[DeTomaso] By-Laws (Re: POCA Election and email voting)

Ed Mendez edducati at mac.com
Sat Dec 6 17:04:19 EST 2014 

I think, if you send an email which is in fact an electronic mail and it passes within the border of the U.S. It is now legally US mail. This is a minimum of first class or better, maybe even priority if you make it so in the email as high priority, only its delivered in milliseconds.

And the electronic signature makes it official.

I just made that up, but makes sense to me, and will certainly spark more debate.

Hahaha

:-)

Ed

Ps. Don't kill me just just trying to make people smile.


Sent from my iPhone 5

> On Dec 6, 2014, at 12:59, Himes, Terry (397C) <terry.himes at jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
> 
> I agree with both.   You can add your own certified signature to the PDF.  Which is what I did.
> I filled it in with PDF edit, did the Adobe Signature and Certification.  Then sent it via email.
> 
> I don't do paper any more.  It's silly.   Long gone are Faxes, Transparencies and Dodo Birds.  ;-))
> (I threw out my home printer years ago. I wasn't going to pay HP another penny for ink Grrr!. ;-)
> 
> Go electronic!  The only way.
> 
> Terry
> 
> 
> Terry W. Himes
> JPL Jet Propulsion Laboratory
> InSight Sequence Team Lead
> Rosetta/MEX Sequence Team Lead
> Phone: (818) 393-6261
> Cell:     (818) 653-8213
> Fax:     (818) 393-3147
> thimes at jpl.nasa.gov
> 
> ________________________________________
> From: DeTomaso [detomaso-bounces at poca.com] on behalf of Asa Jay Laughton [asajay at asajay.com]
> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2014 11:18 AM
> To: De Tomaso List
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] By-Laws  (Re:  POCA Election and email voting)
> 
> I'm rather with Julian on this interpretation.  It's really item L that
> gets specific, that votes may only be on the original ballot.  But the
> latest ballot was on a PDF, ergo... it should be returned as a PDF.  :)
> 
> Was the original ballot sent in accordance with the by-laws?  It was
> included with the newsletter this year (thank you for that), but was it
> mailed using First Class mail?  Or media mail?  Or bulk?  I don't
> remember and I throw away the envelope.
> 
> Even if they were sent correctly, the only stipulation in item K is to
> follow the return "instructions."  Well, those instructions -could- be
> to snail mail them, email them, carve them in stone and deliver by horse
> and cart, or spit in the wind.
> 
> It would seem, with the accidental omission on this year's ballot that
> is now being compensated for by the pdf ballot, that official
> instruction could be modified to accommodate emailing of the original
> PDF ballot back to the official ballot counter.  After all, if we wish
> to try and adhere to item L, which states an official ballot needs to be
> returned... well, the official ballot was a pdf.  :)
> 
> I think this needs one or more POCA Board members to step in and make an
> administrative decision; preferably the President.
> 
> I'm just sayin'
> Asa Jay
> 
> 
> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> &  Shelley Marie
> Spokane, WA
> ******************************
> http://www.racingagainstautism.com
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com
> http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
> 
> 
>> On 12/6/2014 10:23 AM, Julian Kift wrote:
>> All I see is in (k) is a requirement to send out ballots with a
>> pre-printed return envelope and as to ballot return it states "if
>> applicable, together with instructions for their return to the
>> Election Committee and containing the date that the ballots must be
>> postmarked and/or received to be eligible to be counted"
>> 
>> "if applicable, together with instructions for their return" I don't
>> have a copy of my newsletter as I'm in Canada, does it explicitly say
>> ballots have to be returned by USPS mail in the pre-printed envelope
>> provided in the newsletter? I can scan the envelope too if it helps
>> your overcome your bureaucracy.
>> "date that ballots must be postmarked and/or received to be eligible
>> to be counted" would imply that a postmark is not necessarily
>> required, therefore couldbe delivered by such other means as hand
>> delivered, email etc.
>> 
>> Julian
>> *POCA*: *P*olitics like*O*bama; *C*onspiracies*A*bound
>> 
>>> Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2014 09:57:05 -0800
>>> From: asajay at asajay.com
>>> To: detomaso at poca.com
>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] By-Laws (Re: POCA Election and email voting)
>>> 
>>> The POCA By-Laws are published publicly for all to see:
>>> http://www.poca.com/index.php/club/by-laws
>>> 
>>> Note section 4. Elections:
>>> Subsection (e):
>>> (e) It shall be the function of the Election Committee to contact
>>> individuals nominated for office; to verify their availability for
>>> office; to verify that they are members in good standing both at the
>>> time of their nomination and, if successful, at the time of their
>>> election; to solicit additional nominees if warranted; to prepare, mail
>>> and receive ballots; to verify eligibility of both Regular and
>> Associate
>>> members for voting; to count the valid votes; and to announce the
>>> successful candidates;
>>> 
>>> and subsection (k) through (n):
>>> 
>>> (k) On October 1st, ballots and pre-printed return envelopes are to be
>>> provided to Regular members via first-class U.S. mail, with space
>>> provided on the ballot for voting by both the Regular member and the
>>> designated Associate member, if applicable, together with instructions
>>> for their return to the Election Committee and containing the date that
>>> the ballots must be postmarked and/or received to be eligible to be
>> counted;
>>> 
>>> (l) Voting shall be by secret written ballot and only on the original
>>> ballot form as provided by POCA;
>>> 
>>> (m) Only Regular and Associate members in good standing shall be
>>> entitled to vote;
>>> 
>>> (n) Only Associate members who are specifically designated as such by
>>> Regular members will be entitled to vote;
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. I would agree the methods could
>>> change now that we're in the 21st century, but it will take a change to
>>> the by-laws, which has it's own problems.
>>> 
>>> Asa Jay
>>> 
>>> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>>> & Shelley Marie
>>> Spokane, WA
>>> ******************************
>>> http://www.racingagainstautism.com
>>> http://www.teampanteraracing.com
>>> http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 12/6/2014 9:44 AM, Bill Moore wrote:
>>>> People, All.
>>>> 
>>>> Come on it is 2014, damn near 15.
>>>> 
>>>> Just because I have a 40 year old car, it should not mean i vote bu
>>>> snail mail.
>>>> 
>>>> John Buckman, I thought we covered this off Thursday night.
>>>> 
>>>> I completely agree with Julian.
>>>> 
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> 
>>>> Bill Moore
>>>> 
>>>> Incendium Supply
>>>> 
>>>> Calgary
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> 
>>>> From: Julian Kift
>>>> 
>>>> Date:2014-12-06 10:30 AM (GMT-07:00)
>>>> 
>>>> To: cengles at cox.net,detomaso at poca.com
>>>> 
>>>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] POCA Election and email voting
>>>> 
>>>> Chuck,
>>>> Can you point us to where the bylaws specifically state that ballots
>>>> have to be returned via US Mail? I see where ballots must be sent out
>>>> via such means or as later amended within a newsletter, but no
>>>> requirement that they have to be returned by such. This would actually
>>>> preclude all of us outside the US that are members in good standing.
>>>> I would sincerely hope that my PDF vote with my member number and
>>>> signature that I emailed to you will be counted or I am afraid I shall
>>>> be voting with my feet next time my membership comes due.
>>>> Sincerely,
>>>> Julian
>>>> From: cengles at cox.net
>>>> To: detomaso at poca.com
>>>> Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2014 11:14:35 -0600
>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] POCA Election and email voting
>>>> Dear Forum,
>>>> The bylaws state that only mailed ballots are
>>>> acceptable.
>>>> At this time the bylaws do not permit email voting.
>>>> 
>>>> Sincerely, Chuck Engles
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>>>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>>> Chuck,
>>>> Can you point us to where the bylaws specifically state that ballots
>>>> have to be returned via US Mail? I see where ballots must be sent
>>>> out
>>>> via such means or as later amended within a newsletter, but no
>>>> requirement that they have to be returned by such. This would
>>>> actually
>>>> preclude all of us outside the US that are members in good standing.
>>>> I would sincerely hope that my PDF vote with my member number and
>>>> signature that I emailed to you will be counted or I am afraid I
>>>> shall
>>>> be voting with my feet next time my membership comes due.
>>>> Sincerely,
>>>> Julian
>>>> From: cengles at cox.net
>>>> To: detomaso at poca.com
>>>> Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2014 11:14:35 -0600
>>>> Subject: [DeTomaso] POCA Election and email voting
>>>> Dear Forum,
>>>> The bylaws state that only mailed ballots are
>>>> acceptable.
>>>> At this time the bylaws do not permit email voting.
>>>> Sincerely, Chuck Engles
>>>> _______________________________________________ Detomaso Forum
>>>> Managed
>>>> by POCA DeTomaso mailing list DeTomaso at poca.com
>>>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>>> DeTomaso mailing list
>>>> DeTomaso at poca.com
>>>> http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> 
>>>> Detomaso Forum Managed by POCA
>>>> 
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