[DeTomaso] Upgrade List

Tue Sep 18 09:18:38 EDT 2012

<<female anatomy on a Pantera,>>

Oh sure move thing up my to-do list Bill!! 

Larry (was on list) - Cleveland

-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com] On
Behalf Of Bill Lewis
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2012 7:49 PM
To: bill at incendium.com
Cc: detomaso at realbig.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Upgrade List

(I think that this post below was from Bill at Incendium)     Dear Bill,  Dude,
there are many ways to justify the money spent on your Pantera, e.g., if you
fished, hunted, golfed, traveled, chased whatever is in LasVegas, etc. after
the end of the year, you have really good memories and tall tales for your
buds, but the money spent on your car - guess what - step out into your
garage and there it is!......................................Never look back
on that money spent.  It is not "gone!"   As soon as they figure out how to
put a certain part of the female anatomy on a Pantera, it will be the
perfect project.  (Larry ??)    ----Bill

> From: Bill at Incendium.com
> To: steve at snclocks.com; fisher95020 at yahoo.com; rob at dumoulins.net; 
> michaelsavga at gmail.com; ParaPantera at aol.com
> Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2012 10:37:45 -0600
> CC: detomaso at realbig.com
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Upgrade List
> 
> Stephen,
> My story is that I bought the 1st and only Pantera I had ever seen, 
> good news and bad, but it's been great. I drove it home and put on 
> about 150 miles, then I bit the bullet, this was a 38 year old used and
abused toy.
> Upgrades that had been done were short, aluminum intake manifold, 
> Holley carb, brass window motor gears, fiberglass fender flares, and 15
foot paint.
> Safety first.
> 1) All the rubber hoses
> 2) Suspension rubber and bushings
> 3) Brakes, Willwood front and back (here is the slippery slope)
> 4) Steering Wheel
> 5) Headers and GTS mufflers
> 6) MSD ignition
> 7) New Campy clone, wheels and tires, see #3 above.
> 
> I don't have the knowledge, place or time to do the work myself so, 
> more money and B/S
> 
> Drove it about another 300 miles before winter.
> 
> What's the biggest dollar item on this car ? the 38 year old ZF ! Yes 
> it should be serviced. Rather than ship the car in November I 
> procrastinated til the end of January before shipping it to Dennis in 
> Castle Rock. Yes the ZF required the work. And here we go again, 
> another slippery slope, long story short, complete cooling system, 
> suspension, shocks, steering rack, front valance, steel chin spoiler, 
> split front & rear bumpers, 100A 1 wire alt, volt gauge, etc etal but 
> the gas tank and the engine has been serviced and or upgraded. Flew 
> down to Denver and drove it home to Calgary, what a worthwhile BLAST ! 
> This car is solid, fast, tight and a great 15 footer. I'm not sure I want
to clean the road grime off from the trip.
> 
> A short story. LOL.
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com 
> [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Nelson
> Sent: September-16-12 9:09 AM
> To: 'David D Fisher'; 'Rob Dumoulin'; 'michael at michaelshortt.com'; 
> ParaPantera at aol.com
> Cc: 'pantera list'
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Upgrade List
> 
> David, Michael and Ron - thank you for your thoughts and experience on 
> making these cares reliable.
> 
>  
> 
> My goal is to buy a car that has already been made very drivable - so 
> I am in effect looking for a punch list of the things that will likely 
> need rectified to make the car reliable.  As Michael points out, it 
> can get expensive in a hurry taking care of the niggling things that 
> can strand one
> - and, unfortunately, resale prices don't cover all the really 
> valuable work that enthusiasts do to make their cars better.
> 
>  
> 
> Reminds me of the old question - is a restored car more valuable than 
> an original?  While the answer obviously depends on what a buyer wants 
> (and whether there is another person at the auction that will push the 
> buyer to his limit), reality is that restoring a car in the price 
> range demanded by Pantera's is typically a money loosing proposition.
> 
>  
> 
> Between your three's posts, and what I am gleaning by following this 
> forum I am beginning to understand what I want on a car that I will 
> ultimately use for long distance driving.  Having already done all the 
> work myself to make my '69 XKE as bullet proof as I can, I really want 
> to find a car that has already been upgraded, and has covered at least 
> most of the issues raised by you gentlemen.
> 
>  
> 
> One question covering an item not on the lists - Does one typically 
> need to replace the original coolant pipes with stainless?  I would 
> think they could be corroded as well as have significant build-up in them?
> 
>  
> 
> After compiling what I have seen so far, this is my list:
> 
>  
> 
> 
> Fuel System
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Manifold and carburetor
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Fuel hoses
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Vacuum hoses
> 
> 
> Engine belts
> 
> 
> Brakes
> 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Rebuild brake system
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Upgrade front rotors to Mustang vented
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Stainless brake lines
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Emergency brake cable
> 
> 
> Clutch slave and flush system
> 
> 
> Electrical
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Replace fuse box
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Replace ignition switch
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Update alternator
> 
> 
>  
> 
> If leaving amp meter - add a circuit breaker
> 
> 
>  
> 
> MSD Distributor
> 
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Tach adaptor
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Wires and plugs
> 
> 
> Door seals
> 
> 
> Suspension
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Suspension bushings.
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Shocks
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Rear suspension lower pivots - often seized
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Rebuild steering rack
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Rear axle bearings
> 
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Billet axles
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Look at wheel offset and make sure not causing steering challenge
> 
> 
> Cooling
> 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Aluminum radiator and new fans
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Heater core boil or replace
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Radiator cap
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Flush cooling system
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Radiator temperature switch
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Radiator hoses
> 
> 
> Tranny/Differential
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Second gear syncro
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Higher final drive ratio
> 
> 
> Deck lid shocks
> 
> 
> A/C core
> 
> 
> Recover seats
> 
>  
> 
> Again, thank you all for taking the time to give me your thoughts!
> 
>  
> 
> Stephen Nelson
> 
>  
> 
> SNClocks.com <http://www.snclocks.com/>
> 
> Click here for our new
> <http://www.snclocks.com/TheRestofourWorld/Hammered-Dulcimers/About-St
> eves-D ulcimers/19824807_4sHGgj#1558377542_LKmkrT7> Hammered Dulcimers 
> website
> 
> Click here for my new blog <http://www.perfectoldman.com/>  on finding 
> happiness in retirement
> 
>  
> 
>   _____
> 
> From: David D Fisher [mailto:fisher95020 at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 9:40 PM
> To: Rob Dumoulin; Stephen Nelson
> Cc: pantera list
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Upgrade List
> 
>  
> 
> Stephen,
> 
>  
> 
> I am an owner for just under a year now and bought a pretty solid 
> looking car, but one that the previous owner had done everything 
> possible to not spend money on. Still,  it was relatively rust free, ok
paint and the older
> 2 pod dash that I was after.   
> 
>  
> 
> Since then my priority is mechanical first, beauty second.  I tend to 
> do more than I really need to to just drive it, but here's my experience:
> 
>  
> 
> Before the list scares you off,  I should say that I drove the car 
> home for 300 miles, so it was driveable, but it was 40 years old 
> drivable, was not reliabe, and not tight.
> 
>  
> 
> Lastly,  all said and done,  I feel the cars are significantly
undervalued.
> I was comparing this to a Ferrari of the same kind of money and IMHO 
> the Pantera is much more car.
> 
>  
> 
> What I have done:
> 
>  
> 
> 1) Replace everything rubber - hoses, belt, brake piston seals, tires 
> door seals, etc.
> 
> 2) Rebuild brakes - stock brakes aren't bad for street use once 
> rebuilt
> 
> 3) Replace e brake cable
> 
> 4) Replace fuel and vacumm lines
> 
> 5) Replace suspection bushing
> 
> 6) Replace shocks if not done already
> 
> 7) Replace clutch slave and flush out the old fluid
> 
> 8) Update alternator
> 
> 9) New rad if not already aluminium
> 
> 10) Replace rad caps and flush system
> 
> 10) New rad temp switch
> 
> 11) Steering rack rebuild (not done yet on my car)
> 
> 12)  2nd gear syncro - not done but needed
> 
> 13) Rear suspension lower bushing up uprights seized.
> 
> 14) Rear axle bearing shot - I went to billet axles, but only because 
> I plan for more power later.  1 bearing was spun
> 
> 15) I already had MSD, but the distributor advance to seized and the 
> tach adaptor fried
> 
> 16) Door locks gummy
> 
> 17) Replace deck lid shocks
> 
> 18) Replace ignition lock
> 
> 19) New A/C condensor core
> 
> 20) Recharge A/C  (already converted to R134)
> 
> 21) Repair split heater core
> 
> 22) Motor rebuild
> 
>  
> 
> Optional:
> 
> 1) Upgrade front rotors to Mustang vented
> 
> 2) Upgrade rear axles
> 
> 3) Recover seats
> 
> 4) Small headlight kit
> 
> 5) Big brakes
> 
> 6) etc, etc, etc
> 
>  
> 
> Hope this helps,
> 
>  
> 
> David
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> From: Rob Dumoulin <rob at dumoulins.net>
> To: Stephen Nelson <steve at snclocks.com>
> Cc: pantera list <detomaso at realbig.com>
> Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 6:45 PM
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Upgrade List
> 
> 
> Stephen, I posed the same topic a while ago and got a rather cold
response.
> It does seem that there are an abundance of Pantera information spread 
> around everywhere and some owners have done a great job documenting 
> their projects. Good as it may be, it does not provide discussions 
> around the pros and cons of what was done and very few lessons 
> learned. I think a structured Pantera Wiki site would allow this 
> community to define some topics and document equipment options and 
> lessons learned in an attempt to build the ultimate Pantera for:
> 
>   - Reliable Daily Driver
>   - Show Car
>   - Open Road Racer
>   - SCCA Track Car
>   - Bone Stock replacement
>   - Restomod
> 
> For topics like flaw with and mods to:
> 
>   - Cooling System
>   - Electrical (ignition, lights, charging, accessories, fuse box, dash,
>   alternator)
>   - Engine
>   - Gauges
>   - Hubs
>   - Brakes
>   - ZF
>   - Lights
>   - A/C
>   - Heater
> 
> 
> On Sat, Sep 15, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Stephen Nelson <steve at snclocks.com>
wrote:
> 
> > This forum is a great way to start to learn about the finer points 
> > of owning and maintaining a Pantera.  Oh, and about upgrading or 
> > updating these fantastic cars.  So, wanting to learn more about what 
> > should be done to bring a car up to current "standards", I did a 
> > search for upgrade, update, and modification.  And figured out that 
> > there is a lot written about these cars tail lights.
> >
> >
> >
> > Is anyone aware of a previous post or string of posts that covers 
> > what needs to be done to make these cars all they can be today?  I 
> > suppose the list would need to start off with items that really need 
> > done to keep the car from having a major oops - like the issue with 
> > half shafts.  And progress from there to the "wanna-have" items.
> >
> >
> >
> > If there isn't such a list - perhaps some of you more knowledgeable 
> > types could start a listing for us 
> > wanna-have-a-Pantera-that-runs-great
> types.
> >
> >
> >
> > Stephen Nelson
> >
> >
> >
> > SNClocks.com <http://snclocks.com/>  <http://www.snclocks.com/>
> >
> > Click here for our new
> > <
> >
> http://www.snclocks.com/TheRestofourWorld/Hammered-Dulcimers/About-Ste
> ves-D
> > ulcimers/19824807_4sHGgj#1558377542_LKmkrT7> Hammered Dulcimers 
> > website
> >
> > Click here for my <http://www.perfectoldman.com/>  new blog on 
> > finding happiness in retirement
> >
> >
> >
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> >
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> 
> 
> --
> Rob DuMoulin
> 904.476.8744
> rob at dumoulins.net
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