[DeTomaso] DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
jderyke at aol.com
jderyke at aol.com
Mon Nov 14 14:39:02 EST 2016
In some cases, adding 10% alcohol into your gas tank causes emissions to improve. Make sure the tank is no more than half full before adding a quart or two of alky. A dirty air filter will always cause the engine to run rich. And a smoking-hot engine tests better than a moderately warmed-up engine. Finally, retarding the ignition a few degrees (not too much) sometimes helps. You can reset it later. Good luck, Charlie- J Deryke
-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-request <detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com>
To: detomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Mon, Nov 14, 2016 9:00 am
Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
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Daily Detomaso List Digest
Today's Topics:
1. Today's revelation - air is good (Charles McCall)
2. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
(Mike Reilly)
3. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
(Pantdino)
4. Re: Today's revelation - air is good (Will Kooiman)
5. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
(Richard Greenblum)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 18:33:23 +0100
From: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
To: "Detomaso Email List" <detomaso at detomasolist.com>
Subject: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
Message-ID: <000601d23dd4$096571d0$1c305570$@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all
I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say that I
have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is more than 15
years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember rinsing it once with a
garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of the filter was more or less
what one would expect if one had never followed the cleaning instructions.
Several mice families will have to find new homes I think!
I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the carb
(:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't breathe
before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance. The last few
times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to warm up - even
after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold and a little rough.
Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles. I could feel a difference.
No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct, Will,
not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
-------------- next part --------------
Hi all
I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of
the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have to
find new homes I think!
I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to
warm up - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles...
I could feel a difference.
No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 20:05:18 +0000
From: Mike Reilly <reillyms at live.com>
To: marshallgsmith <marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, Mike Drew
<MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Message-ID:
<MWHPR13MB180819E0A07EB284DFA9BA93BABD0 at MWHPR13MB1808.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just replace it each year and really don?t feel it impacts my engine performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: marshallgsmith<mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: Mike Drew<mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com>; Charles McCall<mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com><mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>" <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust, driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc. Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: s?bado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> http://w7tsc.org
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb -
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be happy to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing. Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
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>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com>
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date: 11/12/16
> _______________________________________________
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-------------- next part --------------
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: [1]marshallgsmith
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
Cc: [4]<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso [[5]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take
it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [6]http://w7tsc.org
> [7]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> [8]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>>
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
>>> the links above.
>>>
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
any
>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> [9]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
> the links above.
>>
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
any
> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
approve
> the archiving of list messages.
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [10]www.avg.com
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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>
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
use
> the links above.
>
> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
approve
> the archiving of list messages.
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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use the links above.
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list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
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_______________________________________________
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To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
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References
1. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
2. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
3. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
6. http://w7tsc.org/
7. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
8. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
10. http://www.avg.com/
11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
12. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 21:20:10 -0500
From: Pantdino <pantdino at aol.com>
To: charlesmccall at gmail.com
Cc: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Message-ID: <15860a277be-3121-1de2 at webprd-m33.mail.aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
I have them tell me when it almost my turn and run the car around he block in first gear so it can then go into the test bay
Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
On Saturday, November 12, 2016, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
OK, thanks. It's very helpful to understand the theory - now I have a
problem in applying it. I have a nice, 20 minute highway drive to the
testing station, but the only way to reach the sniffer is to get in
line and wait.
Yesterday was very frustrating - typically the wait is 10-15 minutes,
and I don't know what happened yesterday but the wait was horrible. I
knew that a cold engine was a problem so I kept the engine running.
It's cold here in November, and 45 minutes with the engine shut off
would mean a fairly cold block.
I wonder which is worse - shutting the engine off (cold engine but
without all the carbon/etc) or letting it idle (warm engine but carbon)
The wait isn't something I can control. Would just revving the heck out
of the engine before entering the test bay help blow the cobwebs out?
From: Asa Jay Laughton [mailto:asajay at asajay.com]
Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 20:53
To: Charles McCall
Cc: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
No Charlie, you misunderstand...
An engine IDLED for 45 minutes is nearly guaranteed to FAIL. It will
be so loaded with carbon it can't possibly pass, no matter how "warmed
up it is."
You need to be DRIVING it for 45 minutes and immediately test it. It
needs to be taken through the gears, engine rpms taken high,..... Blow
out the cobwebs, the carbon build-up, etc. Then test. If you idle for
any length of time waiting in line... rinse and repeat. Do NOT spend
time idling in line, it will kill your test.
Asa
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
Charles McCall <[1]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you to all who answered.
I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but I
can
let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The lines
tend
to be pretty long where I go anyway...
I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and therefore
we
should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a little
for
the test.
I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
- neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
the current settings can work.
I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc. Tomorrow
it's
supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air cleaner
removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
Thanks again!
-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [[2]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
Behalf
Of Asa Jay Laughton
Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
To: [3]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take it
for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the emissions
tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
Asa
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************
[4]http://w7tsc.org
[5]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>
> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>
> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
> good cleaning.
>
> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
> pass.
>
> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
> <[6]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
> [7]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi all
>>
>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
due
>> to two points:
>>
>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>
>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
limit
>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>
>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
to
>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
forum
>> J
>>
>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>
>>
>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>> here.
>>
>>
>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>> all!
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> [8]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> [9]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
>> the links above.
>>
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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> DeTomaso mailing list
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>
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
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the archiving of list messages.
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - [12]www.avg.com
> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
>
>
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References
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2. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
3. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
4. http://w7tsc.org/
5. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
6. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com%20on%20behalf%20of%0b
7. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
8. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
10. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
12. http://www.avg.com/
13. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
14. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
15. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
16. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:41:21 -0500
From: Will Kooiman <will.kooiman at gmail.com>
To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: Detomaso Email List <detomaso at detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
Message-ID: <9C7A3F8F-21AE-48B4-BB53-9A5B268B1A02 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Good catch on the air filter.
Regarding CO, my understanding is to lean it out with the idle screws. This increases NOx, but reduces CO.
That's why your CO levels were so high with a dirty filter. It's too rich.
Or, just tune the idle screws for highest idle vacuum. That's where you get the best performance and you'll probably pass too.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Nov 13, 2016, at 12:33 PM, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi all
>
>
> I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
> that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
> more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
> rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of
> the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
> followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have to
> find new homes I think!
>
>
> I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
> wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
> carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
> breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
> The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to
> warm up - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
> and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles...
> I could feel a difference.
>
>
> No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
> Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
>
> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:18:01 -0600
From: Richard Greenblum <Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
To: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Message-ID: <D44F30A2.536CD%Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway. A long time ago I bought
into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera. Never
noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car. When my
K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing and re-oiling,
I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be an IMSA car crew
chief about them. He said stop screwing with it, you?re better off with a
quality paper filter.
Richard
Austin, TX
From: DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Mike
Reilly <reillyms at live.com>
Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
To: marshallgsmith <marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
<MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>" <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: [1]marshallgsmith
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
Cc: [4]<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso [[5]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take
it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [6]http://w7tsc.org
> [7]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> [8]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>>
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
>>> the links above.
>>>
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
any
>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> [9]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
> the links above.
>>
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
any
> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
approve
> the archiving of list messages.
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [10]www.avg.com
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> [11]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
use
> the links above.
>
> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
approve
> the archiving of list messages.
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> [12]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
use the links above.
>
> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
or approve the archiving of list messages.
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DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
[13]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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References
1. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
2. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
3. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
6. http://w7tsc.org/
7. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
8. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
10. http://www.avg.com/
11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
12. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
_______________________________________________
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-------------- next part --------------
I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway. A long time ago I
bought into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera.
Never noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car.
When my K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing
and re-oiling, I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be
an IMSA car crew chief about them. He said stop screwing with it,
you're better off with a quality paper filter.
Richard
Austin, TX
From: DeTomaso <[1]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
of Mike Reilly <[2]reillyms at live.com>
Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
To: marshallgsmith <[3]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
<[4]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <[5]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[6]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[7]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I
just
replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep
it
simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: [1]marshallgsmith
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
Cc: [4]<[8]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
car
does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts
air
flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[9]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <[10]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[12]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing
the
test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are
how-to
videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and
re-oil
with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall
<[13]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting,
it
would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay,
but
I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with
the
timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to
believe
that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really,
really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the
dust,
driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough
to
make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso
[[5][14]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: [15]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not
overheating). Take
it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You
get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a
while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [6][16]http://w7tsc.org
> [7][17]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the
carb
-
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking
it
back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and
tune
it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <[18]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> [19]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a
few
weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to
be
able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high.
The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N.
I
seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest
at
idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass
the
test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a
public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed
chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a
massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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>>
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>>
>>
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>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [10]www.avg.com
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
> _______________________________________________
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>
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References
1. [30]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
2. [31]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
3. [32]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
4. [33]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. [34]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
6. [35]http://w7tsc.org/
7. [36]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
8. [37]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
9. [38]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
10. [39]http://www.avg.com/
11. [40]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
12. [41]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
13. [42]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
_______________________________________________
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References
1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
2. mailto:reillyms at live.com
3. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
4. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
5. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
6. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
7. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
8. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
9. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
10. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
11. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
12. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
13. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
14. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
15. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
16. http://w7tsc.org/
17. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
18. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
19. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
20. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
21. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
22. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
23. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
24. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
25. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
26. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
27. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
28. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
29. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
30. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
31. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
32. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
33. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
34. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
35. http://w7tsc.org/
36. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
37. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
38. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
39. http://www.avg.com/
40. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
41. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
42. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
43. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
44. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
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------------------------------
End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
*****************************************
-------------- next part --------------
In some cases, adding 10% alcohol into your gas tank causes emissions
to improve. Make sure the tank is no more than half full before adding
a quart or two of alky. A dirty air filter will always cause the engine
to run rich. And a smoking-hot engine tests better than a moderately
warmed-up engine. Finally, retarding the ignition a few degrees (not
too much) sometimes helps. You can reset it later. Good luck, Charlie-
J Deryke
-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-request <detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com>
To: detomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Mon, Nov 14, 2016 9:00 am
Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to
[1]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
detomaso-[4]owner at server.detomasolist.com
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..."
Daily Detomaso List Digest
Today's Topics:
1. Today's revelation - air is good (Charles McCall)
2. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
(Mike Reilly)
3. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
(Pantdino)
4. Re: Today's revelation - air is good (Will Kooiman)
5. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
(Richard Greenblum)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 18:33:23 +0100
From: Charles McCall <[5]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
To: "Detomaso Email List" <[6]detomaso at detomasolist.com>
Subject: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
Message-ID: <000601d23dd4$096571d0$1c305570$@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all
I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
that I
have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is more than
15
years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember rinsing it once
with a
garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of the filter was more or
less
what one would expect if one had never followed the cleaning
instructions.
Several mice families will have to find new homes I think!
I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
carb
(:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
breathe
before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance. The last
few
times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to warm up -
even
after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold and a little
rough.
Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles. I could feel a
difference.
No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
Will,
not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
-------------- next part --------------
Hi all
I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of
the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have to
find new homes I think!
I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to
warm up - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles...
I could feel a difference.
No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 20:05:18 +0000
From: Mike Reilly <[7]reillyms at live.com>
To: marshallgsmith <[8]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, Mike Drew
<[9]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <[10]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[12]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Message-ID:
<[13]MWHPR13MB180819E0A07EB284DFA9BA93BABD0 at MWHPR13MB1808.namprd13.prod
.outlook.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
replace it each year and really don?t feel it impacts my engine
performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: marshallgsmith<[14]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: Mike Drew<[15]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com>; Charles
McCall<[16]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc:
<[17]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com><[18]mailto:detomaso at server.detom
asolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[19]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <[20]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[21]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[22]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <[23]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso [[24]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: s?bado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: [25]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [26]http://w7tsc.org
> [27]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <detomaso-[28]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> [29]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be happy
to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing. Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
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>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [34]www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com>
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
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-------------- next part --------------
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: [1]marshallgsmith
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
Cc: [4]<[41]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[42]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <[43]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[44]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[45]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <[46]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso
[[5][47]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: [48]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take
it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [6][49]http://w7tsc.org
> [7][50]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <detomaso-[51]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> [52]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> [53]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> [8][54]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>>
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
>>> the links above.
>>>
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>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
> the links above.
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>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
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> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
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> the archiving of list messages.
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [10][57]www.avg.com
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
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References
1. [64]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
2. [65]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
3. [66]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
4. [67]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. [68]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
6. [69]http://w7tsc.org/
7. [70]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
8. [71]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
9. [72]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
10. [73]http://www.avg.com/
11. [74]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
12. [75]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
13. [76]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 21:20:10 -0500
From: Pantdino <[77]pantdino at aol.com>
To: [78]charlesmccall at gmail.com
Cc: [79]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Message-ID: <15860a277be-3121-1de2 at webprd-m33.mail.aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
I have them tell me when it almost my turn and run the car around he
block in first gear so it can then go into the test bay
Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
On Saturday, November 12, 2016, Charles McCall
<[80]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
OK, thanks. It's very helpful to understand the theory - now I have a
problem in applying it. I have a nice, 20 minute highway drive to the
testing station, but the only way to reach the sniffer is to get in
line and wait.
Yesterday was very frustrating - typically the wait is 10-15 minutes,
and I don't know what happened yesterday but the wait was horrible. I
knew that a cold engine was a problem so I kept the engine running.
It's cold here in November, and 45 minutes with the engine shut off
would mean a fairly cold block.
I wonder which is worse - shutting the engine off (cold engine but
without all the carbon/etc) or letting it idle (warm engine but carbon)
The wait isn't something I can control. Would just revving the heck out
of the engine before entering the test bay help blow the cobwebs out?
From: Asa Jay Laughton [[81]mailto:asajay at asajay.com]
Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 20:53
To: Charles McCall
Cc: [82]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
No Charlie, you misunderstand...
An engine IDLED for 45 minutes is nearly guaranteed to FAIL. It will
be so loaded with carbon it can't possibly pass, no matter how "warmed
up it is."
You need to be DRIVING it for 45 minutes and immediately test it. It
needs to be taken through the gears, engine rpms taken high,..... Blow
out the cobwebs, the carbon build-up, etc. Then test. If you idle for
any length of time waiting in line... rinse and repeat. Do NOT spend
time idling in line, it will kill your test.
Asa
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
Charles McCall <[1][83]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you to all who answered.
I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but I
can
let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The lines
tend
to be pretty long where I go anyway...
I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and therefore
we
should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a little
for
the test.
I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
- neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
the current settings can work.
I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc. Tomorrow
it's
supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air cleaner
removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
Thanks again!
-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [[2][84]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On
Behalf
Of Asa Jay Laughton
Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
To: [3][85]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take it
for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the emissions
tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
Asa
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************
[4][86]http://w7tsc.org
[5][87]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>
> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>
> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
> good cleaning.
>
> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
> pass.
>
> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
> <[6]detomaso-[88]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
> [7][89]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi all
>>
>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
due
>> to two points:
>>
>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>
>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
limit
>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>
>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
to
>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
forum
>> J
>>
>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>
>>
>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>> here.
>>
>>
>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>> all!
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> [8][90]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> [9][91]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
>> the links above.
>>
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
any
>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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> DeTomaso mailing list
> [10][92]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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>
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They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
approve
the archiving of list messages.
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - [12][94]www.avg.com
> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
>
>
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References
1. [99]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
2. [100]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
3. [101]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
4. [102]http://w7tsc.org/
5. [103]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
6.
[104]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com%20on%20behalf%20of
%0b
7. [105]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
8. [106]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
9. [107]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
10. [108]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
11. [109]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
12. [110]http://www.avg.com/
13. [111]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
14. [112]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
15. [113]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
16. [114]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
_______________________________________________
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[115]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:41:21 -0500
From: Will Kooiman <[117]will.kooiman at gmail.com>
To: Charles McCall <[118]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: Detomaso Email List <[119]detomaso at detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
Message-ID: <9C7A3F8F-21AE-48B4-BB53-[120]9A5B268B1A02 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Good catch on the air filter.
Regarding CO, my understanding is to lean it out with the idle screws.
This increases NOx, but reduces CO.
That's why your CO levels were so high with a dirty filter. It's too
rich.
Or, just tune the idle screws for highest idle vacuum. That's where you
get the best performance and you'll probably pass too.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Nov 13, 2016, at 12:33 PM, Charles McCall
<[121]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi all
>
>
> I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
> that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
> more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
> rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition
of
> the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
> followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have
to
> find new homes I think!
>
>
> I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No,
I
> wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
> carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
> breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
> The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever
to
> warm up - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
> and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no
stumbles...
> I could feel a difference.
>
>
> No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
> Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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> [122]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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>
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------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:18:01 -0600
From: Richard Greenblum <[124]Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
To: "<[125]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[126]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Message-ID: <D44F30A2.536CD%[127]Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway. A long time ago I
bought
into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera. Never
noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car. When
my
K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing and
re-oiling,
I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be an IMSA car
crew
chief about them. He said stop screwing with it, you?re better off with
a
quality paper filter.
Richard
Austin, TX
From: DeTomaso <detomaso-[128]bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on
behalf of Mike
Reilly <[129]reillyms at live.com>
Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
To: marshallgsmith <[130]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
<[131]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <[132]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[133]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[134]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: [1]marshallgsmith
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
Cc: [4]<[135]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[136]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <[137]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[138]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[139]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <[140]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso
[[5][141]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: [142]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take
it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [6][143]http://w7tsc.org
> [7][144]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <detomaso-[145]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> [146]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> [147]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>> [8][148]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>>
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etc.) use
>>> the links above.
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>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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>> DeTomaso mailing list
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>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
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> the links above.
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> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
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> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
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> the archiving of list messages.
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [10][151]www.avg.com
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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>
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References
1. [158]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
2. [159]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
3. [160]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
4. [161]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
5. [162]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
6. [163]http://w7tsc.org/
7. [164]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
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-------------- next part --------------
I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway. A long time ago I
bought into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera.
Never noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car.
When my K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing
and re-oiling, I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be
an IMSA car crew chief about them. He said stop screwing with it,
you're better off with a quality paper filter.
Richard
Austin, TX
From: DeTomaso <[1]detomaso-[173]bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on
behalf
of Mike Reilly <[2][174]reillyms at live.com>
Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
To: marshallgsmith <[3][175]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
<[4][176]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall
<[5][177]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[6][178]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[7][179]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I
just
replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep
it
simple!
Sent from my Windows 10 phone
From: [1]marshallgsmith
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
Cc: [4]<[8][180]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
car
does....)
I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts
air
flow slightly.
M
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[9][181]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <[10][182]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<[11][183]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
<[12][184]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
car
does....)
Charlie,
You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing
the
test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are
how-to
videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and
re-oil
with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall
<[13][185]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting,
it
would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay,
but
I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with
the
timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to
believe
that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really,
really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the
dust,
driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough
to
make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso
[[5][14][186]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: [15][187]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not
overheating). Take
it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
emissions
> tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You
get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a
while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> & Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> [6][16][188]http://w7tsc.org
> [7][17][189]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the
carb
-
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking
it
back
>> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and
tune
it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <[18]detomaso-[190]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> [19][191]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
> due
>>> to two points:
>>>
>>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a
few
weeks
>>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to
be
able
>>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high.
The
> limit
>>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N.
I
seem
> to
>>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest
at
idle?
>>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass
the
test.
>>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a
public
> forum
>>> J
>>>
>>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed
chamber
>>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a
massaged
>>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>>> here.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>>> all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>> [20][192]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>>>
[8][21][193]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>>
>>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
etc.) use
>>> the links above.
>>>
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
forward
any
>>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
the
list.
>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
or
>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> [22][194]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
>> [9][23][195]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
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> the links above.
>>
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
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> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
list.
> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
or
approve
> the archiving of list messages.
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - [10][196]www.avg.com
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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6. [35][208]http://w7tsc.org/
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4. [221]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
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6. [223]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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14. [231]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
15. [232]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
16. [233]http://w7tsc.org/
17. [234]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
18. [235]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
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37. [254]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
38. [255]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
39. [256]http://www.avg.com/
40. [257]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
41. [258]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
42. [259]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
43. [260]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
44. [261]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
------------------------------
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End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
*****************************************
References
1. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
2. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
3. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
4. mailto:owner at server.detomasolist.com
5. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
6. mailto:detomaso at detomasolist.com
7. mailto:reillyms at live.com
8. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
9. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
10. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
11. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
12. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
13. mailto:MWHPR13MB180819E0A07EB284DFA9BA93BABD0 at MWHPR13MB1808.namprd13.prod.outlook.com
14. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
15. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
16. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
17. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
18. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
19. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
20. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
21. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
22. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
23. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
24. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
25. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
26. http://w7tsc.org/
27. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
28. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
29. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
30. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
31. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
32. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
33. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
34. http://www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com
35. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
36. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
37. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
38. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
39. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
40. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
41. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
42. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
43. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
44. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
45. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
46. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
47. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
48. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
49. http://w7tsc.org/
50. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
51. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
52. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
53. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
54. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
55. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
56. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
57. http://www.avg.com/
58. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
59. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
60. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
61. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
62. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
63. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
64. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
65. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
66. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
67. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
68. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
69. http://w7tsc.org/
70. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
71. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
72. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
73. http://www.avg.com/
74. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
75. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
76. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
77. mailto:pantdino at aol.com
78. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
79. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
80. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
81. mailto:asajay at asajay.com?
82. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
83. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
84. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
85. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
86. http://w7tsc.org/
87. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
88. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
89. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
90. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
91. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
92. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
93. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
94. http://www.avg.com/
95. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
96. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
97. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
98. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
99. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
100. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
101. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
102. http://w7tsc.org/
103. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
104. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com%20on%20behalf%20of%0b?
105. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
106. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
107. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
108. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
109. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
110. http://www.avg.com/
111. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
112. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
113. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
114. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
115. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
116. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
117. mailto:will.kooiman at gmail.com
118. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
119. mailto:detomaso at detomasolist.com
120. mailto:9A5B268B1A02 at gmail.com
121. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
122. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
123. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
124. mailto:Richard at richardgreenblum.com
125. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
126. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
127. mailto:Richard at richardgreenblum.com
128. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
129. mailto:reillyms at live.com
130. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
131. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
132. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
133. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
134. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
135. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
136. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
137. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
138. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
139. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
140. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
141. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
142. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
143. http://w7tsc.org/
144. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
145. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
146. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
147. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
148. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
149. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
150. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
151. http://www.avg.com/
152. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
153. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
154. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
155. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
156. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
157. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
158. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
159. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
160. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
161. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
162. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
163. http://w7tsc.org/
164. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
165. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
166. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
167. http://www.avg.com/
168. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
169. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
170. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
171. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
172. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
173. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
174. mailto:reillyms at live.com
175. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
176. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
177. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
178. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
179. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
180. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
181. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
182. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
183. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
184. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
185. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
186. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
187. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
188. http://w7tsc.org/
189. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
190. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
191. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
192. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
193. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
194. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
195. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
196. http://www.avg.com/
197. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
198. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
199. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
200. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
201. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
202. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
203. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
204. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
205. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
206. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
207. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
208. http://w7tsc.org/
209. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
210. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
211. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
212. http://www.avg.com/
213. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
214. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
215. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
216. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
217. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
218. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
219. mailto:reillyms at live.com?
220. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
221. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
222. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
223. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
224. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
225. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
226. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
227. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
228. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
229. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
230. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
231. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
232. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
233. http://w7tsc.org/
234. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
235. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
236. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
237. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
238. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
239. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
240. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
241. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
242. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
243. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
244. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
245. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
246. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
247. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
248. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
249. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
250. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
251. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
252. http://w7tsc.org/
253. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
254. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
255. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
256. http://www.avg.com/
257. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
258. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
259. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
260. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
261. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
262. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
263. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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