[DeTomaso] Trying to diagnose weak brakes

Mike & Elizabeth Thomas mbefthomas at comcast.net
Sat Feb 17 10:41:57 EST 2018


Thanks Chuck.  Seems I tried Speed Bleeders some years ago but couldn't
seems to get them to work properly (still have them in a box somewhere).
May not have been using them right.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: Charles Engles [mailto:cengles at cox.net] 
Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2018 6:19 AM
To: 'Joseph F. Byrd, Jr.' <byrdjf at embarqmail.com>; 'Mike & Elizabeth Thomas'
<mbefthomas at comcast.net>
Cc: 'List DeTomaso Forum' <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Trying to diagnose weak brakes

Dear Mike Thomas,


                   As you're working on the brake gremlin, I would suggest
SpeedBleeders for your calipers, if you don't already have them.   They make
brake bleeding a one-man minor task.  They do make them in the correct size
for the stock calipers, alas, I can't tell you what that is.


                                      Warmest regards,  Chuck Engles



-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
Of Joseph F. Byrd, Jr.
Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2018 8:14 AM
To: 'Mike & Elizabeth Thomas'
Cc: 'List DeTomaso Forum'
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Trying to diagnose weak brakes

My first thought would be the excessive "dead band" between the pressing the
pedal and calipers grabbing could be the initial travel of the booster rod
to contact the master piston.  air in the system would be the next thing

-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
Of Mike & Elizabeth Thomas
Sent: Friday, February 16, 2018 23:56 PM
To: 'Paul Timko'
Cc: 'List DeTomaso Forum'
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Trying to diagnose weak brakes

There is probably 3-4 inches of travel at the pedal on the first pump and no
change to the second or beyond.  It's hard after those 4-5 inches, does not
feel like it's bleeding down.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
Of Paul Timko
Sent: Friday, February 16, 2018 7:38 PM
Cc: List DeTomaso Forum <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Trying to diagnose weak brakes

How does the pedal feel with the engine off just sitting in the garage?
Does it take a lot of movement before it catches?  What about the second
pump?  The pedal should have no give after the first press. High and hard.

Paul #9270

On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 8:51 PM Mike & Elizabeth Thomas <
mbefthomas at comcast.net> wrote:

>    I've been working through trying to figure what seems like a weakness
>    in my brakes on 6328.
>
>
>    How do they feel now?  There seems like a fair bit of pedal travel
>    before they start to hook up.  Once they hook, they're fine when I'm
>    just in normal traffic and stop and go.  If I have to stomp down on
>    them, it just doesn't seem like they're biting very well.  If I have to
>    really stomp on them, I can't get any wheel to lock up at all.
>
>
>    Current setup:  the brakes are stock Girling, rebuild in 2004. they've
>    been fully bled at Les Schwab 6 months ago with DOT 3 (they wouldn't
>    use DOT 4 as it was not spec).  Yes, they were aware that there were
>    two nipples on the front, the tech that handled me has 2 or 3 Panteras
>    that come in through the year.  The flex lines were replaced with
>    stainless lines in 2004 when all of the calipers were rebuilt.  The
>    vacuum line from the engine to the tube and tube to booster is recent,
>    about 3-4 years ago.  So far as I know, the proportioning valve has
>    been gutted, but not really sure nor know how to be sure.  The master
>    is an early `80's GM/Cadillac replaced about 10 years ago, the same was
>    in the car when I bought it in `04.  I've just replaced the Porterfield
>    R4S pads.  It was rather cold day when I went out to burn them in so
>    first speculation is that they are not fully `seasoned'.  However, they
>    feel about the same as the previous 10-yr old R4S's, and that wouldn't
>    explain the pedal travel.  The booster is original so far as I know.
>
>
>    First question, how much pedal travel should there be before the pedal
>    feels resistance the brakes start to take up?
>
>
>    So, what else can I check/do out to figure out why my brakes seem so
>    lazy.  I will try to re-season them when the weather gets warmer, but
>    that won't deal with pedal travel.  When brake booster starts to fail,
>    how does that happen?  Gradually or all at once?
>
>
>    Your input is appreciated and eagerly awaited.  I'd like to get this
>    figgered before the season starts as everything else is running a well
>    as it ever has.
>
>
>    Thanks
>
>    Mike Thomas
>
>    Pres., Panteras Northwest
>
>    206-795-3302
>
>    Yellow '74 #6328
>
>    [1]www.panterasnorthwest.com
>
> References
>
>    1. http://www.panterasnorthwest.com/ 
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