[DeTomaso] Keys

Fri Jul 19 17:37:57 EDT 2013

Stephen,

Assuming your car has original style locks you should have two very different keys. The ignition key is a thin 2 sided key and the door / trunk key is a slightly shorter one sided key. 

Gray

-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-bounces at poca.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at poca.com] On Behalf Of Tomas Gunnarsson
Sent: Friday, July 19, 2013 3:48 PM
To: steve at snclocks.com
Cc: MikeLDrew at aol.com; detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Keys

This may be of use: http://www.keys4classics.com/html/DeTomaso.html

I found that site today after seeing my local key maker. He was unable to make me a door key but he found a blank number like the one seen ni the link (AF7A). 

He made me an ignition key from an Orion blank marked FD 11. I also have a "Pantera" ignition key that's made from a Silca blank marked FO9.

Tomas

<-----Ursprungligt Meddelande----->
From: Stephen Nelson [steve at snclocks.com]
Sent: 19/7/2013 10:08:29 PM
To: MikeLDrew at aol.com; detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Keys

Keys - let's just say "it's complex".

Just put a few more miles on 5332, went to a lock shop to get some duplicate keys cut. First challenge is finding the blanks. Looked under Italy in their reference book and there are the numbers for the door and the ignition key blanks. Fine. Door key is a single-sided blank, the ignition is double sided. OK. Hmmm. So, since my double sided ignition key fits the doors I have the locksmith cut a door key blank double sided. Works in the doors when aligned properly (in other words, will only go in one way). Try it in the ignition. Won't go in all the way, but goes in most of the way.
Funny,
the original key sometimes hung up like that - so I wiggle it a bit. No go.
So, figure the wrong blank. Go and get an ignition key blank cut. Works on the doors, but only with one side up on one lock, with either side up on the other two. Go figure. But it also will not slide all the way into the ignition. So, get back the original ignition key (the only key that came with the car). It will not slide in the ignition. ARGH! It is clear at that point that the hump at the end of the key is keeping it from sliding all the way in. So, back into the key shop and have them mill off the first bump on both sides on the ignition key made from a new blank. Works a champ in the ignition but, of course, not in the doors. But the car starts - so I am much happier than I was when nothing would get the ignition to come on.
Good news, I have rebuilt 3 locks so far, now just one left to rebuild! 

Looking at the keys, the longitudinal slots on the ignition key are a sharper "V" than on the door keys. So, apparently the ridges in the door locks are worn and the narrower slots in the ignition key can slip in.
Actually, that is true of 2 of three door locks. The last one only lets the ignition keys in in one orientation. But then it works fine.

On the door keys - wider slot, so they slip into the ignition when cut double sided. So, when I am done rebuilding the ignition lock, the door keys will be the final answer. I hope. If not I can mill the slots in the ignition keys (ah the advantages of being a micro-machinist for my clock and watch hobby).

So, end of the day, Mike Drew is right - the keys are not the same. But, with worn door locks it is possible that an ignition key will slide in.
And,
vice versa, if the door keys are cut double sided they can slide into the ignition switch. Well, they slide in and will likely work when I figure out what is screwed up in the ignition switch.

Stephen Nelson

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From: MikeLDrew at aol.com [mailto:MikeLDrew at aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2013 10:36 AM
To: steve at snclocks.com; detomaso at poca.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Door Latch Rubbers and trunk security

In a message dated 7/17/13 8 28 51, steve at snclocks.com writes:

Good morning oh Pantera-knowledgeable folks. As I fix little things on
5332
I will need to figure out the best source of parts for various items.
The
first one is the gasket around the external door latches. Do the vendors
carry such items?

>>>I don't think those are available anywhere?

>Are there vendors that are best for things like OEM rubber parts and
other
vendors better for other supplies? 

>>>Everyone has their favorites. Many vendors will respond to pressure
from
cheap Pantera owners unwilling to pay top dollar for genuine stuff, and
will
offer cheap hot-rod alternatives to the genuine rubber. Many will carry
both and offer the customer the choice. Genuine rubber is expensive and
is
made in Italy. If it's important to you, ask that specific question
before
committing to buy.

>And, a second question. Is there a kit for converting the trunk latch
to
either an internal release or a keyed lock? 

>>>Uh...the stock trunk latch has a lock which is keyed to match the
doors.

>Am currently converting the door locks to match the replacement
ignition/key

>>>Won't ever happen. Panteras have two keys--a large ignition key and a
small door/trunk key. You can try until doomsday and you won't get an
ignition key to work a door/trunk lock.

The ignition key is European Ford (Capri etc.) and the door/trunk key is
Fiat. I just went through this rekeying exercise on another Pantera. I
had
a key that opened one door but not the other, and an extra tumbler.
Turns
out that there is an undocumented change, and there are two different
styles
of tumbler and two different styles of key blank. One key would go into
one
and another key would go into another. I had to go home and get a third
blank from my parts stash to get three that were of the same type, and
then
the locksmith was able to key all three to the same key and make several
copies for me.

>and trying to understand the reason for the windows slowing down about
3/4
of the way up - it looks like this is a point where the glass goes
through a
very tight fit between the front and rear channels - like the designers
meant for the glass to be precisely aligned so it could then fit into
the
back channel. Comments?

>>>Adjusting the windows is a black art. When all the internal
components
are aligned correctly, they go up and down smoothly. But enough people
have
horsed around inside their doors that it's common for that alignment to
get
goofed up, and then owners just get fed up and accept it. I suspect that
is
what you are experiencing.

It will take a concerted effort to take your door apart and loosen
everything and get it aligned properly, but it can be done....

Cheers!

Mike

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