[DeTomaso] FW: Moment of (sad) truth
Robert Stroj
npdrs at maui.net
Tue Jul 1 14:56:44 EDT 2014
Hi Brent,
Thanks a lot, this is really good info!
What carburetor are you using?
Cheers,
Robert
From: Brent Stewart [mailto:bjbstewart at yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 5:32 AM
To: Robert Stroj; detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] FW: Moment of (sad) truth
Hi Robert,
I have the same CHI heads and intake. Here are my build specs incase you want to utilize those in an engine update:
ENGINE SPECS:
Bennett Racing Dyno’d the engine and provided the spec sheet. The 351C based 392 CID engine made 571 HP and 517 TQ @ 5800 RPM. Here are the details of the build:
Parts list
· SCAT 3.85 Crankshaft, internally balanced
· SCAT 6.00 H Beam Rods
· Custom Ross Pistons
· Custom Bennett Racing Hydraulic Roller Cam
· Superformance Balancer
· Crane Link Bar Hydraulic Roller Lifters
· Comp Cams Pushrods
· Harland Sharp 4005 Roller Rockers
· CHI 228 3V aluminum Heads
· CHI high-rise intake
Build specs
· Bore: 4.030
· Crank: 3.850 9000 series
· Cam: 3018F-3039B 112
o Intake Lobe: 242 @ .050 .366 LL
o Exhaust Lobe: 250 @ .050 .363 LL
o Lobe Separation: 112
· Pushrods: 7.850 Comp Cams HD
On Tuesday, July 1, 2014 8:06 AM, Robert Stroj <npdrs at maui.net> wrote:
So, finally, my '71 Pantera got through all the import procedures and is now
street legal in Europe/Germany!
Car is in very good shape, zero rust anywhere, suspension feels very good to
drive (height adjustable koni set), brakes work well (wilwood conversion),
but there is something not right with the motor.
Engine is a older 351C rebuild using original crankshaft and pistons. Some
years later it was fitted with CHI 3V heads and intake system, SS valves,
780 Holley and GTS exhaust system.
When driving the cart was pulling well, but definitely was not feeling as
400-500HP car; this is what I was sort of expecting after talking to person
who rebuild the engine as well as previous owner...it did not really feel as
300HP car...
I had a chance to put it on the dyno at the friend's garage and got the
following graph (please see the attached image); this are graphs for
adjusted power on the flywheel after recalculating looses between engine and
wheels.
What was really interesting is that he had a chance to test 2 other panteras
recently; one was a client that had rebuilt engine using some "special
parts", bt I am not sure of the actual spec while the other one was black
GR4 replica that is currently listed for sale in Germany and was built by
Braun Motorsport:
http://suchen.mobile.de/auto-inserat/detomaso-pantera-gruppe-4-m-hist-strass
enzul-neuaufbau-neuried-bei-m%C3%BCnche/159513949.html?lang=de&pageNumber=1&
__lp=1&scopeId=C&sortOption.sortBy=creationTime&sortOption.sortOrder=DESCEND
ING&makeModelVariant1.makeId=7400&makeModelVariant1.searchInFreetext=false&m
akeModelVariant2.searchInFreetext=false&makeModelVariant3.searchInFreetext=f
alse&ambitCountry=DE&negativeFeatures=EXPORT
So, finally, my engine did not even reach 250HP, another rebuild pantera
motor did just over 300HP while Braun pantera did very nice 389HP; there is
also Ford GT40 with racing motor in there; it did 410hp but at much higher
RPM.
The most impressive about the Braun car is how smooth the power curve is.
So, now I am wondering where to go from here; could it be that it is as
simple as wrong cam choice?
If going to do a rebuild is there a good configuration someone could suggest
that would use CHI3V heads and intake, as I already got those?
As well, I had something strange happen twice with the gearbox; it got out
of the 3rd gear by itself; would someone know if this could be due to any
wrong linkage adjustment?
Thanks, Robert
_______________________________________________
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DeTomaso mailing list
DeTomaso at poca.com
http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
-------------- next part --------------
Hi Brent,
Thanks a lot, this is really good info!
What carburetor are you using?
Cheers,
Robert
From: Brent Stewart [mailto:bjbstewart at yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 5:32 AM
To: Robert Stroj; detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] FW: Moment of (sad) truth
Hi Robert,
I have the same CHI heads and intake. Here are my build specs incase
you want to utilize those in an engine update:
ENGINE SPECS:
Bennett Racing Dyno'd the engine and provided the spec sheet. The 351C
based 392 CID engine made 571 HP and 517 TQ @ 5800 RPM. Here are the
details of the build:
Parts list
. SCAT 3.85 Crankshaft, internally balanced
. SCAT 6.00 H Beam Rods
. Custom Ross Pistons
. Custom Bennett Racing Hydraulic Roller Cam
. Superformance Balancer
. Crane Link Bar Hydraulic Roller Lifters
. Comp Cams Pushrods
. Harland Sharp 4005 Roller Rockers
. CHI 228 3V aluminum Heads
. CHI high-rise intake
Build specs
. Bore: 4.030
. Crank: 3.850 9000 series
. Cam: 3018F-3039B 112
o Intake Lobe: 242 @ .050 .366 LL
o Exhaust Lobe: 250 @ .050 .363 LL
o Lobe Separation: 112
. Pushrods: 7.850 Comp Cams HD
On Tuesday, July 1, 2014 8:06 AM, Robert Stroj <[1]npdrs at maui.net>
wrote:
So, finally, my '71 Pantera got through all the import procedures and
is now
street legal in Europe/Germany!
Car is in very good shape, zero rust anywhere, suspension feels very
good to
drive (height adjustable koni set), brakes work well (wilwood
conversion),
but there is something not right with the motor.
Engine is a older 351C rebuild using original crankshaft and pistons.
Some
years later it was fitted with CHI 3V heads and intake system, SS
valves,
780 Holley and GTS exhaust system.
When driving the cart was pulling well, but definitely was not feeling
as
400-500HP car; this is what I was sort of expecting after talking to
person
who rebuild the engine as well as previous owner...it did not really
feel as
300HP car...
I had a chance to put it on the dyno at the friend's garage and got the
following graph (please see the attached image); this are graphs for
adjusted power on the flywheel after recalculating looses between
engine and
wheels.
What was really interesting is that he had a chance to test 2 other
panteras
recently; one was a client that had rebuilt engine using some "special
parts", bt I am not sure of the actual spec while the other one was
black
GR4 replica that is currently listed for sale in Germany and was built
by
Braun Motorsport:
[2]http://suchen.mobile.de/auto-inserat/detomaso-pantera-gruppe-4-m-his
t-strass
enzul-neuaufbau-neuried-bei-m%C3%BCnche/159513949.html?lang=de&pageNumb
er=1&
__lp=1&scopeId=C&sortOption.sortBy=creationTime&sortOption.sortOrder=DE
SCEND
ING&makeModelVariant1.makeId=7400&makeModelVariant1.searchInFreetext=fa
lse&m
akeModelVariant2.searchInFreetext=false&makeModelVariant3.searchInFreet
ext=f
alse&ambitCountry=DE&negativeFeatures=EXPORT
So, finally, my engine did not even reach 250HP, another rebuild
pantera
motor did just over 300HP while Braun pantera did very nice 389HP;
there is
also Ford GT40 with racing motor in there; it did 410hp but at much
higher
RPM.
The most impressive about the Braun car is how smooth the power curve
is.
So, now I am wondering where to go from here; could it be that it is as
simple as wrong cam choice?
If going to do a rebuild is there a good configuration someone could
suggest
that would use CHI3V heads and intake, as I already got those?
As well, I had something strange happen twice with the gearbox; it got
out
of the 3rd gear by itself; would someone know if this could be due to
any
wrong linkage adjustment?
Thanks, Robert
_______________________________________________
Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
DeTomaso mailing list
[3]DeTomaso at poca.com
[4]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
References
1. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
2. http://suchen.mobile.de/auto-inserat/detomaso-pantera-gruppe-4-m-hist-strass
3. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
4. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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