[DeTomaso] Upgrade List

Sun Sep 16 12:14:22 EDT 2012

See below
On Sep 16, 2012 11:09 AM, "Stephen Nelson" <steve at snclocks.com> wrote:
>
> David, Michael and Ron – thank you for your thoughts and experience on
making these cares reliable.
>
>
>
> My goal is to buy a car that has already been made very drivable – so I
am in effect looking for a punch list of the things that will likely need
rectified to make the car reliable.  As Michael points out, it can get
expensive in a hurry taking care of the niggling things that can strand one
– and, unfortunately, resale prices don’t cover all the really valuable
work that enthusiasts do to make their cars better.
>
>
>
> Reminds me of the old question – is a restored car more valuable than an
original?  While the answer obviously depends on what a buyer wants (and
whether there is another person at the auction that will push the buyer to
his limit), reality is that restoring a car in the price range demanded by
Pantera’s is typically a money loosing proposition.
>
>
>
> Between your three’s posts, and what I am gleaning by following this
forum I am beginning to understand what I want on a car that I will
ultimately use for long distance driving.  Having already done all the work
myself to make my ’69 XKE as bullet proof as I can, I really want to find a
car that has already been upgraded, and has covered at least most of the
issues raised by you gentlemen.
>
>
>
> One question covering an item not on the lists - Does one typically need
to replace the original coolant pipes with stainless?  I would think they
could be corroded as well as have significant build-up in them?
>
>
>
> After compiling what I have seen so far, this is my list:
>
>
>
> Fuel System
>
>
Clean it, new filter, see what happens.

>
> Manifold and carburetor
>
If original, replace.
>
> Fuel hoses
>
Replace
>
> Vacuum hoses

Replace
>
> Engine belts

Replace and carry spares
>
> Brakes
>
Refurbish
>
>
>
> Rebuild brake system
>
Yes
>
> Upgrade front rotors to Mustang vented
>
Why?

Wait to see how yours work, if you are eventually vetting bigger wheels,
then at that time, buy bigger brakes.
>
> Stainless brake lines
>
>  yes
>
> Emergency brake cable

Does the old one work? Mine does.
>
> Clutch slave and flush system
>

Yes

> Electrical
>
>
>
> Replace fuse box
>
>  yes
>
> Replace ignition switch
>
>  if it doesn't work, for way less money, I have a push button starter.
And if you're belted up, you can't reach the stock ignition switch.
>
> Update alternator
>
>  if needed, see what you got.
>
> If leaving amp meter - add a circuit breaker
>
>  sure
>
> MSD Distributor
>
>  yes
>
>
>
> Tach adaptor
>
>  yes
>
> Wires and plugs
>
> Door seals

If needed
>
> Suspension
>
>
>
> Suspension bushings.
>
>  yes
>
> Shocks
>
>  if yours are bad, you can spend a middle amount to and obscene amount
here.
>
> Rear suspension lower pivots - often seized
>
>  nah
>
> Rebuild steering rack
>
>  if needed,
>
> Rear axle bearings
>
>  if needed
>
>
>
> Billet axles
>
>  no!
>
> Look at wheel offset and make sure not causing steering challenge
>
> Cooling
>
>
>
>
>
> Aluminum radiator and new fans
>
>  no, a cleaned stock unit or thick Hall brass is better, use AL if you
accept they are throw away units.
>
> Heater core boil or replace
>
>  what heater?
>
> Radiator cap
>
>  yes
>
> Flush cooling system
>
>  yes

1 bottle of water wetter
1 gallon of 100% peak
2 gallons of distilled water

>
> Radiator temperature switch
>
>  sure
>
> Radiator hoses
>
> Tranny/Differential
>
>
>
> Second gear syncro
>
>  if needed
>
> Higher final drive ratio

Why unless you plan on OR events
or driving long distances for 20,000 a year. Do the math, the gas savings
versus the $4,000 cost.
>
> Deck lid shocks

It they won't stay up
>
> A/C core

If it doesn't work
>
> Recover seats
>
>  ok

Michael Shortt
>
> Again, thank you all for taking the time to give me your thoughts!
>
>
>
> Stephen Nelson
>
>
>
> SNClocks.com
>
> Click here for our new Hammered Dulcimers website
>
> Click here for my new blog on finding happiness in retirement
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: David D Fisher [mailto:fisher95020 at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 9:40 PM
> To: Rob Dumoulin; Stephen Nelson
> Cc: pantera list
>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Upgrade List
>
>
>
> Stephen,
>
>
>
> I am an owner for just under a year now and bought a pretty solid looking
car, but one that the previous owner had done everything possible to not
spend money on. Still,  it was relatively rust free, ok paint and the older
2 pod dash that I was after.
>
>
>
> Since then my priority is mechanical first, beauty second.  I tend to do
more than I really need to to just drive it, but here's my experience:
>
>
>
> Before the list scares you off,  I should say that I drove the car home
for 300 miles, so it was driveable, but it was 40 years old drivable, was
not reliabe, and not tight.
>
>
>
> Lastly,  all said and done,  I feel the cars are significantly
undervalued.  I was comparing this to a Ferrari of the same kind of money
and IMHO the Pantera is much more car.
>
>
>
> What I have done:
>
>
>
> 1) Replace everything rubber - hoses, belt, brake piston seals, tires
door seals, etc.
>
> 2) Rebuild brakes - stock brakes aren't bad for street use once rebuilt
>
> 3) Replace e brake cable
>
> 4) Replace fuel and vacumm lines
>
> 5) Replace suspection bushing
>
> 6) Replace shocks if not done already
>
> 7) Replace clutch slave and flush out the old fluid
>
> 8) Update alternator
>
> 9) New rad if not already aluminium
>
> 10) Replace rad caps and flush system
>
> 10) New rad temp switch
>
> 11) Steering rack rebuild (not done yet on my car)
>
> 12)  2nd gear syncro - not done but needed
>
> 13) Rear suspension lower bushing up uprights seized.
>
> 14) Rear axle bearing shot - I went to billet axles, but only because I
plan for more power later.  1 bearing was spun
>
> 15) I already had MSD, but the distributor advance to seized and the tach
adaptor fried
>
> 16) Door locks gummy
>
> 17) Replace deck lid shocks
>
> 18) Replace ignition lock
>
> 19) New A/C condensor core
>
> 20) Recharge A/C  (already converted to R134)
>
> 21) Repair split heater core
>
> 22) Motor rebuild
>
>
>
> Optional:
>
> 1) Upgrade front rotors to Mustang vented
>
> 2) Upgrade rear axles
>
> 3) Recover seats
>
> 4) Small headlight kit
>
> 5) Big brakes
>
> 6) etc, etc, etc
>
>
>
> Hope this helps,
>
>
>
> David
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Rob Dumoulin <rob at dumoulins.net>
>
> To: Stephen Nelson <steve at snclocks.com>
> Cc: pantera list <detomaso at realbig.com>
> Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 6:45 PM
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Upgrade List
>
>
> Stephen, I posed the same topic a while ago and got a rather cold
response.
> It does seem that there are an abundance of Pantera information spread
> around everywhere and some owners have done a great job documenting their
> projects. Good as it may be, it does not provide discussions around the
> pros and cons of what was done and very few lessons learned. I think a
> structured Pantera Wiki site would allow this community to define some
> topics and document equipment options and lessons learned in an attempt to
> build the ultimate Pantera for:
>
>   - Reliable Daily Driver
>   - Show Car
>   - Open Road Racer
>   - SCCA Track Car
>   - Bone Stock replacement
>   - Restomod
>
> For topics like flaw with and mods to:
>
>   - Cooling System
>   - Electrical (ignition, lights, charging, accessories, fuse box, dash,
>   alternator)
>   - Engine
>   - Gauges
>   - Hubs
>   - Brakes
>   - ZF
>   - Lights
>   - A/C
>   - Heater
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 15, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Stephen Nelson <steve at snclocks.com>
wrote:
>
> > This forum is a great way to start to learn about the finer points of
> > owning
> > and maintaining a Pantera.  Oh, and about upgrading or updating these
> > fantastic cars.  So, wanting to learn more about what should be done to
> > bring a car up to current "standards", I did a search for upgrade,
update,
> > and modification.  And figured out that there is a lot written about
these
> > cars tail lights.
> >
> >
> >
> > Is anyone aware of a previous post or string of posts that covers what
> > needs
> > to be done to make these cars all they can be today?  I suppose the list
> > would need to start off with items that really need done to keep the car
> > from having a major oops - like the issue with half shafts.  And
progress
> > from there to the "wanna-have" items.
> >
> >
> >
> > If there isn't such a list - perhaps some of you more knowledgeable
types
> > could start a listing for us wanna-have-a-Pantera-that-runs-great types.
> >
> >
> >
> > Stephen Nelson
> >
> >
> >
> > SNClocks.com <http://www.snclocks.com/>
> >
> > Click here for our new
> > <
> >
http://www.snclocks.com/TheRestofourWorld/Hammered-Dulcimers/About-Steves-D
> > ulcimers/19824807_4sHGgj#1558377542_LKmkrT7> Hammered Dulcimers website
> >
> > Click here for my <http://www.perfectoldman.com/>  new blog on finding
> > happiness in retirement
> >
> >
> >
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> >
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>
>
>
> --
> Rob DuMoulin
> 904.476.8744
> rob at dumoulins.net
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