[DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
Tom Shinrock
tmshinro at aol.com
Fri Jul 11 14:42:08 EDT 2014
Hi Scott,
We met in San Diego. Thanks for your input.
I can see that the condenser fitting may have an adaptor in it, but the thing that I still can't figure out is why the adaptor has a flat shoulder ring around it. I would think this would interfere with the female flare from sealing. And I can't figure out what the o-ring does behind the adapter. I tried pulling on the adapter with only finger pressure and I couldn't get it to move. I didn't want to put anymore pressure on it until I know what I got.
Thanks again for pointing out the difference in the flares between AN and the condenser. I'll have to remedy that.
I've got a call into the manufacturer and they are going to have their engineer explain what type of fitting they put on the condenser and verify the flare angle.
Tom
-----Original Message-----
From: Scott Bell <scott at saccrestorations.net>
To: 'Tom Shinrock' <tmshinro at aol.com>
Cc: detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
Sent: Fri, Jul 11, 2014 1:06 pm
Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
I think Ken is right. Look very closely at the fitting on the Condenser. The
part with an O-Ring is likely an adaptor stuck in the
end of the actual fitting on the condenser.
The reason they do this is because they are using a modern O-ring type
connector, found on R-134 systems, on the new condenser. The
older R-12 systems use 45 degree flare fittings. So they installed an adaptor to
go from the O-ring fitting to the flare fitting.
The adaptor isn't an issue when installed correctly. The issue started when your
guy used an AN fitting to change hose directions.
The fitting on the Condenser is a 45 degree fitting and the fitting on the AN
adaptor is 37 degrees. This is likely why it leaked.
-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of Tom Shinrock via
DeTomaso
Sent: Friday, July 11, 2014 9:06 AM
To: detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
I don't think that is what I need. My hoses have flare fittings. The condenser
has a type of flair fitting that has a shoulder
around the end of the flare that is not sealing against the flare of the AN
connector.
I can't get through to CCS to ask them what kind of fitting they put on the
condenser. It is really strange that the lower fitting
is a straight flare but the top fitting has this shoulder fitting. I know they
said they discovered that the fittings on the
Pantera condenser were found to be the cause of leaks and that they were putting
on different fittings to solve the problem but why
only change the top fitting.
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Green <kenn_green at yahoo.com>
To: Tom Shinrock <tmshinro at aol.com>; detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
Sent: Fri, Jul 11, 2014 10:47 am
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
Is this it:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Hose-Adaptor-Kit-convert-O-ring-CONDENSER-to-take-aircon-flare-hose-fittings-P53-/251139343159
Ken
From: Tom Shinrock via DeTomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
To: detomaso at poca.com
Sent: Friday, July 11, 2014 6:57 AM
Subject: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
Well my A/C condenser was delivered on Wednesday (thanks again to Ken
Green) and I hooked it up that afternoon. I had the system charged up
with R-12 yesterday.
The shop said the car held vacuum for half a day. It was 84 deg and
sunny when they charged it and they said they were seeing 29 deg air at
the vents. When I made the short drive home, I was seeing 19 deg air
at the vents. I was in hog heaven thinking that I've finally cracked
the nut on my A/C.
I parked the car and proceeded to wipe off all the dust that had
accumulated on it over the last six weeks I've been waiting to get the
condenser. After I finished the outside of the car I went to wipe down
the engine bay (it's painted). I saw some very small droplets of
something on the edge of the fan shroud next to the condenser fitting
and when I went to wipe them off I could hear a faint hissing sound. I
called the shop and informed them of the sound and they said bring the
car back.
Side note.....My car had an aftermarket condenser on it when I bought
it which had the top fitting coming straight out of the condenser
(pointing to the right side of car). The prior owner had routed the
A/C hoses through the wheel wells so the hose fitting was made to mate
up with the top fitting coming straight out of the condenser.
The "OEM" condenser that Classic Condenser Specialists sells has the
top fitting of the condenser turned down. I didn't have enough hose
length to get to this down turned fitting, so when I had the original
condenser (that leaked) installed, the shop purchased a 90 degree AN
connector to get from the down turned fitting on the condenser to my
straight shot hose.
When I got back to the shop (about a ten minute drive) we opened the
deck lid and there was oil all over the AN connector where it connects
to the condenser. They quickly sucked out the remaining R-12 and
proceeded to look at the AN connector. At first they thought the
connector failed put when they unscrewed if from the condenser they saw
the the condenser fitting had a flare that was not what they expected
to see. At the end of the flare there is a shoulder at the end with an
O ring behind it. They wondered why it wasn't a straight flare. By
the way, the bottom condenser fitting was a straight flare.
I attached a picture of the flare in question. Can anybody tell me
what type of connector I need to match this fitting? I'm going to try
and get CCS to answer the phone and tell me what type of connector I
need but they haven't been answering my calls lately.
I'm still mystified why the system would hold vacuum and not show the
leak. If I can solve my leaking connector problem, I think I'm home
free.
Thanks
Tom
5186
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DeTomaso mailing list
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http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
-------------- next part --------------
Hi Scott,
We met in San Diego. Thanks for your input.
I can see that the condenser fitting may have an adaptor in it, but the
thing that I still can't figure out is why the adaptor has a flat
shoulder ring around it. I would think this would interfere with the
female flare from sealing. And I can't figure out what the o-ring does
behind the adapter. I tried pulling on the adapter with only finger
pressure and I couldn't get it to move. I didn't want to put anymore
pressure on it until I know what I got.
Thanks again for pointing out the difference in the flares between AN
and the condenser. I'll have to remedy that.
I've got a call into the manufacturer and they are going to have their
engineer explain what type of fitting they put on the condenser and
verify the flare angle.
Tom
-----Original Message-----
From: Scott Bell <scott at saccrestorations.net>
To: 'Tom Shinrock' <tmshinro at aol.com>
Cc: detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
Sent: Fri, Jul 11, 2014 1:06 pm
Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
I think Ken is right. Look very closely at the fitting on the Condenser. The
part with an O-Ring is likely an adaptor stuck in the
end of the actual fitting on the condenser.
The reason they do this is because they are using a modern O-ring type
connector, found on R-134 systems, on the new condenser. The
older R-12 systems use 45 degree flare fittings. So they installed an adaptor to
go from the O-ring fitting to the flare fitting.
The adaptor isn't an issue when installed correctly. The issue started when your
guy used an AN fitting to change hose directions.
The fitting on the Condenser is a 45 degree fitting and the fitting on the AN
adaptor is 37 degrees. This is likely why it leaked.
-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [[1]mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of Tom Shinrock v
ia
DeTomaso
Sent: Friday, July 11, 2014 9:06 AM
To: [2]detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
I don't think that is what I need. My hoses have flare fittings. The condenser
has a type of flair fitting that has a shoulder
around the end of the flare that is not sealing against the flare of the AN
connector.
I can't get through to CCS to ask them what kind of fitting they put on the
condenser. It is really strange that the lower fitting
is a straight flare but the top fitting has this shoulder fitting. I know they
said they discovered that the fittings on the
Pantera condenser were found to be the cause of leaks and that they were putting
on different fittings to solve the problem but why
only change the top fitting.
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Green <[3]kenn_green at yahoo.com>
To: Tom Shinrock <[4]tmshinro at aol.com>; detomaso <[5]detomaso at poca.com>
Sent: Fri, Jul 11, 2014 10:47 am
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
Is this it:
[6]http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Hose-Adaptor-Kit-convert-O-ring-CONDENSER-to-take-
aircon-flare-hose-fittings-P53-/251139343159
Ken
From: Tom Shinrock via DeTomaso <[7]detomaso at poca.com>
To: [8]detomaso at poca.com
Sent: Friday, July 11, 2014 6:57 AM
Subject: [DeTomaso] Flare fitting question
Well my A/C condenser was delivered on Wednesday (thanks again to Ken
Green) and I hooked it up that afternoon. I had the system charged up
with R-12 yesterday.
The shop said the car held vacuum for half a day. It was 84 deg and
sunny when they charged it and they said they were seeing 29 deg air at
the vents. When I made the short drive home, I was seeing 19 deg air
at the vents. I was in hog heaven thinking that I've finally cracked
the nut on my A/C.
I parked the car and proceeded to wipe off all the dust that had
accumulated on it over the last six weeks I've been waiting to get the
condenser. After I finished the outside of the car I went to wipe down
the engine bay (it's painted). I saw some very small droplets of
something on the edge of the fan shroud next to the condenser fitting
and when I went to wipe them off I could hear a faint hissing sound. I
called the shop and informed them of the sound and they said bring the
car back.
Side note.....My car had an aftermarket condenser on it when I bought
it which had the top fitting coming straight out of the condenser
(pointing to the right side of car). The prior owner had routed the
A/C hoses through the wheel wells so the hose fitting was made to mate
up with the top fitting coming straight out of the condenser.
The "OEM" condenser that Classic Condenser Specialists sells has the
top fitting of the condenser turned down. I didn't have enough hose
length to get to this down turned fitting, so when I had the original
condenser (that leaked) installed, the shop purchased a 90 degree AN
connector to get from the down turned fitting on the condenser to my
straight shot hose.
When I got back to the shop (about a ten minute drive) we opened the
deck lid and there was oil all over the AN connector where it connects
to the condenser. They quickly sucked out the remaining R-12 and
proceeded to look at the AN connector. At first they thought the
connector failed put when they unscrewed if from the condenser they saw
the the condenser fitting had a flare that was not what they expected
to see. At the end of the flare there is a shoulder at the end with an
O ring behind it. They wondered why it wasn't a straight flare. By
the way, the bottom condenser fitting was a straight flare.
I attached a picture of the flare in question. Can anybody tell me
what type of connector I need to match this fitting? I'm going to try
and get CCS to answer the phone and tell me what type of connector I
need but they haven't been answering my calls lately.
I'm still mystified why the system would hold vacuum and not show the
leak. If I can solve my leaking connector problem, I think I'm home
free.
Thanks
Tom
5186
_______________________________________________
Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
DeTomaso mailing list
[9]DeTomaso at poca.com
[10]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
References
1. mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com?
2. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
3. mailto:kenn_green at yahoo.com
4. mailto:tmshinro at aol.com
5. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
6. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Hose-Adaptor-Kit-convert-O-ring-CONDENSER-to-take-aircon-flare-hose-fittings-P53-/251139343159
7. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
8. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
9. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
10. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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