[DeTomaso] Engine Questions

Julian Kift julian_kift at hotmail.com
Thu Apr 4 14:35:35 EDT 2019 

Mike,

It's not that first style.

One can also support Tim Meyer and get a fancy billet one in the color of your choice for less than the big boys want for a pressed steel repop;

https://www.tmeyerinc.com/product/aeroflow-billet-timing-pointer-cleveland/

Julian
________________________________
From: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 4, 2019 11:19 AM
To: Julian Kift
Cc: Richard Greenblum; detomaso
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine Questions

All,

Here is one kind of stock timing pointer, available used here.

https://secure.cougarpartscatalog.com/store/p/15454-Timing-Pointer-351C-Used-1973-Mercury-Cougar-/-1973-Ford-Mustang.html

Miloden makes a 351C-specific pointer:

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mil-65783

CJ Pony Parts sells a Ford-style 351C pointer too:

https://www.cjponyparts.com/engine-timing-pointer-351c-1970-1974/p/HW3106/

I can’t remember which kind of 351C pointer the Pantera used but I imagine either would work.

Mike

Sent from my iPad

On Apr 4, 2019, at 10:33, Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com<mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com>> wrote:

You might consider a billet steel flywheel, which will be somewhere between the aluminum and stock for rotating mass.

There are any number of aftermarket water pumps available with increased flow, some have the bypass some do not and I do not recall which currently, maybe you have that figured out only quoting Flowkooler and Edelbrock? Without the bypass the correct 351C thermostat with the hat and block off are redundant as no bypass can occur.
Scott at SACC Restorations also sells a water pump overdrive pulley that will increase flow by a further 11%.

I have heard good feedback on the Kevko oil pan, basically the same design and used to be about half the price of Aviaid or Armando, but in looking I see they are now $355 and you have to purchase the pickup separate for an additional $60.
https://kevkoracing.com/products/part-f602-400-m-ford-pantera-pan
FYI Aviaid/Armando Pantera pans no longer have an oil temperature bung standard, so if you want that capability be sure to call it out on ordering.

Stock 351C timing pointers were almost unobtainium for a while with only used ones occasionally coming up on eBay and selling for inflated prices, but I thought someone tooled up and is making them again? I don't believe they are Pantera specific, the crank pulley however is. When you do get a pointer don't rely on it and the harmonic balancer lining up at the mark when the engine is at TDC, do a physical check and if necessary re-mark or adjust the pointer. Taking the time to mark up the flywheel is also a time saver allowing checking timing via the hole in the ZF bellhousing.

Julian

________________________________
From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com>> on behalf of Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>>
Sent: Thursday, April 4, 2019 9:43 AM
To: Richard Greenblum
Cc: detomaso
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine Questions



> On Apr 4, 2019, at 09:24, Richard Greenblum <richard at richardgreenblum.com<mailto:richard at richardgreenblum.com>> wrote:
>
>   I'm at it with questions again...are 351C flywheels 164 tooth?

>>>Yes.

If you use a Fidanza flywheel they don’t countersink the pressure plate mounting bolts properly. That takes a few minutes with a drill press to resolve.

I have a Fidanza flywheel on my striker and it’s great but there are definite trade offs. It lurches and bucks in traffic requiring clutch slipping. Simply not enough flywheel effect. If you are going to spend much time at low speeds or in traffic you might be happier with a stock flywheel. Plus you already have one so there is a cost savings there.
>
>
> >  I'd like to know your experience/opinions on:
>
>
>   Water Pumps--Flowkooler vs. Edelbrock

>>>Both are fine. Flowkooler made in China, Edelbrock 100% US made in Torrance CA. I use Edelbrock.
>
> >  Oil Pans--Aviaid vs. Armando (Mike explained they're basically the same
>   with Armando having come from Aviaid, but I thought there was some
>   concern with the pan rails on Aramandos at one time)

>>>They are identical. Both have issues because they start off using cheap Chinese stock pans as cores, then cut them apart to customize them.
>
>
> >  Does anyone have a stock timing pointer they're willing to sell, or is
>   this a prayer at a junkyard item?  Trying to avoid having to take it
>   off the engine in the car...
>
> >>>I believe, but am not sure, that the Pantera pointer is Pantera-specific?  Others would know far more than I would about that.

Mike


>

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-------------- next part --------------
   Mike,

   It's not that first style.

   One can also support Tim Meyer and get a fancy billet one in the color
   of your choice for less than the big boys want for a pressed steel
   repop;

   [1]https://www.tmeyerinc.com/product/aeroflow-billet-timing-pointer-cle
   veland/

   Julian
     __________________________________________________________________

   From: Mike Drew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
   Sent: Thursday, April 4, 2019 11:19 AM
   To: Julian Kift
   Cc: Richard Greenblum; detomaso
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine Questions

   All,
   Here is one kind of stock timing pointer, available used here.
   [2]https://secure.cougarpartscatalog.com/store/p/15454-Timing-Pointer-3
   51C-Used-1973-Mercury-Cougar-/-1973-Ford-Mustang.html
   Miloden makes a 351C-specific pointer:
   [3]https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mil-65783
   CJ Pony Parts sells a Ford-style 351C pointer too:
   [4]https://www.cjponyparts.com/engine-timing-pointer-351c-1970-1974/p/H
   W3106/
   I can't remember which kind of 351C pointer the Pantera used but I
   imagine either would work.
   Mike
   Sent from my iPad
   On Apr 4, 2019, at 10:33, Julian Kift <[5]julian_kift at hotmail.com>
   wrote:

   You might consider a billet steel flywheel, which will be somewhere
   between the aluminum and stock for rotating mass.
   There are any number of aftermarket water pumps available with
   increased flow, some have the bypass some do not and I do not recall
   which currently, maybe you have that figured out only quoting
   Flowkooler and Edelbrock? Without the bypass the correct 351C
   thermostat with the hat and block off are redundant as no bypass can
   occur.
   Scott at SACC Restorations also sells a water pump overdrive pulley
   that will increase flow by a further 11%.
   I have heard good feedback on the Kevko oil pan, basically the same
   design and used to be about half the price of Aviaid or Armando, but in
   looking I see they are now $355 and you have to purchase the pickup
   separate for an additional $60.
   [6]https://kevkoracing.com/products/part-f602-400-m-ford-pantera-pan
   FYI Aviaid/Armando Pantera pans no longer have an oil temperature bung
   standard, so if you want that capability be sure to call it out on
   ordering.
   Stock 351C timing pointers were almost unobtainium for a while with
   only used ones occasionally coming up on eBay and selling for inflated
   prices, but I thought someone tooled up and is making them again? I
   don't believe they are Pantera specific, the crank pulley however is.
   When you do get a pointer don't rely on it and the harmonic balancer
   lining up at the mark when the engine is at TDC, do a physical check
   and if necessary re-mark or adjust the pointer. Taking the time to mark
   up the flywheel is also a time saver allowing checking timing via the
   hole in the ZF bellhousing.
   Julian
     __________________________________________________________________

   From: DeTomaso <[7]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
   of Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[8]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Sent: Thursday, April 4, 2019 9:43 AM
   To: Richard Greenblum
   Cc: detomaso
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine Questions

   > On Apr 4, 2019, at 09:24, Richard Greenblum
   <[9]richard at richardgreenblum.com> wrote:
   >
   >   I'm at it with questions again...are 351C flywheels 164 tooth?
   >>>Yes.
   If you use a Fidanza flywheel they don't countersink the pressure plate
   mounting bolts properly. That takes a few minutes with a drill press to
   resolve.
   I have a Fidanza flywheel on my striker and it's great but there are
   definite trade offs. It lurches and bucks in traffic requiring clutch
   slipping. Simply not enough flywheel effect. If you are going to spend
   much time at low speeds or in traffic you might be happier with a stock
   flywheel. Plus you already have one so there is a cost savings there.
   >
   >
   > >  I'd like to know your experience/opinions on:
   >
   >
   >   Water Pumps--Flowkooler vs. Edelbrock
   >>>Both are fine. Flowkooler made in China, Edelbrock 100% US made in
   Torrance CA. I use Edelbrock.
   >
   > >  Oil Pans--Aviaid vs. Armando (Mike explained they're basically the
   same
   >   with Armando having come from Aviaid, but I thought there was some
   >   concern with the pan rails on Aramandos at one time)
   >>>They are identical. Both have issues because they start off using
   cheap Chinese stock pans as cores, then cut them apart to customize
   them.
   >
   >
   > >  Does anyone have a stock timing pointer they're willing to sell,
   or is
   >   this a prayer at a junkyard item?  Trying to avoid having to take
   it
   >   off the engine in the car...
   >
   > >>>I believe, but am not sure, that the Pantera pointer is
   Pantera-specific?  Others would know far more than I would about that.
   Mike
   >
   _______________________________________________
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   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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   use the links above.
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   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.

References

   1. https://www.tmeyerinc.com/product/aeroflow-billet-timing-pointer-cleveland/
   2. https://secure.cougarpartscatalog.com/store/p/15454-Timing-Pointer-351C-Used-1973-Mercury-Cougar-/-1973-Ford-Mustang.html
   3. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mil-65783
   4. https://www.cjponyparts.com/engine-timing-pointer-351c-1970-1974/p/HW3106/
   5. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
   6. https://kevkoracing.com/products/part-f602-400-m-ford-pantera-pan
   7. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   8. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   9. mailto:richard at richardgreenblum.com
  10. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso

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