[DeTomaso] Undercar fresh air intake (Re: New engine)
Ken Green
kenn_green at yahoo.com
Mon Dec 8 22:06:36 EST 2014
Asa,
Can you provide a link to photos of MDs air intake system?
Ken
From: Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>
To: detomaso at poca.com
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 6:56 PM
Subject: [DeTomaso] Undercar fresh air intake (Re: New engine)
The photos on this page:
http://teampanteraracing.com/index.php?option=com_g2bridge&view=gallery&Itemid=57&g2_itemId=2586
show you a stock undercar air intake snorkel, minus the flexible hose
that connected it all.
You'll see the undercar air pickup that would normally go to the square
inlet on the air cleaner, and I also show the hot air pickup on the
exhaust manifold that would normally go to the smaller round port on the
underside of the air cleaner snorkel and be controlled by a vacuum motor.
These are all original parts that were on my Pantera when I got it.
Asa Jay
Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************
http://www.racingagainstautism.com
http://www.teampanteraracing.com
http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
On 12/8/2014 9:56 AM, Boyd Casey wrote:
> I believe you could fabricate some sort of "snorkel" using the specter
> air filter "cold air box" using the two intakes directed down toward
> the ground along the bulkhead firewall with NACA ducts at the bottom of
> the snorkels.A ( if you are not familiar with NACA ducts they are
> openingsA that draw in air while passing through the air without
> causing drag because they don't stick out into the path of the air
> flow) This link will bring you to a wikipedia descriptionA [1]NACA
> DuctsA .I have experimented with several different combinations of air
> intakes and remote filters to attempt to provide a source of cold or
> "cooler " air for the intake. If I remember correctly the original
> design of the PanteraA used a "snorkel" to get intake air from near
> the ground. The air down at the ground is substantially cooler then the
> surrounding ambient air and various experiments have shown that the
> Pantera acts like a vacum cleaner as it travels down the road and sucks
> air up from the ground and it passes out the open rear "window" so
> cooler air at the bottom of the car and the "vacuum" process of sucking
> air up and into the engine compartmentA would seem to support the idea
> of using an opening near the ground makes the most sense if one is
> looking for a source for cooler air to improve the operation and
> maximize power. I would ask Mike drew about the original design of the
> "snorkel" intake. I have pictures of some of the parts I have used in
> my efforts to implement a remote cool air source and inline filters.A
> ( if you are interested)
> Boyd
>
> On Mon, Dec 8, 2014 at 12:02 AM, Robert Stroj<[2]npdrs at maui.net>
> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> A
>
> I got a early, flat deck car and my goal is to keep it look as stock as
> possible on the outside; no wings, no flares, just the front hood
> grills (as they are already on the car) and central exhaust exit if I
> end up going with 180 exhaust.
>
> So, I would like to just find a air cleaner assembly that would fit
> well on high single plane intake and that is not restrictive; I liked
> the look of air cleaner I seen on Arjuns GT4 photos.
>
> A
>
> Down the line I am looking to possibly change to IR setup; either Weber
> or FI; but that is a future project for now.
>
> A
>
> Regarding the Cold Air Intakes Mike mentioned earlier that have been
> taking air from below the car; is someone making fiberglass "scoops"
> for this system, or, are there somewhere some pictures showing how this
> was implemented?
>
> A
>
> Robert
>
> A
>
> From: Boyd Casey [mailto:[3]boyd411 at gmail.com]
> Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2014 2:01 PM
> To: Robert Stroj
> Cc: richard boschert; detomaso mail list
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] New engine
>
> A
>
> Robert,
>
> If you are going to use "sugar scoops" at the side windows this is the
> air cleaner "cold air box" that mike drew mentioned which is made by
> Specter [4]specter cold air box air cleaner
>
> Boyd
>
> A
>
> On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 4:16 PM, Robert Stroj<[5]npdrs at maui.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Richard,
> thanks a lot, your system looks really nice!
> Is it stainless or ceramic coated?
> Is it possible to take the valve covers off and adjust the valves
> without
> taking headers off; this is important for me as i run solid lifters?
> Would you please maybe have contact for Ron; would like to see if he
> has or
> can make a system for my application?
> Thanks a lot,
> Robert
> -----Original Message-----
> From: richard boschert [mailto:[6]theemonkey at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2014 6:49 PM
> To: Robert Stroj
>
> Cc: 'detomaso mail list'
> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] New engine
> Robert,I have the Precision Proformance 180's.
> My engine is a 408 Windsor.A A 9.5 deck height,AFR 185 heads,stock
> port
> location.
> Both Hall Pantera and Precision Proformance have 180 headers for Yates
> heads,but Halls exit in the corners so you can leave the air
> conditioning
> condenser in place.I do not like the HallA corner exit as it sounds
> like a
> truck versus the the two exhaust pipes exiting together in the center
> sounds
> like aA wild V12.
> Link to short video clip of mine,
> [7]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXl5tdQqZLA&list=UUtdJuds1sRZCb1aKkP
> sb-Pg
> Attached are a few pics to show roughly how they fit in the engine
> bay.Ignore the dusty engine bay,i have not cleaned it since Laguna
> Seca.
> Everything i have seen that Ron Mcall does has been great,so if he is
> offering 180's that fit your heads, get his if you are able.
> Richard
> --------------------------------------------
> On Fri, 12/5/14, Robert Stroj<[8]npdrs at maui.net> wrote:
> A Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] New engine
> A To: "'richard boschert'"<[9]theemonkey at yahoo.com>
> A Cc: "'detomaso mail list'"<[10]detomaso at poca.com>
> A Date: Friday, December 5, 2014, 3:57 PM
> A Hi Richard,
> A could you please let me know
> A what 180 exhaust did you install?
> A What
> A engine (deck height) and heads combination do you have?
> A A photo would be great!
> A If I find a 180 system that bolts straight toA my 9.2 deck with
> Yates C3
> heads I mightA consider going that route.
> A Thanks, Robert
> A -----Original Message-----
> A From: richard boschert [mailto:[11]theemonkey at yahoo.com]
> A Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2014 1:57
> A PM
> A To: detomaso mail list
> A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] New engine
> A "Rich Boschert had
> A ANSA-sized Flowmaster mufflers, but they were brutallyA loud--they
> almost
> seemed like amplifiers ratherA than mufflers!A A A And theyA lookedA
> terrible
> too."
> A Hey,i
> A do not think they were ugly ,(attached a pic if it goesA thru),but
> yes
> they were LOUDA : )
> A The Ansa mufflers and tips are
> A by far the best looking muffler,but haveA horrible flow.
> A I had Cherry Bomb Extreme mufflers with nonA baffled
> tips.Essentially the
> areA a hollowA can with one angled metal plate .They flowed well,and
> had a
> deepA exhaust note.Less drone at low rpm thanA the stock Ansa's as
> well.The
> problemA with the stock Pantera muffler location is youA have to use
> a short
> lengthA muffler,whichA makes it difficult to have decent exhaust flow
> and
> soundA canceling ability.Also a more powerful engineA will be louder
> than a
> stockA engine with theA same mufflers.
> A ">Other option, should I replace
> A everything with 180 degree system; howA>A muchA> power is it
> really
> worth?
> A>
> A>>>What you get
> A is style and a different sound.A A A You'llA never notice aA
> performance
> difference, andA you will pick up weight plus enormous complexityA
> and
> hamper maintenance access."
> A On my car, i just installed
> A 180's with 4 inch Magnaflow mufflers,and it madeA a significant
> increase in
> power over my alreadyA decent flowing loudA exhaust.In fact the carA
> revs so
> quick i am seriously thinking of changing myA final drive gear ratio
> to
> 3.73, when i changeA the 5th gear in the ZF.
> A With the 180 exhaust you have a lot moreA options on mufflers that
> can
> reduceA noiseA but still have good flow,because you are no longer as
> limited byA muffler body length.You lose yourA trunk storage,but is
> it
> something youA reallyA need?If you drop the battery in the front you
> can
> gain someA moreA storage up front.I started to convert aA trunk that
> was in
> really bad shapeA to goA around my 180's,but it has been on the back
> burner
> sinceA i have beenA able to get by without it soA far.
> A By the way,the
> A 180's sound GLORIOUS!
> A Richard
>
> _______________________________________________
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [12]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [13]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
> A
>
> References
>
> 1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NACA_duct
> 2. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
> 3. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
> 4. http://www.carid.com/spectre/spectre-performance-air-box-12048027.html
> 5. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
> 6. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
> 7. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXl5tdQqZLA&list=UUtdJuds1sRZCb1aKkPsb-Pg
> 8. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
> 9. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
> 10. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
> 11. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
> 12. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
> 13. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> DeTomaso at poca.com
> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2015.0.5577 / Virus Database: 4235/8703 - Release Date: 12/08/14
_______________________________________________
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DeTomaso mailing list
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-------------- next part --------------
Asa,
Can you provide a link to photos of MDs air intake system?
Ken
__________________________________________________________________
From: Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>
To: detomaso at poca.com
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 6:56 PM
Subject: [DeTomaso] Undercar fresh air intake (Re: New engine)
The photos on this page:
[1]http://teampanteraracing.com/index.php?option=com_g2bridge&view=gall
ery&Itemid=57&g2_itemId=2586
show you a stock undercar air intake snorkel, minus the flexible hose
that connected it all.
You'll see the undercar air pickup that would normally go to the square
inlet on the air cleaner, and I also show the hot air pickup on the
exhaust manifold that would normally go to the smaller round port on
the
underside of the air cleaner snorkel and be controlled by a vacuum
motor.
These are all original parts that were on my Pantera when I got it.
Asa Jay
Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************
[2]http://www.racingagainstautism.com
[3]http://www.teampanteraracing.com
[4]http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
On 12/8/2014 9:56 AM, Boyd Casey wrote:
> I believe you could fabricate some sort of "snorkel" using the
specter
> air filter "cold air box" using the two intakes directed down
toward
> the ground along the bulkhead firewall with NACA ducts at the
bottom of
> the snorkels.A ( if you are not familiar with NACA ducts they are
> openingsA that draw in air while passing through the air without
> causing drag because they don't stick out into the path of the air
> flow) This link will bring you to a wikipedia descriptionA
[1]NACA
> DuctsA .I have experimented with several different combinations
of air
> intakes and remote filters to attempt to provide a source of cold
or
> "cooler " air for the intake. If I remember correctly the original
> design of the PanteraA used a "snorkel" to get intake air from
near
> the ground. The air down at the ground is substantially cooler
then the
> surrounding ambient air and various experiments have shown that
the
> Pantera acts like a vacum cleaner as it travels down the road and
sucks
> air up from the ground and it passes out the open rear "window" so
> cooler air at the bottom of the car and the "vacuum" process of
sucking
> air up and into the engine compartmentA would seem to support the
idea
> of using an opening near the ground makes the most sense if one is
> looking for a source for cooler air to improve the operation and
> maximize power. I would ask Mike drew about the original design of
the
> "snorkel" intake. I have pictures of some of the parts I have used
in
> my efforts to implement a remote cool air source and inline
filters.A
> ( if you are interested)
> Boyd
>
> On Mon, Dec 8, 2014 at 12:02 AM, Robert
Stroj<[2][5]npdrs at maui.net>
> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> A
>
> I got a early, flat deck car and my goal is to keep it look as
stock as
> possible on the outside; no wings, no flares, just the front hood
> grills (as they are already on the car) and central exhaust exit
if I
> end up going with 180 exhaust.
>
> So, I would like to just find a air cleaner assembly that would
fit
> well on high single plane intake and that is not restrictive; I
liked
> the look of air cleaner I seen on Arjuns GT4 photos.
>
> A
>
> Down the line I am looking to possibly change to IR setup; either
Weber
> or FI; but that is a future project for now.
>
> A
>
> Regarding the Cold Air Intakes Mike mentioned earlier that have
been
> taking air from below the car; is someone making fiberglass
"scoops"
> for this system, or, are there somewhere some pictures showing how
this
> was implemented?
>
> A
>
> Robert
>
> A
>
> From: Boyd Casey [mailto:[3][6]boyd411 at gmail.com]
> Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2014 2:01 PM
> To: Robert Stroj
> Cc: richard boschert; detomaso mail list
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] New engine
>
> A
>
> Robert,
>
> If you are going to use "sugar scoops" at the side windows this is
the
> air cleaner "cold air box" that mike drew mentioned which is made
by
> Specter [4]specter cold air box air cleaner
>
> Boyd
>
> A
>
> On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 4:16 PM, Robert
Stroj<[5][7]npdrs at maui.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Richard,
> thanks a lot, your system looks really nice!
> Is it stainless or ceramic coated?
> Is it possible to take the valve covers off and adjust the valves
> without
> taking headers off; this is important for me as i run solid
lifters?
> Would you please maybe have contact for Ron; would like to see if
he
> has or
> can make a system for my application?
> Thanks a lot,
> Robert
> -----Original Message-----
> From: richard boschert [mailto:[6][8]theemonkey at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2014 6:49 PM
> To: Robert Stroj
>
> Cc: 'detomaso mail list'
> Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] New engine
> Robert,I have the Precision Proformance 180's.
> My engine is a 408 Windsor.A A 9.5 deck height,AFR 185
heads,stock
> port
> location.
> Both Hall Pantera and Precision Proformance have 180 headers for
Yates
> heads,but Halls exit in the corners so you can leave the air
> conditioning
> condenser in place.I do not like the HallA corner exit as it
sounds
> like a
> truck versus the the two exhaust pipes exiting together in the
center
> sounds
> like aA wild V12.
> Link to short video clip of mine,
>
[7][9]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXl5tdQqZLA&list=UUtdJuds1sRZCb1a
KkP
> sb-Pg
> Attached are a few pics to show roughly how they fit in the engine
> bay.Ignore the dusty engine bay,i have not cleaned it since Laguna
> Seca.
> Everything i have seen that Ron Mcall does has been great,so if he
is
> offering 180's that fit your heads, get his if you are able.
> Richard
> --------------------------------------------
> On Fri, 12/5/14, Robert Stroj<[8][10]npdrs at maui.net> wrote:
> A Subject: RE: [DeTomaso] New engine
> A To: "'richard boschert'"<[9][11]theemonkey at yahoo.com>
> A Cc: "'detomaso mail list'"<[10][12]detomaso at poca.com>
> A Date: Friday, December 5, 2014, 3:57 PM
> A Hi Richard,
> A could you please let me know
> A what 180 exhaust did you install?
> A What
> A engine (deck height) and heads combination do you have?
> A A photo would be great!
> A If I find a 180 system that bolts straight toA my 9.2 deck with
> Yates C3
> heads I mightA consider going that route.
> A Thanks, Robert
> A -----Original Message-----
> A From: richard boschert [mailto:[11][13]theemonkey at yahoo.com]
> A Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2014 1:57
> A PM
> A To: detomaso mail list
> A Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] New engine
> A "Rich Boschert had
> A ANSA-sized Flowmaster mufflers, but they were brutallyA
loud--they
> almost
> seemed like amplifiers ratherA than mufflers!A A A And theyA
lookedA
> terrible
> too."
> A Hey,i
> A do not think they were ugly ,(attached a pic if it goesA
thru),but
> yes
> they were LOUDA : )
> A The Ansa mufflers and tips are
> A by far the best looking muffler,but haveA horrible flow.
> A I had Cherry Bomb Extreme mufflers with nonA baffled
> tips.Essentially the
> areA a hollowA can with one angled metal plate .They flowed
well,and
> had a
> deepA exhaust note.Less drone at low rpm thanA the stock Ansa's
as
> well.The
> problemA with the stock Pantera muffler location is youA have to
use
> a short
> lengthA muffler,whichA makes it difficult to have decent exhaust
flow
> and
> soundA canceling ability.Also a more powerful engineA will be
louder
> than a
> stockA engine with theA same mufflers.
> A ">Other option, should I replace
> A everything with 180 degree system; howA>A muchA> power is it
> really
> worth?
> A>
> A>>>What you get
> A is style and a different sound.A A A You'llA never notice aA
> performance
> difference, andA you will pick up weight plus enormous
complexityA
> and
> hamper maintenance access."
> A On my car, i just installed
> A 180's with 4 inch Magnaflow mufflers,and it madeA a significant
> increase in
> power over my alreadyA decent flowing loudA exhaust.In fact the
carA
> revs so
> quick i am seriously thinking of changing myA final drive gear
ratio
> to
> 3.73, when i changeA the 5th gear in the ZF.
> A With the 180 exhaust you have a lot moreA options on mufflers
that
> can
> reduceA noiseA but still have good flow,because you are no
longer as
> limited byA muffler body length.You lose yourA trunk storage,but
is
> it
> something youA reallyA need?If you drop the battery in the front
you
> can
> gain someA moreA storage up front.I started to convert aA trunk
that
> was in
> really bad shapeA to goA around my 180's,but it has been on the
back
> burner
> sinceA i have beenA able to get by without it soA far.
> A By the way,the
> A 180's sound GLORIOUS!
> A Richard
>
> _______________________________________________
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [12][14]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [13][15]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
> A
>
> References
>
> 1. [16]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NACA_duct
> 2. mailto:[17]npdrs at maui.net
> 3. mailto:[18]boyd411 at gmail.com
> 4.
[19]http://www.carid.com/spectre/spectre-performance-air-box-12048027.h
tml
> 5. mailto:[20]npdrs at maui.net
> 6. mailto:[21]theemonkey at yahoo.com
> 7.
[22]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXl5tdQqZLA&list=UUtdJuds1sRZCb1aKk
Psb-Pg
> 8. mailto:[23]npdrs at maui.net
> 9. mailto:[24]theemonkey at yahoo.com
> 10. mailto:[25]detomaso at poca.com
> 11. mailto:[26]theemonkey at yahoo.com
> 12. mailto:[27]DeTomaso at poca.com
> 13. [28]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>
> DeTomaso mailing list
> [29]DeTomaso at poca.com
> [30]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2015.0.5577 / Virus Database: 4235/8703 - Release Date:
12/08/14
_______________________________________________
Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
DeTomaso mailing list
[31]DeTomaso at poca.com
[32]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
References
1. http://teampanteraracing.com/index.php?option=com_g2bridge&view=gallery&Itemid=57&g2_itemId=2586
2. http://www.racingagainstautism.com/
3. http://www.teampanteraracing.com/
4. http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
5. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
6. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
7. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
8. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
9. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXl5tdQqZLA&list=UUtdJuds1sRZCb1aKkP
10. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
11. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
12. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
13. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
14. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
15. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
16. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NACA_duct
17. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
18. mailto:boyd411 at gmail.com
19. http://www.carid.com/spectre/spectre-performance-air-box-12048027.html
20. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
21. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
22. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXl5tdQqZLA&list=UUtdJuds1sRZCb1aKkPsb-Pg
23. mailto:npdrs at maui.net
24. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
25. mailto:detomaso at poca.com
26. mailto:theemonkey at yahoo.com
27. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
28. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
29. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
30. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
31. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
32. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
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