[DeTomaso] ZF gear oil--another question

Mike Drew MikeLDrew at aol.com
Sat Apr 12 22:12:44 EDT 2014 

Lloyd and other vendors recommend changing every two years. You are long overdue!

Mike

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 12, 2014, at 16:09, Christopher Kimball <chrisvkimball at msn.com> wrote:

>   So with all this talk about ZF gear oil, let me ask a questions:
>   I have put about 25,000 miles on my ZF--the vast majority freeway miles
>   (to Fun Rallies in Phoenix, Reno, etc.)--following safety-wiring and
>   inspection.  Am I OK in terms of gear oil, or is it time to change it?
>   Thanks,
>   Chris
>   From: thomas at hax.se
>   Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2014 00:33:08 +0200
>   To: pantdino at aol.com
>   CC: detomaso at poca.com
>   Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] ZF gear oil
> 
> 
>> 12 apr 2014 kl. 19:12 skrev Pantdino <pantdino at aol.com>:
>> 
>> Thomas,
>> 
>> "And there is no "yellow metal" in our ZF:s, right?"
>> 
>> I think that is not correct.  "Yellow metal" refers to brass, which is what sy
> nchros are made of or at least what they were made of back in the day.
> 
> I believe the synchros are all steel in the ZF.
> 
>> 
>> I read somewhere that GL5 oils coat the metal better than GL4s, but the proble
> m is that the coating is so adherent that when it comes off it can tear off a fe
> w molecules of the metal. Over time this can result in gear wear.
>> 
>> My Abarth guru recommends Red Line MT-90 for my Fiat transaxle.  It is a 75W90
> GL4 oil that is recommended for gearboxes and FRONT-WHEEL DRIVE transaxles but
> not rear wheel drive diffs.
>> 
>> Unfortunately I don't know enough about transaxles to know why GL4 oil is best
> for a Fiat transaxle but wouldn't be good for a ZF or Ferrari unit.  Or maybe i
> t would be??
>> 
>> Jim Oddie
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Thomas Tornblom <thomas at hax.se>
>> To: detomaso <detomaso at poca.com>
>> Sent: Fri, Apr 11, 2014 11:44 pm
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] ZF gear oil
>> 
>> Pantdino skrev 2014-04-12 08:14:
>>>    I think Mike misspoke / miswrote
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>    Most gear oil is GL5 and it is GL4 that is hard to find
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>    But the best oil for the ZF is Red Line 75W90NS--- the NS signifying
>>>    "not so slippery" I presume.
>>> 
>>>    ANY oil that says it is OK to use in a limited slip diff will be TOO
>>>    slippery for proper synchro function and will predispose to early
>>>    synchro wear.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>    GL4 oil is better for "yellow metal" gears but this is a fairly minor
>>>    consideration in comparison to better lubrication for the diff portion
>>>    of the ZF provided by the GL5 Red Line 75W90NS
>> 
>> And there is no "yellow metal" in our ZF:s, right? So GL5 would be
>> appropriate, just as the owners manual says.
>> 
>> That said, I have always used Shell Getriebeoel, which is a fully
>> synthetic GL4, but will now switch to some GL5. Might even try this RL
>> oil. :)
>> 
>> Thomas
>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>    At least this was the conclusion reached by the ferrarichat group for
>>>    use in "brand F" transaxles.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>    Jim Oddie
>>> 
>>>    -----Original Message-----
>>>    From: Corey Price <coreyjprice at gmail.com>
>>>    To: MikeLDrew <MikeLDrew at aol.com>
>>>    Cc: De Tomaso List <detomaso at poca.com>
>>>    Sent: Fri, Apr 11, 2014 9:03 pm
>>>    Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] ZF gear oil
>>> Mike,
>>> 
>>> I thought GL-4 was the recommended oil, per Lloyd's website "FAQ" section.
>> Did
>>> I miss something?
>>> 
>>> Corey
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 11, 2014, at 9:41 PM, [1]MikeLDrew at aol.com wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>   In a message dated 4/11/14 12 32 13, [2]cwhamm at frontier.com writes:
>>>> 
>>>>     Also what is the best gear oil for
>>>>     my ZF transaxle?
>>>> 
>>>>>>> This is a very important question.  I think there is a tendancy
>>>>   among many people to just grab any old gear oil and throw it in there,
>>>>   but the nature of a transaxle demands that one pays very close
>>>>   attention to the manufacturer's recommendations.  All gear oils are NOT
>>>>   created equal!
>>>>   In this case, the first thing to do is RTFM.
>>>>   The manual specifically calls for SAE 80, AP GL5
>>>>   (SAE 90 in Europe).
>>>>   7 1/2 pints of the stuff.
>>>>   While it is very easy to find SAE 80-90 gear oil, it is surprisingly
>>>>   difficult to find *GL5* gear oil, and that's the important part.  GL5
>>>>   oil has specific characteristics designed to work with the types of
>>>>   synchros that our gearboxes have, which are different from most other
>>>>   gearboxes, and definitely different from a typical differential/rear
>>>>   axle.
>>>>   If you go to most auto parts stores, there will be lots of gear oil on
>>>>   the shelf but none of it will be GL5.  The only place I have reliably
>>>>   found GL5 is NAPA auto parts; it is made by Sta-Lube/CRC.
>>>>   Here is the exact link to what you should buy:
>>>>   [3][1]http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL2473
>>>>   It is normally sold in pints or gallons; since you need 7.5 pints and
>>>>   there are 8 pints in a gallon, obviously it is to your advantage to buy
>>>>   a gallon jug.  My local NAPA store used to carry them, but I just had
>>>>   to order a jug a couple of weeks ago as they only have pints now.
>>>>   While you're at it,  you might as well buy a gear oil pump, also by
>>>>   Sta-Lube:
>>>>   [4][2]http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL4344
>>>>   Harbor Freight has a better picture of it:
>>>>   [5][3]http://www.harborfreight.com/sta-lube-gear-fluid-oil-pump-40714.ht
> ml
>>>>   Using this pump has transformed my life.  Normally filling a ZF gearbox
>>>>   is a painful experience involving a lot of spilled gear oil and
>>>>   profanity.  This turns it into a breeze.  Just put the end of the hose
>>>>   in the side of the gearbox (where it's cleverly retained), and start
>>>>   pumping until you feel silly.  When oil starts drooling out the side,
>>>>   you're done.  Let it sit for a few minutes, give a few more pumps just
>>>>   to be sure, then you're really done.
>>>>   Mike (going to change my gearbox oil tomorrow as a matter of fact....)
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> 
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>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> References
>>> 
>>>    1. mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com
>>>    2. mailto:cwhamm at frontier.com
>>>    3. [6]http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL2473
>>>    4. [7]http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL4344
>>>    5. [8]http://www.harborfreight.com/sta-lube-gear-fluid-oil-pump-40714.ht
> ml
>>>    6. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
>>>    7. [9]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>>    8. mailto:DeTomaso at poca.com
>>>    9. [10]http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
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>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Real life:   Thomas Toernblom             Email:    thomas at hax.se
>> Snail mail:  Banvallsvaegen 14            Phone:    +46 18 32 31 18
>>              S - 754 40 Uppsala, Sweden  Cellular: +46 76 209 8320
>> 
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> References
> 
>   1. http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL2473
>   2. http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL4344
>   3. http://www.harborfreight.com/sta-lube-gear-fluid-oil-pump-40714.html
>   4. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>   5. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>   6. http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL2473
>   7. http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=SL4344
>   8. http://www.harborfreight.com/sta-lube-gear-fluid-oil-pump-40714.html
>   9. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>  10. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>  11. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
>  12. http://poca.com/mailman/listinfo/detomaso_poca.com
> _______________________________________________
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