[DeTomaso] ZF Mounted Inboard Brakes

Tue Jun 5 19:26:35 EDT 2012

Dear Boyd,

              I believe that the inboard brakes were fabricated by Ted
Mitchell, who also does headlight conversions.  I believe that he has a
website:  Vader Racing (or something like that).

             Regarding the aluminum DeTomaso valve covers, you might find
some at Hall Pantera.  They come up on eBay from time to time and I bought a
pre owned pair from the Byers Brothers years ago.   They're around, but you
have to scare them up.

                         Warmest regards, Chuck Engles

-----Original Message-----
From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com] On
Behalf Of boyd casey
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2012 6:11 PM
To: Will Kooiman
Cc: Tomas Gunnarsson; De Tomaso List
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] ZF Mounted Inboard Brakes

I can't remember the name of the vendor. They made cats eye conversions as
well as a few other items. One of their big ticket items was an inboard
brake setup. Does anyone remember the name of the vendor?
Boyd

On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 5:21 PM, Will Kooiman <will.kooiman at gmail.com> wrote:

> I also wonder if outboard brakes benefit from direct contact with the 
> wheels.  There has to be some heat sink effect going on there.  You 
> wouldn't benefit nearly as much mounted next to a hot ZF.
>
> I used to own a 93 Mustang Cobra.  They had wheels with louvers cast 
> in them.  The louvers worked like little fans sucking air away from 
> the brakes.  At least that was the theory.
>
> On Jun 5, 2012, at 4:09 PM, Tomas Gunnarsson wrote:
>
> > 116 series Alfa Romeos have inboard rear brakes. This is on a front
> engine,
> > lighter and less powerful car than the Pantera. When brake cooling
> becomes
> > an issue the first major mod is to adapt vented rotors in the stock 
> > position. The stock rotors are around 250 mm in dia BTW. Next step 
> > is
> moving
> > the rotors to the wheels where cool air is readily available and 
> > rotor
> size
> > is by all practical means unlimited. Kinda the opposite of what was 
> > done here. This seems more like a show car modification than a track 
> > car improvement.
> >
> > Tomas
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com
> > [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com]On Behalf Of 
> > michael at michaelshortt.com
> > Sent: den 5 juni 2012 22:16
> > To: Julian Kift
> > Cc: asajay at asajay.com; De Tomaso List
> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] ZF Mounted Inboard Brakes
> >
> >
> > IMHO it's not a modification with any real advantage, lots of work 
> > and expense, damage to to the ZF, and a much worse rotor cooling issue.
> >
> > The advantages in a 100% Sports Racing car are moving the mass 
> > closer to center, and for endurance cars, a much faster pad change.
> >
> > But racing cars care about weight, to really be this anal about 
> > weight,
> you
> > should also lose the passenger seat, use an AL racing shell for the
> driver,
> > remove the radio, the A/C, the carpet, the door panels, replace the 
> > glass with Lexan, the headliner, use a 50% less heavy gel cell 
> > battery, no bumpers, have CF doors, hood, deck lid,
> and
> > an AL block.
> >
> > Most of which would be more beneficial that having inboard brakes.
> >
> > But if you have unlimited money and want to impress other Pantera 
> > owners
> (
> > since we're going to be the only ones to know the difference ), it 
> > would
> be
> > neat to see what was fabricated.
> >
> > Michael Shortt
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Jun 5, 2012 at 3:55 PM, Julian Kift 
> > <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> IIRC it requires some modifications by way of machining or welding 
> >> to
> the
> >> ZF case, which maybe a deterent to many.
> >>
> >> Julian
> >>
> >>
> >>> Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 12:37:33 -0700
> >>> From: asajay at asajay.com
> >>> To: detomaso at realbig.com
> >>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] ZF Mounted Inboard Brakes
> >>>
> >>> Yes, Ted Mitchell showed this off in the Ballroom of a past Las 
> >>> Vegas Fun Rally some years ago. I have photos of it somewhere. I 
> >>> don't think it turned into a sought after mod.
> >>>
> >>> Asa Jay
> >>>
> >>> Quoting The DeTomaso Registry Guy <detomasoregistry at gmail.com>:
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> The other day I was asked to post photos of a cable shifter for 
> >>>> our
> > ZF.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Then Saturday I took a sporty drive thru the mountains in a 
> >>>> vintage
> >> Jag.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> These two things reminded me of the topic of inboard brakes, a la
> >> Jaguar. I
> >>>> remembered
> >>>>
> >>>> seeing a ZF with the brake rotor assembly mounted on the ZF, so I
> >> started
> >>>> searching for photos.
> >>>>
> >>>> I think this was Ted Mitchell's work, not sure.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ZF mounted brakes has been discussed some time ago, but in 
> >>>> searching
> >> the
> >>>> archives
> >>>>
> >>>> I could not find the thread.
> >>>>
> >>>> I guess the archives search function still sucks, I even used a
> >> google-based
> >>>> deep mine
> >>>>
> >>>> search technique without success. Anyway.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> One advantage of this design is that it moves the rear brake 
> >>>> weight
> >> from the
> >>>> un-sprung
> >>>>
> >>>> side of the equation to the sprung side.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> One disadvantage is that it adds heat to the ZF, it is also a bit 
> >>>> complicated.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> While adding vintage photos to the DeTomaso Registry, I stumbled
> > across
> >>>> photos of a so-equipped
> >>>>
> >>>> ZF. I'm adding these photos to the ever-growing section on our 
> >>>> beloved
> >> ZF,
> >>>> find the link under the welcome photo.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.provamo.com/Members/ProvaMoMemMain.asp
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Chuck Melton
> >>>>
> >>>> (The Registry Guy)
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
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> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
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> >>> ******************************************************
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> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Michael L. Shortt
> > Savannah, Georgia
> > www.michaelshortt.com
> > michael at michaelshortt.com
> > 912-232-9390
> >
> >
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