[DeTomaso] DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14

jderyke at aol.com jderyke at aol.com
Mon Nov 14 14:39:02 EST 2016


In some cases, adding 10% alcohol into your gas tank causes emissions to improve. Make sure the tank is no more than half full before adding a quart or two of alky. A dirty air filter will always cause the engine to run rich. And a smoking-hot engine tests better than a moderately warmed-up engine. Finally, retarding the ignition a few degrees (not too much) sometimes helps. You can reset it later. Good luck, Charlie- J Deryke 
 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-request <detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com>
To: detomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Sent: Mon, Nov 14, 2016 9:00 am
Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14

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Daily Detomaso List Digest

Today's Topics:

   1. Today's revelation - air is good (Charles McCall)
   2. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
      (Mike Reilly)
   3. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
      (Pantdino)
   4. Re: Today's revelation - air is good (Will Kooiman)
   5. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
      (Richard Greenblum)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 18:33:23 +0100
From: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
To: "Detomaso Email List" <detomaso at detomasolist.com>
Subject: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
Message-ID: <000601d23dd4$096571d0$1c305570$@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi all

 

I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say that I
have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is more than 15
years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember rinsing it once with a
garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of the filter was more or less
what one would expect if one had never followed the cleaning instructions.
Several mice families will have to find new homes I think!

 

I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the carb
(:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't breathe
before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance. The last few
times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to warm up  - even
after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold and a little rough.
Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles. I could feel a difference.


 

No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct, Will,
not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic. 

-------------- next part --------------
   Hi all


   I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
   that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
   more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
   rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of
   the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
   followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have to
   find new homes I think!


   I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
   wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
   carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
   breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
   The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to
   warm up  - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
   and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles...
   I could feel a difference.


   No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
   Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 20:05:18 +0000
From: Mike Reilly <reillyms at live.com>
To: marshallgsmith <marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, Mike Drew
	<MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
	<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
	does....)
Message-ID:
	<MWHPR13MB180819E0A07EB284DFA9BA93BABD0 at MWHPR13MB1808.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>
	
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"

I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element.  I just replace it each year and really don?t feel it impacts my engine performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter.  Keep it simple!



Sent from my Windows 10 phone



From: marshallgsmith<mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
To: Mike Drew<mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com>; Charles McCall<mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com><mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)




I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air flow slightly.
M

Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 11/12/16  11:59 AM  (GMT-08:00)
To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>" <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
         does....)

Charlie,

You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.

Mike

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:

> Thank you to all who answered.
>
> I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was literally
> idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient temperatures, so
> I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it would be
> difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but I can
> let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The lines tend
> to be pretty long where I go anyway...
>
> I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and therefore we
> should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a little for
> the test.
>
> I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the timing
> - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe that
> the current settings can work.
>
> I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
> clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust, driven
> down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc. Tomorrow it's
> supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air cleaner
> removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to make
> me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
> seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf
> Of Asa Jay Laughton
> Sent: s?bado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
> To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
> does....)
>
> Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating).  Take it
> for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the emissions
> tested.  If the line is too long... come back again later.  You get
> better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
>
> Asa
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> &  Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> http://w7tsc.org
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>
>
> On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
>> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>>
>> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb -
>> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning gasoline.
>>
>> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just needs a
>> good cleaning.
>>
>> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it back
>> for testing.  It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune it to
>> pass.
>>
>> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
>> <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
>> charlesmccall at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>
>>>   Hi all
>>>
>>>   Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and failed
> due
>>>   to two points:
>>>
>>>   1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few weeks
>>>   ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be able
>>>   to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>>
>>>   2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
> limit
>>>   hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same engine
>>>   that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and nothing
>>>   that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>>
>>>   1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the test?
>>>   Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't remember
>>>   when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I seem
> to
>>>   remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at idle?
>>>   If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the test.
>>>   Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be happy to
>>>   share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which I've
>>>   pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
> forum
>>>   J
>>>
>>>   2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my engine?
>>>   Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>>
>>>
>>>   Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>>>   heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>>>   Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be relevant
>>>   here.
>>>
>>>
>>>   I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing. Thanks
>>>   all!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>>> DeTomaso mailing list
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>>>
>>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
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>>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
>>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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>> DeTomaso mailing list
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>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use
> the links above.
>>
>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list.
> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve
> the archiving of list messages.
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com>
>> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date: 11/12/16
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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_______________________________________________


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-------------- next part --------------
   I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element.  I just
   replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
   performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter.  Keep it
   simple!


   Sent from my Windows 10 phone


   From: [1]marshallgsmith
   Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
   To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
   Cc: [4]<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)



   I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
   flow slightly.
   M
   Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
   -------- Original message --------
  From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Date: 11/12/16  11:59 AM  (GMT-08:00)
   To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
            does....)
   Charlie,
   You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
   should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
   test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
   videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
   with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
   Mike
   Sent from my iPhone
   On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
  wrote:
   > Thank you to all who answered.
   >
   > I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
   literally
   > idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
   temperatures, so
   > I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
   would be
   > difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
   I can
   > let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
   lines tend
   > to be pretty long where I go anyway...
   >
   > I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
   therefore we
   > should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
   little for
   > the test.
   >
   > I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
   timing
   > - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
   that
   > the current settings can work.
   >
 > I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
   > clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
   driven
   > down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
   Tomorrow it's
   > supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
   cleaner
   > removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
   make
   > me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
   > seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
   >
   > Thanks again!
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
   > From: DeTomaso [[5]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
   On Behalf
   > Of Asa Jay Laughton
   > Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
   > To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   > does....)
   >
   > Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating).  Take
   it
   > for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
   emissions
   > tested.  If the line is too long... come back again later.  You get
   > better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
   >
   > Asa
   >
   > Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   > &  Shelley Marie
   > Spokane, WA
   > ******************************
   > [6]http://w7tsc.org
   > [7]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   >
   >
   > On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
   >> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
   >>
   >> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
   -
   >> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
   gasoline.
 >>
   >> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
   needs a
   >> good cleaning.
   >>
   >> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
   back
   >> for testing.  It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
   it to
   >> pass.
   >>
   >> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
   >> <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   >> charlesmccall at gmail.com>  wrote:
   >>
   >>>   Hi all
   >>>
   >>>   Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
   failed
   > due
   >>>   to two points:
   >>>
   >>>   1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
   weeks
   >>>   ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
   able
   >>>   to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
   >>>
   >>>   2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
   > limit
   >>>   hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
   engine
   >>>   that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
   nothing
   >>>   that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
   >>>
   >>>   1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
   test?
   >>>   Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
   remember
   >>>   when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
   seem
   > to
   >>>   remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
   idle?
   >>>   If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
   test.
   >>>   Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
   happy to
   >>>   share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
   I've
   >>>   pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
   > forum
   >>>   J
   >>>
   >>>   2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
   engine?
   >>>   Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
   >>>
   >>>
   >>>   Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
   >>>   heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
   >>>   Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
   relevant
   >>>   here.
   >>>
   >>>
   >>>   I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
   Thanks
   >>>   all!
   >>> _______________________________________________
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >>> [8]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>>
   >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   >>> the links above.
   >>>
   >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   >>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   >>> approve the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >> _______________________________________________
   >>
 >>
   >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >> DeTomaso mailing list
   >> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >> [9]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>
   >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   > the links above.
   >>
   >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
   > the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >>
   >> -----
   >> No virus found in this message.
   >> Checked by AVG - [10]www.avg.com
   >> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
   11/12/16
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  > DeTomaso mailing list
   > DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [11]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use
   > the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
   > the archiving of list messages.
   >
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [12]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
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References

   1. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   2. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   3. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  5. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   6. http://w7tsc.org/
   7. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   8. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  10. http://www.avg.com/
  11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  12. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 21:20:10 -0500
From: Pantdino <pantdino at aol.com>
To: charlesmccall at gmail.com
Cc: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
	does....)
Message-ID: <15860a277be-3121-1de2 at webprd-m33.mail.aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

I have them tell me when it almost my turn and run the car around he block in first gear so it can then go into the test bay

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Saturday, November 12, 2016, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:

OK, thanks. It's very helpful to understand the theory - now I have a
problem in applying it. I have a nice, 20 minute highway drive to the
testing station, but the only way to reach the sniffer is to get in
line and wait.


Yesterday was very frustrating - typically the wait is 10-15 minutes,
and I don't know what happened yesterday but the wait was horrible. I
knew that a cold engine was a problem so I kept the engine running.
It's cold here in November, and 45 minutes with the engine shut off
would mean a fairly cold block.


I wonder which is worse - shutting the engine off (cold engine but
without all the carbon/etc) or letting it idle (warm engine but carbon)


The wait isn't something I can control. Would just revving the heck out
of the engine before entering the test bay help blow the cobwebs out?


From: Asa Jay Laughton [mailto:asajay at asajay.com]
Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 20:53
To: Charles McCall
Cc: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)


No Charlie, you misunderstand...

An engine IDLED for 45 minutes is nearly guaranteed to FAIL. It will
be so loaded with carbon it can't possibly pass, no matter how "warmed
up it is."


You need to be DRIVING it for 45 minutes and immediately test it. It
needs to be taken through the gears, engine rpms taken high,..... Blow
out the cobwebs, the carbon build-up, etc. Then test. If you idle for
any length of time waiting in line... rinse and repeat. Do NOT spend
time idling in line, it will kill your test.


Asa


Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks

Charles McCall <[1]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you to all who answered.
I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
literally
idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
temperatures, so
I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
would be
difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but I
can
let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The lines
tend
to be pretty long where I go anyway...
I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and therefore
we
should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a little
for
the test.
I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
timing
- neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
that
the current settings can work.
I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
driven
down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc. Tomorrow
it's
supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air cleaner
removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
make
me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
Thanks again!
-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [[2]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
Behalf
Of Asa Jay Laughton
Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
To: [3]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)
Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take it
for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the emissions
tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
Asa
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************
[4]http://w7tsc.org
[5]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
>
> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
-
> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
gasoline.
>
> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
needs a
> good cleaning.
>
> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
back
> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
it to
> pass.
>
> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
> <[6]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
> [7]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi all
>>
>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
failed
due
>> to two points:
>>
>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
weeks
>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
able
>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
>>
>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
limit
>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
engine
>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
nothing
>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
>>
>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
test?
>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
remember
>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
seem
to
>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
idle?
>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
test.
>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
happy to
>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
I've
>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
forum
>> J
>>
>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
engine?
>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
>>
>>
>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
relevant
>> here.
>>
>>
>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
Thanks
>> all!
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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>> approve the archiving of list messages.
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - [12]www.avg.com
> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
11/12/16
>
>
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References

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2. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
3. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
4. http://w7tsc.org/
5. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
6. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com%20on%20behalf%20of%0b
7. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
8. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
10. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
12. http://www.avg.com/
13. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
14. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
15. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
16. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
_______________________________________________


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------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:41:21 -0500
From: Will Kooiman <will.kooiman at gmail.com>
To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc: Detomaso Email List <detomaso at detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
Message-ID: <9C7A3F8F-21AE-48B4-BB53-9A5B268B1A02 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=us-ascii

Good catch on the air filter.

Regarding CO, my understanding is to lean it out with the idle screws.  This increases NOx, but reduces CO.

That's why your CO levels were so high with a dirty filter.  It's too rich.

Or, just tune the idle screws for highest idle vacuum.  That's where you get the best performance and you'll probably pass too.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 13, 2016, at 12:33 PM, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>   Hi all
> 
> 
>   I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
>   that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
>   more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
>   rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of
>   the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
>   followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have to
>   find new homes I think!
> 
> 
>   I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
>   wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
>   carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
>   breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
>   The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to
>   warm up  - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
>   and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles...
>   I could feel a difference.
> 
> 
> No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
>   Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
> _______________________________________________
> 
> 
> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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> http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
> 
> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the links above.
> 
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------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:18:01 -0600
From: Richard Greenblum <Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
To: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
	<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
	does....)
Message-ID: <D44F30A2.536CD%Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway.  A long time ago I bought
into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera.  Never
noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car.  When my
K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing and re-oiling,
I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be an IMSA car crew
chief about them.  He said stop screwing with it, you?re better off with a
quality paper filter.


Richard
Austin, TX

From:  DeTomaso <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf of Mike
Reilly <reillyms at live.com>
Date:  Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
To:  marshallgsmith <marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
<MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
Cc:  "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>" <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Subject:  Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
does....)

   I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element.  I just
   replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
   performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter.  Keep it
   simple!


   Sent from my Windows 10 phone


   From: [1]marshallgsmith
   Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
   To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
   Cc: [4]<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)



   I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
   flow slightly.
   M
   Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
   -------- Original message --------
   From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Date: 11/12/16  11:59 AM  (GMT-08:00)
   To: Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
          does....)
   Charlie,
   You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
   should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
   test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
   videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
   with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
   Mike
   Sent from my iPhone
   On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   wrote:
   > Thank you to all who answered.
   >
   > I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
   literally
   > idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
   temperatures, so
   > I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
   would be
   > difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
   I can
   > let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
   lines tend
   > to be pretty long where I go anyway...
   >
   > I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
   therefore we
   > should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
   little for
   > the test.
   >
   > I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
   timing
   > - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
   that
   > the current settings can work.
   >
   > I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
   > clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
   driven
   > down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
   Tomorrow it's
   > supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
   cleaner
   > removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
   make
   > me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
   > seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
   >
   > Thanks again!
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
   > From: DeTomaso [[5]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
   On Behalf
   > Of Asa Jay Laughton
   > Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
   > To: detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   > does....)
   >
   > Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating).  Take
   it
   > for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
   emissions
   > tested.  If the line is too long... come back again later.  You get
   > better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
   >
   > Asa
   >
   > Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   > &  Shelley Marie
   > Spokane, WA
   > ******************************
   > [6]http://w7tsc.org
   > [7]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   >
   >
   > On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
   >> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
   >>
   >> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
   -
   >> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
   gasoline.
 >>
   >> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
   needs a
   >> good cleaning.
   >>
   >> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
   back
   >> for testing.  It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
   it to
   >> pass.
   >>
   >> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
   >> <detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   >> charlesmccall at gmail.com>  wrote:
   >>
   >>>   Hi all
   >>>
   >>>   Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
   failed
   > due
   >>>   to two points:
   >>>
   >>>   1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
   weeks
   >>>   ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
   able
   >>>   to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
   >>>
   >>>   2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
   > limit
   >>>   hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
   engine
   >>>   that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
   nothing
   >>>   that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
   >>>
   >>>   1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
   test?
   >>>   Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
   remember
   >>>   when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
   seem
   > to
   >>>   remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
   idle?
   >>>   If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
   test.
   >>>   Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
   happy to
   >>>   share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
   I've
   >>>   pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
   > forum
   >>>   J
   >>>
   >>>   2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
   engine?
   >>>   Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
   >>>
   >>>
   >>>   Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
   >>>   heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
   >>>   Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
   relevant
   >>>   here.
   >>>
   >>>
   >>>   I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
   Thanks
   >>>   all!
   >>> _______________________________________________
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>> DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >>> [8]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>>
   >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   >>> the links above.
   >>>
   >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   >>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   >>> approve the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >> _______________________________________________
   >>
 >>
   >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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   etc.) use
   > the links above.
   >>
   >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
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   >>
   >>
   >> -----
   >> No virus found in this message.
   >> Checked by AVG - [10]www.avg.com
   >> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
   11/12/16
   > _______________________________________________
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   >
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References

   1. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   2. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   3. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  5. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   6. http://w7tsc.org/
   7. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   8. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   9. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  10. http://www.avg.com/
  11. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  12. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  13. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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-------------- next part --------------
   I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway.  A long time ago I
   bought into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera.
    Never noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car.
    When my K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing
   and re-oiling, I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be
   an IMSA car crew chief about them.  He said stop screwing with it,
   you're better off with a quality paper filter.

   Richard

   Austin, TX

   From: DeTomaso <[1]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on behalf
   of Mike Reilly <[2]reillyms at live.com>
   Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
   To: marshallgsmith <[3]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
   <[4]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <[5]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[6]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[7]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)

      I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element.  I
   just
      replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
      performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter.  Keep
   it
      simple!
      Sent from my Windows 10 phone
      From: [1]marshallgsmith
      Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
      To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
      Cc: [4]<[8]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
      Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
   car
      does....)
      I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts
   air
      flow slightly.
      M
      Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
      -------- Original message --------
      From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[9]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
      Date: 11/12/16  11:59 AM  (GMT-08:00)
      To: Charles McCall <[10]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
      Cc: "<[11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
      <[12]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
      Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
   car
               does....)
      Charlie,
      You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
      should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing
 the
      test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are
   how-to
      videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and
   re-oil
      with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
      Mike
      Sent from my iPhone
      On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall
   <[13]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
      wrote:
      > Thank you to all who answered.
      >
      > I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
      literally
      > idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
      temperatures, so
      > I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting,
   it
      would be
      > difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay,
  but
      I can
      > let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
      lines tend
      > to be pretty long where I go anyway...
 >
      > I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
      therefore we
      > should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
      little for
      > the test.
      >
      > I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with
   the
      timing
      > - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to
   believe
      that
      > the current settings can work.
      >
      > I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really,
   really
      > clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the
   dust,
      driven
      > down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
  Tomorrow it's
      > supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
      cleaner
      > removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough
   to
      make
      > me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
      > seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
      >
      > Thanks again!
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: DeTomaso
   [[5][14]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
      On Behalf
      > Of Asa Jay Laughton
      > Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
      > To: [15]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
      > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
   car
      > does....)
      >
      > Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not
   overheating).  Take
      it
      > for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
      emissions
      > tested.  If the line is too long... come back again later.  You
   get
      > better test results when it's been running good and hot for a
   while.
      >
      > Asa
      >
 > Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
      > &  Shelley Marie
     > Spokane, WA
      > ******************************
      > [6][16]http://w7tsc.org
      > [7][17]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
      >
      >
      > On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
      >> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
      >>
      >> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the
   carb
      -
      >> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
      gasoline.
      >>
      >> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
      needs a
      >> good cleaning.
      >>
      >> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking
   it
      back
      >> for testing.  It would help if you could take it somewhere and
   tune
      it to
      >> pass.
      >>
      >> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
      >> <[18]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   >> [19]charlesmccall at gmail.com>  wrote:
      >>
      >>>   Hi all
      >>>
      >>>   Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
  failed
      > due
      >>>   to two points:
      >>>
      >>>   1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a
   few
      weeks
     >>>   ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to
   be
     able
      >>>   to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
 >>>
      >>>   2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high.
 The
      > limit
      >>>   hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
      engine
      >>>   that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
      nothing
      >>>   that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
      >>>
      >>>   1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
      test?
      >>>   Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
      remember
      >>>   when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N.
   I
      seem
      > to
      >>>   remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest
  at
      idle?
      >>>   If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass
   the
      test.
      >>>   Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
      happy to
      >>>   share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
      I've
      >>>   pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a
   public
      > forum
      >>>   J
      >>>
      >>>   2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
      engine?
      >>>   Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
      >>>
      >>>
      >>>   Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed
   chamber
      >>>   heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a
   massaged
      >>>   Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
      relevant
      >>>  here.
      >>>
      >>>
      >>>   I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
      Thanks
      >>>   all!
      >>> _______________________________________________
      >>>
      >>>
      >>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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      >>>
     >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
      etc.) use
      >>> the links above.
      >>>
      >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
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      >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
   the
      list.
    >>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or
    >>> approve the archiving of list messages.
      >>
      >> _______________________________________________
      >>
      >>
      >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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      >> [22]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
      >> [9][23]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
      >>
      >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
      etc.) use
      > the links above.
      >>
      >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
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      > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
      list.
      > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or
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   > the archiving of list messages.
      >>
      >>
      >> -----
      >> No virus found in this message.
      >> Checked by AVG - [10]www.avg.com
     >> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
      11/12/16
      > _______________________________________________
      >
     >
      > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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      > DeTomaso mailing list
      > [24]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
      > [11][25]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
      >
      > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.)
    use
      > the links above.
      >
      > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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      > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or
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   > the archiving of list messages.
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      >
      >
      > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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      > DeTomaso mailing list
      > [26]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
      > [12][27]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
      >
      > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.)
    use the links above.
      >
      > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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      list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
      or approve the archiving of list messages.
      _______________________________________________
      Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
      Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
      DeTomaso mailing list
      [28]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
      [13][29]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
      To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.)
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      or approve the archiving of list messages.
   References
      1. [30]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
      2. [31]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
      3. [32]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
      4. [33]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
      5. [34]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
      6. [35]http://w7tsc.org/
      7. [36]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
      8. [37]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
      9. [38]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     10. [39]http://www.avg.com/
     11. [40]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     12. [41]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     13. [42]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [43]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [44]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
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References

   1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   2. mailto:reillyms at live.com
   3. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   4. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   5. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   6. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   7. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   8. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   9. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  10. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  11. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  12. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  13. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  14. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  15. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  16. http://w7tsc.org/
  17. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  18. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  19. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  20. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  21. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  22. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  23. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  24. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  25. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  26. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  27. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  28. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  29. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  30. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
  31. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
  32. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  33. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  34. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  35. http://w7tsc.org/
  36. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  37. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  38. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  39. http://www.avg.com/
  40. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  41. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  42. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  43. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  44. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso

------------------------------

Subject: Digest Footer

_______________________________________________
Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.


------------------------------

End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
*****************************************

-------------- next part --------------
   In some cases, adding 10% alcohol into your gas tank causes emissions
   to improve. Make sure the tank is no more than half full before adding
   a quart or two of alky. A dirty air filter will always cause the engine
   to run rich. And a smoking-hot engine tests better than a moderately
   warmed-up engine. Finally, retarding the ignition a few degrees (not
   too much) sometimes helps. You can reset it later. Good luck, Charlie-
   J Deryke

   -----Original Message-----
   From: detomaso-request <detomaso-request at server.detomasolist.com>
   To: detomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Sent: Mon, Nov 14, 2016 9:00 am
   Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
   Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to
   [1]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
   [2]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
   detomaso-[3]request at server.detomasolist.com
   You can reach the person managing the list at
   detomaso-[4]owner at server.detomasolist.com
   When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
   than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..."
   Daily Detomaso List Digest
   Today's Topics:
   1. Today's revelation - air is good (Charles McCall)
   2. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
   (Mike Reilly)
   3. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
   (Pantdino)
   4. Re: Today's revelation - air is good (Will Kooiman)
   5. Re: Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car does....)
   (Richard Greenblum)
   ----------------------------------------------------------------------
   Message: 1
   Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 18:33:23 +0100
   From: Charles McCall <[5]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   To: "Detomaso Email List" <[6]detomaso at detomasolist.com>
   Subject: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
   Message-ID: <000601d23dd4$096571d0$1c305570$@gmail.com>
   Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
   Hi all
   I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
   that I
   have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is more than
   15
   years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember rinsing it once
   with a
   garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of the filter was more or
   less
   what one would expect if one had never followed the cleaning
   instructions.
   Several mice families will have to find new homes I think!
   I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
   wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
   carb
   (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
   breathe
   before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance. The last
   few
   times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to warm up -
   even
   after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold and a little
   rough.
   Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles. I could feel a
   difference.
   No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
   Will,
   not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
   -------------- next part --------------
   Hi all
   I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
   that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
   more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
   rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition of
   the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
   followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have to
   find new homes I think!
   I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No, I
   wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
   carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
   breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
   The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever to
   warm up - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
   and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no stumbles...
   I could feel a difference.
   No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
   Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
   ------------------------------
   Message: 2
   Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 20:05:18 +0000
   From: Mike Reilly <[7]reillyms at live.com>
   To: marshallgsmith <[8]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, Mike Drew
   <[9]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <[10]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[12]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   Message-ID:
   <[13]MWHPR13MB180819E0A07EB284DFA9BA93BABD0 at MWHPR13MB1808.namprd13.prod
   .outlook.com>
   Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
   I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
   replace it each year and really don?t feel it impacts my engine
   performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
   simple!
   Sent from my Windows 10 phone
   From: marshallgsmith<[14]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>
   Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
   To: Mike Drew<[15]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com>; Charles
   McCall<[16]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc:
   <[17]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com><[18]mailto:detomaso at server.detom
   asolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
   flow slightly.
   M
   Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
   -------- Original message --------
   From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[19]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
   To: Charles McCall <[20]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[21]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[22]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   Charlie,
   You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
   should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
   test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
   videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
   with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
   Mike
   Sent from my iPhone
   On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <[23]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   wrote:
   > Thank you to all who answered.
   >
   > I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
   literally
   > idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
   temperatures, so
   > I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
   would be
   > difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
   I can
   > let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
   lines tend
   > to be pretty long where I go anyway...
   >
   > I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
   therefore we
   > should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
   little for
   > the test.
   >
   > I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
   timing
   > - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
   that
   > the current settings can work.
   >
   > I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
   > clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
   driven
   > down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
   Tomorrow it's
   > supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
   cleaner
   > removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
   make
   > me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
   > seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
   >
   > Thanks again!
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
   > From: DeTomaso [[24]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
   On Behalf
   > Of Asa Jay Laughton
   > Sent: s?bado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
   > To: [25]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   > does....)
   >
   > Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take it
   > for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
   emissions
   > tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
   > better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
   >
   > Asa
   >
   > Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   > & Shelley Marie
   > Spokane, WA
   > ******************************
   > [26]http://w7tsc.org
   > [27]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   >
   >
   > On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
   >> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
   >>
   >> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
   -
   >> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
   gasoline.
   >>
   >> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
   needs a
   >> good cleaning.
   >>
   >> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
   back
   >> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
   it to
   >> pass.
   >>
   >> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
   >> <detomaso-[28]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   >> [29]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   >>
   >>> Hi all
   >>>
   >>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and failed
   > due
   >>> to two points:
   >>>
   >>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
   weeks
   >>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
   able
   >>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
   >>>
   >>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
   > limit
   >>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
   engine
   >>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and nothing
   >>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
   >>>
   >>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the test?
   >>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
   remember
   >>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
   seem
   > to
   >>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
   idle?
   >>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
   test.
   >>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be happy
   to
   >>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which I've
   >>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
   > forum
   >>> J
   >>>
   >>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
   engine?
   >>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
   >>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
   >>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
   relevant
   >>> here.
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing. Thanks
   >>> all!
   >>> _______________________________________________
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>> [30]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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   >>>
   >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   >>> the links above.
   >>>
   >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   >>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   >>> approve the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >> _______________________________________________
   >>
   >>
   >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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   >> [32]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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   >>
   >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   > the links above.
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   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
   > the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >>
   >> -----
   >> No virus found in this message.
   >> Checked by AVG - [34]www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com>
   >> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
   11/12/16
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
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   -------------- next part --------------
   I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
   replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
   performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
   simple!
   Sent from my Windows 10 phone
   From: [1]marshallgsmith
   Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
   To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
   Cc: [4]<[41]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
   flow slightly.
   M
   Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
   -------- Original message --------
   From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[42]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
   To: Charles McCall <[43]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[44]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[45]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   Charlie,
   You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
   should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
   test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
   videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
   with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
   Mike
   Sent from my iPhone
   On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <[46]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   wrote:
   > Thank you to all who answered.
   >
   > I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
   literally
   > idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
   temperatures, so
   > I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
   would be
   > difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
   I can
   > let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
   lines tend
   > to be pretty long where I go anyway...
   >
   > I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
   therefore we
   > should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
   little for
   > the test.
   >
   > I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
   timing
   > - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
   that
   > the current settings can work.
   >
   > I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
   > clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
   driven
   > down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
   Tomorrow it's
   > supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
   cleaner
   > removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
   make
   > me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
   > seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
   >
   > Thanks again!
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
   > From: DeTomaso
   [[5][47]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
   On Behalf
   > Of Asa Jay Laughton
   > Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
   > To: [48]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   > does....)
   >
   > Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take
   it
   > for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
   emissions
   > tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
   > better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
   >
   > Asa
   >
   > Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   > & Shelley Marie
   > Spokane, WA
   > ******************************
   > [6][49]http://w7tsc.org
   > [7][50]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   >
   >
   > On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
   >> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
   >>
   >> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
   -
   >> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
   gasoline.
   >>
   >> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
   needs a
   >> good cleaning.
   >>
   >> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
   back
   >> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
   it to
   >> pass.
   >>
   >> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
   >> <detomaso-[51]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   >> [52]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   >>
   >>> Hi all
   >>>
   >>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
   failed
   > due
   >>> to two points:
   >>>
   >>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
   weeks
   >>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
   able
   >>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
   >>>
   >>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
   > limit
   >>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
   engine
   >>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
   nothing
   >>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
   >>>
   >>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
   test?
   >>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
   remember
   >>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
   seem
   > to
   >>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
   idle?
   >>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
   test.
   >>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
   happy to
   >>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
   I've
   >>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
   > forum
   >>> J
   >>>
   >>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
   engine?
   >>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
   >>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
   >>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
   relevant
   >>> here.
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
   Thanks
   >>> all!
   >>> _______________________________________________
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>> [53]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >>> [8][54]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>>
   >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   >>> the links above.
   >>>
   >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   >>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   >>> approve the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >> _______________________________________________
   >>
   >>
   >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >> DeTomaso mailing list
   >> [55]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >> [9][56]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>
   >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   > the links above.
   >>
   >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
   > the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >>
   >> -----
   >> No virus found in this message.
   >> Checked by AVG - [10][57]www.avg.com
   >> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
   11/12/16
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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   > [58]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use
   > the links above.
   >
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   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
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   approve
   > the archiving of list messages.
   >
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [60]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [12][61]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [62]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [13][63]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
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   References
   1. [64]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   2. [65]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   3. [66]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   4. [67]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   5. [68]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   6. [69]http://w7tsc.org/
   7. [70]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   8. [71]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   9. [72]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   10. [73]http://www.avg.com/
   11. [74]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   12. [75]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   13. [76]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   ------------------------------
   Message: 3
   Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2016 21:20:10 -0500
   From: Pantdino <[77]pantdino at aol.com>
   To: [78]charlesmccall at gmail.com
   Cc: [79]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   Message-ID: <15860a277be-3121-1de2 at webprd-m33.mail.aol.com>
   Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
   I have them tell me when it almost my turn and run the car around he
   block in first gear so it can then go into the test bay
   Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
   On Saturday, November 12, 2016, Charles McCall
   <[80]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   OK, thanks. It's very helpful to understand the theory - now I have a
   problem in applying it. I have a nice, 20 minute highway drive to the
   testing station, but the only way to reach the sniffer is to get in
   line and wait.
   Yesterday was very frustrating - typically the wait is 10-15 minutes,
   and I don't know what happened yesterday but the wait was horrible. I
   knew that a cold engine was a problem so I kept the engine running.
   It's cold here in November, and 45 minutes with the engine shut off
   would mean a fairly cold block.
   I wonder which is worse - shutting the engine off (cold engine but
   without all the carbon/etc) or letting it idle (warm engine but carbon)
   The wait isn't something I can control. Would just revving the heck out
   of the engine before entering the test bay help blow the cobwebs out?
   From: Asa Jay Laughton [[81]mailto:asajay at asajay.com]
   Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 20:53
   To: Charles McCall
   Cc: [82]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   No Charlie, you misunderstand...
   An engine IDLED for 45 minutes is nearly guaranteed to FAIL. It will
   be so loaded with carbon it can't possibly pass, no matter how "warmed
   up it is."
   You need to be DRIVING it for 45 minutes and immediately test it. It
   needs to be taken through the gears, engine rpms taken high,..... Blow
   out the cobwebs, the carbon build-up, etc. Then test. If you idle for
   any length of time waiting in line... rinse and repeat. Do NOT spend
   time idling in line, it will kill your test.
   Asa
   Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
   Charles McCall <[1][83]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   Thank you to all who answered.
   I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
   literally
   idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
   temperatures, so
   I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
   would be
   difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but I
   can
   let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The lines
   tend
   to be pretty long where I go anyway...
   I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and therefore
   we
   should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a little
   for
   the test.
   I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
   timing
   - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
   that
   the current settings can work.
   I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
   clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
   driven
   down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc. Tomorrow
   it's
   supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air cleaner
   removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
   make
   me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
   seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
   Thanks again!
   -----Original Message-----
   From: DeTomaso [[2][84]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
   On
   Behalf
   Of Asa Jay Laughton
   Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
   To: [3][85]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take it
   for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the emissions
   tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
   better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
   Asa
   Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   & Shelley Marie
   Spokane, WA
   ******************************
   [4][86]http://w7tsc.org
   [5][87]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
   > You mean CO and not CO2, right?
   >
   > My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
   -
   > which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
   gasoline.
   >
   > If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
   needs a
   > good cleaning.
   >
   > The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
   back
   > for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
   it to
   > pass.
   >
   > On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
   > <[6]detomaso-[88]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   > [7][89]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   >
   >> Hi all
   >>
   >> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
   failed
   due
   >> to two points:
   >>
   >> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
   weeks
   >> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
   able
   >> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
   >>
   >> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
   limit
   >> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
   engine
   >> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
   nothing
   >> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
   >>
   >> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
   test?
   >> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
   remember
   >> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
   seem
   to
   >> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
   idle?
   >> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
   test.
   >> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
   happy to
   >> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
   I've
   >> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
   forum
   >> J
   >>
   >> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
   engine?
   >> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
   >>
   >>
   >> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
   >> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
   >> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
   relevant
   >> here.
   >>
   >>
   >> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
   Thanks
   >> all!
   >> _______________________________________________
   >>
   >>
   >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >> DeTomaso mailing list
   >> [8][90]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >> [9][91]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>
   >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   >> the links above.
   >>
   >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   >> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   >> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   >> approve the archiving of list messages.
   >
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [10][92]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
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   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use
   the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
   the archiving of list messages.
   >
   >
   > -----
   > No virus found in this message.
   > Checked by AVG - [12][94]www.avg.com
   > Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
   11/12/16
   >
   >
   _______________________________________________
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   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
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   References
   1. [99]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   2. [100]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   3. [101]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   4. [102]http://w7tsc.org/
   5. [103]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   6.
   [104]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com%20on%20behalf%20of
   %0b
   7. [105]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   8. [106]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   9. [107]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   10. [108]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   11. [109]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   12. [110]http://www.avg.com/
   13. [111]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   14. [112]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   15. [113]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   16. [114]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [115]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [116]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
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   ------------------------------
   Message: 4
   Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:41:21 -0500
   From: Will Kooiman <[117]will.kooiman at gmail.com>
   To: Charles McCall <[118]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: Detomaso Email List <[119]detomaso at detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Today's revelation - air is good
   Message-ID: <9C7A3F8F-21AE-48B4-BB53-[120]9A5B268B1A02 at gmail.com>
   Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
   Good catch on the air filter.
   Regarding CO, my understanding is to lean it out with the idle screws.
   This increases NOx, but reduces CO.
   That's why your CO levels were so high with a dirty filter. It's too
   rich.
   Or, just tune the idle screws for highest idle vacuum. That's where you
   get the best performance and you'll probably pass too.
   Sent from my iPhone
   > On Nov 13, 2016, at 12:33 PM, Charles McCall
   <[121]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   >
   > Hi all
   >
   >
   > I removed the air filter today and took a closer look. Let's just say
   > that I have never, ever owned K&N filter cleaner, and this filter is
   > more than 15 years old. I've oiled it, yes, and I think I remember
   > rinsing it once with a garden hose many moons ago, but the condition
   of
   > the filter was more or less what one would expect if one had never
   > followed the cleaning instructions. Several mice families will have
   to
   > find new homes I think!
   >
   >
   > I took the car for a 20 minute drive with the air filter removed. No,
   I
   > wasn't too worried - I had the engine screen in place to protect the
   > carb (:-p) I came to the conclusion that my poor engine just couldn't
   > breathe before! There was a noticeable difference in the performance.
   > The last few times I drove, it acted as though it was taking forever
   to
   > warm up - even after an hour on the highway. It just felt, well, cold
   > and a little rough. Today it felt looser, freer revving, no
   stumbles...
   > I could feel a difference.
   >
   >
   > No idea if that alone will reduce my CO emissions (you are correct,
   > Will, not CO2) but I'm pretty optimistic.
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [122]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [123]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   ------------------------------
   Message: 5
   Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:18:01 -0600
   From: Richard Greenblum <[124]Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
   To: "<[125]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[126]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   Message-ID: <D44F30A2.536CD%[127]Richard at richardgreenblum.com>
   Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
   I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway. A long time ago I
   bought
   into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera. Never
   noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car. When
   my
   K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing and
   re-oiling,
   I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be an IMSA car
   crew
   chief about them. He said stop screwing with it, you?re better off with
   a
   quality paper filter.
   Richard
   Austin, TX
   From: DeTomaso <detomaso-[128]bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on
   behalf of Mike
   Reilly <[129]reillyms at live.com>
   Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
   To: marshallgsmith <[130]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
   <[131]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall <[132]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[133]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[134]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I just
   replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
   performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep it
   simple!
   Sent from my Windows 10 phone
   From: [1]marshallgsmith
   Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
   To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
   Cc: [4]<[135]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts air
   flow slightly.
   M
   Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
   -------- Original message --------
   From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[136]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
   To: Charles McCall <[137]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[138]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[139]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   Charlie,
   You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
   should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing the
   test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are how-to
   videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and re-oil
   with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
   Mike
   Sent from my iPhone
   On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall <[140]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   wrote:
   > Thank you to all who answered.
   >
   > I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
   literally
   > idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
   temperatures, so
   > I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting, it
   would be
   > difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay, but
   I can
   > let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
   lines tend
   > to be pretty long where I go anyway...
   >
   > I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
   therefore we
   > should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
   little for
   > the test.
   >
   > I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with the
   timing
   > - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to believe
   that
   > the current settings can work.
   >
   > I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really, really
   > clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the dust,
   driven
   > down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
   Tomorrow it's
   > supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
   cleaner
   > removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough to
   make
   > me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
   > seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
   >
   > Thanks again!
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
   > From: DeTomaso
   [[5][141]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
   On Behalf
   > Of Asa Jay Laughton
   > Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
   > To: [142]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   > does....)
   >
   > Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not overheating). Take
   it
   > for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
   emissions
   > tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You get
   > better test results when it's been running good and hot for a while.
   >
   > Asa
   >
   > Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   > & Shelley Marie
   > Spokane, WA
   > ******************************
   > [6][143]http://w7tsc.org
   > [7][144]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   >
   >
   > On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
   >> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
   >>
   >> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the carb
   -
   >> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
   gasoline.
   >>
   >> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
   needs a
   >> good cleaning.
   >>
   >> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking it
   back
   >> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and tune
   it to
   >> pass.
   >>
   >> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
   >> <detomaso-[145]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   >> [146]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   >>
   >>> Hi all
   >>>
   >>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
   failed
   > due
   >>> to two points:
   >>>
   >>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a few
   weeks
   >>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to be
   able
   >>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
   >>>
   >>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high. The
   > limit
   >>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
   engine
   >>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
   nothing
   >>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
   >>>
   >>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
   test?
   >>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
   remember
   >>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N. I
   seem
   > to
   >>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest at
   idle?
   >>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass the
   test.
   >>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
   happy to
   >>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
   I've
   >>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a public
   > forum
   >>> J
   >>>
   >>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
   engine?
   >>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed chamber
   >>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a massaged
   >>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
   relevant
   >>> here.
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
   Thanks
   >>> all!
   >>> _______________________________________________
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>> [147]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >>> [8][148]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>>
   >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   >>> the links above.
   >>>
   >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   >>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   >>> approve the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >> _______________________________________________
   >>
   >>
   >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   >> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   >> DeTomaso mailing list
   >> [149]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >> [9][150]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>
   >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   > the links above.
   >>
   >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
   > the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >>
   >> -----
   >> No virus found in this message.
   >> Checked by AVG - [10][151]www.avg.com
   >> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
   11/12/16
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [152]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [11][153]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use
   > the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
   > the archiving of list messages.
   >
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [154]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [12][155]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
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   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [156]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [13][157]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
   message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   References
   1. [158]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   2. [159]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   3. [160]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   4. [161]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   5. [162]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   6. [163]http://w7tsc.org/
   7. [164]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   8. [165]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   9. [166]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   10. [167]http://www.avg.com/
   11. [168]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   12. [169]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   13. [170]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [171]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [172]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use
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   the archiving of list messages.
   -------------- next part --------------
   I may get slammed for this, but here goes anyway. A long time ago I
   bought into the K&N thing and put them on my daily driver and Pantera.
   Never noticed any difference in performance or milage with either car.
   When my K&N rejuvenation kit ran out of spray, after years of washing
   and re-oiling, I asked a friend of mine who owns a shop and used to be
   an IMSA car crew chief about them. He said stop screwing with it,
   you're better off with a quality paper filter.
   Richard
   Austin, TX
   From: DeTomaso <[1]detomaso-[173]bounces at server.detomasolist.com> on
   behalf
   of Mike Reilly <[2][174]reillyms at live.com>
   Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 14:05
   To: marshallgsmith <[3][175]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>, MikeDrew
   <[4][176]MikeLDrew at aol.com>, Charles McCall
   <[5][177]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[6][178]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[7][179]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my car
   does....)
   I recently ditched my K&N filter for a quality paper element. I
   just
   replace it each year and really don't feel it impacts my engine
   performance enough for me to notice compared to a K&N filter. Keep
   it
   simple!
   Sent from my Windows 10 phone
   From: [1]marshallgsmith
   Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2016 6:12 PM
   To: [2]Mike Drew; [3]Charles McCall
   Cc: [4]<[8][180]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
   car
   does....)
   I would not oil the filter till 'after' the test.The oil restricts
   air
   flow slightly.
   M
   Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
   -------- Original message --------
   From: Mike Drew via DeTomaso <[9][181]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Date: 11/12/16 11:59 AM (GMT-08:00)
   To: Charles McCall <[10][182]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   Cc: "<[11][183]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>"
   <[12][184]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
   car
   does....)
   Charlie,
   You likely won't notice a difference with your butt-o-meter. But you
   should definitely just clean the filter. Don't east your time doing
   the
   test drive--use that time to clean the filter instead. There are
   how-to
   videos on Youtube. You should rinse it from the inside out and
   re-oil
   with K&N oil. You can probably find the oil at a motorcycle shop.
   Mike
   Sent from my iPhone
   On Nov 12, 2016, at 9:53, Charles McCall
   <[13][185]charlesmccall at gmail.com>
   wrote:
   > Thank you to all who answered.
   >
   > I understand that a warm engine will contaminate less. The car was
   literally
   > idling for 45 minutes before testing, albeit in 45F ambient
   temperatures, so
   > I think it was properly warmed up. Due to the lines and waiting,
   it
   would be
   > difficult to come off the highway and roll right into a test bay,
   but
   I can
   > let it idle for as long as I'd like before entering the bay. The
   lines tend
   > to be pretty long where I go anyway...
   >
   > I understand that higher rpms will reduce contamination, and
   therefore we
   > should all drive faster to save the planet! I'll raise the rpm a
   little for
   > the test.
   >
   > I'm reluctant to fiddle with leaning out the idle or playing with
   the
   timing
   > - neither have been touched since previous years so I have to
   believe
   that
   > the current settings can work.
   >
   > I'm also cautiously optimistic that the air filter is really,
   really
   > clogged. I've spent a weekend camping at Le Mans Classic in the
   dust,
   driven
   > down a 2,5 km dirt road a bunch of times in Denmark, etc etc.
   Tomorrow it's
   > supposed to be nice so I'll drive around the block with the air
   cleaner
   > removed and see if I notice any difference. If it's clogged enough
   to
   make
   > me fail emissions, maybe I'll notice something with the
   > seat-of-the-pants-o-meter.
   >
   > Thanks again!
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
   > From: DeTomaso
   [[5][14][186]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com]
   On Behalf
   > Of Asa Jay Laughton
   > Sent: sabado, 12 de noviembre de 2016 17:47
   > To: [15][187]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Engine help needed - I've got gas! (or my
   car
   > does....)
   >
   > Also, make sure the engine is good and hot (not
   overheating). Take
   it
   > for a good long spirited drive and then immediately have the
   emissions
   > tested. If the line is too long... come back again later. You
   get
   > better test results when it's been running good and hot for a
   while.
   >
   > Asa
   >
   > Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
   > & Shelley Marie
   > Spokane, WA
   > ******************************
   > [6][16][188]http://w7tsc.org
   > [7][17][189]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
   >
   >
   > On 11/12/2016 3:04 AM, Will Kooiman wrote:
   >> You mean CO and not CO2, right?
   >>
   >> My understanding is to reduce CO and increase Nox, you lean the
   carb
   -
   >> which should also reduce CO2, since it is a byproduct of burning
   gasoline.
   >>
   >> If nothing has changed on your car, perhaps your carburetor just
   needs a
   >> good cleaning.
   >>
   >> The hardest part is knowing if your changes helped without taking
   it
   back
   >> for testing. It would help if you could take it somewhere and
   tune
   it to
   >> pass.
   >>
   >> On 11/12/16, 5:30 AM, "DeTomaso on behalf of Charles McCall"
   >> <[18]detomaso-[190]bounces at server.detomasolist.com on behalf of
   >> [19][191]charlesmccall at gmail.com> wrote:
   >>
   >>> Hi all
   >>>
   >>> Went for my annual safety/technical inspection yesterday and
   failed
   > due
   >>> to two points:
   >>>
   >>> 1) My car door handle is damaged as mentioned on the list a
   few
   weeks
   >>> ago... a replacement is coming for Christmas, but you need to
   be
   able
   >>> to open the door from outside and inside to pass inspection.
   >>>
   >>> 2) Most worrying is that my CO2 levels were excessively high.
   The
   > limit
   >>> hasn't been changed compared to former years, this is the same
   engine
   >>> that has had its emissions tested for the past 15 years and
   nothing
   >>> that I am aware of has changed. Two questions:
   >>>
   >>> 1) What can I change/check to lower my CO2 levels to pass the
   test?
   >>> Will begin by cleaning the air filter - to be honest I don't
   remember
   >>> when I last cleaned it, which tells me something. It's a K&N.
   I
   seem
   > to
   >>> remember that CO2 levels lower at higher rpms and are highest
   at
   idle?
   >>> If this is the case then I'll raise the rpms at idle to pass
   the
   test.
   >>> Any other tricks to temporarily reduce CO2 emissions? I'll be
   happy to
   >>> share my trick for passing the emergency brake portion, which
   I've
   >>> pretty much got down pat now due to practice, but not on a
   public
   > forum
   >>> J
   >>>
   >>> 2) Perhaps more importantly, what is this telling me about my
   engine?
   >>> Is it sick? Is there something that isn't working properly?
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Don't know if it matters but the engine has Aussie closed
   chamber
   >>> heads, a Compcams 282S solid lifter camshaft, MSD 6AL, a
   massaged
   >>> Holley 650DP. Don't think I left out anything that could be
   relevant
   >>> here.
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> I have 20 days to "fix it" and bring it back for re-testing.
   Thanks
   >>> all!
   >>> _______________________________________________
   >>>
   >>>
   >>> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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   >>> DeTomaso mailing list
   >>> [20][192]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   >>>
   [8][21][193]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >>>
   >>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   >>> the links above.
   >>>
   >>> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
   forward
   any
   >>> message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
   the
   list.
   >>> They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or
   >>> approve the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >> _______________________________________________
   >>
   >>
   >> Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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   >>
   >> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.) use
   > the links above.
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   >> Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
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   > message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list.
   > They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or
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   > the archiving of list messages.
   >>
   >>
   >> -----
   >> No virus found in this message.
   >> Checked by AVG - [10][196]www.avg.com
   >> Version: 2016.0.7859 / Virus Database: 4664/13396 - Release Date:
   11/12/16
   > _______________________________________________
   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
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   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [24][197]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [11][25][198]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
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   use
   > the links above.
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   >
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   >
   >
   > Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   > Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   > DeTomaso mailing list
   > [26][199]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   > [12][27][200]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   >
   > To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.)
   use the links above.
   >
   > Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
   the
   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [28][201]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [13][29][202]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.)
   use the links above.
   Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
   message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   References
   1. [30][203]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   2. [31][204]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   3. [32][205]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   4. [33][206]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   5. [34][207]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   6. [35][208]http://w7tsc.org/
   7. [36][209]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   8. [37][210]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   9. [38][211]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   10. [39][212]http://www.avg.com/
   11. [40][213]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   12. [41][214]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   13. [42][215]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [43][216]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [44][217]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
   message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   References
   1. [218]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   2. [219]mailto:reillyms at live.com
   3. [220]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   4. [221]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   5. [222]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   6. [223]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   7. [224]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   8. [225]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   9. [226]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   10. [227]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   11. [228]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   12. [229]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   13. [230]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   14. [231]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   15. [232]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   16. [233]http://w7tsc.org/
   17. [234]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   18. [235]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   19. [236]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   20. [237]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   21. [238]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   22. [239]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   23. [240]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   24. [241]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   25. [242]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   26. [243]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   27. [244]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   28. [245]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   29. [246]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   30. [247]mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   31. [248]mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
   32. [249]mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   33. [250]mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   34. [251]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
   35. [252]http://w7tsc.org/
   36. [253]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
   37. [254]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   38. [255]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   39. [256]http://www.avg.com/
   40. [257]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   41. [258]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   42. [259]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   43. [260]mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   44. [261]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   ------------------------------
   Subject: Digest Footer
   _______________________________________________
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [262]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [263]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
   message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.
   ------------------------------
   End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 149, Issue 14
   *****************************************

References

   1. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   2. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   3. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
   4. mailto:owner at server.detomasolist.com
   5. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
   6. mailto:detomaso at detomasolist.com
   7. mailto:reillyms at live.com
   8. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
   9. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
  10. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  11. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  12. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  13. mailto:MWHPR13MB180819E0A07EB284DFA9BA93BABD0 at MWHPR13MB1808.namprd13.prod.outlook.com
  14. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
  15. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
  16. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
  17. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  18. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
  19. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  20. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  21. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  22. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  23. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  24. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
  25. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  26. http://w7tsc.org/
  27. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  28. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  29. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  30. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  31. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  32. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  33. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  34. http://www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com
  35. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  36. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  37. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  38. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  39. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  40. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  41. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  42. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  43. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  44. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  45. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  46. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  47. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
  48. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  49. http://w7tsc.org/
  50. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  51. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  52. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  53. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  54. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  55. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  56. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  57. http://www.avg.com/
  58. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  59. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  60. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  61. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  62. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  63. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  64. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
  65. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
  66. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
  67. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
  68. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
  69. http://w7tsc.org/
  70. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  71. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  72. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  73. http://www.avg.com/
  74. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  75. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  76. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  77. mailto:pantdino at aol.com
  78. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  79. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  80. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  81. mailto:asajay at asajay.com?
  82. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  83. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  84. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
  85. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  86. http://w7tsc.org/
  87. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  88. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  89. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
  90. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  91. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  92. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  93. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  94. http://www.avg.com/
  95. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  96. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  97. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  98. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  99. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 100. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 101. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 102. http://w7tsc.org/
 103. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 104. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com%20on%20behalf%20of%0b?
 105. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 106. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 107. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 108. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 109. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 110. http://www.avg.com/
 111. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 112. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 113. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 114. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 115. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 116. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 117. mailto:will.kooiman at gmail.com
 118. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 119. mailto:detomaso at detomasolist.com
 120. mailto:9A5B268B1A02 at gmail.com
 121. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 122. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 123. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 124. mailto:Richard at richardgreenblum.com
 125. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 126. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 127. mailto:Richard at richardgreenblum.com
 128. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
 129. mailto:reillyms at live.com
 130. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
 131. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
 132. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 133. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 134. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 135. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 136. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 137. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 138. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 139. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 140. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 141. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 142. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 143. http://w7tsc.org/
 144. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 145. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
 146. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 147. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 148. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 149. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 150. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 151. http://www.avg.com/
 152. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 153. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 154. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 155. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 156. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 157. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 158. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
 159. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
 160. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 161. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 162. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 163. http://w7tsc.org/
 164. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 165. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 166. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 167. http://www.avg.com/
 168. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 169. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 170. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 171. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 172. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 173. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
 174. mailto:reillyms at live.com
 175. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
 176. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
 177. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 178. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 179. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 180. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 181. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 182. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 183. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 184. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 185. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 186. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 187. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 188. http://w7tsc.org/
 189. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 190. mailto:bounces at server.detomasolist.com
 191. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com
 192. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 193. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 194. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 195. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 196. http://www.avg.com/
 197. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 198. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 199. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 200. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 201. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 202. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 203. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
 204. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
 205. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 206. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 207. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 208. http://w7tsc.org/
 209. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 210. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 211. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 212. http://www.avg.com/
 213. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 214. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 215. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 216. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 217. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 218. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 219. mailto:reillyms at live.com?
 220. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
 221. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com?
 222. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 223. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 224. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 225. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 226. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 227. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 228. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 229. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 230. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 231. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 232. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 233. http://w7tsc.org/
 234. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 235. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
 236. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 237. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 238. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 239. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 240. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 241. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 242. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 243. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 244. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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 246. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 247. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net?
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 249. mailto:charlesmccall at gmail.com?
 250. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
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 254. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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 258. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 259. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 260. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com?
 261. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 262. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 263. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso


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