[DeTomaso] problems with engine shutting down
Jordan Klein
ohjordan at hotmail.com
Sat May 30 00:40:56 EDT 2015
I agree w Asa Jay & Jim Coyne. And of course Mike Drew's comments about the Motorcraft 4300D is totally valid.
My Pantera, stock w 4300D was doing the exact same sputtering, most notable as I exited a freeway ramp then stalled upon stop. Would start right up & accelerate easily until it happened again. I sensed cruise speeds were down on power, and perhaps exhibited a little stumbling.
My first assumption was debris in the gas tank partially blocking the pick-up sock. On flashlight examination peering into the tank, I did see the sock was brittle with one small hole. I next took the horn (top portion) off the carb & again found some debris in the bowl, though it seemed minor. I sent the carb off to Pony Carbs in New Mexico (owner now deceased) and he rebuild it. At the time he said the 4300D was known to warp and cause stumbling as the fuel sloshes & overflows into the carb throat, but that mine was in not warped and in excellent shape. While the carb was being rebuilt, I decided to do a little clean-up, and ordered a new pick-up tube and sending unit from Steve Wilkinson, ordered a stainless fuel-pump-to-carb gas line from one on the a Mustang vendors, replaced the tank-to-pump braided hose (seemed brittle - don't like engine fires), and replaced the fuel pump. When I opened up the old stock fuel pump (because I have to see inside), I found the diaphragms had turned totally flaccid, probably due to the 10% ethanol in California fuels. The diaphragms were so flaccid, I'm surprised the pump moved any fuel at all, or that the car would even run and accelerate. With the carb rebuilt, new filters, new lines, and new fuel pump -- the problem disappeared. I wish I could tell you exactly what was wrong, but if I had to guess, Its the fine metering holes between idle and cruse, combined with partially plugged carb filter, and in my case-- a very weak fuel pump.
At least you've now heard from another Pantera owner who had your exact same symptoms and resolved it, although I took the replace everything related to fuel approach.
Jordan Klein 7314
Date: Fri, 29 May 2015 16:20:04 -0700
From: asajay at asajay.com
To: MikeLDrew at aol.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] problems with engine shutting down
CC: detomaso at poca.com; cwhamm at frontier.com
He mentioned in a previous post that it was the Motorcraft 4300D I think. My first reaction at this point is to simply replace the carb.
I had a boat that ran the same way after sitting a year. Ran nearly fine as long as I was over 2,500 rpm but try to idle and it would die every time. I eventually rebuilt the carb. The idle and off-idle transition ports were totally plugged from the crappy gas we now get. My bet is this carb suffers the same, regardless if he does say he only gets good gas. ALL gas will go bad at some point.
I say its the carb, but I could be wrong.
Asa Jay
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at poca.com> wrote:
>Clarke,
>
>Most people will assume that you have a Holley carb. Do you still have the stock carb? Because that sounds like standard behavior on a 40 year old stock carb which was never very good when new and is now about 35 years past its prime.
>
>Do tell?
>
>Mike
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>On May 29, 2015, at 15:23, "clarkewilma" <cwhamm at frontier.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for all the input. I was headed up to Napa to buy an ignition
>> coil and though I would do a test of all of what is going on. Started
>> up fine. Choke was on. About 1500rpm. Backed out. Let it run for about
>> a minute. Tapped on the throttle and choke went off and we are off. 60
>> degrees F outside. No problems until it gets nice and warm. Put it in
>> neutral and was coasting down a hill with no braking and in about 10
>> seconds it dies. Stop and it starts perfect. It will run good for about
>> 20 seconds and it starts to die if I feather the gas I can keep it
>> running. Clear it and we are fine. If I let it die it starts up fine.
>> Here is what might tell you guys what is wrong. If I drive in first at
>> 3k steady it bucks some and once in a while it will pop. Between 30 and
>> 40 in 2^nd and 3^rd it bucks some. It will accelerate fine. Runs fine
>> at high speed. Any time now at an idle eventually it will die after it
>> is warmed up.
>>
>> Clarke Hamm 7350
>> _______________________________________________
>>
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>
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-------------- next part --------------
I agree w Asa Jay & Jim Coyne. And of course Mike Drew's comments
about the Motorcraft 4300D is totally valid.
My Pantera, stock w 4300D was doing the exact same sputtering, most
notable as I exited a freeway ramp then stalled upon stop. Would start
right up & accelerate easily until it happened again. I sensed cruise
speeds were down on power, and perhaps exhibited a little stumbling.
My first assumption was debris in the gas tank partially blocking the
pick-up sock. On flashlight examination peering into the tank, I did
see the sock was brittle with one small hole. I next took the horn
(top portion) off the carb & again found some debris in the bowl,
though it seemed minor. I sent the carb off to Pony Carbs in New
Mexico (owner now deceased) and he rebuild it. At the time he said the
4300D was known to warp and cause stumbling as the fuel sloshes &
overflows into the carb throat, but that mine was in not warped and in
excellent shape. While the carb was being rebuilt, I decided to do a
little clean-up, and ordered a new pick-up tube and sending unit from
Steve Wilkinson, ordered a stainless fuel-pump-to-carb gas line from
one on the a Mustang vendors, replaced the tank-to-pump braided hose
(seemed brittle - don't like engine fires), and replaced the fuel
pump. When I opened up the old stock fuel pump (because I have to see
inside), I found the diaphragms had turned totally flaccid, probably
due to the 10% ethanol in California fuels. The diaphragms were so
flaccid, I'm surprised the pump moved any fuel at all, or that the car
would even run and accelerate. With the carb rebuilt, new filters, new
lines, and new fuel pump -- the problem disappeared. I wish I could
tell you exactly what was wrong, but if I had to guess, Its the fine
metering holes between idle and cruse, combined with partially plugged
carb filter, and in my case-- a very weak fuel pump.
At least you've now heard from another Pantera owner who had your exact
same symptoms and resolved it, although I took the replace everything
related to fuel approach.
Jordan Klein 7314
Date: Fri, 29 May 2015 16:20:04 -0700
From: asajay at asajay.com
To: MikeLDrew at aol.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] problems with engine shutting down
CC: detomaso at poca.com; cwhamm at frontier.com
He mentioned in a previous post that it was the Motorcraft 4300D I think. My fi
rst reaction at this point is to simply replace the carb.
I had a boat that ran the same way after sitting a year. Ran nearly fine as lon
g as I was over 2,500 rpm but try to idle and it would die every time. I eventu
ally rebuilt the carb. The idle and off-idle transition ports were totally plug
ged from the crappy gas we now get. My bet is this carb suffers the same, regar
dless if he does say he only gets good gas. ALL gas will go bad at some point.
I say its the carb, but I could be wrong.
Asa Jay
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
Mike Drew via DeTomaso <detomaso at poca.com> wrote:
>Clarke,
>
>Most people will assume that you have a Holley carb. Do you still have the stoc
k carb? Because that sounds like standard behavior on a 40 year old stock carb w
hich was never very good when new and is now about 35 years past its prime.
>
>Do tell?
>
>Mike
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>On May 29, 2015, at 15:23, "clarkewilma" <cwhamm at frontier.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for all the input. I was headed up to Napa to buy an ignition
>> coil and though I would do a test of all of what is going on. Started
>> up fine. Choke was on. About 1500rpm. Backed out. Let it run for about
>> a minute. Tapped on the throttle and choke went off and we are off. 60
>> degrees F outside. No problems until it gets nice and warm. Put it in
>> neutral and was coasting down a hill with no braking and in about 10
>> seconds it dies. Stop and it starts perfect. It will run good for about
>> 20 seconds and it starts to die if I feather the gas I can keep it
>> running. Clear it and we are fine. If I let it die it starts up fine.
>> Here is what might tell you guys what is wrong. If I drive in first at
>> 3k steady it bucks some and once in a while it will pop. Between 30 and
>> 40 in 2^nd and 3^rd it bucks some. It will accelerate fine. Runs fine
>> at high speed. Any time now at an idle eventually it will die after it
>> is warmed up.
>>
>> Clarke Hamm 7350
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>> Posted emails must not exceed 1.5 Megabytes
>> DeTomaso mailing list
>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>> [1]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>
>> To manage your subscription (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) use the
links above.
>
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>
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>
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inks above.
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