[DeTomaso] NPC: Tesla in space

Larry-Ohio Time Corp Larry at ohiotimecorp.com
Tue Feb 13 08:45:33 EST 2018



So Paul are you saying my car,that is sitting in boxes, is as fast as your
car?

Larry (not) - Cleveland



-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
Of Paul Timko
Sent: February 12, 2018 10:59 PM
To: Email List Address For Posting
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] NPC: Tesla in space

The Tesla is orbiting the sun every 1.6 years.  My Pantera is orbiting the
sun once every year!  Which one is faster?

Paul #9270

On Mon, Feb 12, 2018 at 6:10 PM Jeff Detrich <jjdetrich at gmail.com> wrote:

>    "Billions of years from now, when our Sun has
>    A  A turned into a red giant and engulfed the Earth in nuclear fire,
>    the
>    A  A Pioneer, [2]Voyager, and [3]New Horizons probes will still be
>    traveling
>    A  A through our galaxy like a quintet of robotic Odysseus's."
>    I believe VGER will return us and will collect the Tesla on its way
>    back to save us
>    A from the Sun.
>    Live long and prosper.
>    Jeff
>    6559
>
>    On Mon, Feb 12, 2018 at 1:13 PM, Larry-Ohio Time Corp
>    <[1]Larry at ohiotimecorp.com> wrote:
>
>      A  A If the SpaceX [1]Falcon Heavy is the world's most powerful
>      rocket, then
>      A  A the Tesla Roadster that it shot into interplanetary space holds
>      the
>      A  A record for the fastest car in history. This cosmic convertible
>      will
>      A  A orbit around the Sun once every 1.6 years, but how long will it
>      A  A continue to do so, and what will be its fate? Will it still
>      look as
>      A  A pristine a billion years from now as it did in the videos
>      beamed back
>      A  A to Earth? Probably not.
>      A  A At the moment, there are five US spacecraft speeding out of our
>      Solar
>      A  A System, never to return. Billions of years from now, when our
>      Sun has
>      A  A turned into a red giant and engulfed the Earth in nuclear fire,
>      the
>      A  A Pioneer, [2]Voyager, and [3]New Horizons probes will still be
>      traveling
>      A  A through our galaxy like a quintet of robotic Odysseus's.
>      A  A Even back in our system and revolving about our Earth are
>      satellites
>      A  A that will still be around for many millions of years. For
>      example, one
>      A  A Earth-orbiting satellite, [4]LAGEOS-1, is a passive laser
>      reflector
>      A  A satellite that will not only remain circling our planet for 8.4
>      million
>      A  A years, but will remain functional for most of that time.
>      A  A With a track record like that, it looks as if the Tesla
>      Roadster that
>      A  A rocketed into space on February 6, 2018 will be cruising
>      happily among
>      A  A the stars as a permanent monument to the early days of
>      commercial deep
>      A  A space travel. It's a nice thought that the Starman mannequin
>      driver and
>      A  A his cherry red ride will still be around long after the
>      pyramids have
>      A  A crumbled to sand.
>      A  A Except that's not going to happen. In fact, the Starman and the
>      A  A Roadster are in for a very unpleasant time and may not be in
>      very good
>      A  A shape after a few years. And their lifespan, while huge by
>      human
>      A  A standards, may be rather limited.
>      A  A At the moment, the Falcon Heavy second stage and the Roadster
>      attached
>      A  A to it are in an orbit that [5]Jonathan McDowell of the
>      A  A Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics has recalculated
>      from Elon
>      A  A Musk's rather generous [6]rough estimate of a few hours after
>      liftoff.
>      A  A According to McDowell, the second stage is a Hohmann transfer
>      orbit,
>      A  A which is most economical orbit in terms of energy for going
>      from one
>      A  A place to another.
>      A  A Where Musk estimated that the second stage was circling the Sun
>      at a
>      A  A distance between 91 million mi (150 million km) and 240 million
>      mi (390
>      A  A million km) with an inclination of 29-o to the ecliptic,
>      McDowell
>      A  A calculates that its orbit is between 92 million mi (148 million
>      km) and
>      A  A 158 million mi (255 million km) with an inclination of 1.1-o
>      and a
>      A  A period of about 1.6 years. This puts its farthest distance from
>      the sun
>      A  A just beyond the orbit of Mars.
>      A  A The popular idea is that the Roadster will orbit the Sun for
>      hundreds
>      A  A of millions, if not billions of years, but that isn't the case.
>      The
>      A  A second stage and Roadster are now essentially a [7]near-Earth
>      A  A object (NEO), much like the asteroids that space agencies keep
>      an eye
>      A  A on just in case a large one is going to hit the Earth.
>      A  A One thing that marks NEOs is that they don't have very long
>      careers.
>      A  A They're interplanetary jaywalkers with all the hazards that
>      implies.
>      A  A Planets and asteroids in circular orbits stay out of each
>      other's way
>      A  A and are relatively stable, but NEOs, and the Roadster, are in
>      eccentric
>      A  A orbits that cross the orbits of the planets. This makes their
>      A  A trajectories very unstable.
>      A  A The second stage will cross the orbits of Earth and Mars and
>      its
>      A  A trajectory will certainly be perturbed by Jupiter's
>      gravitational
>      A  A field, so there is a small chance that it might strike Earth or
>      Mars
>      A  A many thousands of years from now, though it's so small that it
>      will
>      A  A burn up in the atmosphere. Another possibility is that it might
>      get
>      A  A flung out past Jupiter or inward past Venus. It might even be
>      propelled
>      A  A into the Sun, as happens to many near-Earth asteroids after a
>      few tens
>      A  A of millions of years. The orbital mechanics are very complex,
>      so it's
>      A  A difficult to predict, but the upshot is that the Roadster won't
>      be
>      A  A roaming the Solar System for as long as its neighbors.
>      A  A Another problem is that with the Roadster so close to the plane
>      of the
>      A  A ecliptic, it's in danger of being struck by cosmic debris.
>      There is a
>      A  A very small chance that it might be hit by a large object like
>      an
>      A  A asteroid, but the greater threat is from micrometeoroids, which
>      over
>      A  A the millennia will hit the car time and again. Each of these
>      will cause
>      A  A small and not-so-small amounts of damage, until it could one
>      day look
>      A  A like it's been shot at by a cannon filled with sand and gravel.
>      A  A But the much greater problem is that the Roadster isn't a
>      purpose-built
>      A  A spacecraft. It's a production electric car, which means it's as
>      A  A suitable for surviving the environment of space as a chocolate
>      Easter
>      A  A bunny in a convection oven.
>      A  A [8]The Roadster passing the terminator
>      A  A We're used to stories of interplanetary spacecraft functioning
>      long
>      A  A past the predicted end of their service life. Mars rovers
>      expected to
>      A  A operate for 90 days are still rolling after many years, and the
>      Voyager
>      A  A probes are still working 40 years after their launch. Even the
>      defunct
>      A  A machines, like the [9]Kepler Space Telescope, can be expected
>      to be
>      A  A around for many millions of years in a relatively intact
>      condition. Why
>      A  A not the roadster, then?
>      A  A The answer is very simple. Space engineers have spent decades
>      studying
>      A  A how to build spacecraft and especially which materials to build
>      them
>      A  A out of. They know which ones can withstand the extreme heat and
>      cold of
>      A  A space, the hard ultraviolet (UV) radiation, as well as the
>      X-rays,
>      A  A gamma rays, and cosmic rays that are constantly bombarding our
>      A  A technology outside the protection of Earth's atmosphere and Van
>      Allen
>      A  A belts.
>      A  A The Tesla Roadster, on the other hand, was designed to drive on
>      A  A Earthside roads, not galavant between the Earth and Mars. It
>      was made
>      A  A to be light and fast, and have good road handling. That may be
>      fine on
>      A  A the twisting roads of Italy, but the engineering that went into
>      the
>      A  A Roadster is now a positive detriment in space.
>      A  A The biggest problem is that the Roadster, and Starman, and made
>      up
>      A  A largely of rubber, plastics, and carbon composites, which
>      consist of
>      A  A long chain organic molecules that include epoxy resins,
>      polypropylene,
>      A  A polystyrene, polyvinyl chloride, nylon, and many others. These
>      make up
>      A  A the carbon composite car body, the fabrics in the interior, the
>      A  A cushions in the seats, electrical insulation, and a myriad of
>      A  A fasteners, fairings, and adhesive compounds. Starman and his
>      suit are
>      A  A made almost entirely out of organic polymers and even the
>      safety glass
>      A  A in the car's windscreen is a plastic laminate.
>      A  A IFRAME:
>      A  A [10][2]https://tpc.googlesyndication.com/safeframe/1-0-15/html/
>      container.h
>      A  A tml
>      A  A All of these, at this very moment, are being subjected to
>      dangerously
>      A  A high temperature variations as the sunlit areas heat to 260-o F
>      (127-o
>      A  A C) and the shaded areas plunging to -280-o F (-173-o C).
>      Fortunately,
>      A  A the second stage is slowly rotating, so the car is being evenly
>      baked
>      A  A like a rotisserie chicken, but as the vehicle orbits toward and
>      away
>      A  A from the Sun, it will produce strong thermal stresses that will
>      produce
>      A  A all manner of material fatigue. Also, the rotation means that
>      anything
>      A  A that comes loose can fly away.
>      A  A But the worst is all that radiation hitting those long polymer
>      chain
>      A  A molecules. As the rays strike, they will break down the
>      molecules bit
>      A  A by bit, converting them into free radicals. The same goes for
>      the
>      A  A pigments used to give the Roadster its red color. Eventually,
>      the car
>      A  A will become bleached, then everything made of polymers will
>      A  A disintegrate and crumble into dust.
>      A  A It's all happened before and it doesn't take very long. If you
>      look at
>      A  A pictures of the old Apollo moon missions of the late 1960s and
>      early
>      A  A 70s, you'll be familiar with the images of spacesuited American
>      A  A astronauts saluting the [11]flag and the Lunar Module wrapped
>      in gold
>      A  A Mylar foil to keep it cool under the harsh lunar sun. If you
>      were to go
>      A  A back to those landing sites, you'd find the flag poles empty
>      and the
>      A  A descent stage of the module largely unclad because half a
>      century of
>      A  A radiation has done its work.
>      A  A So what will the Tesla Roadster look like in a couple of
>      centuries? The
>      A  A most obvious thing will be that the carbon composite body will
>      be gone
>      A  A as the epoxy resins have all broken down and the carbon fibers
>      fallen
>      A  A apart. The rubber tires on the wheels won't be there either.
>      A  A Many other bits will have come loose as the adhesives turned
>      brittle
>      A  A and ceased to stick. Even the windscreen will have a yellowy
>      opaque
>      A  A look, provided the laminate hasn't failed completely or a
>      meteoroid
>      A  A hasn't slammed into it. In the cockpit, Starman is now reduced
>      to a few
>      A  A metal joints. The seats are bare metal frames with the fabric
>      covers
>      A  A now powder, and the foam rubber cushions long gone.
>      A  A Other materials in the car will also suffer over time. Any
>      lubricants
>      A  A will have frozen or boiled away. Those that remain will degrade
>      like
>      A  A the plastics, turning into a brittle mess. If any graphite was
>      used for
>      A  A lubricant, the water molecules that make graphite powder
>      slippery will
>      A  A evaporate and the carbon molecules left behind will now have
>      the
>      A  A property of jeweler's polish.
>      A  A It's very likely that the 6,831 lithium-ion cells that powered
>      the
>      A  A Roadster will have been removed before leaving Earth. The FAA
>      probably
>      A  A wouldn't have been too happy about 700 lb (317 kg) of
>      fire-prone
>      A  A batteries sitting atop the Falcon Heavy, turning into a very
>      large
>      A  A bomb. However, there was a battery aboard to run the cameras
>      that
>      A  A beamed back video to Earth. That battery may, depending on its
>      design,
>      A  A start to generate gas and may one day explode. Meanwhile, the
>      A  A electronics used to transmit video will very soon be fried by
>      the
>      A  A radiation as the delicate micro circuits are destroyed bit by
>      bit.
>      A  A Even the metals in the car will be affected. The roadster uses
>      advanced
>      A  A alloys - some of which might start to outgas. Radiation will
>      eventually
>      A  A affect the crystalline structure of the alloys and may give
>      them a
>      A  A patina, such as is sometimes found on metallic objects in very
>      dry
>      A  A deserts. Over millions of years, some may become brittle. Some
>      may
>      A  A develop something similar to tin pest, where tin alters its
>      structure
>      A  A at very low temperatures and appears to rot.
>      A  A In the end, if some distant future expedition does retrieve the
>      A  A Roadster, it will be in a sorry state - a battered, bare metal
>      frame
>      A  A with a few pockets of organic chemical dust. But maybe that
>      won't be so
>      A  A bad. Maybe it will give it the right air of romance, like the
>      Parthenon
>      A  A or Stonehenge. Or maybe it will be regarded as a challenge by
>      the
>      A  A finders, who may embark on the greatest car restoration project
>      in
>      A  A history.
>      A  A Let's hope they get the paint job right.
>      A  A  Larry (too used for me) - Cleveland
>      References
>      A  A Visible links
>      A  A 1. [3]https://newatlas.com/falcon-heavy-launch/53258/
>      A  A 2. [4]https://newatlas.com/voyager-40th-anniversary-
>      retrospective-gallery/50744/
>      A  A 3. [5]https://newatlas.com/new-horizons-pluto-flyby-nasa/34777/
>      A  A 4. [6]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LAGEOS
>      A  A 5. [7]https://mobile.twitter.com/planet4589/status/
>      961394843648954368
>      A  A 6. [8]https://newatlas.com/spacex-
>      images-starman-asteroid/53301/
>      A  A 7. [9]http://www.science20.com/robert_walker/will_elon_musks_
>      cherry_red_tesla_roadster_orbit_for_a_billion_years_
>      falcon_heavy_test_launch-230358
>      A  A 8. javascript:void(0)
>      A  A 9. [10]https://newatlas.com/kepler-
>      recovery-emergency-mode/42756/
>      A  10. [11]https://tpc.googlesyndication.com/safeframe/1-0-15/html/
>      container.html
>      A  11. [12]https://newatlas.com/apollo-moon-flags-standing/23523/
>      A  A Hidden links:
>      A  13. javascript:void(0)
>      A  14. javascript:void(0)
>      A  15. javascript:void(0)
>      A  16. javascript:void(0)
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> References
>
>    1. mailto:Larry at ohiotimecorp.com
>    2. https://tpc.googlesyndication.com/safeframe/1-0-15/html/container.h
>    3. https://newatlas.com/falcon-heavy-launch/53258/
>    4.
> https://newatlas.com/voyager-40th-anniversary-retrospective-gallery/50744/
>    5. https://newatlas.com/new-horizons-pluto-flyby-nasa/34777/
>    6. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LAGEOS
>    7. https://mobile.twitter.com/planet4589/status/961394843648954368
>    8. https://newatlas.com/spacex-images-starman-asteroid/53301/
>    9.
>
http://www.science20.com/robert_walker/will_elon_musks_cherry_red_tesla_road
ster_orbit_for_a_billion_years_falcon_heavy_test_launch-230358
>   10. https://newatlas.com/kepler-recovery-emergency-mode/42756/
>   11.
> https://tpc.googlesyndication.com/safeframe/1-0-15/html/container.html
>   12. https://newatlas.com/apollo-moon-flags-standing/23523/
>   13. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>   14. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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