[DeTomaso] IR FI system

Ed Mendez edducati at mac.com
Thu Oct 22 17:59:52 EDT 2015


I only paid $4300 for my polished Hilborn 8-stack EFI, running no AIC and runs Bitchin. Using FAST XFI.

They even custom port matched it to my CHI 3V heads. They fit perfectly look bitchin  and runs great! Best of all I did not even have to cut my decklid using short velocity stacks it all fit under the engine screen.

Got it from Mike Chilando alkydigger.net

Sent from my iPhone 6 Plus

> On 23/10/2015, at 10:51, Cullen McCann <cmccann1972 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>   Robert,
>   There is an EFI Individual Throttle Bodies group in Australia. I seems
>   like a guy named John Cain built them then stopped.A Now a group called
>   Aussiespeed picked up some similar designA stuff.A  I wonder if they
>   affiliated.
>   Here is one group that makes the same systems... gulp... try 5 grand
>   for the Cleveland system:
>   [1]https://www.efihardware.com/products/c393/Ford-8-Cylinder-Throttle-B
>   ody-Kits
>   I am not an engine builder but I've asked the same questions about the
>   size of the throttle bodies that you have asked. I have been told that
>   by principal, they should flow similar to the same motor as would weber
>   carbs (48mm IDA) so research for that motor should yield similar
>   performance potential with the EFI version of the downdraft ITB's we
>   are discussing here. If anything they should OUTFLOW the Webers
>   slightly on volume since they are 50mm instead of 48 and there is no
>   venturi in the center to reduce airflow.
>   That being said, I've heard that these ITB motors tend to perform best
>   asA high RPM motors, and tend to struggle for street ability to get
>   good idle quality. I have heard throttle response can be phenomenal,
>   almost to a fault. If you do the math on the total volume of airflow
>   potential with 8 cylindrical stacks of 50mm diameter, the airflow seems
>   hugely over sized for just about any motor. We all know the
>   consequences of over carbureting. So I think that's something to
>   consider. I could do the math on pi x radius of 50mm squared x height
>   of stack x 8 bores and compare that to a 750 cfm carb, but I don't have
>   the time right now. I know its more than the equivalent carb. Honestly
>   I don't know how Webers get away with it, but I know they can run
>   great.
>   Again, when I hear/ read real engine building masters like Dan Jones
>   discuss it, I'm humbled, so take it with a grain of salt and I could be
>   dead wrong. Just what Ive heard when sitting around the table. I do
>   believe is hard to answer the question you have asked. Given no details
>   about head properties... valve and port flow, compression and cam
>   profile...etc. high horsepower numbers alone wont tell most engine
>   builders enough about it to speculate if one induction system is
>   advantageous over another...so I doubt you'll get much good intel...but
>   I can appreciate the way you are thinking. Please keep me in the loop
>   about what you are doing, because I'm interested in the downdraft EFI
>   systems.
>   I like the ITB EFI system so much.... SO MUCH ...I would be prepared to
>   build an entire engine with the needed characteristics JUST to justify
>   its use...even more than being motivated by driving characteristics. I
>   know... that sounds crazy...but its JUST that cool. I would take a
>   driving COMPROMISE to have them. ( until I change my mind)
>   Cullen
> 
>   On Wed, Oct 21, 2015 at 5:41 PM, Robert Stroj <[2]npdrs at maui.net>
>   wrote:
> 
>     Hi,
>     I did talk to their technical guy; it is actually a company based in
>     Australia.
>     My understanding is that they somehow use Procomp name or sales
>     network to sale their parts in US.
>     Anyway, down to the actual part, I am wondering how big is the risk?
>     According to the tech guy in Australia the 351C manifold is made to
>     fit 2V heads and would have enough material to port it to fit 4v or
>     my Yates C3 heads.
>     Although 351C version is $200 more than 351W system I would go with
>     351C as it is already split to fit onto 9.2 deck and also it looks
>     like a nicer intake casting with longer, smoother channels.
>     Other nice point is that this intake apparently fits Webber IDA bolt
>     pattern, so, down the road one could change throttle bodies to ones
>     that Readline makes or TWM ones.
>     The only throttle body size they offer at the moment is 50mm; would
>     this be adequate for 416ci engine that made 675Hp at 6500rpm on
>     engine dyno with Holley 850 carburetor on single plane high intake.
>     What would be suggested injectors; looking at what Holley recommends
>     in their systems it seems that something between 48# and 66# would
>     be good choice?
>     I will keep you updated in case I get this system.
>     Robert
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: Cullen McCann [mailto:[3]cmccann1972 at gmail.com]
>     Sent: Monday, October 19, 2015 6:58 AM
>     To: Daniel C Jones
>     Cc: POCA list
>     Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] IR FI system
>     I was also looking at the same system for the 351W. The price is
>     very appealing, considering that most other downdraft EFI systems
>     are 3500 bucks plus management. I know you "get what you pay for"
>     but its hard not to try it, and the risk seems.. "low" in a way. I
>     certainly wouldn't keep from buying it simply because "anything that
>     cheap must be a piece of junk". its not ALWAYS true.
>     The 351C system shown in your link is 1365.00.A  Consider the 351W
>     system on ebay, distributed by speedmaster is less than 1100.00. But
>     obviously the vertical stacks might require cutting the deck. I like
>     it when they stick out of the deck, rain and all. Super sex appeal,
>     even if they do run like crap.
>     here is a link:
>     351W speedmaster system on ebay
>     <[4]http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-351W-Windsor-Down-Draft-EFI-Stack-I
>     ntake-Manifold-System-Complete-Satin-/201449143138?hash=item2ee74dfb
>     62:g:uncAAOSw14xWHvjZ&vxp=mtr>
> 
>   or this one if that doesn't work:
>   [5]http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-351W-Windsor-Down-Draft-EFI-Stack-Intak
>   e-Manifold-System-Complete-Satin-/201449143138?hash=item2ee74dfb62:g:un
>   cAAOSw14xWHvjZ&vxp=mtr
>   Also, I know most people don't care or believe the ebay system holds
>   any "merit" or credibility for customer confidence, but in a way, I
>   disagree.
>   Speedmaster currently has 99.6% positive feedback on ebay with over 53
>   THOUSAND transactions. that means... specifically, that 53,600 people
>   bought something from them on eBay and had positive things to say.
>   That being said.... I'm sure they might be giving their "feedback"
>   before installing the system or something...but contrary to what some
>   people think, you cannot "fake" the feedback rating on ebay. If you
>   could, I would have done it by now. Either people are positive about
>   your sales reputation or they aren't. period. (I've been a power seller
>   on ebay for 15 years....and this isn't a scam) EBay's customer service
>   sucks.... no doubt about it, but the transaction feedback rating system
>   is real and it works like its supposed to.
>   In closing, I put 100 percent confidence into what Dan says about his
>   experience dyno tuning procomp products. I have a family member who
>   build street rods and he says the same thing. He also says that it
>   depends on what you buy. They are hit and miss. Some parts seem to work
>   great but some are cheap and dont perform or install as expected. But
>   Ill be honest... Id be willing to try it if I thought I could save 4
>   grand or something and have that sexy system. Maybe your motor makes
>   500 horse instead of 550...and you saved 4 grand. Maybe you pick a
>   different management system and keep the speedmaster hardware. Its just
>   a matter of weighing options and your budget, IMO.
>   I'll be buying one of the Windsor systems in the next year or so...I'll
>   let you know if I get anywhere with it.
>   Cullen
>   On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 10:07 AM, Daniel C Jones
>   <[6]daniel.c.jones2 at gmail.com>
>   wrote:
>> A  A  > I realize it comes without ECU and injectors, but looks really
>   nice
>> A  A  and seems very well priced.
>> A  A  Speedmaster is the company formerly known as Procomp.AA  Procomp
>   earned
>> A  A  such a bad reputation they had to rename the company.AA  We dyno
>   tested
>> A  A  the Procomp copy of the CHI Cleveland heads and they were 50 HP
>   down on
>> A  A  a 351C to the real CHI heads and 20 HP down to the OEM cast iron
>> A  A  Cleveland heads.
>> A  A  Dan Jones
>> 
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> 
> References
> 
>   1. https://www.efihardware.com/products/c393/Ford-8-Cylinder-Throttle-Body-Kits
>   2. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
>   3. mailto:cmccann1972 at gmail.com
>   4. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-351W-Windsor-Down-Draft-EFI-Stack-Intake-Manifold-System-Complete-Satin-/201449143138?hash=item2ee74dfb62:g:uncAAOSw14xWHvjZ&vxp=mtr
>   5. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-351W-Windsor-Down-Draft-EFI-Stack-Intake-Manifold-System-Complete-Satin-/201449143138?hash=item2ee74dfb62:g:uncAAOSw14xWHvjZ&vxp=mtr
>   6. mailto:daniel.c.jones2 at gmail.com
>   7. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
>   8. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> _______________________________________________
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