[DeTomaso] Sam

Ken Green kenn_green at yahoo.com
Mon Aug 15 13:58:47 EDT 2016


Laurie,
    The same young people spend the rest of the day glued to their smart phones unaware of the physical world around them.  I suspect they also have no interest in cars unless the cars are in a video game.  They have one foot in the Matrix and would not object to living in virtual realty if that could be arranged.  I worry about the future of mankind.
Ken  
      From: Laurie Ferrari via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
 To: laurieferrari at aol.com; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com 
 Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 10:10 AM
 Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam
   
  p.s. In my experience with young people of the day, they are more
  adapted to and capable of reading electronic material than most adults
  I know.  Many classrooms now use Ipads.

  Laurie

    I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice
    to
    just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to
    hand-off
    to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that?

  -----Original Message-----
  From: laurieferrari <laurieferrari at aol.com>
  To: detomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
  Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:57 am
  Subject: Re: resignations
  Dear AJ,
  I have always respected you and your opinions but in this case you are
  incorrect as far as the resignation of Jack DeRyke.  I was on the Board
  of Directors' conference call where he was asked to stay and he
  adamantly refused to if the printer changed.  Jack's resignation was
  specifically because of the change in printer!  You can go research
  that phone conference call, or the minutes of the meeting, as the facts
  are saved.  As far as Mike Haney's resignation, that was done by his
  Mrs. for their reasons which most likely were aligned with their
  parents.
  Laurie

    In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,?
    [1]asajay at asajay.com writes:
    The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
    interested
    in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
    me,
    it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing
    out on
    full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.?
    However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
    properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will
    properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone.
    I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice
    to
    just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to
    hand-off
    to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that?
    I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership
    database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the
    member's
    profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone number,
    if I
    could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or both,
    and
    select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus
    Newsletter),
    that might be ideal.
    However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well
    could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
    print
    50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the
    board will? look at as well.
    Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from
    more
    than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA
    changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content that
    in
    essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that
    appeared
    to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and
    it's
    unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they
    applied
    to him.
    For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers
    -twice-
    since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got out
    of
    the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was not
    a
    factor in the resignations.
    Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation)
    Asa? Jay
    Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
    &? Shelley? Mar

  -----Original Message-----
  From: detomaso-request <detomaso-[2]request at server.detomasolist.com>
  To: detomaso <[3]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
  Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:00 am
  Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 146, Issue 20
  Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to
  [4]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
  [5]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
  detomaso-[6]request at server.detomasolist.com
  You can reach the person managing the list at
  detomaso-[7]owner at server.detomasolist.com
  When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
  than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..."
  Daily Detomaso List Digest
  Today's Topics:
  1. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (marshallgsmith)
  2. Re: De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!! (Michael Cox)
  3. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (Stephen)
  ----------------------------------------------------------------------
  Message: 1
  Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2016 20:27:43 -0700
  From: marshallgsmith <[8]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>
  To: [9]P6746 at aol.com, [10]asajay at asajay.com,
  [11]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
  Message-ID:
  <[12]sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405 at email.android.com>
  Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
  I have a couple questions Bob:
  > Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making the
  issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
  printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for a
  discount because of the savings.
  > What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the
  board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to
  allow for this discount?
  > Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer to?
  > I agree that the editors should have the most influence ?on the
  process. ?However, our editors of both publications seem to have a hard
  time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the
  publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or will
  radio silence be the norm here?
  Marshall Smith
  Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
  -------- Original message --------
  From: P6746--- via DeTomaso <[13]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
  Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00)
  To: [14]asajay at asajay.com, [15]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
  To use a cliche, we're working on it.?
  Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.?? However, there
  are
  restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently? stand.?
  There
  are no provisions for multiple dues levels,? particularly pertaining to
  how a
  member elects to have their club? publications delivered, etc.? That
  will
  take time as any changes or? amendments must be approved by the whole
  membership.
  The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would? continue as a print
  publication for all except foreign members who elect to? receive it
  digitally.?
  As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is? so
  expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit?
  cost.? So as
  fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit? increases but
  not
  proportionately.??
  An apples to apples comparison was made between an online? printer and
  the
  current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference? was
  pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.?
  As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have? the most
  influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are? the
  ones who
  must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular? basis.
  Bob Reid?
  In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,?
  [16]asajay at asajay.com writes:
  The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
  interested
  in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me,
  it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out
  on
  full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.?
  However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
  properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will
  properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone.
  I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice to
  just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to hand-off
  to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that?
  I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership
  database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the
  member's
  profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone number, if
  I
  could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or both,
  and
  select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus Newsletter),
  that might be ideal.
  However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well
  could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
  print
  50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the
  board will? look at as well.
  Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from
  more
  than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA
  changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content that in
  essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that
  appeared
  to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and it's
  unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they
  applied
  to him.
  For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers -twice-
  since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got out of
  the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was not a
  factor in the resignations.
  Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation)
  Asa? Jay
  Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
  &? Shelley? Marie
  Spokane,? WA
  ******************************
  [17]http://w7tsc.org/
  [18]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso? Email List is not managed by POCA
  Posted emails must not exceed 1.5? Megabytes
  DeTomaso mailing? list
  [19]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [20]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  To? manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
  use
  the? links above.
  Members who post to this list grant license to the list to? forward any
  message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the?
  list. They
  also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or? approve
  the
  archiving of list? messages.
  ?? To use a cliche, we're working on it.
  ?? Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.? However, there
  are
  ?? restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
  ?? There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,
  ?? particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club
  ?? publications delivered, etc.? That will take time as any changes or
  ?? amendments must be approved by the whole membership.
  ?? The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a
  print
  ?? publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
  ?? digitally.
  ?? As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
  ?? expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
  ?? cost.? So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
  ?? increases but not proportionately.
  ?? An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer
  and
  ?? the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
  ?? was pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
  ?? As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
  ?? influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are
  the
  ?? ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
  ?? basis.
  ?? Bob Reid
  ?? In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
  ?? [21]asajay at asajay.com writes:
  ???? The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
  ???? interested
  ???? in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
  ???? me,
  ???? it's a wait and see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing
  out
  ???? on
  ???? full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
  ???? However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
  ???? properly.? I have more faith that the present board members will
  ???? properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
  ???? I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's
  nice
  ???? to
  ???? just sit back and read a paper copy too.? It's also easier to
  ???? hand-off
  ???? to Sam so he can read it later.? How do you really fix that?
  ???? I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
  ???? database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
  ???? member's
  ???? profile or details.? Just as I can set an address and phone
  number,
  ???? if I
  ???? could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or
  both,
  ???? and
  ???? select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus
  Newsletter),
  ???? that might be ideal.
  ???? However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very
  well
  ???? could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
  ???? print
  ???? 50, or 10 (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations
  the
  ???? board will look at as well.
  ???? Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
  ???? more
  ???? than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
  ???? changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content
  that
  ???? in
  ???? essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For a guy that
  ???? appeared
  ???? to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and
  ???? it's
  ???? unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
  ???? applied
  ???? to him.
  ???? For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers
  ???? -twice-
  ???? since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got
  out
  ???? of
  ???? the business.? So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was
  not
  ???? a
  ???? factor in the resignations.
  ???? Just my $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation)
  ???? Asa? Jay
  ???? Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
  ???? &? Shelley Marie
  ???? Spokane, WA
  ???? ******************************
  ???? [22]http://w7tsc.org/
  ???? [23]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  ???? _______________________________________________
  ???? Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
  ???? Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  ???? DeTomaso mailing list
  ???? [24]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  ???? [25]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  ???? To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
  ???? etc.) use the links above.
  ???? Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
  ???? any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
  ???? the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
  ???? archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
  Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  DeTomaso mailing list
  [26]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [27]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
  use the links above.
  Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
  message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
  or approve the archiving of list messages.
  -------------- next part --------------
  I have a couple questions Bob:
  > Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making the
  issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
  printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for a
  discount because of the savings.
  > What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the
  board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to
  allow for this discount?
  > Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer to?
  > I agree that the editors should have the most influence on the
  process. However, our editors of both publications seem to have a hard
  time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the
  publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or will
  radio silence be the norm here?
  Marshall Smith
  Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
  -------- Original message --------
  From: P6746--- via DeTomaso <[28]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
  Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00)
  To: [29]asajay at asajay.com, [30]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
  To use a cliche, we're working on it.
  Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there
  are
  restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
  There
  are no provisions for multiple dues levels, particularly pertaining to
  how a
  member elects to have their club publications delivered, etc. That
  will
  take time as any changes or amendments must be approved by the whole
  membership.
  The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print
  publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
  digitally.
  As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
  expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
  cost. So as
  fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit increases but
  not
  proportionately.
  An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and
  the
  current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference was
  pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
  As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
  influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are the
  ones who
  must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular basis.
  Bob Reid
  In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
  [31]asajay at asajay.com writes:
  The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
  interested
  in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me,
  it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing out
  on
  full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
  However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
  properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
  properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
  I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice to
  just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to hand-off
  to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
  I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
  database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
  member's
  profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone number, if
  I
  could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or both,
  and
  select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus Newsletter),
  that might be ideal.
  However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very well
  could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
  print
  50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations the
  board will look at as well.
  Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
  more
  than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
  changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that in
  essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that
  appeared
  to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and it's
  unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
  applied
  to him.
  For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers -twice-
  since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out of
  the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not a
  factor in the resignations.
  Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation)
  Asa Jay
  Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
  & Shelley Marie
  Spokane, WA
  ******************************
  [32]http://w7tsc.org/
  [33]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
  Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  DeTomaso mailing list
  [34]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [35]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
  use
  the links above.
  Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
  message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
  list. They
  also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve
  the
  archiving of list messages.
  To use a cliche, we're working on it.
  Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there
  are
  restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
  There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,
  particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club
  publications delivered, etc. That will take time as any changes or
  amendments must be approved by the whole membership.
  The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a
  print
  publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
  digitally.
  As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
  expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
  cost. So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
  increases but not proportionately.
  An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer
  and
  the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
  was pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
  As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
  influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are
  the
  ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
  basis.
  Bob Reid
  In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
  [36]asajay at asajay.com writes:
  The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
  interested
  in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
  me,
  it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing
  out
  on
  full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
  However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
  properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
  properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
  I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's
  nice
  to
  just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to
  hand-off
  to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
  I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
  database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
  member's
  profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone
  number,
  if I
  could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or
  both,
  and
  select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus
  Newsletter),
  that might be ideal.
  However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very
  well
  could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
  print
  50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations
  the
  board will look at as well.
  Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
  more
  than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
  changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content
  that
  in
  essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that
  appeared
  to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and
  it's
  unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
  applied
  to him.
  For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers
  -twice-
  since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got
  out
  of
  the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was
  not
  a
  factor in the resignations.
  Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation)
  Asa Jay
  Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
  & Shelley Marie
  Spokane, WA
  ******************************
  [37]http://w7tsc.org/
  [38]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
  Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  DeTomaso mailing list
  [39]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [40]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
  etc.) use the links above.
  Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
  any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
  the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
  archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
  Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  DeTomaso mailing list
  [41]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [42]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
  use the links above.
  Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
  message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
  or approve the archiving of list messages.
  ------------------------------
  Message: 2
  Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2016 20:56:45 -0700
  From: Michael Cox <[43]coxmichaelt at gmail.com>
  To: [44]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!!
  Message-ID:
  <CAMPkPf3HQcqg5vLxgjpJP=7z=UBbrVs=[45]ynAnbzepC1U9QH+A_Q at mail.gmail.com
  >
  Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
  > From: Ed Mendez <[46]edducati at mac.com>
  > Subject: [DeTomaso] De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!!
  >
  > Hi! I found this on eBay and thought you might like it! Check it out
  now! De Tomaso:
  > Other Pantera GTS [47]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  These guys found that ad too. :^)
  [48]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-ha
  s-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
  --michael cox
  -------------- next part --------------
  > From: Ed Mendez <[1][49]edducati at mac.com>
  > Subject: [DeTomaso] De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!!
  >A
  > Hi! I found this on eBay and thought you might like it! Check it out
  now!A De Tomaso:
  > Other Pantera GTSA [2][50]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  These guys found that ad too. A :^)
  [3][51]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera
  -has
  -only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
  A A --michael cox
  References
  1. [52]mailto:edducati at mac.com
  2. [53]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  3.
  [54]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-ha
  s-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
  ------------------------------
  Message: 3
  Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2016 08:05:15 -0700
  From: "Stephen" <[55]steve at snclocks.com>
  To: "'marshallgsmith'" <[56]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>,
  <[57]P6746 at aol.com>, <[58]asajay at asajay.com>,
  <[59]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
  Message-ID: <004701d1f706$6ead4a50$4c07def0$@snclocks.com>
  Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
  Having been on Boards before - I'd suggest the current Board deserves
  some time to catch their breath and recover from the situation they
  have recently been through. It is amazing how much time something like
  this takes - and I suspect everyone on the Board would like to catch up
  on all the things they have let slide while coping with the removal of
  a president and all the animosity and e-mails the whole mess generated.
  It's so easy to ask questions - but takes a lot more time to figure out
  how to do everything asked below. For now, let's just let the Board
  recover and slowly get some of the loose ends taken care of.
  Stephen Nelson
  -----Original Message-----
  From: DeTomaso [[60]mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
  Behalf Of marshallgsmith
  Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2016 8:28 PM
  To: [61]P6746 at aol.com; [62]asajay at asajay.com;
  [63]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
  I have a couple questions Bob:
  > Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making the
  issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
  printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for a
  discount because of the savings.
  > What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the
  board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to
  allow for this discount?
  > Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer to?
  > I agree that the editors should have the most influence on the
  process. However, our editors of both publications seem to have a hard
  time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the
  publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or will
  radio silence be the norm here?
  Marshall Smith
  Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
  -------- Original message --------
  From: P6746--- via DeTomaso <[64]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
  Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00)
  To: [65]asajay at asajay.com, [66]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
  To use a cliche, we're working on it.
  Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there are
  restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
  There are no provisions for multiple dues levels, particularly
  pertaining to how a member elects to have their club publications
  delivered, etc. That will take time as any changes or amendments must
  be approved by the whole membership.
  The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print
  publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
  digitally.
  As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
  expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
  cost. So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
  increases but not proportionately.
  An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and
  the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
  was pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
  As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
  influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are the
  ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
  basis.
  Bob Reid
  In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
  [67]asajay at asajay.com writes:
  The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was interested
  in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me,
  it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing out on
  full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
  However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
  properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
  properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
  I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice to
  just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to hand-off
  to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
  I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
  database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
  member's profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone
  number, if I could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies,
  or both, and select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus
  Newsletter), that might be ideal.
  However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very well
  could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to print
  50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations the
  board will look at as well.
  Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from more
  than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
  changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that in
  essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that appeared
  to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and it's
  unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
  applied to him.
  For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers -twice-
  since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out of
  the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not a
  factor in the resignations.
  Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation) Asa Jay
  Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired & Shelley Marie Spokane,
  WA
  ******************************
  [68]http://w7tsc.org/
  [69]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not
  exceed 1.5 Megabytes DeTomaso mailing list
  [70]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [71]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
  use the links above.
  Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
  message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
  or approve the archiving of list messages.
  To use a cliche, we're working on it.
  Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there are
  restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
  There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,
  particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club
  publications delivered, etc. That will take time as any changes or
  amendments must be approved by the whole membership.
  The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print
  publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
  digitally.
  As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
  expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
  cost. So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
  increases but not proportionately.
  An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and
  the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
  was pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
  As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
  influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are the
  ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
  basis.
  Bob Reid
  In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
  [72]asajay at asajay.com writes:
  The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
  interested
  in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
  me,
  it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing out
  on
  full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
  However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
  properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
  properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
  I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice
  to
  just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to
  hand-off
  to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
  I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
  database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
  member's
  profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone number,
  if I
  could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or both,
  and
  select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus Newsletter),
  that might be ideal.
  However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very well
  could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
  print
  50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations the
  board will look at as well.
  Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
  more
  than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
  changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that
  in
  essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that
  appeared
  to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and
  it's
  unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
  applied
  to him.
  For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers
  -twice-
  since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out
  of
  the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not
  a
  factor in the resignations.
  Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation)
  Asa Jay
  Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
  & Shelley Marie
  Spokane, WA
  ******************************
  [73]http://w7tsc.org/
  [74]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
  Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  DeTomaso mailing list
  [75]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [76]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
  etc.) use the links above.
  Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
  any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
  the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
  archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
  _______________________________________________
  Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not
  exceed 1.5 Megabytes DeTomaso mailing list
  [77]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [78]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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  use the links above.
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  or approve the archiving of list messages.
  ------------------------------
  Subject: Digest Footer
  _______________________________________________
  Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
  DeTomaso mailing list
  [79]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  [80]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
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  message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
  list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
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  ------------------------------
  End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 146, Issue 20
  *****************************************

References

  1. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  2. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
  3. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  4. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  5. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  6. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
  7. mailto:owner at server.detomasolist.com
  8. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
  9. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
  10. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  11. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  12. mailto:sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405 at email.android.com
  13. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  14. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  15. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  16. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  17. http://w7tsc.org/
  18. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  19. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  20. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  21. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  22. http://w7tsc.org/
  23. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  24. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  25. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  26. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  27. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  28. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  29. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  30. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  31. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  32. http://w7tsc.org/
  33. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  34. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  35. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  36. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  37. http://w7tsc.org/
  38. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  39. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  40. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  41. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  42. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  43. mailto:coxmichaelt at gmail.com
  44. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  45. mailto:ynAnbzepC1U9QH+A_Q at mail.gmail.com
  46. mailto:edducati at mac.com
  47. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  48. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-has-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
  49. mailto:edducati at mac.com
  50. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  51. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-has
  52. mailto:edducati at mac.com?
  53. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  54. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-has-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
  55. mailto:steve at snclocks.com
  56. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
  57. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
  58. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  59. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  60. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
  61. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
  62. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  63. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  64. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  65. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  66. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  67. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  68. http://w7tsc.org/
  69. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  70. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  71. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  72. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  73. http://w7tsc.org/
  74. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  75. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  76. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  77. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  78. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  79. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  80. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso

_______________________________________________


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Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
DeTomaso mailing list
DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso

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Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or approve the archiving of list messages.

  
-------------- next part --------------
   Laurie,
       The same young people spend the rest of the day glued to their
   smart phones unaware of the physical world around them.  I suspect they
   also have no interest in cars unless the cars are in a video
   game.  They have one foot in the Matrix and would not object to living
   in virtual realty if that could be arranged.  I worry about the future
   of mankind.
   Ken
     __________________________________________________________________

   From: Laurie Ferrari via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
   To: laurieferrari at aol.com; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 10:10 AM
   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Sam
     p.s. In my experience with young people of the day, they are more
     adapted to and capable of reading electronic material than most
   adults
     I know.  Many classrooms now use Ipads.
     Laurie
       I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's
   nice
       to
       just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to
       hand-off
       to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that?
     -----Original Message-----
     From: laurieferrari <[1]laurieferrari at aol.com>
     To: detomaso <[2]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
     Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:57 am
     Subject: Re: resignations
     Dear AJ,
     I have always respected you and your opinions but in this case you
   are
     incorrect as far as the resignation of Jack DeRyke.  I was on the
   Board
     of Directors' conference call where he was asked to stay and he
     adamantly refused to if the printer changed.  Jack's resignation was
     specifically because of the change in printer!  You can go research
     that phone conference call, or the minutes of the meeting, as the
   facts
     are saved.  As far as Mike Haney's resignation, that was done by his
     Mrs. for their reasons which most likely were aligned with their
     parents.
     Laurie
       In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,?
       [1][3]asajay at asajay.com writes:
       The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
       interested
       in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
       me,
       it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing
       out on
       full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is
   amiss.?
       However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
       properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will
       properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone.
       I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's
   nice
       to
       just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to
       hand-off
       to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that?
       I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership
       database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the
       member's
       profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone
   number,
       if I
       could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or
   both,
       and
       select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus
       Newsletter),
       that might be ideal.
       However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very
   well
       could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
       print
       50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations
   the
       board will? look at as well.
       Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from
       more
       than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA
       changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content
   that
       in
       essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that
       appeared
       to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and
       it's
       unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they
       applied
       to him.
       For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers
       -twice-
       since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got
   out
       of
       the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was
   not
       a
       factor in the resignations.
       Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation)
       Asa? Jay
       Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
       &? Shelley? Mar
     -----Original Message-----
     From: detomaso-request
   <detomaso-[2][4]request at server.detomasolist.com>
     To: detomaso <[3][5]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
     Sent: Mon, Aug 15, 2016 9:00 am
     Subject: DeTomaso Digest, Vol 146, Issue 20
     Send DeTomaso mailing list submissions to
     [4][6]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
     [5][7]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
     detomaso-[6][8]request at server.detomasolist.com
     You can reach the person managing the list at
     detomaso-[7][9]owner at server.detomasolist.com
     When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
     than "Re: Contents of DeTomaso digest..."
     Daily Detomaso List Digest
     Today's Topics:
     1. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (marshallgsmith)
     2. Re: De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!! (Michael Cox)
     3. Re: Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic (Stephen)

   ----------------------------------------------------------------------
     Message: 1
     Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2016 20:27:43 -0700
     From: marshallgsmith <[8][10]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>
     To: [9][11]P6746 at aol.com, [10][12]asajay at asajay.com,
     [11][13]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
     Message-ID:
     <[12][14]sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405 at email.android.com>
     Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
     I have a couple questions Bob:
     > Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making
   the
     issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
     printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for
   a
     discount because of the savings.
     > What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the
     board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to
     allow for this discount?
     > Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer
   to?
     > I agree that the editors should have the most influence ?on the
     process. ?However, our editors of both publications seem to have a
   hard
     time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the
     publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or
   will
     radio silence be the norm here?
     Marshall Smith
     Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
     -------- Original message --------
     From: P6746--- via DeTomaso
   <[13][15]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
     Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00)
     To: [14][16]asajay at asajay.com,
   [15][17]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
     To use a cliche, we're working on it.?
     Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.?? However, there
     are
     restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently?
   stand.?
     There
     are no provisions for multiple dues levels,? particularly pertaining
   to
     how a
     member elects to have their club? publications delivered, etc.? That
     will
     take time as any changes or? amendments must be approved by the whole
     membership.
     The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would? continue as a
   print
     publication for all except foreign members who elect to? receive it
     digitally.?
     As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is? so
     expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit?
     cost.? So as
     fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit? increases
   but
     not
     proportionately.??
     An apples to apples comparison was made between an online? printer
   and
     the
     current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference? was
     pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.?
     As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have? the most
     influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are?
   the
     ones who
     must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular? basis.
     Bob Reid?
     In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,?
     [16][18]asajay at asajay.com writes:
     The last? I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
     interested
     in doing a? -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
   me,
     it's a wait and? see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing out
     on
     full-color? and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.?
     However, I? also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
     properly.? I? have more faith that the present board members will
     properly investigate? and sort it out for everyone.
     I am on-board with electronic delivery,? though I do admit it's nice
   to
     just sit back and read a paper copy? too.? It's also easier to
   hand-off
     to Sam so he can read it? later.? How do you really fix that?
     I would think (and I don't? know), that the ClubExpress membership
     database might be able to include a? "preference" as part of the
     member's
     profile or details.? Just as I? can set an address and phone number,
   if
     I
     could check a box for Electronic? delivery or paper copies, or both,
     and
     select whatever I wanted for each? item (Profiles versus Newsletter),
     that might be ideal.
     However,? I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very well
     could be? that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
     print
     50, or 10? (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations the
     board will? look at as well.
     Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have? heard (from
     more
     than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign? "because POCA
     changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter? content that
   in
     essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For? a guy that
     appeared
     to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the? by-laws (and
   it's
     unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't? feel they
     applied
     to him.
     For the record, as I understand it, POCA? has changed printers
   -twice-
     since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related? to the DeRykes) got out
   of
     the business.? So the "family tie-in"? previously eluded to, was not
   a
     factor in the resignations.
     Just my? $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation)
     Asa? Jay
     Asa Jay? Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
     &? Shelley? Marie
     Spokane,? WA
     ******************************
     [17][19]http://w7tsc.org/
     [18][20]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso? Email List is not managed by POCA
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5? Megabytes
     DeTomaso mailing? list
     [19][21]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [20][22]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To? manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
   etc.)
     use
     the? links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to? forward
   any
     message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the?
     list. They
     also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or?
   approve
     the
     archiving of list? messages.
     ?? To use a cliche, we're working on it.
     ?? Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.? However,
   there
     are
     ?? restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently
   stand.
     ?? There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,
     ?? particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club
     ?? publications delivered, etc.? That will take time as any changes
   or
     ?? amendments must be approved by the whole membership.
     ?? The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a
     print
     ?? publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
     ?? digitally.
     ?? As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
     ?? expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per
   unit
     ?? cost.? So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per
   unit
     ?? increases but not proportionately.
     ?? An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer
     and
     ?? the current printer for both printing and mailing and the
   difference
     ?? was pennies.? That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
     ?? As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the
   most
     ?? influence as to how and where their product is produced.? They are
     the
     ?? ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a
   regular
     ?? basis.
     ?? Bob Reid
     ?? In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
     ?? [21][23]asajay at asajay.com writes:
     ???? The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
     ???? interested
     ???? in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so
   for
     ???? me,
     ???? it's a wait and see kind of thing.? I agree, if POCA was missing
     out
     ???? on
     ???? full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is
   amiss.
     ???? However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
     ???? properly.? I have more faith that the present board members will
     ???? properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
     ???? I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's
     nice
     ???? to
     ???? just sit back and read a paper copy too.? It's also easier to
     ???? hand-off
     ???? to Sam so he can read it later.? How do you really fix that?
     ???? I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress
   membership
     ???? database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
     ???? member's
     ???? profile or details.? Just as I can set an address and phone
     number,
     ???? if I
     ???? could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or
     both,
     ???? and
     ???? select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus
     Newsletter),
     ???? that might be ideal.
     ???? However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.? It very
     well
     ???? could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does
   to
     ???? print
     ???? 50, or 10 (but I doubt it).? I imagine those are considerations
     the
     ???? board will look at as well.
     ???? Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard
   (from
     ???? more
     ???? than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because
   POCA
     ???? changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content
     that
     ???? in
     ???? essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.? For a guy that
     ???? appeared
     ???? to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and
     ???? it's
     ???? unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
     ???? applied
     ???? to him.
     ???? For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers
     ???? -twice-
     ???? since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got
     out
     ???? of
     ???? the business.? So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was
     not
     ???? a
     ???? factor in the resignations.
     ???? Just my $1.50? (two cents adjusted for inflation)
     ???? Asa? Jay
     ???? Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
     ???? &? Shelley Marie
     ???? Spokane, WA
     ???? ******************************
     ???? [22][24]http://w7tsc.org/
     ???? [23][25]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     ???? _______________________________________________
     ???? Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
     ???? Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
     ???? DeTomaso mailing list
     ???? [24][26]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     ???? [25][27]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     ???? To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
     ???? etc.) use the links above.
     ???? Members who post to this list grant license to the list to
   forward
     ???? any message posted here to all past, current, or future members
   of
     ???? the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain
   an
     ???? archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
     DeTomaso mailing list
     [26][28]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [27][29]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
     use the links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
     message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
     list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
     or approve the archiving of list messages.
     -------------- next part --------------
     I have a couple questions Bob:
     > Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making
   the
     issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
     printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for
   a
     discount because of the savings.
     > What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the
     board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to
     allow for this discount?
     > Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer
   to?
     > I agree that the editors should have the most influence on the
     process. However, our editors of both publications seem to have a
   hard
     time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the
     publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or
   will
     radio silence be the norm here?
     Marshall Smith
     Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
     -------- Original message --------
     From: P6746--- via DeTomaso
   <[28][30]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
     Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00)
     To: [29][31]asajay at asajay.com,
   [30][32]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
     To use a cliche, we're working on it.
     Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there
     are
     restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
     There
     are no provisions for multiple dues levels, particularly pertaining
   to
     how a
     member elects to have their club publications delivered, etc. That
     will
     take time as any changes or amendments must be approved by the whole
     membership.
     The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print
     publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
     digitally.
     As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
     expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
     cost. So as
     fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit increases but
     not
     proportionately.
     An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and
     the
     current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference was
     pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
     As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
     influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are the
     ones who
     must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular basis.
     Bob Reid
     In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
     [31][33]asajay at asajay.com writes:
     The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
     interested
     in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me,
     it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing out
     on
     full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
     However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
     properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
     properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
     I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice
   to
     just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to hand-off
     to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
     I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
     database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
     member's
     profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone number, if
     I
     could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or both,
     and
     select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus Newsletter),
     that might be ideal.
     However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very well
     could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
     print
     50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations the
     board will look at as well.
     Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
     more
     than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
     changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that
   in
     essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that
     appeared
     to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and it's
     unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
     applied
     to him.
     For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers -twice-
     since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out
   of
     the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not a
     factor in the resignations.
     Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation)
     Asa Jay
     Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
     & Shelley Marie
     Spokane, WA
     ******************************
     [32][34]http://w7tsc.org/
     [33][35]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
     DeTomaso mailing list
     [34][36]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [35][37]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
     use
     the links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
     message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
     list. They
     also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive or
   approve
     the
     archiving of list messages.
     To use a cliche, we're working on it.
     Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there
     are
     restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
     There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,
     particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club
     publications delivered, etc. That will take time as any changes or
     amendments must be approved by the whole membership.
     The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a
     print
     publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
     digitally.
     As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
     expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
     cost. So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
     increases but not proportionately.
     An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer
     and
     the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
     was pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
     As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
     influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are
     the
     ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
     basis.
     Bob Reid
     In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
     [36][38]asajay at asajay.com writes:
     The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
     interested
     in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
     me,
     it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing
     out
     on
     full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
     However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
     properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
     properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
     I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's
     nice
     to
     just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to
     hand-off
     to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
     I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
     database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
     member's
     profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone
     number,
     if I
     could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or
     both,
     and
     select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus
     Newsletter),
     that might be ideal.
     However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very
     well
     could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
     print
     50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations
     the
     board will look at as well.
     Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
     more
     than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
     changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content
     that
     in
     essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that
     appeared
     to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and
     it's
     unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
     applied
     to him.
     For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers
     -twice-
     since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got
     out
     of
     the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was
     not
     a
     factor in the resignations.
     Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation)
     Asa Jay
     Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
     & Shelley Marie
     Spokane, WA
     ******************************
     [37][39]http://w7tsc.org/
     [38][40]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
     DeTomaso mailing list
     [39][41]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [40][42]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
     etc.) use the links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
     any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
     the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
     archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
     DeTomaso mailing list
     [41][43]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [42][44]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
     use the links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
     message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
     list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
     or approve the archiving of list messages.
     ------------------------------
     Message: 2
     Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2016 20:56:45 -0700
     From: Michael Cox <[43][45]coxmichaelt at gmail.com>
     To: [44][46]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!!
     Message-ID:

   <CAMPkPf3HQcqg5vLxgjpJP=7z=UBbrVs=[45]ynAnbzepC1U9QH+[47]A_Q at mail.gmail
   .com
     >
     Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
     > From: Ed Mendez <[46][48]edducati at mac.com>
     > Subject: [DeTomaso] De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!!
     >
     > Hi! I found this on eBay and thought you might like it! Check it
   out
     now! De Tomaso:
     > Other Pantera GTS [47][49]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
     These guys found that ad too. :^)

   [48][50]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-panter
   a-ha
     s-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
     --michael cox
     -------------- next part --------------
     > From: Ed Mendez <[1][49][51]edducati at mac.com>
     > Subject: [DeTomaso] De Tomaso Pantera GTS on eBay! again $250K!!
     >A
     > Hi! I found this on eBay and thought you might like it! Check it
   out
     now!A De Tomaso:
     > Other Pantera GTSA [2][50][52]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
     These guys found that ad too. A :^)

   [3][51][53]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pan
   tera
     -has
     -only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
     A A --michael cox
     References
     1. [52]mailto:[54]edducati at mac.com
     2. [53][55]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
     3.

   [54][56]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-panter
   a-ha
     s-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
     ------------------------------
     Message: 3
     Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2016 08:05:15 -0700
     From: "Stephen" <[55][57]steve at snclocks.com>
     To: "'marshallgsmith'" <[56][58]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net>,
     <[57][59]P6746 at aol.com>, <[58][60]asajay at asajay.com>,
     <[59][61]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
     Message-ID: <004701d1f706$6ead4a50$4c07def0$@snclocks.com>
     Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
     Having been on Boards before - I'd suggest the current Board deserves
     some time to catch their breath and recover from the situation they
     have recently been through. It is amazing how much time something
   like
     this takes - and I suspect everyone on the Board would like to catch
   up
     on all the things they have let slide while coping with the removal
   of
     a president and all the animosity and e-mails the whole mess
   generated.
     It's so easy to ask questions - but takes a lot more time to figure
   out
     how to do everything asked below. For now, let's just let the Board
     recover and slowly get some of the loose ends taken care of.
     Stephen Nelson
     -----Original Message-----
     From: DeTomaso
   [[60]mailto:[62]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On
     Behalf Of marshallgsmith
     Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2016 8:28 PM
     To: [61][63]P6746 at aol.com; [62][64]asajay at asajay.com;
     [63][65]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
     I have a couple questions Bob:
     > Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making
   the
     issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have
     printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for
   a
     discount because of the savings.
     > What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the
     board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to
     allow for this discount?
     > Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer
   to?
     > I agree that the editors should have the most influence on the
     process. However, our editors of both publications seem to have a
   hard
     time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the
     publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or
   will
     radio silence be the norm here?
     Marshall Smith
     Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone
     -------- Original message --------
     From: P6746--- via DeTomaso
   <[64][66]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
     Date: 8/14/16 3:10 PM (GMT-08:00)
     To: [65][67]asajay at asajay.com,
   [66][68]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic
     To use a cliche, we're working on it.
     Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there
   are
     restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
     There are no provisions for multiple dues levels, particularly
     pertaining to how a member elects to have their club publications
     delivered, etc. That will take time as any changes or amendments must
     be approved by the whole membership.
     The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print
     publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
     digitally.
     As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
     expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
     cost. So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
     increases but not proportionately.
     An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and
     the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
     was pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
     As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
     influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are the
     ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
     basis.
     Bob Reid
     In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
     [67][69]asajay at asajay.com writes:
     The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
   interested
     in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me,
     it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing out
   on
     full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
     However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
     properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
     properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
     I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice
   to
     just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to hand-off
     to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
     I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
     database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
     member's profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone
     number, if I could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper
   copies,
     or both, and select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus
     Newsletter), that might be ideal.
     However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very well
     could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
   print
     50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations the
     board will look at as well.
     Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
   more
     than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
     changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that
   in
     essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that
   appeared
     to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and it's
     unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
     applied to him.
     For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers -twice-
     since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out
   of
     the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not a
     factor in the resignations.
     Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation) Asa Jay
     Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired & Shelley Marie
   Spokane,
     WA
     ******************************
     [68][70]http://w7tsc.org/
     [69][71]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not
     exceed 1.5 Megabytes DeTomaso mailing list
     [70][72]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [71][73]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
     use the links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
     message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
     list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
     or approve the archiving of list messages.
     To use a cliche, we're working on it.
     Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline. However, there
   are
     restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
     There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,
     particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club
     publications delivered, etc. That will take time as any changes or
     amendments must be approved by the whole membership.
     The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print
     publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
     digitally.
     As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
     expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
     cost. So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
     increases but not proportionately.
     An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and
     the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
     was pennies. That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.
     As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
     influence as to how and where their product is produced. They are the
     ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
     basis.
     Bob Reid
     In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
     [72][74]asajay at asajay.com writes:
     The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
     interested
     in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
     me,
     it's a wait and see kind of thing. I agree, if POCA was missing out
     on
     full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
     However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
     properly. I have more faith that the present board members will
     properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
     I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice
     to
     just sit back and read a paper copy too. It's also easier to
     hand-off
     to Sam so he can read it later. How do you really fix that?
     I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
     database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
     member's
     profile or details. Just as I can set an address and phone number,
     if I
     could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or both,
     and
     select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus Newsletter),
     that might be ideal.
     However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting. It very well
     could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
     print
     50, or 10 (but I doubt it). I imagine those are considerations the
     board will look at as well.
     Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
     more
     than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
     changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that
     in
     essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws. For a guy that
     appeared
     to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and
     it's
     unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
     applied
     to him.
     For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers
     -twice-
     since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out
     of
     the business. So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not
     a
     factor in the resignations.
     Just my $1.50 (two cents adjusted for inflation)
     Asa Jay
     Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
     & Shelley Marie
     Spokane, WA
     ******************************
     [73][75]http://w7tsc.org/
     [74][76]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
     DeTomaso mailing list
     [75][77]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [76][78]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe,
     etc.) use the links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
     any message posted here to all past, current, or future members of
     the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
     archive or approve the archiving of list messages.
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA Posted emails must not
     exceed 1.5 Megabytes DeTomaso mailing list
     [77][79]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [78][80]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
     use the links above.
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
     message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
     list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
     or approve the archiving of list messages.
     ------------------------------
     Subject: Digest Footer
     _______________________________________________
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
     DeTomaso mailing list
     [79][81]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     [80][82]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward
   any
     message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
     list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
   archive
     or approve the archiving of list messages.
     ------------------------------
     End of DeTomaso Digest, Vol 146, Issue 20
     *****************************************
   References
     1. mailto:[83]asajay at asajay.com
     2. mailto:[84]request at server.detomasolist.com
     3. mailto:[85]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     4. mailto:[86]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     5. [87]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     6. mailto:[88]request at server.detomasolist.com
     7. mailto:[89]owner at server.detomasolist.com
     8. mailto:[90]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
     9. mailto:[91]P6746 at aol.com
     10. mailto:[92]asajay at asajay.com
     11. mailto:[93]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     12.
   mailto:[94]sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405 at email.android.com
     13. mailto:[95]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     14. mailto:[96]asajay at asajay.com
     15. mailto:[97]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     16. mailto:[98]asajay at asajay.com
     17. [99]http://w7tsc.org/
     18. [100]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     19. mailto:[101]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     20. [102]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     21. mailto:[103]asajay at asajay.com
     22. [104]http://w7tsc.org/
     23. [105]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     24. mailto:[106]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     25. [107]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     26. mailto:[108]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     27. [109]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     28. mailto:[110]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     29. mailto:[111]asajay at asajay.com
     30. mailto:[112]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     31. mailto:[113]asajay at asajay.com
     32. [114]http://w7tsc.org/
     33. [115]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     34. mailto:[116]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     35. [117]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     36. mailto:[118]asajay at asajay.com
     37. [119]http://w7tsc.org/
     38. [120]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     39. mailto:[121]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     40. [122]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     41. mailto:[123]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     42. [124]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     43. mailto:[125]coxmichaelt at gmail.com
     44. mailto:[126]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     45. mailto:ynAnbzepC1U9QH+[127]A_Q at mail.gmail.com
     46. mailto:[128]edducati at mac.com
     47. [129]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
     48.
   [130]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-h
   as-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
     49. mailto:[131]edducati at mac.com
     50. [132]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
     51.
   [133]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-h
   as
     52. mailto:[134]edducati at mac.com?
     53. [135]http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
     54.
   [136]http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-h
   as-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
     55. mailto:[137]steve at snclocks.com
     56. mailto:[138]marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
     57. mailto:[139]P6746 at aol.com
     58. mailto:[140]asajay at asajay.com
     59. mailto:[141]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     60. mailto:[142]detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com?
     61. mailto:[143]P6746 at aol.com
     62. mailto:[144]asajay at asajay.com
     63. mailto:[145]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     64. mailto:[146]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     65. mailto:[147]asajay at asajay.com
     66. mailto:[148]detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     67. mailto:[149]asajay at asajay.com
     68. [150]http://w7tsc.org/
     69. [151]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     70. mailto:[152]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     71. [153]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     72. mailto:[154]asajay at asajay.com
     73. [155]http://w7tsc.org/
     74. [156]http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
     75. mailto:[157]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     76. [158]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     77. mailto:[159]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     78. [160]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
     79. mailto:[161]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
     80. [162]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   _______________________________________________
   Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
   Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
   DeTomaso mailing list
   [163]DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   [164]http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.)
   use the links above.
   Members who post to this list grant license to the list to forward any
   message posted here to all past, current, or future members of the
   list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an archive
   or approve the archiving of list messages.

References

   1. mailto:laurieferrari at aol.com
   2. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   3. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
   4. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
   5. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   6. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
   7. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
   8. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
   9. mailto:owner at server.detomasolist.com
  10. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
  11. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
  12. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  13. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  14. mailto:sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405 at email.android.com
  15. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  16. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  17. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  18. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  19. http://w7tsc.org/
  20. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  21. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  22. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  23. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  24. http://w7tsc.org/
  25. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  26. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  27. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  28. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  29. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  30. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  31. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  32. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  33. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  34. http://w7tsc.org/
  35. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  36. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  37. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  38. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  39. http://w7tsc.org/
  40. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  41. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  42. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  43. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  44. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  45. mailto:coxmichaelt at gmail.com
  46. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  47. mailto:A_Q at mail.gmail.com
  48. mailto:edducati at mac.com
  49. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  50. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-ha
  51. mailto:edducati at mac.com
  52. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  53. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera
  54. mailto:edducati at mac.com
  55. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
  56. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-ha
  57. mailto:steve at snclocks.com
  58. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
  59. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
  60. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  61. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  62. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
  63. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
  64. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  65. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  66. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  67. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  68. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  69. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  70. http://w7tsc.org/
  71. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  72. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  73. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  74. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  75. http://w7tsc.org/
  76. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
  77. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  78. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  79. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  80. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  81. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  82. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  83. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  84. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
  85. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  86. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  87. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
  88. mailto:request at server.detomasolist.com
  89. mailto:owner at server.detomasolist.com
  90. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
  91. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
  92. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  93. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  94. mailto:sdxpj9k7caacwyvlamgw7uly.1471231663405 at email.android.com
  95. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  96. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  97. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
  98. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
  99. http://w7tsc.org/
 100. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 101. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 102. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 103. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 104. http://w7tsc.org/
 105. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 106. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 107. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 108. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 109. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 110. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 111. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 112. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 113. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 114. http://w7tsc.org/
 115. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 116. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 117. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 118. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 119. http://w7tsc.org/
 120. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 121. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 122. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 123. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 124. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 125. mailto:coxmichaelt at gmail.com
 126. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 127. mailto:A_Q at mail.gmail.com
 128. mailto:edducati at mac.com
 129. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
 130. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-has-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
 131. mailto:edducati at mac.com
 132. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
 133. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-has
 134. mailto:edducati at mac.com
 135. http://r.ebay.com/qvHdvC
 136. http://news.boldride.com/2016/08/this-stunning-de-tomaso-pantera-has-only-785-miles-to-its-name/109069/
 137. mailto:steve at snclocks.com
 138. mailto:marshallgsmith at sbcglobal.net
 139. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
 140. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 141. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 142. mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com
 143. mailto:P6746 at aol.com
 144. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 145. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 146. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 147. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 148. mailto:detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 149. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 150. http://w7tsc.org/
 151. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 152. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 153. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 154. mailto:asajay at asajay.com
 155. http://w7tsc.org/
 156. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
 157. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 158. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 159. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 160. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 161. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 162. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso
 163. mailto:DeTomaso at server.detomasolist.com
 164. http://server.detomasolist.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso


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