[DeTomaso] Question re: push button or earliest Pantera mufflers

MikeLDrew at aol.com MikeLDrew at aol.com
Sat Apr 22 06:41:29 EDT 2017


In a message dated 4/21/17 10 01 9, mghibli7 at hotmail.com writes:


Can anybody tell me if the exhaust system that came on the very first 
panteras had a different muffler hanger system?

>>>This took a little research.   Yes, as it turns out, the very first 
series of mufflers used a different attachment system.   I don't believe any of 
these were found on USA cars, i.e. they are only on pre-USA European 
pushbutton cars.   Instead of a flat tab welded to one corner of the muffler where 
it joins the pipe, there were a pair of tabs welded to the pipe itself.   
This was probably a very poor setup and done away with almost immediately.   
Looking at your photos, I can't see any evidence of any tab mounted in the 
corner of the muffler can?

Can you see any evidence of a pair of vertical tabs broken off from the 
pipe a few inches ahead of the muffler can?

Here is a diagram of what I *think* you have:

http://www.panterasbywilkinson.com/2016/ill17e.html

This is what the early 1971 USA mufflers looked like:

http://www.panterasbywilkinson.com/2016/ill17d.html

>My cars have all been '73/'74 but among the parts I got with one car was 
an Ansa muffler that doesn't have the L bracket welded to the muffler and 
pipe. I'm wondering if the very first Panteras came with some sort of clamp 
type mount that attached around the pipe rather than the bracket that is welded 
to the pipe and muffler.

>>>Apparently it was a couple of vertical tabs.

>Aside from that the muffler seems to be slightly smaller than the later 
ones.

>>>Yes, the first and second series mufflers were very small.   There is an 
error in the USA De Tomaso parts book, which lists physical dimensions for 
the first and second series that are different from one another.   In fact, 
the first and second series were exactly the same, but the third series used 
a much larger muffler can.   The European parts book shows this more 
clearly.   Those were used on only a few hundred cars in the late 1971/early 1972 
timeframe, before the 'standard' muffler was introduced.   (There are no 
mentions of the size of the standard muffler in any of the parts books).

>That being said, I have this one right side I don't need if anybody is 
looking for one or would like it.

While not perfect, as it has some pitting on the chrome, and what appears 
to be shelf wear on the wrinkle finish, it is in very good condition. I don't 
think has ever been mounted on a car, but if it was, it was only for a very 
short time. It also doesn't look like it was ever modified, the wrinkle 
finish paint is consistent throughout.

>>>It's certainly an interesting curio--it's too bad you don't have a pair 
to offer up, as they are very difficult to find, and a key part of a proper 
restoration for a pushbutton or early 1971 Pantera!

Mike
-------------- next part --------------
   In a message dated 4/21/17 10 01 9, mghibli7 at hotmail.com writes:
   Can anybody tell me if the exhaust system that came on the very first
   panteras had a different muffler hanger system?
   >>>This took a little research.  Yes, as it turns out, the very first
   series of mufflers used a different attachment system.  I don't believe
   any of these were found on USA cars, i.e. they are only on pre-USA
   European pushbutton cars.  Instead of a flat tab welded to one corner
   of the muffler where it joins the pipe, there were a pair of tabs
   welded to the pipe itself.  This was probably a very poor setup and
   done away with almost immediately.  Looking at your photos, I can't see
   any evidence of any tab mounted in the corner of the muffler can?
   Can you see any evidence of a pair of vertical tabs broken off from the
   pipe a few inches ahead of the muffler can?
   Here is a diagram of what I *think* you have:
   http://www.panterasbywilkinson.com/2016/ill17e.html
   This is what the early 1971 USA mufflers looked like:
   http://www.panterasbywilkinson.com/2016/ill17d.html
   >My cars have all been '73/'74 but among the parts I got with one car
   was an Ansa muffler that doesn't have the L bracket welded to the
   muffler and pipe. I'm wondering if the very first Panteras came with
   some sort of clamp type mount that attached around the pipe rather than
   the bracket that is welded to the pipe and muffler.
   >>>Apparently it was a couple of vertical tabs.
   >Aside from that the muffler seems to be slightly smaller than the
   later ones.
   >>>Yes, the first and second series mufflers were very small.  There is
   an error in the USA De Tomaso parts book, which lists physical
   dimensions for the first and second series that are different from one
   another.  In fact, the first and second series were exactly the same,
   but the third series used a much larger muffler can.  The European
   parts book shows this more clearly.  Those were used on only a few
   hundred cars in the late 1971/early 1972 timeframe, before the
   'standard' muffler was introduced.  (There are no mentions of the size
   of the standard muffler in any of the parts books).
   >That being said, I have this one right side I don't need if anybody is
   looking for one or would like it.
   While not perfect, as it has some pitting on the chrome, and what
   appears to be shelf wear on the wrinkle finish, it is in very good
   condition. I don't think has ever been mounted on a car, but if it was,
   it was only for a very short time. It also doesn't look like it was
   ever modified, the wrinkle finish paint is consistent throughout.
   >>>It's certainly an interesting curio--it's too bad you don't have a
   pair to offer up, as they are very difficult to find, and a key part of
   a proper restoration for a pushbutton or early 1971 Pantera!
   Mike


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