[DeTomaso] Pantera Steering Rack Interchange Ferrari 308
doug351c
doug351c at gmail.com
Sat Feb 22 23:38:40 EST 2014
Dave,
How did you shim your steering column? I cannibalized the just-right sized
feeler gauge blades as shims and it worked like a charm. I did this in both
my 70 MACH1 and my Pantera and it makes a dramatic ipmprovment in sterring
response. I didn't feel it prudent to defeat the collapsible column
feature.
Doug Braun
blue 73L #5505
-----Original Message-----
From: DeTomaso [mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com]On Behalf Of dave
londry
Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 2:07 PM
To: detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Steering Rack Interchange Ferrari 308
Julian
I know you've already done this ---- but just in case.
I chased tramlining and bump-steer on my 74L for 2 years.
(with a rebuilt rack - my rebuild, Mike's recipe)
80% of it went away when I shimmed the sliding joint in the steering
column.
Looks like most of the rest is clearance at the front bulkhead; the
whole column is moving laterally there.
The slop in the sliding joint gave an amazing imitation of bump-steer as
the load came off the front wheels.
dave
On 22/02/2014 9:43 AM, Julian Kift wrote:
> Thomas,
> You may very well be right, I can still feel a little bit of play in
> the rack and that might be just the tolerance on the rack & pinion,
but
> this is the last thing to change before I have to just accept it was
it
> is or sell it. I modified my front a-arms for the full 7 degrees of
> caster too. New tires improved it a little I now have the Michelin
PS2,
> whereas the previous Michelin Sport was the old Chevron tread style.
> Off topic but the suspension geometry on the Si was changed and I have
> heard the Si's are great cars to drive. I assume the body width was
the
> same as GT5S and they moved the center line of the wheels out via use
> of longer a-arms. Anyone have dimensions of the Si suspension to hand?
> Julian
> > CC: julian_kift at hotmail.com; detomaso at poca.com
> > From: thomas at hax.se
> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Steering Rack Interchange Ferrari
308
> > Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2014 10:56:20 +0100
> > To: MikeLDrew at aol.com
> >
> > I rebuilt the rack in #9321 (1984 GT5) using a brass bushing that
> Mike supplied, and I believe it is the later rack.
> >
> > Later I removed some of the thin shims to reduce steering wheel
play.
> >
> > I have Marino's offset poly bushings and it is still a white knuckle
> ride with the 285-40/15 Yokohama AVS-1 tires.
> >
> > I don't think this can be fixed with a new rack alone.
> >
> > Thomas
> >
> > > 22 feb 2014 kl. 08:13 skrev MikeLDrew at aol.com:
> > >
> > > In a message dated 2/21/14 21 43 19, julian_kift at hotmail.com
> writes:
> > >
> > > As you know I have replaced just about everything on the steering
> > > end of my GT5 in an effort to try and make it an enjoyable drive,
> > > alas it is still a white knuckle ride tram lining the slightest
rut
> > > in the road and darting when one changes lanes over the center
> > > crest. The rack was rebuilt at some point by someone who was heavy
> > > handed with vice grips and I have never been happy with it, so my
> > > last ditch effort is to just change out the rack for a new one.
> > > Mine being an early GT5 where Alejandro was still using up
leftover
> > > Ford parts has the same rack as my '74, so I'd be keen to know if
> > > what you have in the box there fits. That said I'm intrigued that
> > > later GT5's had a different rack, are they dimensionally the same
> or
> > > does the later rack alter (improve) the steering geometry?
> > >
> > >>>> The later rack appears to be dimensionally the same. The rack
> > > housing tube is a smaller diameter, and there are crude spacers
> that
> > > wrap around the outside of it to make up the difference between
the
> > > small tube and the larger opening in the Pantera rack housing
> clamps.
> > > Here is what arrived at my house for me to repair, plucked from
the
> > > GT5:
> > >
>
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ferrari-Testarossa-TRW-Steering-Rack-/121278970
> > > 012
> > > At least, I'm 99.9% certain it's the same. The tie rods are
> completely
> > > different from an early Pantera rack, the rack is different, the
> > > housing is different, although the boot on the driver's side seems
> > > largely the same (the passenger side is very different. You can
see
> > > the tube is much smaller in diameter as well.
> > > But functionally it seems to be identical. As I said, I'm going to
> > > fully compare the worn-out GT5 rack, a standard Pantera rack that
I
> > > keep on hand as a visual aid, and the new early 308 rack I just
> bought,
> > > and we will see wot's wot.
> > > BTW Rick Moseley's 1980 308 uses a later-style rack I believe,
with
> a
> > > different housing with the mounting clamps cast integral with the
> > > housing. But internally it is the same as the Pantera rack, needs
> the
> > > same bronze bushing for a quality repair, etc. etc. Rick is the
one
> > > who contacted TRW (the outfit that purchased Cam Gears UK, the
> original
> > > maker of the Pantera and Ferrari racks) and asked what to use as a
> > > lubricant; they told him in no uncertain terms that gear oil was
no
> > > longer in vogue and 0-weight grease was the lube of choice. The
> > > GT5/Testa Rossa rack comes filled with this grease, as did the TRW
> > > racks that some vendors were selling a few years ago, and also the
> ones
> > > that Roland was selling. I have no doubt the new rack we just
> bought
> > > will have grease as well.
> > > (As an aside, I just replaced the worn-out rack on one of my VW
> > > Sciroccos today. The new rack came from the German manufacturer
> filled
> > > with grease too).
> > > Rick and I worked together with the fellow you saw on the F-chat
> forum,
> > > who has an early 308 GT4 Dino and had a blown-out rack. Some thief
> had
> > > charged him over $1000 to 'repair' his rack; he threw a home-made
> > > nylong bushing inside, bludgeoned some later-style tie rods onto
> the
> > > rack, and overtightened them to the point where they were bound up
> > > solid. The poor guy got the rack installed in his car with some
> > > difficulty, but the car was virtually undriveable. He managed to
> get
> > > it to an alignment shop and they literally couldn't turn the tie
> rods
> > > to set the toe, so they sent him home.
> > > With much long-distance hand-holding, he took the rack apart,
> dumped
> > > the new parts, got three (!) Pantera rack bushings from three
> different
> > > Pantera vendors, chose the one we told him to choose in the first
> > > place, and put his rack back together using his original tie rods.
> The
> > > result was perfection and he was quite pleased, not only with the
> > > results, but with himself for having taken on the challenge and
> > > prevailing.
> > > He has been trying to sell one of his three rack bushings on E-bay
> for
> > > quite some time now, with no takers; oddly, the other one sold
> almost
> > > instantly?
> > > Mike
> > >
> > >
> > > !DSPAM:53084e8a24993343511756!
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