[DeTomaso] Don Byars and what he did to me and my Pantera

[michael at michaelshortt.com]

Any 12 year old can change the content of an email and reset the computer
clock to give it a new time stamp.

Michael
On Feb 6, 2014 1:19 AM, "Pantdino" <pantdino at aol.com> wrote:

>  You will find emails are generally worthless in court if it comes to
> that.
>
>  I'm not a lawyer but if the shop had email responses from the customer
> confirming "yes, I want XXX done at YYY price" I would think it would
> protect them against charges that they had done work without permission.
> (Not that this applies here--  I just find it hard to believe that emails
> are meaningless in court-- certainly better than "he told me verbally.")
>
> In California the shop has to give you a written estimate and document
> that they called you on certain dates to confirm that you agree to any
> further work.  My understanding is that if they do stuff you don't approve
> you don't have to pay for it-- the shop has to eat it.
>
> Do you have the original estimate and itemization of things beyond that
> you agreed to?
>
> Jim
>
>
>  -----Original Message-----
> From: michael <michael at michaelshortt.com>
> To: Bjoern Flesland <bflesland at gmail.com>
> Cc: detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
> Sent: Wed, Feb 5, 2014 9:11 pm
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Don Byars and what he did to me and my Pantera
>
>  You will find emails are generally worthless in court if it comes to
> that.
> I would have a written contact with each and every
> Itemized task and quoted cost beside it.
> I would have completion dates for each project as well.
> It's only legal if you both sign it, a notary seal makes it all the better.
> You should also have warranty terms and a stated policy of organization of
> receipts.
> Any items requiring additional hours or change orders should require a
> signed addendum sheet.
> No honest shop should object, it protects them as much as it does you.
> Of course a written list and complete photographic inventory and condition
> of the "before" car should help settle any issues with dents, scratches,
> missing parts, etc.
>  Michael Shortt
> Good fences make good neighbors, a solid restoration agreement will keep
> your shop and you on good terms before, during and after your car has been
> serviced.
> On Feb 5, 2014 11:48 PM, "bflesland at gmail.com" <bflesland at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>  So what's the best suggested approach of having major work done at a
>> car resto/body shop?
>> I am myself starting having a car restored/built and painted by a
>> reputable shop as well and want to avoid any future problems.
>>
>>  I understand paying upfront is a no-no.
>> I don't have a contract but everything to be done is in writing by email.
>> I am getting billed along the way as work progress.
>>
>>  Is a contract mandatory in case of future problems?
>>
>>  Hope I am not hijacking the thread here but this has happened before
>> and will again for somebody in the future, for sure!
>> I think bad communications and/or unrealistic expectations may be the
>> cause sometimes, together with poorly performed work, not done in a timely
>> manner.
>> Once I had to retrieve a car from a shop due to the shop owner had
>> personal problems, long sad story...
>>
>>  The thing today with internet and everything, is that from someone you
>> hear a shop is very good and reputable.
>> But if you search them yourself on the web you find bad stories posted as
>> well.
>> So not easy to pick the right shop.
>>
>>  Sorry for the long rant!
>> Cheers Bjoern
>>
>>
>> Den 5. feb. 2014 kl. 20:38 skrev audionut at hushmail.com:
>>
>>  Sad to hear stuff like this.
>>
>>  Don's shop did my A/C upgrade on time at a fair price around the year
>> 2008.  Hard to believe a respected, time-tested shop like this screwed up
>> but....
>>
>>  The shop is nearly *always* responsible for horror stories like this.
>>  It is the responsibility of the shop to quote the job right, clearly,*
>> in writing*, and complete
>> the job within a reasonable time, barring circumstances beyond the shops'
>> control.  Misunderstandings should be easily cleared up by the contract, if
>> they are not,
>> then the shop f'd up.
>>
>>  If the job gets out of hand in some way and the customer gets upset,
>> then it is nothing but a petty, juvenile, bully attitude if the shop then
>> says "Hey if you don't like it, I got your car, I got your money so, nyah
>> nyah nyah.  What are you gonna do about it?"
>>
>>  I can't see how Ed did anything wrong other than pay in full up front.
>>  Always a bad idea.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent using Hushmail
>>
>>
>> On February 5, 2014 at 11:09 AM, "Pantdino" <pantdino at aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>  Ed,
>>
>> Just to give us some background, what was Don supposed to do for the
>> original estimate of $36K?  That's a significant amount of money.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ed Mendez <edducati at mac.com>
>> To: detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
>> Sent: Tue, Feb 4, 2014 2:03 am
>> Subject: [DeTomaso] Don Byars and what he did to me and my Pantera
>>
>>  To All Pantera Owners Worldwide,
>>
>> You should all ready this, so this does not happen to you.
>>
>>  As of now Don Byars refuses to help me or repair any of the damage he
>> did to my Pantera after paying him $42,000 over the last two years! It is
>> shameful behaviour!
>>
>>  Mike Drew was going to feature my car in Profiles. Sorry but I would
>> rather you did not. Don deserves no advertising.
>>
>>  Read below how Don held my car as ransom, extorted $6000 more dollars
>> out of me, and made me sign a waiver releasing him of all warranty for work
>> he completed.
>>
>>  Now I am in another country, I have dumped my car on a friend to
>> finish, and I am out of a lot of cash.
>>
>>  I guess he did not realise that I have 300+ Pantera friends worldwide
>> on Facebook. I guess he will soon.
>>
>>  Ed
>>
>>
>> Begin forwarded message:
>>
>>  *From: *"Patterson, Lee R." <LEE.R.PATTERSON at saic.com>
>>  *Subject: **RE: [SDP] Hi Everyone please read*
>>  *Date: *4 February 2014 17:41:57 NZDT
>>  *To: *Kevin Ryniker <durland at san.rr.com>, 'Westmicro' <westmicro at aol.com>,
>> "mikebecker at cox.net" <mikebecker at cox.net>, "edducati at mac.com" <
>> edducati at mac.com>, "sdpanteras at googlegroups.com" <
>> sdpanteras at googlegroups.com>
>>  *Cc: *"Patterson, Lee R." <LEE.R.PATTERSON at saic.com>
>>
>>   I can only relate the time I called him to purchase a very small,
>> inexpensive part for my car.  His response was "that's all you want to
>> buy?" to which I said yes.  He then sighed and reluctantly took my order.
>> Upon receipt, the part was a poorly reproduced version of the original
>> part, the art work was off-center and after attempting to "fix" it myself,
>> I threw it in the trash.  So my only experience with him was he was
>> uninterested in my business and the product he sold and represented me was
>> shit.  So no, I will not call him ever again because to me, that behavior
>> speaks to total lack of INTEGRITY AND ETHICS.  I hope the $12,000 you
>> bought from him were better than my $25. part.
>>
>>  *From:* sdpanteras at googlegroups.com [mailto:sdpanteras at googlegroups.com
>> ] *On Behalf Of *Kevin Ryniker
>> *Sent:* Monday, February 03, 2014 8:30 PM
>> *To:* 'Westmicro'; mikebecker at cox.net; edducati at mac.com;
>> sdpanteras at googlegroups.com
>> *Subject:* RE: [SDP] Hi Everyone please read
>>
>> I Have to agree with Mike to the extent that there must be something else
>> going on. This sounds like a cash flow crunch, he is acting like a producer
>> on a show that got in over his head.
>>
>> I known Bobby Buyers for 10 years at least, never had a problem, I've
>> easily bought $12,000 worth of parts from him. He has always stood behind
>> his work and his dealings with me. He even warranty parts that I got from
>> Wilkenson and Hall, for free, expensive stuff. Never really delt with Don
>> but I think he is Don's brother, they used to be in business with each
>> other, might be worthwhile to call Bobby. Just an idea.
>>
>> Any help I can aid in please feel free to ask.
>>
>>  Durland Productions
>> Kevin Ryniker, Cell (858) 336 9803
>> Phone (858) 693 6207, Fax (858) 693 6227
>> 8766 Betelgeuse Way, San Diego, CA 92126
>> www.durlandproductions.com
>>
>>
>>
>>  *From:* sdpanteras at googlegroups.com [mailto:sdpanteras at googlegroups.com
>> ] *On Behalf Of *Westmicro
>> *Sent:* Monday, February 03, 2014 7:47 PM
>> *To:* mikebecker at cox.net; edducati at mac.com; sdpanteras at googlegroups.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [SDP] Hi Everyone please read
>>
>> Please pass all this on to Don.
>>  Maybe this will make him realize what he has done here, and he will
>> make it right.
>>  Reputation and doing the right thing is Everything in Business.
>>  *Dave Nuding*
>>  *Western Micrographics & Imaging Systems*
>>  *Houston / San Diego*
>>  *858-722-5500*
>>  *http://www.westernmicrographics.com*
>>
>>
>>  -----Original Message-----
>> From: Michael Becker <mikebecker at cox.net>
>> To: 'Ed Mendez' <edducati at mac.com>; 'San Diego Panteras' <
>> sdpanteras at googlegroups.com>
>> Sent: Mon, Feb 3, 2014 8:35 pm
>> Subject: RE: [SDP] Hi Everyone please read
>>
>> Holy crap, that's terrible Ed.  So sorry to hear this.  I don't understand,
>>
>> I've never heard a bad thing about Don.  I've also never had any work done
>>
>> by him, but the general perception is that his work speaks for itself.  I
>>
>> can't imagine what his reasoning is.  I don't have any kind of relationship
>>
>> with him, so I don't really feel I could speak to him.  Maybe something just
>>
>> got into him and he needs time to realize the pickle he's put you in.  Maybe
>>
>> he's got some other troubles and sort of reached a breaking point or
>>
>> something like that.  Perhaps he'll come around and somehow make good on it.
>>
>> I would hold off on slinging mud until all options for reconciliation are
>>
>> exhausted.
>>
>> Hang in there,
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>>
>> From: sdpanteras at googlegroups.com [mailto:sdpanteras at googlegroups.com] On
>>
>> Behalf Of Ed Mendez
>>
>> Sent: Monday, February 03, 2014 4:39 PM
>>
>> To: San Diego Panteras
>>
>> Subject: [SDP] Hi Everyone please read
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>>
>>
>> Made it to New Zealand and started work. Still a bit jet lagged but that is
>>
>> nothing compared to how I feel from what Don Byars did to me before I left.
>>
>>
>>
>> After paying Don $36,000 in cash and up front and paying my final invoiced
>>
>> bill on Jan. 22nd. There were some electrical issues from the Pantera
>>
>> Electronics parts I bought. There were two blown up boards, Pantera not
>>
>> charging, and several other issues. This was NOT from Pantera Electronics
>>
>> however, it was from Don not following the simple directions and hooking
>>
>> things up wrong. So he spent the next four days trying to sort out the
>>
>> issues. On the 28th he called me and said come and get this car out of my
>>
>> shop! I asked if it was done, he said no, and it is not running either. He
>>
>> verbally told me on the 22nd that it would be about $2000 more and he would
>>
>> have it all finished including the seats bolted in on the seat rails, the
>>
>> seat belts, and all be working. What he told me on the phone shocked me. He
>>
>> said that I now owed him an additional $6300 and that knowing I was leaving,
>>
>> he wanted cash, and would not release the car until I paid him in full!
>>
>>
>>
>> I have always paid him up front, and in advance. Since I was leaving the
>>
>> country, he gave me no choice, I had to come up with cash. He delivered the
>>
>> car to me, backed it out of his trailer still hooked to the cable, I then
>>
>> paid him in full and he refused to unhook the car until I signed a waiver
>>
>> releasing him of any work related defects!!!
>>
>>
>>
>> He treated me like a criminal and EXTORTED $6000 from me!
>>
>>
>>
>> Now the car is sitting in Vista, Ca. The seats were not bolted in, the belts
>>
>> were not done, seat rails, scratches in my paint under the hood, he left my
>>
>> brand new air compressor disconnected and exposed to air. The car runs but
>>
>> electrically a mess, far from being done, and far from being in a state of
>>
>> condition for the money I paid him.
>>
>>
>>
>> Don Byars is a thief to the Nth degree! And he did all this in front of
>>
>> whom? The new President of POCA!
>>
>>
>>
>> Just wondering if he is completely stupid!? I just wonder what I did, I was
>>
>> utterly insulted. What did I do to deserve this? His wife told me Don was
>>
>> mad because I did not let him finish the car!!!??? I paid him a total of
>>
>> $42,000. He knew the drop dead date months before I was leaving. Even John Haas of Pantera Electronics offered to help, Don did not call him once!!! I asked John Haas to call him.
>>
>>      At this point my car is in the care of John Buckman, if anyone can please
>>
>> offer any assistance, I have to get it in a somewhat completed state to ship
>>
>> overseas.
>>
>>
>>
>> Please spread the word. If I were there I could do something, all I have is
>>
>> you guys to spread the word about what he did to me.
>>
>>
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Ed Mendez
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>
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