[DeTomaso] Shelby GT5-S on Discovery Driven - SPOILER ALERT
Julian Kift
julian_kift at hotmail.com
Tue Mar 31 12:37:44 EDT 2020
Mike,
Yeah, I missed the air filter sat right there front and center, duh! Note the carb is sat back almost over the bell housing and not connected to the intake manifold, the turbos draw through the carb and then blow into the intake manifold via the intercooler.
Julian
________________________________
From: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2020 9:17 AM
To: Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Shelby GT5-S on Discovery Driven - SPOILER ALERT
Julian,
No, the air intake is through the air cleaner sitting on top of the carb. It’s a draw-through system meaning the turbos suck from below the carb instead of pressurizing from above the way a supercharger does. But what happens after that is a mystery to me.
Mike
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 31, 2020, at 08:55, Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com> wrote:
Mike,
I looked back at the Bonhams auction photos, you are indeed correct it came with a fugly drop tip wing...
I did not catch the ZF in the junkyard, I will have to re-watch, but that news just cements the whole drive train story as even less believable now...
Larry Stock sent me an engine photo he took at SEMA, I resized to just under 1MB so hopefully it will get through to the list. Not great detail but it looks like the air intake is somewhere down by the headers, this is one application where using functional side scoops to draw cold air would actually make sense.
Julian
________________________________
From: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2020 8:39 AM
To: Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Shelby GT5-S on Discovery Driven - SPOILER ALERT
Julian,
Didja notice the fact that the ZF was sitting on a pallet next to the engine when they ‘discovered’ it? In the junkyard? That makes the $7500 seem far more reasonable.
It wasn’t a NASCAR engine as far as I know—just an ordinary Dodge motor.
I find the whole story of the engine being taken to a junkyard two hours away and left for 30 years to be very hard to swallow. When I saw the car back in 2002, the drivetrain was out of it, but I got the impression it was lying around somewhere out of sight.
Changing the brakes was wholly unnecessary as stock GT5-S brakes are terrific (although heavy, but who cares?).
The car was originally built to Amerisport spec, including the drop-tip wing. They just bought a new one from Kirk, which now comes with a built-in third brake light. It’s an easy mistake to make to assume the hole spacing of the studs would be the same (why would it change?), and once the goof was discovered, it was easier to change the car to fit the part than to change the part to fit the car.
Shelby had at least one or two other turbo Dodge Panteras, one of which is now owned by Paul Donderwinkle in New Zealand (formerly a London resident and England’s premier De Tomaso service specialist). That one is a red Euro GTS. Reportedly Shelby used to keep it on his ranch in Texas, which had a runway, and would entertain guests by taking them out for high-speed blasts. Driveability of the turbo system was probably not great but WOT performance was terrific!
Mike
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 31, 2020, at 07:29, Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com> wrote:
I watched it and the Galpin Auto Sports guys seem to be it bit more rational than many of the other 'reality tv' auto shows, although they were previously featured on 'pimp my ride' so that should tell us something! Yes there were still plenty of scripted cliche's, loosely based historical facts and false drama.
Now, do I believe they called around local junk yards and miraculously found the original Shelby test mule engine just sat there on pallet under a pristine tarp for 30 years? The $7,500 they paid the old guy was probably more like hush money!
In parts of the show it's all about originality and keeping it the way Shelby touched it, "hey we can't rebuild the engine as it wouldn't be original any more" "we had the exact shade of Shelby white matched by PPG" where they then duly go and bolt up an ugly drop tip delta wing on the car just crudely re-drilling the decklid after paint and then go one step further and slap on a Wilwood brake kit.
But I'm sure now it has attained a little more TV fame and has the "original" engine back where it is supposed to be it will become the 'one of one' most expensive Pantera ever! In what is probably the most representative part of the related Shelby history "don't let the truth get int he way of a good story"
Julian
________________________________
From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2020 10:44 PM
To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Shelby GT5-S on Discovery at 9 pm tonight
Spoiler alert: they didn’t destroy the car the way the Gas Monkey Garage monkeys did (twice!)
The finished car looks right. The show had a bunch of stupid scripted car shows drama, but in general they seemed to do a good job.
It uses a draw-through turbo system but I can’t figure out how the air gets into the engine. It goes through the air cleaner, carb, intake, turbo, intercooler...and then a miracle happens. How does it get from the intercooler back into the engine?
They never show the engine clearly so I wasn’t able to see.
Mike
Sent from my iPad
> On Mar 30, 2020, at 18:25, Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com> wrote:
>
> Too late for anybody but the west coast guys, but tonight at 9 pm on the discovery channel, the show ‘Driven’ is all about the restoration of Carroll Shelby’s prototype GT5-S Pantera, which was powered from new by a turbocharged 340 Dodge!
>
> I saw the car many years ago, engineless, languishing at the back of Shelby’s Goodyear race tire distributorship in Gardena, CA. At the time it had almost no miles on it, and was basically brand new, with the engine bay hacked up to accommodate the Dodge engine. It sold at auction last year.
>
> It should be interesting to see its restoration. I hope they can avoid all the stupid car restoration show drama and just do a good job.....
>
> Mike
>
> Sent from my iPad
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<Shelby 5S 1-2.jpg>
-------------- next part --------------
Mike,
Yeah, I missed the air filter sat right there front and center, duh!
Note the carb is sat back almost over the bell housing and not
connected to the intake manifold, the turbos draw through the carb and
then blow into the intake manifold via the intercooler.
Julian
__________________________________________________________________
From: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2020 9:17 AM
To: Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Shelby GT5-S on Discovery Driven - SPOILER
ALERT
Julian,
No, the air intake is through the air cleaner sitting on top of the
carb. It's a draw-through system meaning the turbos suck from below the
carb instead of pressurizing from above the way a supercharger does.
But what happens after that is a mystery to me.
Mike
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 31, 2020, at 08:55, Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
wrote:
Mike,
I looked back at the Bonhams auction photos, you are indeed correct it
came with a fugly drop tip wing...
I did not catch the ZF in the junkyard, I will have to re-watch, but
that news just cements the whole drive train story as even less
believable now...
Larry Stock sent me an engine photo he took at SEMA, I resized to just
under 1MB so hopefully it will get through to the list. Not great
detail but it looks like the air intake is somewhere down by the
headers, this is one application where using functional side scoops to
draw cold air would actually make sense.
Julian
__________________________________________________________________
From: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2020 8:39 AM
To: Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
Cc: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Shelby GT5-S on Discovery Driven - SPOILER
ALERT
Julian,
Didja notice the fact that the ZF was sitting on a pallet next to the
engine when they `discovered' it? In the junkyard? That makes the
$7500 seem far more reasonable.
It wasn't a NASCAR engine as far as I know--just an ordinary Dodge
motor.
I find the whole story of the engine being taken to a junkyard two
hours away and left for 30 years to be very hard to swallow. When I saw
the car back in 2002, the drivetrain was out of it, but I got the
impression it was lying around somewhere out of sight.
Changing the brakes was wholly unnecessary as stock GT5-S brakes are
terrific (although heavy, but who cares?).
The car was originally built to Amerisport spec, including the drop-tip
wing. They just bought a new one from Kirk, which now comes with a
built-in third brake light. It's an easy mistake to make to assume the
hole spacing of the studs would be the same (why would it change?), and
once the goof was discovered, it was easier to change the car to fit
the part than to change the part to fit the car.
Shelby had at least one or two other turbo Dodge Panteras, one of which
is now owned by Paul Donderwinkle in New Zealand (formerly a London
resident and England's premier De Tomaso service specialist). That one
is a red Euro GTS. Reportedly Shelby used to keep it on his ranch in
Texas, which had a runway, and would entertain guests by taking them
out for high-speed blasts. Driveability of the turbo system was
probably not great but WOT performance was terrific!
Mike
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 31, 2020, at 07:29, Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
wrote:
I watched it and the Galpin Auto Sports guys seem to be it bit more
rational than many of the other 'reality tv' auto shows, although they
were previously featured on 'pimp my ride' so that should tell us
something! Yes there were still plenty of scripted cliche's, loosely
based historical facts and false drama.
Now, do I believe they called around local junk yards and miraculously
found the original Shelby test mule engine just sat there on pallet
under a pristine tarp for 30 years? The $7,500 they paid the old guy
was probably more like hush money!
In parts of the show it's all about originality and keeping it the way
Shelby touched it, "hey we can't rebuild the engine as it wouldn't be
original any more" "we had the exact shade of Shelby white matched by
PPG" where they then duly go and bolt up an ugly drop tip delta wing on
the car just crudely re-drilling the decklid after paint and then go
one step further and slap on a Wilwood brake kit.
But I'm sure now it has attained a little more TV fame and has the
"original" engine back where it is supposed to be it will become the
'one of one' most expensive Pantera ever! In what is probably the most
representative part of the related Shelby history "don't let the truth
get int he way of a good story"
Julian
__________________________________________________________________
From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of
Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2020 10:44 PM
To: De Tomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Shelby GT5-S on Discovery at 9 pm tonight
Spoiler alert: they didn't destroy the car the way the Gas Monkey
Garage monkeys did (twice!)
The finished car looks right. The show had a bunch of stupid scripted
car shows drama, but in general they seemed to do a good job.
It uses a draw-through turbo system but I can't figure out how the air
gets into the engine. It goes through the air cleaner, carb, intake,
turbo, intercooler...and then a miracle happens. How does it get from
the intercooler back into the engine?
They never show the engine clearly so I wasn't able to see.
Mike
Sent from my iPad
> On Mar 30, 2020, at 18:25, Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com> wrote:
>
> Too late for anybody but the west coast guys, but tonight at 9 pm on
the discovery channel, the show `Driven' is all about the restoration
of Carroll Shelby's prototype GT5-S Pantera, which was powered from new
by a turbocharged 340 Dodge!
>
> I saw the car many years ago, engineless, languishing at the back of
Shelby's Goodyear race tire distributorship in Gardena, CA. At the time
it had almost no miles on it, and was basically brand new, with the
engine bay hacked up to accommodate the Dodge engine. It sold at
auction last year.
>
> It should be interesting to see its restoration. I hope they can
avoid all the stupid car restoration show drama and just do a good
job.....
>
> Mike
>
> Sent from my iPad
_______________________________________________
Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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use the links above.
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list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
or approve the archiving of list messages.
<Shelby 5S 1-2.jpg>
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