[DeTomaso] Pantera Steering Rack Interchange Ferrari 308
thomas
thomas at hax.se
Sat Feb 22 18:45:33 EST 2014
> 22 feb 2014 kl. 23:46 skrev B Hower <b.hower3400 at yahoo.com>:
>
> By any chance does the tires have ware from before rack repair, is it possible they are aiding the poor handling?
No, the front tires doesn't seem to wear at all. The car has the same tires in the front as when I bought it in March 2000. I have replaced the rears once and they are pretty worn now again.
I will replace all of them now, but I don't expect any improvement in the tram lining problem.
Thomas
>
>
> Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not be ! )
>
> From: thomas <thomas at hax.se>
> To: "MikeLDrew at aol.com" <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
> Cc: "detomaso at poca.com" <detomaso at poca.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 3:56 AM
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Steering Rack Interchange Ferrari 308
>
> I rebuilt the rack in #9321 (1984 GT5) using a brass bushing that Mike supplied, and I believe it is the later rack.
>
> Later I removed some of the thin shims to reduce steering wheel play.
>
> I have Marino's offset poly bushings and it is still a white knuckle ride with the 285-40/15 Yokohama AVS-1 tires.
>
> I don't think this can be fixed with a new rack alone.
>
> Thomas
>
> > 22 feb 2014 kl. 08:13 skrev MikeLDrew at aol.com:
> >
> > In a message dated 2/21/14 21 43 19, julian_kift at hotmail.com writes:
> >
> > As you know I have replaced just about everything on the steering
> > end of my GT5 in an effort to try and make it an enjoyable drive,
> > alas it is still a white knuckle ride tram lining the slightest rut
> > in the road and darting when one changes lanes over the center
> > crest. The rack was rebuilt at some point by someone who was heavy
> > handed with vice grips and I have never been happy with it, so my
> > last ditch effort is to just change out the rack for a new one.
> > Mine being an early GT5 where Alejandro was still using up leftover
> > Ford parts has the same rack as my '74, so I'd be keen to know if
> > what you have in the box there fits. That said I'm intrigued that
> > later GT5's had a different rack, are they dimensionally the same or
> > does the later rack alter (improve) the steering geometry?
> >
> >>>> The later rack appears to be dimensionally the same. The rack
> > housing tube is a smaller diameter, and there are crude spacers that
> > wrap around the outside of it to make up the difference between the
> > small tube and the larger opening in the Pantera rack housing clamps.
> > Here is what arrived at my house for me to repair, plucked from the
> > GT5:
> > http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ferrari-Testarossa-TRW-Steering-Rack-/121278970
> > 012
> > At least, I'm 99.9% certain it's the same. The tie rods are completely
> > different from an early Pantera rack, the rack is different, the
> > housing is different, although the boot on the driver's side seems
> > largely the same (the passenger side is very different. You can see
> > the tube is much smaller in diameter as well.
> > But functionally it seems to be identical. As I said, I'm going to
> > fully compare the worn-out GT5 rack, a standard Pantera rack that I
> > keep on hand as a visual aid, and the new early 308 rack I just bought,
> > and we will see wot's wot.
> > BTW Rick Moseley's 1980 308 uses a later-style rack I believe, with a
> > different housing with the mounting clamps cast integral with the
> > housing. But internally it is the same as the Pantera rack, needs the
> > same bronze bushing for a quality repair, etc. etc. Rick is the one
> > who contacted TRW (the outfit that purchased Cam Gears UK, the original
> > maker of the Pantera and Ferrari racks) and asked what to use as a
> > lubricant; they told him in no uncertain terms that gear oil was no
> > longer in vogue and 0-weight grease was the lube of choice. The
> > GT5/Testa Rossa rack comes filled with this grease, as did the TRW
> > racks that some vendors were selling a few years ago, and also the ones
> > that Roland was selling. I have no doubt the new rack we just bought
> > will have grease as well.
> > (As an aside, I just replaced the worn-out rack on one of my VW
> > Sciroccos today. The new rack came from the German manufacturer filled
> > with grease too).
> > Rick and I worked together with the fellow you saw on the F-chat forum,
> > who has an early 308 GT4 Dino and had a blown-out rack. Some thief had
> > charged him over $1000 to 'repair' his rack; he threw a home-made
> > nylong bushing inside, bludgeoned some later-style tie rods onto the
> > rack, and overtightened them to the point where they were bound up
> > solid. The poor guy got the rack installed in his car with some
> > difficulty, but the car was virtually undriveable. He managed to get
> > it to an alignment shop and they literally couldn't turn the tie rods
> > to set the toe, so they sent him home.
> > With much long-distance hand-holding, he took the rack apart, dumped
> > the new parts, got three (!) Pantera rack bushings from three different
> > Pantera vendors, chose the one we told him to choose in the first
> > place, and put his rack back together using his original tie rods. The
> > result was perfection and he was quite pleased, not only with the
> > results, but with himself for having taken on the challenge and
> > prevailing.
> > He has been trying to sell one of his three rack bushings on E-bay for
> > quite some time now, with no takers; oddly, the other one sold almost
> > instantly?
> > Mike
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> >
> > DeTomaso mailing list
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> > http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> >
> >
> > !DSPAM:53084e8a24993343511756!
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
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>
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-------------- next part --------------
22 feb 2014 kl. 23:46 skrev B Hower <[1]b.hower3400 at yahoo.com>:
By any chance does the tires have ware from before rack repair, is it
possible they are aiding the poor handling?
No, the front tires doesn't seem to wear at all. The car has the same
tires in the front as when I bought it in March 2000. I have replaced
the rears once and they are pretty worn now again.
I will replace all of them now, but I don't expect any improvement in
the tram lining problem.
Thomas
Bud #3400 ( Drive it like there is no tomorrow -- for there may not be
! )
__________________________________________________________________
From: thomas <[2]thomas at hax.se>
To: "[3]MikeLDrew at aol.com" <[4]MikeLDrew at aol.com>
Cc: "[5]detomaso at poca.com" <[6]detomaso at poca.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 3:56 AM
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Steering Rack Interchange Ferrari 308
I rebuilt the rack in #9321 (1984 GT5) using a brass bushing that Mike
supplied, and I believe it is the later rack.
Later I removed some of the thin shims to reduce steering wheel play.
I have Marino's offset poly bushings and it is still a white knuckle
ride with the 285-40/15 Yokohama AVS-1 tires.
I don't think this can be fixed with a new rack alone.
Thomas
> 22 feb 2014 kl. 08:13 skrev [7]MikeLDrew at aol.com:
>
> In a message dated 2/21/14 21 43 19, [8]julian_kift at hotmail.com
writes:
>
> As you know I have replaced just about everything on the steering
> end of my GT5 in an effort to try and make it an enjoyable drive,
> alas it is still a white knuckle ride tram lining the slightest
rut
> in the road and darting when one changes lanes over the center
> crest. The rack was rebuilt at some point by someone who was heavy
> handed with vice grips and I have never been happy with it, so my
> last ditch effort is to just change out the rack for a new one.
> Mine being an early GT5 where Alejandro was still using up
leftover
> Ford parts has the same rack as my '74, so I'd be keen to know if
> what you have in the box there fits. That said I'm intrigued that
> later GT5's had a different rack, are they dimensionally the same
or
> does the later rack alter (improve) the steering geometry?
>
>>>> The later rack appears to be dimensionally the same. The rack
> housing tube is a smaller diameter, and there are crude spacers that
> wrap around the outside of it to make up the difference between the
> small tube and the larger opening in the Pantera rack housing
clamps.
> Here is what arrived at my house for me to repair, plucked from the
> GT5:
>
[9]http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ferrari-Testarossa-TRW-Steering-Rack-/121278
970
> 012
> At least, I'm 99.9% certain it's the same. The tie rods are
completely
> different from an early Pantera rack, the rack is different, the
> housing is different, although the boot on the driver's side seems
> largely the same (the passenger side is very different. You can see
> the tube is much smaller in diameter as well.
> But functionally it seems to be identical. As I said, I'm going to
> fully compare the worn-out GT5 rack, a standard Pantera rack that I
> keep on hand as a visual aid, and the new early 308 rack I just
bought,
> and we will see wot's wot.
> BTW Rick Moseley's 1980 308 uses a later-style rack I believe, with
a
> different housing with the mounting clamps cast integral with the
> housing. But internally it is the same as the Pantera rack, needs
the
> same bronze bushing for a quality repair, etc. etc. Rick is the one
> who contacted TRW (the outfit that purchased Cam Gears UK, the
original
> maker of the Pantera and Ferrari racks) and asked what to use as a
> lubricant; they told him in no uncertain terms that gear oil was no
> longer in vogue and 0-weight grease was the lube of choice. The
> GT5/Testa Rossa rack comes filled with this grease, as did the TRW
> racks that some vendors were selling a few years ago, and also the
ones
> that Roland was selling. I have no doubt the new rack we just
bought
> will have grease as well.
> (As an aside, I just replaced the worn-out rack on one of my VW
> Sciroccos today. The new rack came from the German manufacturer
filled
> with grease too).
> Rick and I worked together with the fellow you saw on the F-chat
forum,
> who has an early 308 GT4 Dino and had a blown-out rack. Some thief
had
> charged him over $1000 to 'repair' his rack; he threw a home-made
> nylong bushing inside, bludgeoned some later-style tie rods onto the
> rack, and overtightened them to the point where they were bound up
> solid. The poor guy got the rack installed in his car with some
> difficulty, but the car was virtually undriveable. He managed to
get
> it to an alignment shop and they literally couldn't turn the tie
rods
> to set the toe, so they sent him home.
> With much long-distance hand-holding, he took the rack apart, dumped
> the new parts, got three (!) Pantera rack bushings from three
different
> Pantera vendors, chose the one we told him to choose in the first
> place, and put his rack back together using his original tie rods.
The
> result was perfection and he was quite pleased, not only with the
> results, but with himself for having taken on the challenge and
> prevailing.
> He has been trying to sell one of his three rack bushings on E-bay
for
> quite some time now, with no takers; oddly, the other one sold
almost
> instantly?
> Mike
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [10]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [11]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
> !DSPAM:53084e8a24993343511756!
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References
1. mailto:b.hower3400 at yahoo.com
2. mailto:thomas at hax.se
3. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
4. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
5. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
6. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
7. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
8. mailto:julian_kift at hotmail.com
9. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ferrari-Testarossa-TRW-Steering-Rack-/121278970
10. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
11. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
12. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
13. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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