[DeTomaso] Fw: Cleveland engine question
michael at michaelshortt.com
michael at michaelshortt.com
Thu May 8 06:31:30 EDT 2014
Make sure that there is no water in the oil and oil in the water. All
electrical connections are secure, do you have spark?
Pull the dist cap, is the rotor turning?
If timing chain issue...you may want to pull a head and see if any valves
smacked the pistons.
If a sheared pin, you can fix that or use this opportunity to look into a
distributorless engine with an Electromotive system ( works great ).
Hopefully, something simple and easy ($) to repair.
Michael
On May 8, 2014 1:47 AM, <jgkrenton at comcast.net> wrote:
> Boyd:
>
>
> Since no big pieces seem to have left the block, the first thing to do
> is pull a valve cover and the distributor cap. Then hit the starter
> and turn the motor over (which you report is still turning??).
>
>
> If the timing chain has failed, the valves and distributor will not
> move. If the distributor gear/pin has failed, then the valves will
> move but the distributor will not turn. Check the timing too. If the
> gear/pin failed the distributor may turn but be way out of time...
> (check: timing, compression, spark, fuel, one of them is missing....)
>
>
> Good luck..
>
>
> Jeff/2467
>
> __________________________________________________________________
>
> From: "Boyd Casey" <boyd411 at gmail.com>
> To: "mark skwarek" <ehpantera at yahoo.com>
> Cc: "Detomaso List" <detomaso at poca.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 7, 2014 10:06:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fw: Cleveland engine question
> Well as the more astute among may have already guessed I had an
> "episode"
> this evening while giving my pantera a workout after getting my new
> CNC sssleeve clutch master,
> ss sleeve long throw slave, new 90 amp alternator and new harmonic
> balanceralong with new front seal and pulley. My car was running and
> sounding
> great! I loved the new master and slave set up and even though the
> expected
> increase in clutch pedal effort materialised (as promised) I really
> liked
> the pedal resistance and the new longer throw slave really seemed to
> make
> the clutch engage ( it was like it slammed shut) the rear wheels seemed
> to
> hook up better and I was really enjoying my drive. I was actually
> enjoying
> it a little too much because I was in 5th and on it hard when all of a
> sudden there was a loud boom and a sudden loss of all power. At first
> the
> car was still in gear and the engine was turning due to the forward
> momentum of the car. There were no cylinders firing just the lub dub
> sound
> of an engine turning with out ignition and a substantial amount of
> smoke
> was visible in my rear view as well as a funky smell which I hope was
> fuel
> and air vaporising as it traveld through the hot engine with no spark
> to
> ignite it. I was very close to my exit so I put the car in neutral and
> rolled off the Parkway exit ramp.Once stopped I called a buddy of mine
> who
> lives near by and who owns a flat bed. He is also an avid car collector
> and
> restores classic cars as a hobby. He suggested I do a few things like
> try
> to restart the car and when it wouldn't start he suggested turning the
> key
> to start with the car in gear to see if it was locked up. When I turned
> the
> starter in first the car moved forward so at least it didn't appear to
> be a
> complete catastrophic failure ( but I guess that depends on your own
> definition of "catastrophic failure" The way I was feeling a broken
> timing
> chain or sheared distributor gear didn't seem as bad a a completely
> blown
> engine. (like a rod through the block kind of blown engine).
> So for those of you in the know whats the best way and order to check
> if
> it's a sheared pin or a jumped or broken timing chain? The thing that
> really made me think it was more then just a sheared distributor pin
> was
> the loud boom when the shit hit the fan(in a manner of speaking). So
> what
> to do?
> Boyd
> P.S. please excuse any more spelling errors then one would normally
> expect
> from a post written by an extremely distressed Pantera owner. It seems
> my
> spell check isn't running much better then my Pantera!
> On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 11:30 PM, mark skwarek <ehpantera at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> > For me I have a gear driven cam and the pin that drives the cam
> sheared
> > resulting the two broken valves. Hopefully my pics will come
> through.
> > Mark
> > On Wednesday, May 7, 2014 11:24 PM, Will Kooiman
> <will.kooiman at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > I would be very surprised if there isn't interference.
> >
> > But the timing chain rarely breaks. If it jumps a tooth, you are
> probably
> > still safe, even with a mild performance cam.
> >
> > On 5/7/14 10:57 PM, "Boyd Casey" <boyd411 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Do Cleveland engines (generally) have valves that will hit the
> pistons
> > > if the timing chain breaks? I assume if you have a high lift cam
> and or
> > > high top pistons you could have interference but what about a
> stock
> > > engine?A
> > > Boyd
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >
> > >Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> > >
> > >DeTomaso mailing list
> > >DeTomaso at poca.com
> > >http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> >
> > DeTomaso mailing list
> > DeTomaso at poca.com
> > http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at poca.com
> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at poca.com
> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
Make sure that there is no water in the oil and oil in the water. All
electrical connections are secure, do you have spark?
Pull the dist cap, is the rotor turning?
If timing chain issue...you may want to pull a head and see if any
valves smacked the pistons.
If a sheared pin, you can fix that or use this opportunity to look into
a distributorless engine with an Electromotive system ( works great ).
Hopefully, something simple and easy ($) to repair.
Michael
On May 8, 2014 1:47 AM, <[1]jgkrenton at comcast.net> wrote:
A A Boyd:
A A Since no big pieces seem to have left the block, the first
thing to do
A A is pull a valve cover and the distributor cap. A Then hit the
starter
A A and turn the motor over (which you report is still turning??).
A A If the timing chain has failed, the valves and distributor will
not
A A move. A If the distributor gear/pin has failed, then the valves
will
A A move but the distributor will not turn. Check the timing too.
A If the
A A gear/pin failed the distributor may turn but be way out of
time...
A A (check: timing, compression, spark, fuel, one of them is
missing....)
A A Good luck..
A A Jeff/2467
A A
A __________________________________________________________________
A A From: "Boyd Casey" <[2]boyd411 at gmail.com>
A A To: "mark skwarek" <[3]ehpantera at yahoo.com>
A A Cc: "Detomaso List" <[4]detomaso at poca.com>
A A Sent: Wednesday, May 7, 2014 10:06:39 PM
A A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Fw: A Cleveland engine question
A A Well as the more astute among may have already guessed I had an
A A "episode"
A A this evening while giving my pantera a workout after getting my
new
A A CNC sssleeve clutch master,
A A ss sleeve long throw slave, new 90 amp alternator and new
harmonic
A A balanceralong with new front seal and pulley. My car was
running and
A A sounding
A A great! I loved the new master and slave set up and even though
the
A A expected
A A increase in clutch pedal effort materialised (as promised) I
really
A A liked
A A the pedal resistance and the new longer throw slave really
seemed to
A A make
A A the clutch engage ( it was like it slammed shut) the rear
wheels seemed
A A to
A A hook up better and I was really enjoying my drive. I was
actually
A A enjoying
A A it a little too much because I was in 5th and on it hard when
all of a
A A sudden there was a loud boom and a sudden loss of all power. At
first
A A the
A A car was still in gear and the engine was turning due to the
forward
A A momentum of the car. There were no cylinders firing just the
lub dub
A A sound
A A of A an engine turning with out ignition A and a substantial
amount of
A A smoke
A A was visible in my rear view as well as a funky smell which I
hope was
A A fuel
A A and air vaporising as it traveld through the hot engine with no
spark
A A to
A A ignite it. I was very close to my exit so I put the car in
neutral and
A A rolled off the Parkway exit ramp.Once stopped I called a buddy
of mine
A A who
A A lives near by and who owns a flat bed. He is also an avid car
collector
A A and
A A restores classic cars as a hobby. He suggested I do a few
things like
A A try
A A to restart the car and when it wouldn't start he suggested
turning the
A A key
A A to start with the car in gear to see if it was locked up. When
I turned
A A the
A A starter in first the car moved forward so at least it didn't
appear to
A A be a
A A complete catastrophic failure ( but I guess that depends on
your own
A A definition of "catastrophic failure" The way I was feeling a
broken
A A timing
A A chain or sheared distributor gear didn't seem as bad a a
completely
A A blown
A A engine. (like a rod through the block kind of blown engine).
A A So for those of you in the know whats the best way and order to
check
A A if
A A it's a sheared pin or a jumped or broken timing chain? The
thing that
A A really made me think it was more then just a sheared
distributor pin
A A was
A A the loud boom when the shit hit the fan(in a manner of
speaking). So
A A what
A A to do?
A A Boyd
A A P.S. please excuse any more spelling errors then one would
normally
A A expect
A A from a post written by an extremely distressed Pantera owner.
It seems
A A my
A A spell check isn't running much better then my Pantera!
A A On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 11:30 PM, mark skwarek
<[5]ehpantera at yahoo.com>
A A wrote:
A A > For me I have a gear driven cam and the pin that drives the
cam
A A sheared
A A > resulting the two broken A valves. A Hopefully my pics will
come
A A through.
A A > Mark
A A > A On Wednesday, May 7, 2014 11:24 PM, Will Kooiman
A A <[6]will.kooiman at gmail.com>
A A > wrote:
A A > A I would be very surprised if there isn't interference.
A A >
A A > But the timing chain rarely breaks. A If it jumps a tooth,
you are
A A probably
A A > still safe, even with a mild performance cam.
A A >
A A > On 5/7/14 10:57 PM, "Boyd Casey" <[7]boyd411 at gmail.com>
wrote:
A A >
A A > > A Do Cleveland engines (generally) have valves that will
hit the
A A pistons
A A > > A if the timing chain breaks? I assume if you have a high
lift cam
A A and or
A A > > A high top pistons you could have interference but what
about a
A A stock
A A > > A engine?A
A A > > A Boyd
A A > >_______________________________________________
A A > >
A A > >Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
A A > >
A A > >DeTomaso mailing list
A A > >[8]DeTomaso at poca.com
A A > >[9]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
A A >
A A >
A A >
A A >
A A > _______________________________________________
A A >
A A > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
A A >
A A > DeTomaso mailing list
A A > [10]DeTomaso at poca.com
A A > [11]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
A A >
A A >
A A >
A A _______________________________________________
A A Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
A A DeTomaso mailing list
A A [12]DeTomaso at poca.com
A A [13]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
_______________________________________________
Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
DeTomaso mailing list
[14]DeTomaso at poca.com
[15]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
References
1. mailto:jgkrenton at comcast.net
2. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
3. mailto:ehpantera at yahoo.com
4. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
5. mailto:ehpantera at yahoo.com
6. mailto:will.kooiman at gmail.com
7. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
8. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
9. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
10. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
11. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
12. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
13. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
14. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
15. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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