[DeTomaso] Intake carb base question.

[Daniel C Jones]

> AFAIK, the Blue Thunder "Pantera" intake is the ONLY intake that offers
> a parallel-to-the-ground design when installed in our Panteras

That is not the case.  Other intakes that have level carb pads
(or have it optionally) include Scott Cook's dual plane, the Edelbrock
Scorpion, Bud Moore Ram box, most of the Ford Motorsport high ports
and the CHI single planes.

> found "the" ford aluminum intake, in his opinion, better than BT.

By the Ford aluminum intake, do you mean the over-the-counter Holley
carb pattern version (p/n D1ZX-9425-DA) of the Boss/HO 4300D pattern
intake ((p/n D1ZX-9425-CA)?  In any case, in unmodified form both the
Ford and Blue Thunder intakes have the same problem, 4 good runners
and 4 bad, though the pattern of good and bad runners is different.
When D1ZX-9425-DA intake was bolted to a 351C-4V head that flowed
322 CFM @ 0.6" lift, half the runners flowed in the 270's to 280's,
while the other half were down in the 250's. To equalize the flow in
the runners, the center plenum divider was cut down, the port plenum
entry radiused to bring the poor flowing ports up to match the good
flowing ports and a 1" spacer installed.

With those modifications, on Glen Hartog's 408C, the modified Ford
intake made 31 HP and 23 ft-lbs more than the unmodified Blue Thunder
but was down about 15 HP at peak to a Holley Strip Dominator.  When
we did the same treatment to Mike Drew's Blue Thunder, it equaled the
Strip Dominator in peak power.

Dan Jones

On Sun, May 9, 2021 at 9:06 PM Joseph F Byrd, Jr <byrdjf at embarqmail.com>
wrote:

>    I had a discussion with shop building 5177 last week.   (I've lost
>    interest and relying his abilities.)  Progress is VERRY slow
>
>    The engine builder that abandoned the project a couple years ago had
>    found "the" ford aluminum intake, in his opinion, better than BT.   He
>    was onboard about making carb base level and re doing studs.
>
>    Coming to now.   The engine is supposed to be complete EXCEPT, builder
>    didn't do any thing to intake.   During last week discussion with car
>    shop, he stated he want to "get measurements with engine in" (makes no
>    sense to me)
>
>
>    So, to my questions and request for info.
>
>
>    Wouldn't the machine shop instructions be mill carb base parallel with
>    head flanges (then Heli coil studs to be square to machined carb base.
>
>    Is there anything I am missing?   Would anyone know of a pantera
>    shop/dealer my builder could talk to confirm the intake NEEDS to have
>    the carb base level. AND can be done without taking measurements in the
>    car.
>
>    Or some good replies I could forward him
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-------------- next part --------------
   > AFAIK, the Blue Thunder "Pantera" intake is the ONLY intake that
   offers
   > a parallel-to-the-ground design when installed in our Panteras
   That is not the case.A  Other intakes that have level carb pads
   (or have it optionally) include Scott Cook's dual plane, the Edelbrock
   Scorpion, Bud Moore Ram box, most of the Ford Motorsport high ports
   and the CHI single planes.
   > found "the" ford aluminum intake, in his opinion, better than BT.
   By the Ford aluminum intake, do you mean the over-the-counter Holley
   carb pattern version (p/n D1ZX-9425-DA) of the Boss/HO 4300D pattern
   intake ((p/n D1ZX-9425-CA)?A  In any case, in unmodified form both the
   Ford and Blue Thunder intakes have the same problem, 4 good runners
   and 4 bad, though the pattern of good and bad runners is different.
   When D1ZX-9425-DA intake was bolted to a 351C-4V head that flowed
   322 CFM @ 0.6" lift, half the runners flowed in the 270's to 280's,
   while the other half were down in the 250's. To equalize the flow in
   the runners, the center plenum divider was cut down, the port plenum
   entry radiused to bring the poor flowing ports up to match the good
   flowing ports and a 1" spacer installed.
   With those modifications, on Glen Hartog's 408C, the modified Ford
   intake made 31 HP and 23 ft-lbs more than the unmodified Blue Thunder
   but was down about 15 HP at peak to a Holley Strip Dominator.A  When
   we did the same treatment to Mike Drew's Blue Thunder, it equaled the
   Strip Dominator in peak power.
   Dan Jones

   On Sun, May 9, 2021 at 9:06 PM Joseph F Byrd, Jr
   <[1]byrdjf at embarqmail.com> wrote:

     A  A I had a discussion with shop building 5177 last week.A  A (I've
     lost
     A  A interest and relying his abilities.)A  Progress is VERRY slow
     A  A The engine builder that abandoned the project a couple years
     ago had
     A  A found "the" ford aluminum intake, in his opinion, better than
     BT.A  A He
     A  A was onboard about making carb base level and re doing studs.
     A  A Coming to now.A  A The engine is supposed to be complete
     EXCEPT, builder
     A  A didn't do any thing to intake.A  A During last week discussion
     with car
     A  A shop, he stated he want to "get measurements with engine in"
     (makes no
     A  A sense to me)
     A  A So, to my questions and request for info.
     A  A Wouldn't the machine shop instructions be mill carb base
     parallel with
     A  A head flanges (then Heli coil studs to be square to machined
     carb base.
     A  A Is there anything I am missing?A  A Would anyone know of a
     pantera
     A  A shop/dealer my builder could talk to confirm the intake NEEDS
     to have
     A  A the carb base level. AND can be done without taking
     measurements in the
     A  A car.
     A  A Or some good replies I could forward him
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References

   1. mailto:byrdjf at embarqmail.com
   2. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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