[DeTomaso] Fwd: Re: Engine gaskets
Dave Londry
davel at emspace.com
Mon Oct 2 15:48:01 EDT 2017
It's Kevco Racing from Minnesota Charles.
30 odd years of making pans for circle-track, dirt track, sprint and so on.
They know a lot about controlling oil.
They make about 10 302/Windsor pans and about 9 Cleveland pans including:
F602-400M Pantera
pan $325.00 pickup$35.00
Dave
On 02/10/2017 1:13 AM, Charles McCall wrote:
> Who makes your 8qt pan? I have an Aviad...
>
> On Sun, Oct 1, 2017 at 8:32 PM, Dave Londry <davel at emspace.com
> <mailto:davel at emspace.com>> wrote:
>
> I've found the Ford pan isn't too bad to get seated.
> My 8 quart pan is very, very difficult.
>
> dave
>
>
> On 01/10/2017 12:39 AM, Jack DeRyke via DeTomaso wrote:
>
> Most 351-C rear main seals can be r & r-ed with the engine & ZF in
> place. First the pan must come off, then the rear main cap.
> Half the
> seal will be in the cap and can be popped out immediately.
> Slacking off
> the #4, #3 and #2 main cap bolts a turn or two will allow the
> crank to
> sag down a little even with the ZF in place. If it doesn't sag
> enough,
> reach up and pull down on it. The upper seal-half in the block
> can then
> be progressively tapped out using a curved plastic or wood
> pusher-stick
> so you don't scar up the rear crank journal. Once its out a ways,
> careful pulling with pliers will remove it. Oil up a new
> seal-half and
> tap it back in place, leaving one end out about 1/8" or so with the
> other seal-half mirror-imaged in the cap. This is so you can
> add a dab
> of silicone on the seal ends. And don't forget to torque all those
> loose main cap bolts. Can't remember if your car has a
> Cleveland or a
> Windsor, but the job is the same with either engine.
> But unless you are really lucky or skillful, your biggest
> problem will
> be the pan seals. With the engine in place in a Pantera, its
> darn near
> impossible to get the pan gaskets & pan seals to index
> properly, get a
> dab of silicone on each of the 4 ends and wrestle the pan in
> place and
> have everything stay there while you get a couple of bolts
> started. So
> you wind up with pan leaks maybe worse than what you had to
> start with.
> That's why most guys pull the engine and ZF, clean everything
> up and
> reassemble while not having oil dripping in your face.
> Before signing up for all this, simply try re-torquing the pan
> bolts.
> Its surprising how many leaks come from pan gaskets simply
> shrinking
> from heat or age, or getting over-compressed, leading to loose pan
> bolts, then leaks. USE A TORQUE WRENCH- one in inch-pounds is
> best. The
> little pan bolts are absurdly easy to snap off when tightening
> by eye.
> Don't ask how I found this out.... A broken pan bolt can be removed
> with the engine & pan still in place but it takes specialized
> equipment, patience and skill- which I also found. Far better
> to not
> overtighten & snap one (or more) off.
> Good luck, Charlie- J DeRyke
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Thomas TAP:rnblom [1]<tipo874 at gmail.com
> <mailto:tipo874 at gmail.com>>
> To: Mike Drew [2]<MikeLDrew at aol.com <mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com>>
> Cc: detomaso [3]<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>>
> Sent: Sat, Sep 30, 2017 12:06 pm
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine gaskets
> You need to remove the rear main cap to get half of the seal
> out, but
> then you still have the other half to worry about. Not sure if
> you can
> slide that out with the crank in place.
> Thomas
> > 30 sep. 2017 kl. 20:43 skrev Mike Drew via DeTomaso
> [4]<[1]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>>:
> >
> > Charlie,
> >
> > Many are smarter than I in this department (line forms to the
> left).
> But I'm pretty certain you can replace the rear main seal with the
> engine in place. Gotta pull the gearbox, clutch and flywheel,
> and drop
> the oil pan down a few inches, and then you can get to it.
> >
> > Others back me up or tell me I'm FOS please! :)
> >
> > If that's your only problem, fix your only problem. :)
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Sep 30, 2017, at 13:09, Charles McCall
> [5]<[2]charlesmccall at gmail.com
> <mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi all
> >>
> >> For several years now, my Pantera has gone "marking its
> territory"
> by
> >> leaving engine oil where it goes. It doesn't leak a LOT, but
> it does
> >> leak. Roland Jaeckel thinks it is coming from the rear main
> seal,
> but
> >> the only real way to be sure is to pull the engine and open
> things
> up.
> >>
> >>
> >> If I'm going to pull the engine, I'm thinking of replacing
> all the
> >> gaskets except the head gasket and valve cover gaskets
> (those are
> >> relatively new and get checked regularly). The gaskets were
> installed
> >> in 2000, and I've done quite a few miles since then. Is a
> gasket a
> >> gasket, or are there manufacturers to avoid? I'd like to do this
> only
> >> once...
> >>
> >> Something like this?
> >>
> >>
>
> [1][3][6]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B>
> 01N
> >>
>
> 0HDAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=engine+gasket+
> >> 351C
> >>
> >>
> >> Has some things I won't need... any other suggestions?
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks all
> >>
> >> References
> >>
> >> 1.
>
> [4][7]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N>
>
> 0HDAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=engine+gasket+
> 351C
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> 2. [15]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
> <mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>
> 3.
> [16]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N>
> 4.
> [17]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N0H
> DAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=engine+gasket+351C
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N0H%0ADAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=engine+gasket+351C>
> 5. [18]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> 6. [19]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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> 1. mailto:tipo874 at gmail.com <mailto:tipo874 at gmail.com>
> 2. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com <mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com>
> 3. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> 4. mailto:[1]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> 5. mailto:[2]charlesmccall at gmail.com
> <mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>
> 6.
> https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B>
> 7.
> https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N>
> 8. mailto:5 <mailto:5>]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> 9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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> 10. mailto:7 <mailto:7>]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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> 13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> <http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso>
> 14. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> 15. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com <mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>
> 16.
> https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N>
> 17.
> https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N0HDAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=engine+gasket+351C
> <https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-Ford/dp/B01N0HDAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=engine+gasket+351C>
> 18. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> <mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
> 19. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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> 20. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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> 22. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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-------------- next part --------------
It's Kevco Racing from Minnesota Charles.
30 odd years of making pans for circle-track, dirt track, sprint and so
on.
They know a lot about controlling oil.
They make about 10 302/Windsor pans and about 9 Cleveland pans
including:
F602-400M Pantera
pan $325.00 pickup$35.00
Dave
On 02/10/2017 1:13 AM, Charles McCall wrote:
Who makes your 8qt pan? I have an Aviad...
On Sun, Oct 1, 2017 at 8:32 PM, Dave Londry <[1]davel at emspace.com>
wrote:
I've found the Ford pan isn't too bad to get seated.
My 8 quart pan is very, very difficult.
dave
On 01/10/2017 12:39 AM, Jack DeRyke via DeTomaso wrote:
Most 351-C rear main seals can be r & r-ed with the engine & ZF in
place. First the pan must come off, then the rear main cap. Half the
seal will be in the cap and can be popped out immediately. Slacking
off
the #4, #3 and #2 main cap bolts a turn or two will allow the crank
to
sag down a little even with the ZF in place. If it doesn't sag
enough,
reach up and pull down on it. The upper seal-half in the block can
then
be progressively tapped out using a curved plastic or wood
pusher-stick
so you don't scar up the rear crank journal. Once its out a ways,
careful pulling with pliers will remove it. Oil up a new seal-half
and
tap it back in place, leaving one end out about 1/8" or so with the
other seal-half mirror-imaged in the cap. This is so you can add a
dab
of silicone on the seal ends. And don't forget to torque all those
loose main cap bolts. Can't remember if your car has a Cleveland or
a
Windsor, but the job is the same with either engine.
But unless you are really lucky or skillful, your biggest problem
will
be the pan seals. With the engine in place in a Pantera, its darn
near
impossible to get the pan gaskets & pan seals to index properly, get
a
dab of silicone on each of the 4 ends and wrestle the pan in place
and
have everything stay there while you get a couple of bolts started.
So
you wind up with pan leaks maybe worse than what you had to start
with.
That's why most guys pull the engine and ZF, clean everything up and
reassemble while not having oil dripping in your face.
Before signing up for all this, simply try re-torquing the pan
bolts.
Its surprising how many leaks come from pan gaskets simply shrinking
from heat or age, or getting over-compressed, leading to loose pan
bolts, then leaks. USE A TORQUE WRENCH- one in inch-pounds is best.
The
little pan bolts are absurdly easy to snap off when tightening by
eye.
Don't ask how I found this out.... A broken pan bolt can be removed
with the engine & pan still in place but it takes specialized
equipment, patience and skill- which I also found. Far better to not
overtighten & snap one (or more) off.
Good luck, Charlie- J DeRyke
-----Original Message-----
From: Thomas TAP:rnblom [1]<[2]tipo874 at gmail.com>
To: Mike Drew [2]<[3]MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Cc: detomaso [3]<[4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Sat, Sep 30, 2017 12:06 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine gaskets
You need to remove the rear main cap to get half of the seal out,
but
then you still have the other half to worry about. Not sure if
you can
slide that out with the crank in place.
Thomas
> 30 sep. 2017 kl. 20:43 skrev Mike Drew via DeTomaso
[4]<[1][5]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>:
>
> Charlie,
>
> Many are smarter than I in this department (line forms to the
left).
But I'm pretty certain you can replace the rear main seal with
the
engine in place. Gotta pull the gearbox, clutch and flywheel, and
drop
the oil pan down a few inches, and then you can get to it.
>
> Others back me up or tell me I'm FOS please! :)
>
> If that's your only problem, fix your only problem. :)
>
> Mike
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 30, 2017, at 13:09, Charles McCall
[5]<[2][6]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all
>>
>> For several years now, my Pantera has gone "marking its
territory"
by
>> leaving engine oil where it goes. It doesn't leak a LOT, but
it does
>> leak. Roland Jaeckel thinks it is coming from the rear main
seal,
but
>> the only real way to be sure is to pull the engine and open
things
up.
>>
>>
>> If I'm going to pull the engine, I'm thinking of replacing all
the
>> gaskets except the head gasket and valve cover gaskets (those
are
>> relatively new and get checked regularly). The gaskets were
installed
>> in 2000, and I've done quite a few miles since then. Is a
gasket a
>> gasket, or are there manufacturers to avoid? I'd like to do
this
only
>> once...
>>
>> Something like this?
>>
>>
[1][3][6][7]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-
1970-1982-Ford/dp/B
01N
>>
0HDAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=
engine+gasket+
>> 351C
>>
>>
>> Has some things I won't need... any other suggestions?
>>
>>
>> Thanks all
>>
>> References
>>
>> 1.
[4][7][8]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-
1982-Ford/dp/B01N
0HDAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=
engine+gasket+
351C
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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References
1. [14]mailto:[15]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
2. [15]mailto:[16]charlesmccall at gmail.com
3. [16][17]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-
1982-Ford/dp/B01N
4. [17][18]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-
1982-Ford/dp/B01N0H
DAB5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1506794131&sr=8-1&keywords=
engine+gasket+351C
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4. mailto:[1][30]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. mailto:[2][31]charlesmccall at gmail.com
6. [32]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-
Ford/dp/B
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16. [45]https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Overhaul-Gasket-1970-1982-
Ford/dp/B01N
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