[DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic

Stephen steve at snclocks.com
Mon Aug 15 11:05:15 EDT 2016


Having been on Boards before - I'd suggest the current Board deserves some time to catch their breath and recover from the situation they have recently been through.  It is amazing how much time something like this takes - and I suspect everyone on the Board would like to catch up on all the things they have let slide while coping with the removal of a president and all the animosity and e-mails the whole mess generated.

It's so easy to ask questions - but takes a lot more time to figure out how to do everything asked below.  For now, let's just let the Board recover and slowly get some of the loose ends taken care of.

Stephen Nelson


-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at server.detomasolist.com] On Behalf Of marshallgsmith
Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2016 8:28 PM
To: P6746 at aol.com; asajay at asajay.com; detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic


    
I have a couple questions Bob:
> Calling this situation "multiple dues levels" seems to be making the issue too complex. There are some members that are opting to not have printed magazines mailed which should make those members eligible for a discount because of the savings.
> What is your estimate of the length of time that it would take the board to arrange for a vote of the membership to change the bylaws to allow for this discount?
> Who specifically made that apples-to-apples comparison you refer to?
> I agree that the editors should have the most influence  on the process.  However, our editors of both publications seem to have a hard time reporting to the members about ANY issues pertaining to the publication's themselves. Might that change in the near future or will radio silence be the norm here?
Marshall Smith


Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: P6746--- via DeTomaso <detomaso at server.detomasolist.com>
Date: 8/14/16  3:10 PM  (GMT-08:00)
To: asajay at asajay.com, detomaso at server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Newsletters, cost, paper vs. electronic 

To use a cliche, we're working on it.  
 
Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.   However, there are restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently  stand.  There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,  particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club  publications delivered, etc.  That will take time as any changes or  amendments must be approved by the whole membership. 
 
The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would  continue as a print publication for all except foreign members who elect to  receive it digitally.  
 
As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is  so expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit  cost.  So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit  increases but not proportionately.   
 
An apples to apples comparison was made between an online  printer and the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference  was pennies.  That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.  
 
As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have  the most influence as to how and where their product is produced.  They are  the ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular  basis.
 
Bob Reid  
 
 
 
In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, asajay at asajay.com writes:

The last  I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was interested in doing a  -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for me, it's a wait and  see kind of thing.  I agree, if POCA was missing out on full-color  and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss. However, I  also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs properly.  I  have more faith that the present board members will properly investigate  and sort it out for everyone.

I am on-board with electronic delivery,  though I do admit it's nice to just sit back and read a paper copy  too.  It's also easier to hand-off to Sam so he can read it  later.  How do you really fix that?

I would think (and I don't  know), that the ClubExpress membership database might be able to include a  "preference" as part of the member's profile or details.  Just as I  can set an address and phone number, if I could check a box for Electronic  delivery or paper copies, or both, and select whatever I wanted for each  item (Profiles versus Newsletter), that might be ideal.

However,  I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.  It very well could be  that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to print 50, or 10  (but I doubt it).  I imagine those are considerations the board will  look at as well.

Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have  heard (from more than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign  "because POCA changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter  content that in essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.  For  a guy that appeared to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the  by-laws (and it's unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't  feel they applied to him.

For the record, as I understand it, POCA  has changed printers -twice- since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related  to the DeRykes) got out of the business.  So the "family tie-in"  previously eluded to, was not a factor in the resignations.

Just my  $1.50  (two cents adjusted for inflation) Asa  Jay

Asa Jay  Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired &  Shelley  Marie Spokane,  WA
******************************
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com


_______________________________________________


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   To use a cliche, we're working on it.



   Most of what has been mentioned is in the pipeline.  However, there are
   restrictions, particularly with the By-Laws as they currently stand.
   There are no provisions for multiple dues levels,
   particularly pertaining to how a member elects to have their club
   publications delivered, etc.  That will take time as any changes or
   amendments must be approved by the whole membership.



   The consensus seems to be that the Profiles would continue as a print
   publication for all except foreign members who elect to receive it
   digitally.



   As far as printing is concerned, it is that first copy that is so
   expensive, it is the subsequent copies that bring down the per unit
   cost.  So as fewer units are produced and shipped, the cost per unit
   increases but not proportionately.



   An apples to apples comparison was made between an online printer and
   the current printer for both printing and mailing and the difference
   was pennies.  That wasn't pennies per unit but for the whole run.



   As far as I am concerned, it is the editors who should have the most
   influence as to how and where their product is produced.  They are the
   ones who must work with the printers and mailing houses on a regular
   basis.



   Bob Reid





   In a message dated 8/13/2016 9:54:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
   asajay at asajay.com writes:

     The last I heard (and I may have heard wrong), the board was
     interested
     in doing a -real- accounting comparison of printing costs, so for
     me,
     it's a wait and see kind of thing.  I agree, if POCA was missing out
     on
     full-color and paying $8,000 more for B/W then something is amiss.
     However, I also believe Mr. Shortt didn't account for all costs
     properly.  I have more faith that the present board members will
     properly investigate and sort it out for everyone.
     I am on-board with electronic delivery, though I do admit it's nice
     to
     just sit back and read a paper copy too.  It's also easier to
     hand-off
     to Sam so he can read it later.  How do you really fix that?
     I would think (and I don't know), that the ClubExpress membership
     database might be able to include a "preference" as part of the
     member's
     profile or details.  Just as I can set an address and phone number,
     if I
     could check a box for Electronic delivery or paper copies, or both,
     and
     select whatever I wanted for each item (Profiles versus Newsletter),
     that might be ideal.
     However, I'm also familiar with quantity discounting.  It very well
     could be that it costs the same amount to print 500 as it does to
     print
     50, or 10 (but I doubt it).  I imagine those are considerations the
     board will look at as well.
     Oh, and in contrast to what Laurie has claimed, I have heard (from
     more
     than one person), that Jack and Mike did not resign "because POCA
     changed printers;" it was over "control" of newsletter content that
     in
     essence fell outside the bounds of the by-laws.  For a guy that
     appeared
     to try very hard to get everyone else to follow the by-laws (and
     it's
     unwritten code of ethics), Mr. Shortt certainly didn't feel they
     applied
     to him.
     For the record, as I understand it, POCA has changed printers
     -twice-
     since the Fertitta's (sp) (who were related to the DeRykes) got out
     of
     the business.  So the "family tie-in" previously eluded to, was not
     a
     factor in the resignations.
     Just my $1.50  (two cents adjusted for inflation)
     Asa  Jay
     Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
     &  Shelley Marie
     Spokane, WA
     ******************************
     http://w7tsc.org
     http://www.teampanteraracing.com
     _______________________________________________
     Detomaso Email List is not managed by POCA
     Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
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     the list. They also grant the list owner permission to maintain an
     archive or approve the archiving of list messages.

_______________________________________________


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