[DeTomaso] FLUIDYNE RADIATOR STORY
Will Kooiman
will.kooiman at gmail.com
Mon Jan 27 06:41:52 EST 2014
Bob, I had the same problem.
You radiator flows air both ways. Your fans only flow air one way.
If your radiator only flowed one way, you would overheat once you were
moving. Your radiator wasn't defective. Your fans were which are only
needed when you are going slowly.
I had spal fans with curved blades. These are sucker fans, but they were
mounted as pushers and wired backwards. They were spinning the "pusher"
direction, but they didn't flow any air. I verified by running them off the
car. They didn't push air. They agitated it.
I remounted them as suckers and it made a big difference.
Listen to Fluidyne. They are correct.
From: Tomas Gunnarsson <guson at home.se>
Date: Monday, January 27, 2014 4:21 AM
To: <detomaso at poca.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] FLUIDYNE RADIATOR STORY
But Bob wrote in his first post that he had already ruined the radiator
completely with the pressure washer.
Tomas
<-----Ursprungligt Meddelande----->
From: Boyd Casey [boyd411 at gmail.com]
Sent: 27/1/2014 8:21:04 AM
To: terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov;terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov
Cc: detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] FLUIDYNE RADIATOR STORY
Aside from the questions being debated about the radiator flowing in one
direction and not the other or if the radiator was even defective or not. I
think it was inappropriate for Fluidyne to do destructive testing on the
radiator Bob sent them with out clearing it with Bob first. By destroying
the radiator they forced him to replace it and prevented anyone else from
testing it in the future. If your supposed to be doing an investigation you
don't destroy the evidence!. Now Bob has no way to prove his ( and his
mechanics) claims. It seems to me that Fluidyne could test whether their
radiator was working as it should with out cutting it in half. If they found
that it wasn't cooling then they could have asked for permission to do a
forensic examination to determining the reason it wasn't cooling to specs.
They had no right to destroy Bob's radiator with out getting Bob's
permission. They owe him a new radiator just for doing that! Boyd
On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 7:11 PM, Himes, Terry (397C)
<terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
> Hmmm? I dunno about this. But I'll let the expert mechanics duke it out.
>
> But I bought my 1974 Pantera in 2000, it was completely stock, with 38,000 mi.
> I always ran a perfect 190deg
> (at least that's what the temp gauge said) in traffic or open road. Even all
> trips to Las Vegas for POCA every year
> with AC full blast with NO overheating. When one of the original fans gave
> out I replace both with 5 or 6 blade
> (can't remember which) fans and againŠ never an overheating problem. Dunno,
> maybe it's just luck.
>
>
>
> Terry W. HimesJPL Jet Propulsion LaboratoryDeep Impact Sequence Team LeadDeep
> Impact Spacecraft Engineer & Activity LeadPhone: (818) 393-6261
> <tel:%28818%29%20393-6261> Cell: (818) 653-8213 <tel:%28818%29%20653-8213>
> Fax: (818) 393-3147 <tel:%28818%29%20393-3147> thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
>
> From: "LEVITT1946 at aol.com" <LEVITT1946 at aol.com>
> Date: Sunday, January 26, 2014 11:28 AM
> To: "detomaso at poca.com" <detomaso at poca.com>
> Subject: [DeTomaso] FLUIDYNE RADIATOR STORY
>
> Hello All,
>
> Many of you go thru high heat issues with the Pantera.
>
> When I purchased my car in 2008 the previous owner told me if I was in traffic
> to just pull over . I was determined to cure this car from high heat exposure.
>
> The first things I attached on the car was the following:
>
> Replaced Water Pump with Hi Flow Water Pump
> Replaced Thermostat ( many times)
> Replaced the old brass radiator with an new Aluminum radiator from Summit.
> Replaced Meriah fans with new sucker fans
> Replaced antifreeze and purged air from system (many times)
> Did complete Tune Up. ( many times)
>
> Now it was time for the big test. I got on the highway and the car was holding
> temp at a steady 180. The minute I got off the highway the temp started rising
> to the point of boil over. I could hear my pressure bottle perculating.
>
> This went on for years. I drove the car across the USA in the Gumball Rally.As
> long as the car was moving I knew we would be ok and we made it from Santa
> Monica California to Miami Beach safely.
>
> The car was still running hot so I tracked down an NOS Pressure tank and
> overflow bottle from a place in Modena Italy. I thought maybe there was
> something wrong with my pressure and overflow bottles.
>
> My local mechanic replaced the pressure and overflow bottles and the car
> started to overheat immediately. The only part to look at now was the FLUIDYNE
> Radiator that I had replaced 4 years ago when I purchased the car.
>
> We let the car cool a little and then restarted the car. My mechanic said he
> was going to run water over the front of the radiator when I started the car.
> I was in the car while it was running to see if the water temp would lower as
> he ran the hose on the front of the FLUIDYNE radiator. The temp was lowering!
> . Then he said shut the car. My Mechanic said that since I had sucker fans my
> car should have been sprayed with water when he ran the water on the front of
> the radiator. Instead the car was DRY . This meant that the radiator was now
> allowing the water to flow through and thus no air could flow through either.
>
> Next step was to reverse the fans to blow out the front of the car and leave
> it idling in place . The car ran at a steady 180 for 30 minutes and the temp
> did not rise. This told us that the radiator was fault and only flowed ONE WAY
> .
>
> I could not believe that the radiator could be faulty. I drove home and
> cleaned the radiator with a pressure washer and ruined every fin on the
> radiator.
>
> Then I contacted the owner of Fluidyne. I explained what we had done and in
> summary we felt we had a one way radiator that could only flow air one way . I
> also admitted that I had pressure washed the radiator and ruined the outside
> fins. Hard to believe but TRUE.
> He asked me to send the radiator to him and if they faund any defect in
> workmanship he would replace the radiator at no charge. He came up with
> every excuse possible. He cut the radiator in half to look at the internals of
> the radiator.
>
> Here is FLUIDYNES actual response:
> Good Morning Robert, Further to our investigation:· Your radiator was
> inspected upon receipt and found to be Œbloated¹ Š swollen in the middle of
> the core, consistent with symptoms of over-pressurization.· The fans
> were tested while installed on the core and operation was verified. They
> seemed to pull a reasonable amount of air. · The fans were then
> removed and inspected. The fans are ³pusher² fansŠ not ³puller² fans as you
> were told. [See pic 3 to see arrow markings]o They most likely were wired
> to work as ³pullers² but the performance would be significantly hampered
> considering the pitch of the blade is backwards· The Inlet/Outlet
> water tank was removed to inspect the core. Debris was found near the top &
> bottom [see pic 1 and 2] which had plugged several tubes.o This is not a
> significant blockage but we noted that foreign debris was indeed inside the
> core. · The Return water tank was then removed [pic 4] which showed a
> significant amount of engine oil has passed thru the core. o We suspect
> this oil was introduced to the radiator by failure of a cylinder head gasket.o
> I appears the oil remained in the core for some time as it would not wipe off.
> o We also assume this failure created the high pressure event that caused
> the core to be over-pressurized.· The Core shows no internal
> structural damage and the outside structure [air fin] was heavily damaged as
> you know and has rendered the core useless. Conclusion:The outside air fin has
> sustained significant damage and 90% of the louvers have been bent shut in
> both directions. The radiator core appears to be sound. We noted no failures
> of our Materials or Workmanship nor evidence of Electrolysis erosion. The
> over-pressurization event, while it likely created the Œbloated¹ shape of the
> unit, does not appear to have affected the core¹s performance. The only
> anomaly we discovered was the fact that as installed, the pusher fans were
> likely wired to run backwards as puller fans. This
>
> === message truncated ===
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