 -0700
> From: Larry Finch <fresnofinches at aol.com>
> To: Email List Address For Posting <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: [DeTomaso] Concorso 2024
> Message-ID: <65C41CA9-917E-4448-809F-BFD7BC9EBD0B at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
> 
> All,
> 
> The new owners, whoever they may be, of Concorso have finally got a website up and running.
> 
> Currently registration for your car is $160, but you better hurry because on May 1, that is just eight days, it goes up $35 to become a $195 admission ticket.
> 
> Based on past years? declining attendance and attractions, the question now is whether it is worth attending to see what they come up with this year??
> 
> Larry
> 
> Sent from me using a magic, handheld electronic gizmo.
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2024 17:46:37 +0000
> From: William Schauer <wrschauer at sbcglobal.net>
> To: Jeff Krekeler <jeff at krek.com>, "detomaso at server.detomasolist.com"
>    <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 18
> Message-ID:
>    <PH0PR19MB51004AD07CC9CAA9115570A5F2132 at PH0PR19MB5100.namprd19.prod.outlook.com>
>    
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Hi Jeff.
> 
> If not already sold, would like to purchase. Let me know.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> William R Schauer
> 
> 630-513-6700
> 
> wrschauer at sbcglobal.net
> 
> ________________________________
> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Jeff Krekeler <jeff at krek.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 10:03 AM
> To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 18
> 
> 
> I have this that I picked up after my son lost the key to our Pantera (and subsequently found it).
> 
> $150 shipped.
> 
>> On Apr 20, 2024, at 11:00?AM, detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com wrote:
>> 
>> ?Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to
>>   detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>   http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>   detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>   detomaso-owner at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..."
>> 
>> 
>> Daily Detomaso List Digest
>> 
>> Today's Topics:
>> 
>>  1. tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
>>  2. Re: tumbler (Charles Engles)
>>  3. Re: tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
>>  4. Re: tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  5. Re: tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  6. Fwd:  tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  7. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
>>  8. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  9. Re: tumbler (Bill Lewis)
>> 
>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 00:04:55 +0000
>> From: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>>   <CY8PR20MB571498DAE8FDC5703636559DBC0C2 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Hi folks,
>> 
>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>  difficult to find.
>> 
>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>  halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half a
>>  can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>>  around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon, but
>>  once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>  switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>>  Thanks for your help!
>> 
>>  Sincerely,
>> 
>>  Chris
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 19:23:45 -0500
>> From: "Charles Engles" <cengles at cox.net>
>> To: "'Christopher Kimball'" <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, "'Pantera Owners
>>   Club of America'" <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID: <001901da92b9$02376200$06a62600$@cox.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="us-ascii"
>> 
>> Dear Chris,
>> 
>>            ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>> Ignition Trick????
>> 
>>            Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>> 
>>                           Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
>> Of Christopher Kimball
>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>> difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch halfway.  It
>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini in
>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get it to
>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light switch
>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing to
>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 00:41:07 +0000
>> From: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>> To: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, 'Pantera Owners Club of America'
>>   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>>   <CY8PR20MB571453A846734A6D1129B91FBC0C2 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> 
>> Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick, unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable smartphone
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners Club of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Dear Chris,
>> 
>>            ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>> Ignition Trick????
>> 
>>            Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>> 
>>                           Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
>> Of Christopher Kimball
>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>> difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch halfway.  It
>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini in
>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get it to
>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light switch
>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing to
>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick,
>>  unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>  -------- Original message --------
>>  From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>  Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>  To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners Club
>>  of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>>  Dear Chris,
>>               ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>>  Ignition Trick????
>>               Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>                              Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>  Behalf
>>  Of Christopher Kimball
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>  Hi folks,
>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>  difficult to find.
>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>  halfway.  It
>>  will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini
>>  in
>>  it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>>  it to
>>  work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>>  myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>  switch
>>  on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing
>>  to
>>  sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>  Thanks for your help!
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 18:00:07 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> Cc: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID: <BDD1092A-3B56-4604-9D79-667CC7DAEC05 at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>> 
>> Chris,
>> 
>> Asking the obvious question here:
>> 
>> Is the face of the lock tumbler flush with the surround?  If not, that?s your problem, easily fixed with a paper clip bent to form a hook and pull it out.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:05, Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?   Hi folks,
>>> 
>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>> difficult to find.
>>> 
>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>> 
>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>> halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half a
>>> can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>>> around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon, but
>>> once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>> 
>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>> 
>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>> switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>> willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>> 
>>> Thanks for your help!
>>> 
>>> Sincerely,
>>> 
>>> Chris
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>> 
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>>> 
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 18:01:25 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> Cc: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID: <A1222E8B-7933-4C5D-BDCA-391CA78BD9EE at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>> 
>> Chris,
>> 
>> Send us pics please?.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick,
>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>> smartphone
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners Club
>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Dear Chris,
>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> Hi folks,
>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>> difficult to find.
>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>> halfway.  It
>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini
>>> in
>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>>> it to
>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>> switch
>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing
>>> to
>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>> Thanks for your help!
>>> Sincerely,
>>> Chris
>>> 
>>> References
>>> 
>>> 1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>> 
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>>> 
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 21:05:09 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
>> Message-ID: <34B8DDCC-94F8-4FFB-8DC4-DE74A474982E at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> ?Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>> ?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please?.
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Sigh.
>> 
>>  This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>  You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>    On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>    wrote:
>> 
>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>> 
>>  -------- Original message --------
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>  To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>  Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>>    Chris,
>>    Send us pics please....
>>    Mike
>>    Sent from my iPhone
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>>    <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>    trick,
>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>> smartphone
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>    Owners Club
>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Dear Chris,
>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>    Paper Clip
>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: DeTomaso
>>    [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> Hi folks,
>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>    they were
>>> difficult to find.
>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>    car!"
>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>> halfway.  It
>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>    Houdini
>>> in
>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>    to get
>>> it to
>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>    jiggle
>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>    and
>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>    light
>>> switch
>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>    willing
>>> to
>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>> Thanks for your help!
>>> Sincerely,
>>> Chris
>>> 
>>> References
>>> 
>>> 1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>> 
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>    etc.) use the links above.
>>> 
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>>    any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
>>    the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
>>    archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>>  <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 7
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 04:57:34 +0000
>> From: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>, Mike Drew
>>   <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>>   <CY8PR20MB571441B0FFFB670F7C432FA8BC0C2 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> 
>> I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> ________________________________
>> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> ?Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> ?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please?.
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cdadedcfdcc0f49c3bd2308dc60ef1d8b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638491827323261929%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wAJl%2F9XG9SXQxJNwBZ55%2F1VqfqYZXor9g4oEmjY18i4%3D&reserved=0<http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends
>>  straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>> 
>>  Sincerely,
>> 
>>  Chris
>>    __________________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>>  Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>>  To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>>> Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please....
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>  trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>  Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>  Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>>  [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>  they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>  car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>  Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>  to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>  jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>  and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>  light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> 
>>  [2]https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserv
>>  er.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cd
>>  adedcfdcc0f49c3bd2308dc60ef1d8b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%
>>  7C0%7C638491827323261929%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLC
>>  JQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wAJl%2F
>>  9XG9SXQxJNwBZ55%2F1VqfqYZXor9g4oEmjY18i4%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>  etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>>  any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>>  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>>  or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>  2. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 8
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 22:46:47 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
>> Message-ID: <30FC0FD7-C4BF-46C8-8CFE-7910A213D66B at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> 
>>  Chris,
>> 
>>  Ooh. I've never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with minimal
>>  effort.
>> 
>>  Try maximal effort?
>> 
>>  Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
>> 
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>    On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball
>>    <ChrisVKimball at msn.com> wrote:
>> 
>>  I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends
>>  straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>> 
>>  Sincerely,
>> 
>>  Chris
>>      _______________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>>  Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>>  To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>>> Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please....
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>  trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>  Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>  Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>>  [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>  they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>  car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>  Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>  to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>  jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>  and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>  light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> 
>>  [2]https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserv
>>  er.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cd
>>  adedcfdcc0f49c3bd2308dc60ef1d8b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%
>>  7C0%7C638491827323261929%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLC
>>  JQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wAJl%2F
>>  9XG9SXQxJNwBZ55%2F1VqfqYZXor9g4oEmjY18i4%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>  etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>>  any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>>  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>>  or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>  2. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 9
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 14:04:15 +0000
>> From: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, Pantera Owners Club
>>   of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>>   <SN7PR14MB4317E5FA27933D4FB95353C3BB0C2 at SN7PR14MB4317.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>> I live on a small ranch in SE Texas, which means I have lots of locks & tumblers of all sizes and shapes.  I discovered Houdini years ago.  Houdini is my friend!
>> Good luck with your search.  (Mine will probably break tomorrow!)
>> 
>> Bill Lewis
>> ________________________________
>> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 12:04 AM
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Chris
>> 
>>  I live on a small ranch in SE Texas, which means I have lots of locks &
>>  tumblers of all sizes and shapes.  I discovered Houdini years ago.
>>  Houdini is my friend!
>> 
>>  Good luck with your search.  (Mine will probably break tomorrow!)
>> 
>>  Bill Lewis
>>    __________________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>>  Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 12:04 AM
>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>>  Hi folks,
>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>  difficult to find.
>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>  halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half a
>>  can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>>  around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon, but
>>  once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>  switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>  Thanks for your help!
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Subject: Digest Footer
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> 
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 18
>> *****************************************
> -------------- next part --------------
>   Hi Jeff.
> 
>   If not already sold, would like to purchase. Let me know.
> 
>   Thanks.
> 
>     William R Schauer
> 
>     630-513-6700
> 
>     wrschauer at sbcglobal.net
>     __________________________________________________________________
> 
>   From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>   Jeff Krekeler <jeff at krek.com>
>   Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 10:03 AM
>   To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 18
> 
>    I have this that I picked up after my son lost the key to our Pantera
>   (and subsequently found it).
>   $150 shipped.
>>> On Apr 20, 2024, at 11:00AM, detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com
>>   wrote:
>> 
>> Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to
>>   detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>   [1]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>   detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>   detomaso-owner at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..."
>> 
>> 
>> Daily Detomaso List Digest
>> 
>> Today's Topics:
>> 
>>  1. tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
>>  2. Re: tumbler (Charles Engles)
>>  3. Re: tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
>>  4. Re: tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  5. Re: tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  6. Fwd:  tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  7. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Christopher Kimball)
>>  8. Re: Fwd:  tumbler (Mike Drew)
>>  9. Re: tumbler (Bill Lewis)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>   ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 00:04:55 +0000
>> From: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>> 
>   <CY8PR20MB571498DAE8FDC5703636559DBC0C2 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.out
>   look.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>   halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half a
>   can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>   around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon, but
>   once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>   apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>   switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Hi folks,
>> 
>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>>  difficult to find.
>> 
>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>  halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half
>   a
>>  can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>>  around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon,
>   but
>>  once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go
>   in.
>> 
>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>  switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would
>   be
>>  willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>>  Thanks for your help!
>> 
>>  Sincerely,
>> 
>>  Chris
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 19:23:45 -0500
>> From: "Charles Engles" <cengles at cox.net>
>> To: "'Christopher Kimball'" <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, "'Pantera Owners
>>   Club of America'" <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID: <001901da92b9$02376200$06a62600$@cox.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="us-ascii"
>> 
>> Dear Chris,
>> 
>>            ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper
>   Clip
>> Ignition Trick????
>> 
>>            Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>> 
>>                           Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: DeTomaso [[2]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
>   On Behalf
>> Of Christopher Kimball
>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>> difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>   halfway.  It
>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini in
>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>   it to
>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>   switch
>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing to
>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 00:41:07 +0000
>> From: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>> To: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, 'Pantera Owners Club of
>   America'
>>   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>> 
>   <CY8PR20MB571453A846734A6D1129B91FBC0C2 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.out
>   look.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> 
>> Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick,
>   unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>   smartphone
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners
>   Club of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Dear Chris,
>> 
>>            ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper
>   Clip
>> Ignition Trick????
>> 
>>            Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>> 
>>                           Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: DeTomaso [[3]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
>   On Behalf
>> Of Christopher Kimball
>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>> difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>   halfway.  It
>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini in
>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>   it to
>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>   switch
>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing to
>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>   trick,
>>  unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>  -------- Original message --------
>>  From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>  Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>  To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners
>   Club
>>  of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>>  Dear Chris,
>>               ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper
>   Clip
>>  Ignition Trick????
>>               Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>                              Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
>   On
>>  Behalf
>>  Of Christopher Kimball
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>  Hi folks,
>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>>  difficult to find.
>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>  halfway.  It
>>  will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini
>>  in
>>  it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to
>   get
>>  it to
>>  work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>>  myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>  switch
>>  on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing
>>  to
>>  sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>  Thanks for your help!
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. [4]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 18:00:07 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> Cc: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID: <BDD1092A-3B56-4604-9D79-667CC7DAEC05 at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>> 
>> Chris,
>> 
>> Asking the obvious question here:
>> 
>> Is the face of the lock tumbler flush with the surround?  If not,
>   that?s your problem, easily fixed with a paper clip bent to form a hook
>   and pull it out.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:05, Christopher Kimball
>   <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?   Hi folks,
>>> 
>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>>> difficult to find.
>>> 
>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>> 
>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>> halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half
>   a
>>> can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>>> around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon,
>   but
>>> once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go
>   in.
>>> 
>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>> 
>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>> switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would
>   be
>>> willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>> 
>>> Thanks for your help!
>>> 
>>> Sincerely,
>>> 
>>> Chris
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> [5]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>> 
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>   etc.) use the links above.
>>> 
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>   or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 18:01:25 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> Cc: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID: <A1222E8B-7933-4C5D-BDCA-391CA78BD9EE at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>> 
>> Chris,
>> 
>> Send us pics please?.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>   <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>   trick,
>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>> smartphone
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners
>   Club
>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Dear Chris,
>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper
>   Clip
>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
>   On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> Hi folks,
>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>>> difficult to find.
>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>> halfway.  It
>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini
>>> in
>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to
>   get
>>> it to
>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>> switch
>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing
>>> to
>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>> Thanks for your help!
>>> Sincerely,
>>> Chris
>>> 
>>> References
>>> 
>>> 1. [6]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> [7]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>> 
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>   etc.) use the links above.
>>> 
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>   or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 21:05:09 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
>> Message-ID: <34B8DDCC-94F8-4FFB-8DC4-DE74A474982E at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> ?Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>   clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball
>   <chrisvkimball at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>> ?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>   smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of
>   America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please?.
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>   <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>   trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>   Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>   Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>   [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>   car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to
>   get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>   and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [8]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> [9]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>   etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>   or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Sigh.
>> 
>>  This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>  You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>    On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball
>   <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>    wrote:
>> 
>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>> 
>>  -------- Original message --------
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>  To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>  Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of
>   America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>>    Chris,
>>    Send us pics please....
>>    Mike
>>    Sent from my iPhone
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>>    <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>    trick,
>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>> smartphone
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>    Owners Club
>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Dear Chris,
>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>    Paper Clip
>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: DeTomaso
>>    [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> Hi folks,
>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>    they were
>>> difficult to find.
>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>    car!"
>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>> halfway.  It
>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>    Houdini
>>> in
>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>    to get
>>> it to
>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>    jiggle
>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>    and
>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>    light
>>> switch
>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>    willing
>>> to
>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>> Thanks for your help!
>>> Sincerely,
>>> Chris
>>> 
>>> References
>>> 
>>> 1. [10]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> [11]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>> 
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>    etc.) use the links above.
>>> 
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>>    any message posted here to all past, current, or future members
>   of
>>    the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain
>   an
>>    archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>>  <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 7
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 04:57:34 +0000
>> From: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>, Mike Drew
>>   <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>> 
>   <CY8PR20MB571441B0FFFB670F7C432FA8BC0C2 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.out
>   look.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> 
>> I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends
>   straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> ________________________________
>> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
>   of Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> ?Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>   clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> ?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>   smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of
>   America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please?.
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>   <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>   trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>   Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>   Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>   [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>   car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to
>   get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>   and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [12]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> 
>   [13]https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fser
>   ver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7C
>   dadedcfdcc0f49c3bd2308dc60ef1d8b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1
>   %7C0%7C638491827323261929%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiL
>   CJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wAJl%2
>   F9XG9SXQxJNwBZ55%2F1VqfqYZXor9g4oEmjY18i4%3D&reserved=0<http://server.d
>   etomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>   etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>   or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just
>   bends
>>  straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling
>   power.
>> 
>>  Sincerely,
>> 
>>  Chris
>> 
>   __________________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
>   of
>>  Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>>  To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>>> Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of
>   America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please....
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>  trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>  Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>  Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>>  [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>  they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>  car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>  Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>  to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>  jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>  and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>  light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> 
>> 
>   [2]https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserv
>> 
>   er.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cd
>> 
>   adedcfdcc0f49c3bd2308dc60ef1d8b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%
>> 
>   7C0%7C638491827323261929%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLC
>> 
>   JQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wAJl%2F
>>  9XG9SXQxJNwBZ55%2F1VqfqYZXor9g4oEmjY18i4%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>  etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>>  any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
>   the
>>  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
>   archive
>>  or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. [14]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>  2. [15]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 8
>> Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 22:46:47 -0700
>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
>> Message-ID: <30FC0FD7-C4BF-46C8-8CFE-7910A213D66B at aol.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> 
>>  Chris,
>> 
>>  Ooh. I've never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with
>   minimal
>>  effort.
>> 
>>  Try maximal effort?
>> 
>>  Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
>> 
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>    On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball
>>    <ChrisVKimball at msn.com> wrote:
>> 
>>  I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just
>   bends
>>  straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling
>   power.
>> 
>>  Sincerely,
>> 
>>  Chris
>>      _______________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
>   of
>>  Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>>  To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>>> Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of
>   America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please....
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>  trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>  Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>  Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>>  [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>  they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>  car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>  Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>  to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>  jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>  and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>  light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> 
>> 
>   [2]https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserv
>> 
>   er.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cd
>> 
>   adedcfdcc0f49c3bd2308dc60ef1d8b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%
>> 
>   7C0%7C638491827323261929%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLC
>> 
>   JQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wAJl%2F
>>  9XG9SXQxJNwBZ55%2F1VqfqYZXor9g4oEmjY18i4%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>  etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>>  any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
>   the
>>  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
>   archive
>>  or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. [16]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>  2. [17]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 9
>> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2024 14:04:15 +0000
>> From: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, Pantera Owners Club
>>   of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> Message-ID:
>> 
>   <SN7PR14MB4317E5FA27933D4FB95353C3BB0C2 at SN7PR14MB4317.namprd14.prod.out
>   look.com>
>> 
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>> I live on a small ranch in SE Texas, which means I have lots of locks
>   & tumblers of all sizes and shapes.  I discovered Houdini years ago.
>   Houdini is my friend!
>> Good luck with your search.  (Mine will probably break tomorrow!)
>> 
>> Bill Lewis
>> ________________________________
>> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
>   of Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 12:04 AM
>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>> Hi folks,
>> 
>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were difficult to find.
>> 
>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>> 
>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>   halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half a
>   can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>   around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon, but
>   once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go in.
>> 
>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>   apparently, they are no longer made.
>> 
>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>   switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>> 
>> Thanks for your help!
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> 
>> Chris
>> -------------- next part --------------
>>  Chris
>> 
>>  I live on a small ranch in SE Texas, which means I have lots of
>   locks &
>>  tumblers of all sizes and shapes.  I discovered Houdini years ago.
>>  Houdini is my friend!
>> 
>>  Good luck with your search.  (Mine will probably break tomorrow!)
>> 
>>  Bill Lewis
>> 
>   __________________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
>   of
>>  Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 12:04 AM
>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>> 
>>  Hi folks,
>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they
>   were
>>  difficult to find.
>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>  halfway.  It will not go in any further, even after squirting half
>   a
>>  can of Houdini in it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key
>>  around enough to get it to work so I could get home this afternoon,
>   but
>>  once home, I could jiggle myself to death and that key will not go
>   in.
>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>  switch on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would
>   be
>>  willing to sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>  Thanks for your help!
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Subject: Digest Footer
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> [18]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> 
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>   or approve the archiving of list messages.
>> 
>> 
>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 18
>> *****************************************
> 
> References
> 
>   1. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>   2. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>   3. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>   4. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>   5. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>   6. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>   7. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>   8. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>   9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>  10. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>  11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>  12. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>  13. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cdadedcfdcc0f49c3bd2308dc60ef1d8b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638491827323261929%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wAJl%2F9XG9SXQxJNwBZ55%2F1VqfqYZXor9g4oEmjY18i4%3D&reserved=0<http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
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>  15. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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>  17. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>  18. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2024 12:58:20 +0000
> From: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
> To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>, Mike Drew
>    <mikeldrew at aol.com>, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
> Message-ID:
>    <SN7PR14MB431798CE55ECD6CF54319E4CBB122 at SN7PR14MB4317.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>
>    
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Chris, thank you for an edition of "Captain My Captain" this morning.  It could have only been better by being hampered somehow by some of the Seven Deadly Sins.  Good luck and sweet driving.    BILL Lewis
> ________________________________
> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:26 PM
> To: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> Hi Mike (and forum readers),
> 
> I spent the last several hours disassembling the entire ignition switch mechanism, and for those who are interested, here is, in excruciating detail, what happened:
> 
> 
> I have said many times I?m not much of a mechanic, but I can follow directions fairly well.  Larry Finch was kind enough to send me some pictures of how to remove the tumbler, so in another act of purest optimism, I grabbed my flashlight, a few screwdrivers, and my socket set and climbed under the dash.
> 
> 
> 
> First I had to partially remove the plate holding one of the 6x9, 3-way speakers I mounted under the dash.  (I must say, that plate was very well constructed.  It was fabricated by Finn?s Auto Restoration, and replaced a rather lame one I had installed made out of thin plywood).
> 
> 
> 
> Once that was out of the way I used a hex wrench to remove two bolts under the steering column, followed by the two large bolts located just behind the hex bolts.  At that point the entire steering column lowered so I could take out the two screws on each side of the plastic housing surrounding the turn-signal stalk and ignition keyhole.
> 
> 
> 
> So far, so good.
> 
> 
> 
> The next step was to remove two flat-head screws to take off the electrical cylinder which is the actual ignition switch.  Just for fun I used a screwdriver to turn it, and the car started right up.  That was good, since I figured if all else failed I could just mount that to the dashboard and attached a large screwdriver to my keyring.
> 
> 
> 
> I covered the exposed terminals on the ignition switch with tape so I wouldn?t end up causing a Pantera-destroying fire (not to mention my garage and house) and surveyed the landscape.
> 
> 
> 
> The tumbler is mounted in a metal structure which seemed to be attached with some sort of press-fit shafts designed to never be removed.  That was OK, though, since Larry Finch?s pictures also showed how to remove the tumbler from the steering column.
> 
> 
> 
> You see, when the clever Italians assembled this part of the car, they had so much faith and confidence the tumbler would never break, they installed it with a spring clip located inside the bomb-proof housing?totally inaccessible to mere mortals.  Not only that, they didn?t mount the spring clip longitudinally, so slight pressure would release the tumbler, oh no, they mounted it sideways so there is no way to get it to release and free the tumbler.
> 
> 
> 
> But here is where it is a great thing to have the combined brainpower of all the Pantera owners out there.  Larry showed me via his pictures how one can drill a hole directly above where the spring clip resides, enabling the spring clip to be depressed by a thin awl, thereby releasing the tumbler.
> 
> 
> 
> The picture provided by Larry showed a digital micrometer measuring .628 of an inch from the face of the tumbler to the place where the spring clip access hole would need to be drilled.  It was 180 degrees from a small mark on the chrome face of the ignition tumbler where the key inserts.
> 
> 
> 
> Although I may have some kind of micrometer manufactured before electricity which I inherited from my grandfather buried somewhere in the garage (the micrometer, not my grandfather), I don?t have a digital unit.  I used the next best thing:  The new 40? industrial tape measure I just bought to replace the tape measure I lost (but then found a week later).  This, of course, was only slightly less accurate than a digital micrometer, but I figured I could make up for the inaccuracy by just drilling a bigger hole.
> 
> 
> 
> In assessing where the hole would need to be drilled, I found the location was on the backside of the metal housing.  Pretty much the most inconvenient place for me to have to drill.
> 
> 
> 
> In order to mark where the hole was supposed to go, I used my precision giant tape measure to determine the correct distance, then I used painters tape to circumnavigate the column.  I reasoned the distance from the face of the ignition switch to the edge of the tape would be the same all the way around, so all I?d have to do it make sure the drill bit was lined up with the edge of the tape on the far side of the assembly 180 degrees from the little mark so I could drill the whole from the back where I couldn?t really see anything.
> 
> 
> 
> What could go wrong?
> 
> 
> 
> Amazingly, and very un-Pandora-like, I managed to get the hole drilled in exactly the right place.  I pushed an awl into the hole, used a screwdriver to pry the tumbler partway out, then employed vise grips to grab it and wiggle it the rest of the way.
> 
> 
> 
> This was going way better than I thought it would!
> 
> 
> 
> I examined the tumbler and decided to disassemble it to see if I could find anything obvious which might be the cause of the problem.  The first thing I noticed is that in all my key-wiggling frenzies trying to get it to work, the tip of the key had broken off and was wedged at the bottom of the tumbler.
> 
> 
> 
> After some tapping, pushing, and pulling the little spring-loaded tabs in the tumbler I managed to get the piece of key removed.  That, however, wasn?t the actual problem, just a result of the problem, because when I used my extra key, it still got jammed up and wouldn?t work.
> 
> 
> 
> Even with Houdini?s help, the little brass pieces which are supposed to move in and out in conjunction with the key being inserted, wouldn?t cooperate.  I think they were just plum worn out.
> 
> 
> 
> I could either take the assembly to a locksmith and see if he or she could repair it, or I could use the Primitive Pete method.  Guess which one I chose?
> 
> 
> 
> I simply removed all the brass pieces so the key would easily slide into the tumbler and rotate the assembly.  It worked great!  Of course, it also meant any variety of keys could be used to start the car.  In fact, my extra V-Max key works great!
> 
> 
> 
> The multi-key method may not be the most secure, but it?s not a big problem and even has some advantages.  For example:
> 
> 
> 
>  1.  Most young car thieves have no idea how to drive a manual 5-speed, and most of the old car thieves who do are now too old to get in and out of a Pantera.
>  2.
> I can always replace the 12-volt lockout switch by the battery, which quit working, with a new one which has it?s own key.
>  3.  The key which unlocks the doors still needs to be used to get into the car.
>  4.  I won?t have to worry about the tumbler messing up again.
>  5.  If I lose my ignition key I can now use any number of other things to start my car!
> 
> I reassembled everything with no problem, and now the ignition switch starts the car easier than ever!
> 
> 
> 
> If the next owner wants to restore the ignition tumbler back to stock, that will be easy since I saved the little brass things in a diminutive zip-lock bag.  The tough part will be finding said bag amongst the piles of other used Pantera parts which seems to grow larger by the day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 1:35 PM
> To: chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Cc: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>; De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> Yes when the tumbler isn?t flush it won?t allow the key to fully enter.
> 
> Maybe some debris in there? Or something broke off.
> 
> Mike
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Apr 20, 2024, at 09:58, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Nothing is broken as far as the key is concerned. The key goes in about half way then abruptly stops because it is hitting something solid inside the Tumbler that won't allow the key to go in all the way. I can pull it in and out half way quite easily, but as far as turning it, no way! Also I did try repeatedly with the paper clip to pull the cylinder out but it's as if it's glued in place permanently.
> 
> I'll try a few more times over the next few days, but I have a feeling it's going to be Tumbler extraction time for me pretty soon!
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Chris
> 
> 
> 
> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable smartphone
> 
> 
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
> Date: 4/19/24 10:47 PM (GMT-08:00)
> To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> Chris,
> 
> Ooh. I?ve never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with minimal effort.
> 
> Try maximal effort?
> 
> Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
> 
> Mike
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Chris
> ________________________________
> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> 
> 
>> ?Sigh.
>> 
>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>> 
>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>> ?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable smartphone
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Chris,
>>> 
>>> Send us pics please?.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick,
>>>>  unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>  smartphone
>>>>  -------- Original message --------
>>>>  From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>  Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>  To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners Club
>>>>  of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>  Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>>  Dear Chris,
>>>>               ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>>>>  Ignition Trick????
>>>>               Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>                              Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>  -----Original Message-----
>>>>  From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>  Behalf
>>>>  Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>  Hi folks,
>>>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>>>  difficult to find.
>>>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>  halfway.  It
>>>>  will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini
>>>>  in
>>>>  it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>>>>  it to
>>>>  work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>>>>  myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>>>  switch
>>>>  on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing
>>>>  to
>>>>  sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>  Thanks for your help!
>>>>  Sincerely,
>>>>  Chris
>>>> 
>>>> References
>>>> 
>>>>  1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso<http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>>>> 
>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>>>> 
>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>> 
>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
> -------------- next part --------------
>   Chris, thank you for an edition of "Captain My Captain" this morning.
>   It could have only been better by being hampered somehow by some of the
>   Seven Deadly Sins.  Good luck and sweet driving.    BILL Lewis
>     __________________________________________________________________
> 
>   From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>   Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>   Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:26 PM
>   To: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball
>   <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
>   Hi Mike (and forum readers),
>   I spent the last several hours disassembling the entire ignition switch
>   mechanism, and for those who are interested, here is, in excruciating
>   detail, what happened:
>   I have said many times I'm not much of a mechanic, but I can follow
>   directions fairly well.  Larry Finch was kind enough to send me some
>   pictures of how to remove the tumbler, so in another act of purest
>   optimism, I grabbed my flashlight, a few screwdrivers, and my socket
>   set and climbed under the dash.
>   First I had to partially remove the plate holding one of the 6x9, 3-way
>   speakers I mounted under the dash.  (I must say, that plate was very
>   well constructed.  It was fabricated by Finn's Auto Restoration, and
>   replaced a rather lame one I had installed made out of thin plywood).
>   Once that was out of the way I used a hex wrench to remove two bolts
>   under the steering column, followed by the two large bolts located just
>   behind the hex bolts.  At that point the entire steering column lowered
>   so I could take out the two screws on each side of the plastic housing
>   surrounding the turn-signal stalk and ignition keyhole.
>   So far, so good.
>   The next step was to remove two flat-head screws to take off the
>   electrical cylinder which is the actual ignition switch.  Just for fun
>   I used a screwdriver to turn it, and the car started right up.  That
>   was good, since I figured if all else failed I could just mount that to
>   the dashboard and attached a large screwdriver to my keyring.
>   I covered the exposed terminals on the ignition switch with tape so I
>   wouldn't end up causing a Pantera-destroying fire (not to mention my
>   garage and house) and surveyed the landscape.
>   The tumbler is mounted in a metal structure which seemed to be attached
>   with some sort of press-fit shafts designed to never be removed.  That
>   was OK, though, since Larry Finch's pictures also showed how to remove
>   the tumbler from the steering column.
>   You see, when the clever Italians assembled this part of the car, they
>   had so much faith and confidence the tumbler would never break, they
>   installed it with a spring clip located inside the bomb-proof
>   housing--totally inaccessible to mere mortals.  Not only that, they
>   didn't mount the spring clip longitudinally, so slight pressure would
>   release the tumbler, oh no, they mounted it sideways so there is no way
>   to get it to release and free the tumbler.
>   But here is where it is a great thing to have the combined brainpower
>   of all the Pantera owners out there.  Larry showed me via his pictures
>   how one can drill a hole directly above where the spring clip resides,
>   enabling the spring clip to be depressed by a thin awl, thereby
>   releasing the tumbler.
>   The picture provided by Larry showed a digital micrometer measuring
>   .628 of an inch from the face of the tumbler to the place where the
>   spring clip access hole would need to be drilled.  It was 180 degrees
>   from a small mark on the chrome face of the ignition tumbler where the
>   key inserts.
>   Although I may have some kind of micrometer manufactured before
>   electricity which I inherited from my grandfather buried somewhere in
>   the garage (the micrometer, not my grandfather), I don't have a digital
>   unit.  I used the next best thing:  The new 40' industrial tape measure
>   I just bought to replace the tape measure I lost (but then found a week
>   later).  This, of course, was only slightly less accurate than a
>   digital micrometer, but I figured I could make up for the inaccuracy by
>   just drilling a bigger hole.
>   In assessing where the hole would need to be drilled, I found the
>   location was on the backside of the metal housing.  Pretty much the
>   most inconvenient place for me to have to drill.
>   In order to mark where the hole was supposed to go, I used my precision
>   giant tape measure to determine the correct distance, then I used
>   painters tape to circumnavigate the column.  I reasoned the distance
>   from the face of the ignition switch to the edge of the tape would be
>   the same all the way around, so all I'd have to do it make sure the
>   drill bit was lined up with the edge of the tape on the far side of the
>   assembly 180 degrees from the little mark so I could drill the whole
>   from the back where I couldn't really see anything.
>   What could go wrong?
>   Amazingly, and very un-Pandora-like, I managed to get the hole drilled
>   in exactly the right place.  I pushed an awl into the hole, used a
>   screwdriver to pry the tumbler partway out, then employed vise grips to
>   grab it and wiggle it the rest of the way.
>   This was going way better than I thought it would!
>   I examined the tumbler and decided to disassemble it to see if I could
>   find anything obvious which might be the cause of the problem.  The
>   first thing I noticed is that in all my key-wiggling frenzies trying to
>   get it to work, the tip of the key had broken off and was wedged at the
>   bottom of the tumbler.
>   After some tapping, pushing, and pulling the little spring-loaded tabs
>   in the tumbler I managed to get the piece of key removed.  That,
>   however, wasn't the actual problem, just a result of the problem,
>   because when I used my extra key, it still got jammed up and wouldn't
>   work.
>   Even with Houdini's help, the little brass pieces which are supposed to
>   move in and out in conjunction with the key being inserted, wouldn't
>   cooperate.  I think they were just plum worn out.
>   I could either take the assembly to a locksmith and see if he or she
>   could repair it, or I could use the Primitive Pete method.  Guess which
>   one I chose?
>   I simply removed all the brass pieces so the key would easily slide
>   into the tumbler and rotate the assembly.  It worked great!  Of course,
>   it also meant any variety of keys could be used to start the car.  In
>   fact, my extra V-Max key works great!
>   The multi-key method may not be the most secure, but it's not a big
>   problem and even has some advantages.  For example:
>     1.  Most young car thieves have no idea how to drive a manual
>   5-speed, and most of the old car thieves who do are now too old to get
>   in and out of a Pantera.
>     2.
>   I can always replace the 12-volt lockout switch by the battery, which
>   quit working, with a new one which has it's own key.
>     3.  The key which unlocks the doors still needs to be used to get
>   into the car.
>     4.  I won't have to worry about the tumbler messing up again.
>     5.  If I lose my ignition key I can now use any number of other
>   things to start my car!
>   I reassembled everything with no problem, and now the ignition switch
>   starts the car easier than ever!
>   If the next owner wants to restore the ignition tumbler back to stock,
>   that will be easy since I saved the little brass things in a diminutive
>   zip-lock bag.  The tough part will be finding said bag amongst the
>   piles of other used Pantera parts which seems to grow larger by the
>   day.
>   ________________________________
>   From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>   Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 1:35 PM
>   To: chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   Cc: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>; De Tomaso Forum
>   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>   Yes when the tumbler isn't flush it won't allow the key to fully enter.
>   Maybe some debris in there? Or something broke off.
>   Mike
>   Sent from my iPhone
>   On Apr 20, 2024, at 09:58, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   wrote:
>   Nothing is broken as far as the key is concerned. The key goes in about
>   half way then abruptly stops because it is hitting something solid
>   inside the Tumbler that won't allow the key to go in all the way. I can
>   pull it in and out half way quite easily, but as far as turning it, no
>   way! Also I did try repeatedly with the paper clip to pull the cylinder
>   out but it's as if it's glued in place permanently.
>   I'll try a few more times over the next few days, but I have a feeling
>   it's going to be Tumbler extraction time for me pretty soon!
>   Sincerely,
>   Chris
>   Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>   smartphone
>   -------- Original message --------
>   From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>   Date: 4/19/24 10:47 PM (GMT-08:00)
>   To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>   Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>   Chris,
>   Ooh. I've never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with minimal
>   effort.
>   Try maximal effort?
>   Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
>   Mike
>   Sent from my iPad
>   On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>   wrote:
>   I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends
>   straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>   Sincerely,
>   Chris
>   ________________________________
>   From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>   Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>   To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> Sigh.
>> 
>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>> 
>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>   clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   wrote:
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>   smartphone
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America
>   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Chris,
>>> 
>>> Send us pics please....
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>   <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>   trick,
>>>>  unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>  smartphone
>>>>  -------- Original message --------
>>>>  From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>  Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>  To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>   Owners Club
>>>>  of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>  Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>>  Dear Chris,
>>>>               ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>   Paper Clip
>>>>  Ignition Trick????
>>>>               Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>                              Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>  -----Original Message-----
>>>>  From: DeTomaso
>   [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>  Behalf
>>>>  Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>  Hi folks,
>>>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>   they were
>>>>  difficult to find.
>>>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>   car!"
>>>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>  halfway.  It
>>>>  will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini
>>>>  in
>>>>  it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>   to get
>>>>  it to
>>>>  work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>>>>  myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>   and
>>>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>>>  switch
>>>>  on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing
>>>>  to
>>>>  sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>  Thanks for your help!
>>>>  Sincerely,
>>>>  Chris
>>>> 
>>>> References
>>>> 
>>>>  1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> 
>   [2]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso<http://serv
>   er.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>>>> 
>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>   etc.) use the links above.
>>>> 
>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>   or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>> 
>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
> 
> References
> 
>   1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>   2. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso<http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2024 08:05:42 -0700
> From: Dave Londry <davel at trguys.com>
> To: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
> Cc: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>, De Tomaso Forum
>    <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>, chrisvkimball
>    <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
> Message-ID: <8B11D6E9-7138-4AB4-AEF2-6EC9A4F916E3 at trguys.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
> 
> I agree Bill.
> That would be a stand-up comedy routine performed upside down  under a dashboard.
> We knew Chris was a talented guy, but this is outstanding.
> Dave
> 
> Dave Londry.   
> TRGuys.com
> davel at trguys.com
> 
>> On Apr 22, 2024, at 5:58 AM, Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> ?   Chris, thank you for an edition of "Captain My Captain" this morning.
>>  It could have only been better by being hampered somehow by some of the
>>  Seven Deadly Sins.  Good luck and sweet driving.    BILL Lewis
>>    __________________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>>  Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:26 PM
>>  To: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>>  Hi Mike (and forum readers),
>>  I spent the last several hours disassembling the entire ignition switch
>>  mechanism, and for those who are interested, here is, in excruciating
>>  detail, what happened:
>>  I have said many times I'm not much of a mechanic, but I can follow
>>  directions fairly well.  Larry Finch was kind enough to send me some
>>  pictures of how to remove the tumbler, so in another act of purest
>>  optimism, I grabbed my flashlight, a few screwdrivers, and my socket
>>  set and climbed under the dash.
>>  First I had to partially remove the plate holding one of the 6x9, 3-way
>>  speakers I mounted under the dash.  (I must say, that plate was very
>>  well constructed.  It was fabricated by Finn's Auto Restoration, and
>>  replaced a rather lame one I had installed made out of thin plywood).
>>  Once that was out of the way I used a hex wrench to remove two bolts
>>  under the steering column, followed by the two large bolts located just
>>  behind the hex bolts.  At that point the entire steering column lowered
>>  so I could take out the two screws on each side of the plastic housing
>>  surrounding the turn-signal stalk and ignition keyhole.
>>  So far, so good.
>>  The next step was to remove two flat-head screws to take off the
>>  electrical cylinder which is the actual ignition switch.  Just for fun
>>  I used a screwdriver to turn it, and the car started right up.  That
>>  was good, since I figured if all else failed I could just mount that to
>>  the dashboard and attached a large screwdriver to my keyring.
>>  I covered the exposed terminals on the ignition switch with tape so I
>>  wouldn't end up causing a Pantera-destroying fire (not to mention my
>>  garage and house) and surveyed the landscape.
>>  The tumbler is mounted in a metal structure which seemed to be attached
>>  with some sort of press-fit shafts designed to never be removed.  That
>>  was OK, though, since Larry Finch's pictures also showed how to remove
>>  the tumbler from the steering column.
>>  You see, when the clever Italians assembled this part of the car, they
>>  had so much faith and confidence the tumbler would never break, they
>>  installed it with a spring clip located inside the bomb-proof
>>  housing--totally inaccessible to mere mortals.  Not only that, they
>>  didn't mount the spring clip longitudinally, so slight pressure would
>>  release the tumbler, oh no, they mounted it sideways so there is no way
>>  to get it to release and free the tumbler.
>>  But here is where it is a great thing to have the combined brainpower
>>  of all the Pantera owners out there.  Larry showed me via his pictures
>>  how one can drill a hole directly above where the spring clip resides,
>>  enabling the spring clip to be depressed by a thin awl, thereby
>>  releasing the tumbler.
>>  The picture provided by Larry showed a digital micrometer measuring
>>  .628 of an inch from the face of the tumbler to the place where the
>>  spring clip access hole would need to be drilled.  It was 180 degrees
>>  from a small mark on the chrome face of the ignition tumbler where the
>>  key inserts.
>>  Although I may have some kind of micrometer manufactured before
>>  electricity which I inherited from my grandfather buried somewhere in
>>  the garage (the micrometer, not my grandfather), I don't have a digital
>>  unit.  I used the next best thing:  The new 40' industrial tape measure
>>  I just bought to replace the tape measure I lost (but then found a week
>>  later).  This, of course, was only slightly less accurate than a
>>  digital micrometer, but I figured I could make up for the inaccuracy by
>>  just drilling a bigger hole.
>>  In assessing where the hole would need to be drilled, I found the
>>  location was on the backside of the metal housing.  Pretty much the
>>  most inconvenient place for me to have to drill.
>>  In order to mark where the hole was supposed to go, I used my precision
>>  giant tape measure to determine the correct distance, then I used
>>  painters tape to circumnavigate the column.  I reasoned the distance
>>  from the face of the ignition switch to the edge of the tape would be
>>  the same all the way around, so all I'd have to do it make sure the
>>  drill bit was lined up with the edge of the tape on the far side of the
>>  assembly 180 degrees from the little mark so I could drill the whole
>>  from the back where I couldn't really see anything.
>>  What could go wrong?
>>  Amazingly, and very un-Pandora-like, I managed to get the hole drilled
>>  in exactly the right place.  I pushed an awl into the hole, used a
>>  screwdriver to pry the tumbler partway out, then employed vise grips to
>>  grab it and wiggle it the rest of the way.
>>  This was going way better than I thought it would!
>>  I examined the tumbler and decided to disassemble it to see if I could
>>  find anything obvious which might be the cause of the problem.  The
>>  first thing I noticed is that in all my key-wiggling frenzies trying to
>>  get it to work, the tip of the key had broken off and was wedged at the
>>  bottom of the tumbler.
>>  After some tapping, pushing, and pulling the little spring-loaded tabs
>>  in the tumbler I managed to get the piece of key removed.  That,
>>  however, wasn't the actual problem, just a result of the problem,
>>  because when I used my extra key, it still got jammed up and wouldn't
>>  work.
>>  Even with Houdini's help, the little brass pieces which are supposed to
>>  move in and out in conjunction with the key being inserted, wouldn't
>>  cooperate.  I think they were just plum worn out.
>>  I could either take the assembly to a locksmith and see if he or she
>>  could repair it, or I could use the Primitive Pete method.  Guess which
>>  one I chose?
>>  I simply removed all the brass pieces so the key would easily slide
>>  into the tumbler and rotate the assembly.  It worked great!  Of course,
>>  it also meant any variety of keys could be used to start the car.  In
>>  fact, my extra V-Max key works great!
>>  The multi-key method may not be the most secure, but it's not a big
>>  problem and even has some advantages.  For example:
>>    1.  Most young car thieves have no idea how to drive a manual
>>  5-speed, and most of the old car thieves who do are now too old to get
>>  in and out of a Pantera.
>>    2.
>>  I can always replace the 12-volt lockout switch by the battery, which
>>  quit working, with a new one which has it's own key.
>>    3.  The key which unlocks the doors still needs to be used to get
>>  into the car.
>>    4.  I won't have to worry about the tumbler messing up again.
>>    5.  If I lose my ignition key I can now use any number of other
>>  things to start my car!
>>  I reassembled everything with no problem, and now the ignition switch
>>  starts the car easier than ever!
>>  If the next owner wants to restore the ignition tumbler back to stock,
>>  that will be easy since I saved the little brass things in a diminutive
>>  zip-lock bag.  The tough part will be finding said bag amongst the
>>  piles of other used Pantera parts which seems to grow larger by the
>>  day.
>>  ________________________________
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 1:35 PM
>>  To: chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  Cc: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>; De Tomaso Forum
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>  Yes when the tumbler isn't flush it won't allow the key to fully enter.
>>  Maybe some debris in there? Or something broke off.
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPhone
>>  On Apr 20, 2024, at 09:58, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>  Nothing is broken as far as the key is concerned. The key goes in about
>>  half way then abruptly stops because it is hitting something solid
>>  inside the Tumbler that won't allow the key to go in all the way. I can
>>  pull it in and out half way quite easily, but as far as turning it, no
>>  way! Also I did try repeatedly with the paper clip to pull the cylinder
>>  out but it's as if it's glued in place permanently.
>>  I'll try a few more times over the next few days, but I have a feeling
>>  it's going to be Tumbler extraction time for me pretty soon!
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>  -------- Original message --------
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Date: 4/19/24 10:47 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>  To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>  Chris,
>>  Ooh. I've never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with minimal
>>  effort.
>>  Try maximal effort?
>>  Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPad
>>  On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  wrote:
>>  I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends
>>  straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>>  ________________________________
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>>  Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>>  To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>> Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please....
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>  trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>  Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>  Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>>  [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>  they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>  car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>  Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>  to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>  jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>  and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>  light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> 
>>  [2]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso<http://serv
>>  er.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>  etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>>  any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>>  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>>  or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>  2. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso<http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>> _______________________________________________
>> 
>> 
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>> 
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>> 
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2024 15:26:30 +0000
> From: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
> To: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>, Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>,
>    chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
> Message-ID:
>    <CY8PR20MB57147ED6973650D6C9C46EF7BC122 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
>    
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> ?
> ________________________________
> From: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
> Sent: Monday, April 22, 2024 5:58 AM
> To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>; Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> Chris, thank you for an edition of "Captain My Captain" this morning.  It could have only been better by being hampered somehow by some of the Seven Deadly Sins.  Good luck and sweet driving.    BILL Lewis
> ________________________________
> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:26 PM
> To: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> Hi Mike (and forum readers),
> 
> I spent the last several hours disassembling the entire ignition switch mechanism, and for those who are interested, here is, in excruciating detail, what happened:
> 
> 
> I have said many times I?m not much of a mechanic, but I can follow directions fairly well.  Larry Finch was kind enough to send me some pictures of how to remove the tumbler, so in another act of purest optimism, I grabbed my flashlight, a few screwdrivers, and my socket set and climbed under the dash.
> 
> 
> 
> First I had to partially remove the plate holding one of the 6x9, 3-way speakers I mounted under the dash.  (I must say, that plate was very well constructed.  It was fabricated by Finn?s Auto Restoration, and replaced a rather lame one I had installed made out of thin plywood).
> 
> 
> 
> Once that was out of the way I used a hex wrench to remove two bolts under the steering column, followed by the two large bolts located just behind the hex bolts.  At that point the entire steering column lowered so I could take out the two screws on each side of the plastic housing surrounding the turn-signal stalk and ignition keyhole.
> 
> 
> 
> So far, so good.
> 
> 
> 
> The next step was to remove two flat-head screws to take off the electrical cylinder which is the actual ignition switch.  Just for fun I used a screwdriver to turn it, and the car started right up.  That was good, since I figured if all else failed I could just mount that to the dashboard and attached a large screwdriver to my keyring.
> 
> 
> 
> I covered the exposed terminals on the ignition switch with tape so I wouldn?t end up causing a Pantera-destroying fire (not to mention my garage and house) and surveyed the landscape.
> 
> 
> 
> The tumbler is mounted in a metal structure which seemed to be attached with some sort of press-fit shafts designed to never be removed.  That was OK, though, since Larry Finch?s pictures also showed how to remove the tumbler from the steering column.
> 
> 
> 
> You see, when the clever Italians assembled this part of the car, they had so much faith and confidence the tumbler would never break, they installed it with a spring clip located inside the bomb-proof housing?totally inaccessible to mere mortals.  Not only that, they didn?t mount the spring clip longitudinally, so slight pressure would release the tumbler, oh no, they mounted it sideways so there is no way to get it to release and free the tumbler.
> 
> 
> 
> But here is where it is a great thing to have the combined brainpower of all the Pantera owners out there.  Larry showed me via his pictures how one can drill a hole directly above where the spring clip resides, enabling the spring clip to be depressed by a thin awl, thereby releasing the tumbler.
> 
> 
> 
> The picture provided by Larry showed a digital micrometer measuring .628 of an inch from the face of the tumbler to the place where the spring clip access hole would need to be drilled.  It was 180 degrees from a small mark on the chrome face of the ignition tumbler where the key inserts.
> 
> 
> 
> Although I may have some kind of micrometer manufactured before electricity which I inherited from my grandfather buried somewhere in the garage (the micrometer, not my grandfather), I don?t have a digital unit.  I used the next best thing:  The new 40? industrial tape measure I just bought to replace the tape measure I lost (but then found a week later).  This, of course, was only slightly less accurate than a digital micrometer, but I figured I could make up for the inaccuracy by just drilling a bigger hole.
> 
> 
> 
> In assessing where the hole would need to be drilled, I found the location was on the backside of the metal housing.  Pretty much the most inconvenient place for me to have to drill.
> 
> 
> 
> In order to mark where the hole was supposed to go, I used my precision giant tape measure to determine the correct distance, then I used painters tape to circumnavigate the column.  I reasoned the distance from the face of the ignition switch to the edge of the tape would be the same all the way around, so all I?d have to do it make sure the drill bit was lined up with the edge of the tape on the far side of the assembly 180 degrees from the little mark so I could drill the whole from the back where I couldn?t really see anything.
> 
> 
> 
> What could go wrong?
> 
> 
> 
> Amazingly, and very un-Pandora-like, I managed to get the hole drilled in exactly the right place.  I pushed an awl into the hole, used a screwdriver to pry the tumbler partway out, then employed vise grips to grab it and wiggle it the rest of the way.
> 
> 
> 
> This was going way better than I thought it would!
> 
> 
> 
> I examined the tumbler and decided to disassemble it to see if I could find anything obvious which might be the cause of the problem.  The first thing I noticed is that in all my key-wiggling frenzies trying to get it to work, the tip of the key had broken off and was wedged at the bottom of the tumbler.
> 
> 
> 
> After some tapping, pushing, and pulling the little spring-loaded tabs in the tumbler I managed to get the piece of key removed.  That, however, wasn?t the actual problem, just a result of the problem, because when I used my extra key, it still got jammed up and wouldn?t work.
> 
> 
> 
> Even with Houdini?s help, the little brass pieces which are supposed to move in and out in conjunction with the key being inserted, wouldn?t cooperate.  I think they were just plum worn out.
> 
> 
> 
> I could either take the assembly to a locksmith and see if he or she could repair it, or I could use the Primitive Pete method.  Guess which one I chose?
> 
> 
> 
> I simply removed all the brass pieces so the key would easily slide into the tumbler and rotate the assembly.  It worked great!  Of course, it also meant any variety of keys could be used to start the car.  In fact, my extra V-Max key works great!
> 
> 
> 
> The multi-key method may not be the most secure, but it?s not a big problem and even has some advantages.  For example:
> 
> 
> 
>  1.  Most young car thieves have no idea how to drive a manual 5-speed, and most of the old car thieves who do are now too old to get in and out of a Pantera.
>  2.
> I can always replace the 12-volt lockout switch by the battery, which quit working, with a new one which has it?s own key.
>  3.  The key which unlocks the doors still needs to be used to get into the car.
>  4.  I won?t have to worry about the tumbler messing up again.
>  5.  If I lose my ignition key I can now use any number of other things to start my car!
> 
> I reassembled everything with no problem, and now the ignition switch starts the car easier than ever!
> 
> 
> 
> If the next owner wants to restore the ignition tumbler back to stock, that will be easy since I saved the little brass things in a diminutive zip-lock bag.  The tough part will be finding said bag amongst the piles of other used Pantera parts which seems to grow larger by the day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 1:35 PM
> To: chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Cc: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>; De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> Yes when the tumbler isn?t flush it won?t allow the key to fully enter.
> 
> Maybe some debris in there? Or something broke off.
> 
> Mike
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Apr 20, 2024, at 09:58, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Nothing is broken as far as the key is concerned. The key goes in about half way then abruptly stops because it is hitting something solid inside the Tumbler that won't allow the key to go in all the way. I can pull it in and out half way quite easily, but as far as turning it, no way! Also I did try repeatedly with the paper clip to pull the cylinder out but it's as if it's glued in place permanently.
> 
> I'll try a few more times over the next few days, but I have a feeling it's going to be Tumbler extraction time for me pretty soon!
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Chris
> 
> 
> 
> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable smartphone
> 
> 
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
> Date: 4/19/24 10:47 PM (GMT-08:00)
> To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
> Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> Chris,
> 
> Ooh. I?ve never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with minimal effort.
> 
> Try maximal effort?
> 
> Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
> 
> Mike
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Chris
> ________________________________
> From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
> To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> 
> 
>> ?Sigh.
>> 
>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>> 
>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>> ?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable smartphone
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Chris,
>>> 
>>> Send us pics please?.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> ?   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip trick,
>>>>  unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>  smartphone
>>>>  -------- Original message --------
>>>>  From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>  Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>  To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera Owners Club
>>>>  of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>  Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>>  Dear Chris,
>>>>               ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical Paper Clip
>>>>  Ignition Trick????
>>>>               Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>                              Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>  -----Original Message-----
>>>>  From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>  Behalf
>>>>  Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>  Hi folks,
>>>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that they were
>>>>  difficult to find.
>>>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my car!"
>>>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>  halfway.  It
>>>>  will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of Houdini
>>>>  in
>>>>  it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough to get
>>>>  it to
>>>>  work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could jiggle
>>>>  myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale, and
>>>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant light
>>>>  switch
>>>>  on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be willing
>>>>  to
>>>>  sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>  Thanks for your help!
>>>>  Sincerely,
>>>>  Chris
>>>> 
>>>> References
>>>> 
>>>>  1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso<http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso><http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso%3Chttp://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso%3E>
>>>> 
>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>>>> 
>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>> 
>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
> -------------- next part --------------
>     __________________________________________________________________
> 
>   From: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
>   Sent: Monday, April 22, 2024 5:58 AM
>   To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>; Mike Drew
>   <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
>   Chris, thank you for an edition of "Captain My Captain" this morning.
>   It could have only been better by being hampered somehow by some of the
>   Seven Deadly Sins.  Good luck and sweet driving.    BILL Lewis
>     __________________________________________________________________
> 
>   From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>   Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>   Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:26 PM
>   To: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball
>   <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
>   Hi Mike (and forum readers),
>   I spent the last several hours disassembling the entire ignition switch
>   mechanism, and for those who are interested, here is, in excruciating
>   detail, what happened:
>   I have said many times I'm not much of a mechanic, but I can follow
>   directions fairly well.  Larry Finch was kind enough to send me some
>   pictures of how to remove the tumbler, so in another act of purest
>   optimism, I grabbed my flashlight, a few screwdrivers, and my socket
>   set and climbed under the dash.
>   First I had to partially remove the plate holding one of the 6x9, 3-way
>   speakers I mounted under the dash.  (I must say, that plate was very
>   well constructed.  It was fabricated by Finn's Auto Restoration, and
>   replaced a rather lame one I had installed made out of thin plywood).
>   Once that was out of the way I used a hex wrench to remove two bolts
>   under the steering column, followed by the two large bolts located just
>   behind the hex bolts.  At that point the entire steering column lowered
>   so I could take out the two screws on each side of the plastic housing
>   surrounding the turn-signal stalk and ignition keyhole.
>   So far, so good.
>   The next step was to remove two flat-head screws to take off the
>   electrical cylinder which is the actual ignition switch.  Just for fun
>   I used a screwdriver to turn it, and the car started right up.  That
>   was good, since I figured if all else failed I could just mount that to
>   the dashboard and attached a large screwdriver to my keyring.
>   I covered the exposed terminals on the ignition switch with tape so I
>   wouldn't end up causing a Pantera-destroying fire (not to mention my
>   garage and house) and surveyed the landscape.
>   The tumbler is mounted in a metal structure which seemed to be attached
>   with some sort of press-fit shafts designed to never be removed.  That
>   was OK, though, since Larry Finch's pictures also showed how to remove
>   the tumbler from the steering column.
>   You see, when the clever Italians assembled this part of the car, they
>   had so much faith and confidence the tumbler would never break, they
>   installed it with a spring clip located inside the bomb-proof
>   housing--totally inaccessible to mere mortals.  Not only that, they
>   didn't mount the spring clip longitudinally, so slight pressure would
>   release the tumbler, oh no, they mounted it sideways so there is no way
>   to get it to release and free the tumbler.
>   But here is where it is a great thing to have the combined brainpower
>   of all the Pantera owners out there.  Larry showed me via his pictures
>   how one can drill a hole directly above where the spring clip resides,
>   enabling the spring clip to be depressed by a thin awl, thereby
>   releasing the tumbler.
>   The picture provided by Larry showed a digital micrometer measuring
>   .628 of an inch from the face of the tumbler to the place where the
>   spring clip access hole would need to be drilled.  It was 180 degrees
>   from a small mark on the chrome face of the ignition tumbler where the
>   key inserts.
>   Although I may have some kind of micrometer manufactured before
>   electricity which I inherited from my grandfather buried somewhere in
>   the garage (the micrometer, not my grandfather), I don't have a digital
>   unit.  I used the next best thing:  The new 40' industrial tape measure
>   I just bought to replace the tape measure I lost (but then found a week
>   later).  This, of course, was only slightly less accurate than a
>   digital micrometer, but I figured I could make up for the inaccuracy by
>   just drilling a bigger hole.
>   In assessing where the hole would need to be drilled, I found the
>   location was on the backside of the metal housing.  Pretty much the
>   most inconvenient place for me to have to drill.
>   In order to mark where the hole was supposed to go, I used my precision
>   giant tape measure to determine the correct distance, then I used
>   painters tape to circumnavigate the column.  I reasoned the distance
>   from the face of the ignition switch to the edge of the tape would be
>   the same all the way around, so all I'd have to do it make sure the
>   drill bit was lined up with the edge of the tape on the far side of the
>   assembly 180 degrees from the little mark so I could drill the whole
>   from the back where I couldn't really see anything.
>   What could go wrong?
>   Amazingly, and very un-Pandora-like, I managed to get the hole drilled
>   in exactly the right place.  I pushed an awl into the hole, used a
>   screwdriver to pry the tumbler partway out, then employed vise grips to
>   grab it and wiggle it the rest of the way.
>   This was going way better than I thought it would!
>   I examined the tumbler and decided to disassemble it to see if I could
>   find anything obvious which might be the cause of the problem.  The
>   first thing I noticed is that in all my key-wiggling frenzies trying to
>   get it to work, the tip of the key had broken off and was wedged at the
>   bottom of the tumbler.
>   After some tapping, pushing, and pulling the little spring-loaded tabs
>   in the tumbler I managed to get the piece of key removed.  That,
>   however, wasn't the actual problem, just a result of the problem,
>   because when I used my extra key, it still got jammed up and wouldn't
>   work.
>   Even with Houdini's help, the little brass pieces which are supposed to
>   move in and out in conjunction with the key being inserted, wouldn't
>   cooperate.  I think they were just plum worn out.
>   I could either take the assembly to a locksmith and see if he or she
>   could repair it, or I could use the Primitive Pete method.  Guess which
>   one I chose?
>   I simply removed all the brass pieces so the key would easily slide
>   into the tumbler and rotate the assembly.  It worked great!  Of course,
>   it also meant any variety of keys could be used to start the car.  In
>   fact, my extra V-Max key works great!
>   The multi-key method may not be the most secure, but it's not a big
>   problem and even has some advantages.  For example:
>     1.  Most young car thieves have no idea how to drive a manual
>   5-speed, and most of the old car thieves who do are now too old to get
>   in and out of a Pantera.
>     2.
>   I can always replace the 12-volt lockout switch by the battery, which
>   quit working, with a new one which has it's own key.
>     3.  The key which unlocks the doors still needs to be used to get
>   into the car.
>     4.  I won't have to worry about the tumbler messing up again.
>     5.  If I lose my ignition key I can now use any number of other
>   things to start my car!
>   I reassembled everything with no problem, and now the ignition switch
>   starts the car easier than ever!
>   If the next owner wants to restore the ignition tumbler back to stock,
>   that will be easy since I saved the little brass things in a diminutive
>   zip-lock bag.  The tough part will be finding said bag amongst the
>   piles of other used Pantera parts which seems to grow larger by the
>   day.
>   ________________________________
>   From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>   Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 1:35 PM
>   To: chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   Cc: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>; De Tomaso Forum
>   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>   Yes when the tumbler isn't flush it won't allow the key to fully enter.
>   Maybe some debris in there? Or something broke off.
>   Mike
>   Sent from my iPhone
>   On Apr 20, 2024, at 09:58, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   wrote:
>   Nothing is broken as far as the key is concerned. The key goes in about
>   half way then abruptly stops because it is hitting something solid
>   inside the Tumbler that won't allow the key to go in all the way. I can
>   pull it in and out half way quite easily, but as far as turning it, no
>   way! Also I did try repeatedly with the paper clip to pull the cylinder
>   out but it's as if it's glued in place permanently.
>   I'll try a few more times over the next few days, but I have a feeling
>   it's going to be Tumbler extraction time for me pretty soon!
>   Sincerely,
>   Chris
>   Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>   smartphone
>   -------- Original message --------
>   From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>   Date: 4/19/24 10:47 PM (GMT-08:00)
>   To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>   Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>   Chris,
>   Ooh. I've never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with minimal
>   effort.
>   Try maximal effort?
>   Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
>   Mike
>   Sent from my iPad
>   On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>   wrote:
>   I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends
>   straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>   Sincerely,
>   Chris
>   ________________________________
>   From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>   Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>   To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> Sigh.
>> 
>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>> 
>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>   clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>   wrote:
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>   smartphone
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America
>   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>> 
>>> Chris,
>>> 
>>> Send us pics please....
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>   <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>   Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>   trick,
>>>>  unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>  smartphone
>>>>  -------- Original message --------
>>>>  From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>  Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>  To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>   Owners Club
>>>>  of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>  Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>>  Dear Chris,
>>>>               ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>   Paper Clip
>>>>  Ignition Trick????
>>>>               Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>                              Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>  -----Original Message-----
>>>>  From: DeTomaso
>   [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>  Behalf
>>>>  Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>  To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>  Hi folks,
>>>>  Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>   they were
>>>>  difficult to find.
>>>>  "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>   car!"
>>>>  Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>  halfway.  It
>>>>  will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>   Houdini
>>>>  in
>>>>  it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>   to get
>>>>  it to
>>>>  work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>   jiggle
>>>>  myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>  I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>   and
>>>>  apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>  Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>   light
>>>>  switch
>>>>  on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>   willing
>>>>  to
>>>>  sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>  Thanks for your help!
>>>>  Sincerely,
>>>>  Chris
>>>> 
>>>> References
>>>> 
>>>>  1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>> 
>   [2]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso<http://serv
>   er.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>>>> 
>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>   etc.) use the links above.
>>>> 
>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
>   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
>   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>   or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>> 
>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
> 
> References
> 
>   1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>   2. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso%3Chttp://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso%3E
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2024 15:29:54 +0000
> From: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
> To: Dave Londry <davel at trguys.com>, Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
> Cc: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>, De Tomaso Forum
>    <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>, chrisvkimball
>    <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd:  tumbler
> Message-ID:
>    <CY8PR20MB57146955DA38EBFEEDCB7013BC122 at CY8PR20MB5714.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
>    
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Thank you.  They say there's a fine line between creativity and insanity...:)
> ________________________________
> From: Dave Londry <davel at trguys.com>
> Sent: Monday, April 22, 2024 8:05 AM
> To: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
> Cc: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>; Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>; De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
> I agree Bill.
> That would be a stand-up comedy routine performed upside down  under a dashboard.
> We knew Chris was a talented guy, but this is outstanding.
> Dave
> 
> Dave Londry.
> TRGuys.com
> davel at trguys.com
> 
>> On Apr 22, 2024, at 5:58 AM, Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> ?   Chris, thank you for an edition of "Captain My Captain" this morning.
>>  It could have only been better by being hampered somehow by some of the
>>  Seven Deadly Sins.  Good luck and sweet driving.    BILL Lewis
>>    __________________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>>  Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:26 PM
>>  To: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>>  Hi Mike (and forum readers),
>>  I spent the last several hours disassembling the entire ignition switch
>>  mechanism, and for those who are interested, here is, in excruciating
>>  detail, what happened:
>>  I have said many times I'm not much of a mechanic, but I can follow
>>  directions fairly well.  Larry Finch was kind enough to send me some
>>  pictures of how to remove the tumbler, so in another act of purest
>>  optimism, I grabbed my flashlight, a few screwdrivers, and my socket
>>  set and climbed under the dash.
>>  First I had to partially remove the plate holding one of the 6x9, 3-way
>>  speakers I mounted under the dash.  (I must say, that plate was very
>>  well constructed.  It was fabricated by Finn's Auto Restoration, and
>>  replaced a rather lame one I had installed made out of thin plywood).
>>  Once that was out of the way I used a hex wrench to remove two bolts
>>  under the steering column, followed by the two large bolts located just
>>  behind the hex bolts.  At that point the entire steering column lowered
>>  so I could take out the two screws on each side of the plastic housing
>>  surrounding the turn-signal stalk and ignition keyhole.
>>  So far, so good.
>>  The next step was to remove two flat-head screws to take off the
>>  electrical cylinder which is the actual ignition switch.  Just for fun
>>  I used a screwdriver to turn it, and the car started right up.  That
>>  was good, since I figured if all else failed I could just mount that to
>>  the dashboard and attached a large screwdriver to my keyring.
>>  I covered the exposed terminals on the ignition switch with tape so I
>>  wouldn't end up causing a Pantera-destroying fire (not to mention my
>>  garage and house) and surveyed the landscape.
>>  The tumbler is mounted in a metal structure which seemed to be attached
>>  with some sort of press-fit shafts designed to never be removed.  That
>>  was OK, though, since Larry Finch's pictures also showed how to remove
>>  the tumbler from the steering column.
>>  You see, when the clever Italians assembled this part of the car, they
>>  had so much faith and confidence the tumbler would never break, they
>>  installed it with a spring clip located inside the bomb-proof
>>  housing--totally inaccessible to mere mortals.  Not only that, they
>>  didn't mount the spring clip longitudinally, so slight pressure would
>>  release the tumbler, oh no, they mounted it sideways so there is no way
>>  to get it to release and free the tumbler.
>>  But here is where it is a great thing to have the combined brainpower
>>  of all the Pantera owners out there.  Larry showed me via his pictures
>>  how one can drill a hole directly above where the spring clip resides,
>>  enabling the spring clip to be depressed by a thin awl, thereby
>>  releasing the tumbler.
>>  The picture provided by Larry showed a digital micrometer measuring
>>  .628 of an inch from the face of the tumbler to the place where the
>>  spring clip access hole would need to be drilled.  It was 180 degrees
>>  from a small mark on the chrome face of the ignition tumbler where the
>>  key inserts.
>>  Although I may have some kind of micrometer manufactured before
>>  electricity which I inherited from my grandfather buried somewhere in
>>  the garage (the micrometer, not my grandfather), I don't have a digital
>>  unit.  I used the next best thing:  The new 40' industrial tape measure
>>  I just bought to replace the tape measure I lost (but then found a week
>>  later).  This, of course, was only slightly less accurate than a
>>  digital micrometer, but I figured I could make up for the inaccuracy by
>>  just drilling a bigger hole.
>>  In assessing where the hole would need to be drilled, I found the
>>  location was on the backside of the metal housing.  Pretty much the
>>  most inconvenient place for me to have to drill.
>>  In order to mark where the hole was supposed to go, I used my precision
>>  giant tape measure to determine the correct distance, then I used
>>  painters tape to circumnavigate the column.  I reasoned the distance
>>  from the face of the ignition switch to the edge of the tape would be
>>  the same all the way around, so all I'd have to do it make sure the
>>  drill bit was lined up with the edge of the tape on the far side of the
>>  assembly 180 degrees from the little mark so I could drill the whole
>>  from the back where I couldn't really see anything.
>>  What could go wrong?
>>  Amazingly, and very un-Pandora-like, I managed to get the hole drilled
>>  in exactly the right place.  I pushed an awl into the hole, used a
>>  screwdriver to pry the tumbler partway out, then employed vise grips to
>>  grab it and wiggle it the rest of the way.
>>  This was going way better than I thought it would!
>>  I examined the tumbler and decided to disassemble it to see if I could
>>  find anything obvious which might be the cause of the problem.  The
>>  first thing I noticed is that in all my key-wiggling frenzies trying to
>>  get it to work, the tip of the key had broken off and was wedged at the
>>  bottom of the tumbler.
>>  After some tapping, pushing, and pulling the little spring-loaded tabs
>>  in the tumbler I managed to get the piece of key removed.  That,
>>  however, wasn't the actual problem, just a result of the problem,
>>  because when I used my extra key, it still got jammed up and wouldn't
>>  work.
>>  Even with Houdini's help, the little brass pieces which are supposed to
>>  move in and out in conjunction with the key being inserted, wouldn't
>>  cooperate.  I think they were just plum worn out.
>>  I could either take the assembly to a locksmith and see if he or she
>>  could repair it, or I could use the Primitive Pete method.  Guess which
>>  one I chose?
>>  I simply removed all the brass pieces so the key would easily slide
>>  into the tumbler and rotate the assembly.  It worked great!  Of course,
>>  it also meant any variety of keys could be used to start the car.  In
>>  fact, my extra V-Max key works great!
>>  The multi-key method may not be the most secure, but it's not a big
>>  problem and even has some advantages.  For example:
>>    1.  Most young car thieves have no idea how to drive a manual
>>  5-speed, and most of the old car thieves who do are now too old to get
>>  in and out of a Pantera.
>>    2.
>>  I can always replace the 12-volt lockout switch by the battery, which
>>  quit working, with a new one which has it's own key.
>>    3.  The key which unlocks the doors still needs to be used to get
>>  into the car.
>>    4.  I won't have to worry about the tumbler messing up again.
>>    5.  If I lose my ignition key I can now use any number of other
>>  things to start my car!
>>  I reassembled everything with no problem, and now the ignition switch
>>  starts the car easier than ever!
>>  If the next owner wants to restore the ignition tumbler back to stock,
>>  that will be easy since I saved the little brass things in a diminutive
>>  zip-lock bag.  The tough part will be finding said bag amongst the
>>  piles of other used Pantera parts which seems to grow larger by the
>>  day.
>>  ________________________________
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 1:35 PM
>>  To: chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  Cc: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>; De Tomaso Forum
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>  Yes when the tumbler isn't flush it won't allow the key to fully enter.
>>  Maybe some debris in there? Or something broke off.
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPhone
>>  On Apr 20, 2024, at 09:58, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>  Nothing is broken as far as the key is concerned. The key goes in about
>>  half way then abruptly stops because it is hitting something solid
>>  inside the Tumbler that won't allow the key to go in all the way. I can
>>  pull it in and out half way quite easily, but as far as turning it, no
>>  way! Also I did try repeatedly with the paper clip to pull the cylinder
>>  out but it's as if it's glued in place permanently.
>>  I'll try a few more times over the next few days, but I have a feeling
>>  it's going to be Tumbler extraction time for me pretty soon!
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>  -------- Original message --------
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Date: 4/19/24 10:47 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>  To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>  Chris,
>>  Ooh. I've never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with minimal
>>  effort.
>>  Try maximal effort?
>>  Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPad
>>  On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  wrote:
>>  I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just bends
>>  straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling power.
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>>  ________________________________
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
>>  Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>>  To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>> Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please....
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>  trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>  Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>  Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>>  [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>  they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>  car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>  Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>  to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>  jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>  and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>  light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> 
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>>  er.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>>>>> 
>>>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
>>  etc.) use the links above.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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>>  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
>>  or approve the archiving of list messages.
>>>> 
>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
>> References
>> 
>>  1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>  2. https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7C7e2dc9f3659b492f1b3a08dc62ddbf12%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638493951751946600%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=24IqBpXsmprh%2B74gDrqIze7y4Wa%2FDoLAQHD6%2F%2F3Yn0M%3D&reserved=0<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7C7e2dc9f3659b492f1b3a08dc62ddbf12%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638493951751949789%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=T23aysnnZ61HZAAzNj5n3TpZ4VExK4MLaGXaxYmZ%2Fyc%3D&reserved=0><http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
>> _______________________________________________
>> 
>> 
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fserver.detomasolist.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fdetomaso&data=05%7C02%7C%7C7e2dc9f3659b492f1b3a08dc62ddbf12%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638493951751952795%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=kJtMDfKwn5M6ssRckPTGrVMyVsEDAseFxKtA%2FGZLpfU%3D&reserved=0<http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
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> -------------- next part --------------
>   Thank you.  They say there's a fine line between creativity and
>   insanity...:)
>     __________________________________________________________________
> 
>   From: Dave Londry <davel at trguys.com>
>   Sent: Monday, April 22, 2024 8:05 AM
>   To: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
>   Cc: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>; Mike Drew
>   <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>; De Tomaso
>   Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
> 
>   I agree Bill.
>   That would be a stand-up comedy routine performed upside down  under a
>   dashboard.
>   We knew Chris was a talented guy, but this is outstanding.
>   Dave
>   Dave Londry.
>   TRGuys.com
>   davel at trguys.com
>>> On Apr 22, 2024, at 5:58 AM, Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
>>   wrote:
>> 
>>   Chris, thank you for an edition of "Captain My Captain" this
>   morning.
>>  It could have only been better by being hampered somehow by some of
>   the
>>  Seven Deadly Sins.  Good luck and sweet driving.    BILL Lewis
>> 
>   __________________________________________________________________
>> 
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
>   of
>>  Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 11:26 PM
>>  To: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>; chrisvkimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>> 
>>  Hi Mike (and forum readers),
>>  I spent the last several hours disassembling the entire ignition
>   switch
>>  mechanism, and for those who are interested, here is, in
>   excruciating
>>  detail, what happened:
>>  I have said many times I'm not much of a mechanic, but I can follow
>>  directions fairly well.  Larry Finch was kind enough to send me
>   some
>>  pictures of how to remove the tumbler, so in another act of purest
>>  optimism, I grabbed my flashlight, a few screwdrivers, and my
>   socket
>>  set and climbed under the dash.
>>  First I had to partially remove the plate holding one of the 6x9,
>   3-way
>>  speakers I mounted under the dash.  (I must say, that plate was
>   very
>>  well constructed.  It was fabricated by Finn's Auto Restoration,
>   and
>>  replaced a rather lame one I had installed made out of thin
>   plywood).
>>  Once that was out of the way I used a hex wrench to remove two
>   bolts
>>  under the steering column, followed by the two large bolts located
>   just
>>  behind the hex bolts.  At that point the entire steering column
>   lowered
>>  so I could take out the two screws on each side of the plastic
>   housing
>>  surrounding the turn-signal stalk and ignition keyhole.
>>  So far, so good.
>>  The next step was to remove two flat-head screws to take off the
>>  electrical cylinder which is the actual ignition switch.  Just for
>   fun
>>  I used a screwdriver to turn it, and the car started right up.
>   That
>>  was good, since I figured if all else failed I could just mount
>   that to
>>  the dashboard and attached a large screwdriver to my keyring.
>>  I covered the exposed terminals on the ignition switch with tape so
>   I
>>  wouldn't end up causing a Pantera-destroying fire (not to mention
>   my
>>  garage and house) and surveyed the landscape.
>>  The tumbler is mounted in a metal structure which seemed to be
>   attached
>>  with some sort of press-fit shafts designed to never be removed.
>   That
>>  was OK, though, since Larry Finch's pictures also showed how to
>   remove
>>  the tumbler from the steering column.
>>  You see, when the clever Italians assembled this part of the car,
>   they
>>  had so much faith and confidence the tumbler would never break,
>   they
>>  installed it with a spring clip located inside the bomb-proof
>>  housing--totally inaccessible to mere mortals.  Not only that, they
>>  didn't mount the spring clip longitudinally, so slight pressure
>   would
>>  release the tumbler, oh no, they mounted it sideways so there is no
>   way
>>  to get it to release and free the tumbler.
>>  But here is where it is a great thing to have the combined
>   brainpower
>>  of all the Pantera owners out there.  Larry showed me via his
>   pictures
>>  how one can drill a hole directly above where the spring clip
>   resides,
>>  enabling the spring clip to be depressed by a thin awl, thereby
>>  releasing the tumbler.
>>  The picture provided by Larry showed a digital micrometer measuring
>>  .628 of an inch from the face of the tumbler to the place where the
>>  spring clip access hole would need to be drilled.  It was 180
>   degrees
>>  from a small mark on the chrome face of the ignition tumbler where
>   the
>>  key inserts.
>>  Although I may have some kind of micrometer manufactured before
>>  electricity which I inherited from my grandfather buried somewhere
>   in
>>  the garage (the micrometer, not my grandfather), I don't have a
>   digital
>>  unit.  I used the next best thing:  The new 40' industrial tape
>   measure
>>  I just bought to replace the tape measure I lost (but then found a
>   week
>>  later).  This, of course, was only slightly less accurate than a
>>  digital micrometer, but I figured I could make up for the
>   inaccuracy by
>>  just drilling a bigger hole.
>>  In assessing where the hole would need to be drilled, I found the
>>  location was on the backside of the metal housing.  Pretty much the
>>  most inconvenient place for me to have to drill.
>>  In order to mark where the hole was supposed to go, I used my
>   precision
>>  giant tape measure to determine the correct distance, then I used
>>  painters tape to circumnavigate the column.  I reasoned the
>   distance
>>  from the face of the ignition switch to the edge of the tape would
>   be
>>  the same all the way around, so all I'd have to do it make sure the
>>  drill bit was lined up with the edge of the tape on the far side of
>   the
>>  assembly 180 degrees from the little mark so I could drill the
>   whole
>>  from the back where I couldn't really see anything.
>>  What could go wrong?
>>  Amazingly, and very un-Pandora-like, I managed to get the hole
>   drilled
>>  in exactly the right place.  I pushed an awl into the hole, used a
>>  screwdriver to pry the tumbler partway out, then employed vise
>   grips to
>>  grab it and wiggle it the rest of the way.
>>  This was going way better than I thought it would!
>>  I examined the tumbler and decided to disassemble it to see if I
>   could
>>  find anything obvious which might be the cause of the problem.  The
>>  first thing I noticed is that in all my key-wiggling frenzies
>   trying to
>>  get it to work, the tip of the key had broken off and was wedged at
>   the
>>  bottom of the tumbler.
>>  After some tapping, pushing, and pulling the little spring-loaded
>   tabs
>>  in the tumbler I managed to get the piece of key removed.  That,
>>  however, wasn't the actual problem, just a result of the problem,
>>  because when I used my extra key, it still got jammed up and
>   wouldn't
>>  work.
>>  Even with Houdini's help, the little brass pieces which are
>   supposed to
>>  move in and out in conjunction with the key being inserted,
>   wouldn't
>>  cooperate.  I think they were just plum worn out.
>>  I could either take the assembly to a locksmith and see if he or
>   she
>>  could repair it, or I could use the Primitive Pete method.  Guess
>   which
>>  one I chose?
>>  I simply removed all the brass pieces so the key would easily slide
>>  into the tumbler and rotate the assembly.  It worked great!  Of
>   course,
>>  it also meant any variety of keys could be used to start the car.
>   In
>>  fact, my extra V-Max key works great!
>>  The multi-key method may not be the most secure, but it's not a big
>>  problem and even has some advantages.  For example:
>>    1.  Most young car thieves have no idea how to drive a manual
>>  5-speed, and most of the old car thieves who do are now too old to
>   get
>>  in and out of a Pantera.
>>    2.
>>  I can always replace the 12-volt lockout switch by the battery,
>   which
>>  quit working, with a new one which has it's own key.
>>    3.  The key which unlocks the doors still needs to be used to get
>>  into the car.
>>    4.  I won't have to worry about the tumbler messing up again.
>>    5.  If I lose my ignition key I can now use any number of other
>>  things to start my car!
>>  I reassembled everything with no problem, and now the ignition
>   switch
>>  starts the car easier than ever!
>>  If the next owner wants to restore the ignition tumbler back to
>   stock,
>>  that will be easy since I saved the little brass things in a
>   diminutive
>>  zip-lock bag.  The tough part will be finding said bag amongst the
>>  piles of other used Pantera parts which seems to grow larger by the
>>  day.
>>  ________________________________
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2024 1:35 PM
>>  To: chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  Cc: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>; De Tomaso Forum
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>  Yes when the tumbler isn't flush it won't allow the key to fully
>   enter.
>>  Maybe some debris in there? Or something broke off.
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPhone
>>  On Apr 20, 2024, at 09:58, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>  Nothing is broken as far as the key is concerned. The key goes in
>   about
>>  half way then abruptly stops because it is hitting something solid
>>  inside the Tumbler that won't allow the key to go in all the way. I
>   can
>>  pull it in and out half way quite easily, but as far as turning it,
>   no
>>  way! Also I did try repeatedly with the paper clip to pull the
>   cylinder
>>  out but it's as if it's glued in place permanently.
>>  I'll try a few more times over the next few days, but I have a
>   feeling
>>  it's going to be Tumbler extraction time for me pretty soon!
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>  -------- Original message --------
>>  From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>  Date: 4/19/24 10:47 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>  To: Christopher Kimball <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>  Chris,
>>  Ooh. I've never heard of that. Normally it just pops out with
>   minimal
>>  effort.
>>  Try maximal effort?
>>  Did the end of the key break off in the lock?
>>  Mike
>>  Sent from my iPad
>>  On Apr 19, 2024, at 21:57, Christopher Kimball
>   <ChrisVKimball at msn.com>
>>  wrote:
>>  I tried that, the tumbler won't budge, and the paper clip just
>   bends
>>  straight again, even using a BIG paper clip for extra pulling
>   power.
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Chris
>>  ________________________________
>>  From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
>   of
>>  Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 9:05 PM
>>  To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>  Subject: [DeTomaso] Fwd: tumbler
>>> Sigh.
>>> 
>>> This is EXACTLY the problem I have repeatedly described.
>>> 
>>> You need to pull the key out, then put the tumbler out with a paper
>>  clip, then insert the key and it should work.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 19:56, chrisvkimball <chrisvkimball at gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>  smartphone
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: Mike Drew <mikeldrew at aol.com>
>>>> Date: 4/19/24 6:01 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>> To: Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com>
>>>> Cc: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>, Pantera Owners Club of
>   America
>>  <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>> 
>>>> Chris,
>>>> 
>>>> Send us pics please....
>>>> 
>>>> Mike
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2024, at 17:41, Christopher Kimball
>>  <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  Larry Finch was kind enough to walk me through the paper clip
>>  trick,
>>>>> unfortunately, it was to no Avail!
>>>>> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S9+, an AT&T 5G Evolution capable
>>>>> smartphone
>>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>>> From: Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net>
>>>>> Date: 4/19/24 5:23 PM (GMT-08:00)
>>>>> To: 'Christopher Kimball' <chrisvkimball at msn.com>, 'Pantera
>>  Owners Club
>>>>> of America' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
>>>>> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dear Chris,
>>>>>              ......or is this a case for Mike Drew's Magical
>>  Paper Clip
>>>>> Ignition Trick????
>>>>>              Calling Mike.  Come in Mike.
>>>>>                             Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: DeTomaso
>>  [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Christopher Kimball
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 19, 2024 7:05 PM
>>>>> To: Pantera Owners Club of America
>>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] tumbler
>>>>> Hi folks,
>>>>> Recently I remember a post about ignition tumblers, and that
>>  they were
>>>>> difficult to find.
>>>>> "Ha!"  I thought, "At least I don't have that problem with my
>>  car!"
>>>>> Oops.  Today my key decided to only go into the ignition switch
>>>>> halfway.  It
>>>>> will not go in any further, even after squirting half a can of
>>  Houdini
>>>>> in
>>>>> it.  I was fortunate that I could wiggle the key around enough
>>  to get
>>>>> it to
>>>>> work so I could get home this afternoon, but once home, I could
>>  jiggle
>>>>> myself to death and that key will not go in.
>>>>> I talked to a couple of vendors, and neither has any for sale,
>>  and
>>>>> apparently, they are no longer made.
>>>>> Before I bypass the ignition switch entirely and mount a giant
>>  light
>>>>> switch
>>>>> on my dash to start the car, does anyone have one they would be
>>  willing
>>>>> to
>>>>> sell to me, or know where I might find one?
>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>> Chris
>>>>> 
>>>>> References
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. [1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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>>>> <20240419_143206.jpg>
>> 
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> ------------------------------
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> End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 238, Issue 21
> *****************************************