[DeTomaso] harness bar.

Tue Sep 14 20:46:44 EDT 2010

Good Grief of all people to mess that up

SCENE, not SEEN

Michael

On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 8:45 PM, michael at michaelshortt.com <
michaelsavga at gmail.com> wrote:

> I would absolutely LOVE to go into court and take that ticket to trial.
>
> So Officer, you're saying that a belt recognized by IHRA, NHRA, NASCAR,
> INDY CARS, Formula One, SCCA, VRDA, etc. is good enough to protect occupants
> from crashes at over 200 mph, but isn't safe enough for the street use?
>
> Exactly what are your engineering credentials?
>
> So If I wear a SNELL 2005 helmet rather than a Wal-Mart DOT Helmet, am I
> equally breaking the law?
>
> I think for the most part, as long as we/you/us don't drive around like
> @$$holes, they give us a lot of space.
>
> I remember that seen in the movie "The Big Chill" when the stoner dude gets
> lippy with the local cops and the character played by Kevin Kline, sets him
> straight by telling him how those cops kept his house from being robbed.
>
> I go out of my way to talk to them at shows in parking lots, and wave like
> ateenager when they see me driving...cause one day
>
> ( as has happened many times ) they're gonna see me being stupid and just
> ignore it as long as I'm just a little stupid or just a 15 MPH over the
> limit.
>
> I hire many of them for off duty and security work, most are cool, a few
> are weenies, but most just want to do their kjob, go home and have a beer.
>
> None of them likes to go to court except the lawyer want to bes and they
> either don't last long or quit and go to law school.
>
> I just know if trouble comes calling, I'm calling them eventually ( guess
> it depends upon the rouble and if I want to handle it myself until they get
> there.
>
> The last time my alarm went off, I beat the cops to my house from my office
> and went room to room, cocked, locked and ready to rock.
>
> when they showed up, I was releived that somebody would have had my back if
> needed.
>
> It's hard to not envoke jealousy when we have these cars, live in a nice
> houses and have nice things, it's natural ( like I feel when I see some dude
> in a SL63 AMG or an Audi R8, Enzo, etc., esp if he is on wife #3 who's age
> is less than half of his, just kidding dear! ) you can either be a dick and
> disarm them by being overly nice. Overly nice will go a lot further down the
> road than being a weenie.
>
> Michael Shortt
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 8:25 PM, Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>wrote:
>
>> As far as I know, racing harnesses are -not- DOT approved for passenger
>> car use.  Has anyone ever got a ticket though?
>>
>> Asa Jay
>> Sent using Elfen Magic.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: boyd casey <boyd411 at gmail.com>
>> Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2010 20:05:41
>> To: michael frazier<red3644 at hotmail.com>
>>  Cc: <asajay at asajay.com>; <detomaso-bounces at realbig.com>; pantera list<
>> detomaso at realbig.com>
>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] harness bar.
>>
>> I have seen posts( not on this list0 that said multi point harnesses and
>> helmets were illegal on the street. Some of the posts seemed to be from
>> Australia or Europe. Does anyone know as a matter a fact are helmets or
>> harnesses illegal on the street in the USA?
>> Boyd
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 7:55 PM, michael frazier <red3644 at hotmail.com
>> >wrote:
>>
>> >  The upper side and front bars are way too close to your head due to the
>> > demensions of the cabin.  If you're in a tight harness, you might
>> > miss the front bar but will most likely still wack the top side bar in a
>> > wreck...without a helmet, that would be bad.  As for just wearing a full
>> > harness?  Well, if you look at stock seat belts in most modern cars the
>> > have a folded or doubled section that tears open to ease the
>> deceleration.
>> > You have to consider all the other safety items in new cars too.  Three
>> > inch shoulder belts will stretch too, but not as much and that will
>> leave
>> > your neck as the last elastic link in the chain if you don't have a
>> padded
>> > neck collar or HANS like device.  There is no surefire way to get around
>> > this...
>> > You pays your money and takes your chances.  You can't wear a helmet on
>> the
>> > street.  I won't put a cage in because of that.  I wear a harness
>> > because the stock belts were a joke.  I guess I'm in the middle
>> somewhere.
>> >
>> > Michael Frazier
>> > Gruppo Rompiculi Corsa
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] harness bar.
>> > > To: boyd411 at gmail.com; detomaso-bounces at realbig.com;
>> red3644 at hotmail.com
>> > > CC: detomaso at realbig.com
>> > > From: asajay at asajay.com
>> > > Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2010 23:32:17 +0000
>> >
>> > >
>> > > What kind of injuries? How is it these devices caused more injury? No
>> > padding? Need more info before making a judgment.
>> > > Sent using Elfen Magic.
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: boyd casey <boyd411 at gmail.com>
>> > > Sender: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com
>> > > Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2010 19:13:10
>> > > To: michael frazier<red3644 at hotmail.com>
>> > > Cc: pantera list<detomaso at realbig.com>
>> > > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] harness bar.
>> > >
>> > > To anyone interested I have read several articles that stated that
>> > driving a
>> > > car with a harness , or roll bar or roll cage while not wearing a
>> helmet
>> > > dramatically increased the chances of suffering serious head ,or neck
>> > > injuries . They pointed out that it was considerably inconvenient to
>> wear
>> > a
>> > > helmet while driving on the street but having a car equipped with a
>> roll
>> > > bar, roll cage or harness bar and not wearing a helmet was tantamount
>> to
>> > > inviting catastrophic head injury. The harness bar seemed to offer the
>> > least
>> > > danger while the roll cage provided the greatest danger. The article
>> > really
>> > > got my attention and got me worried about the potential dangers.
>> Anyone
>> > care
>> > > to comment on this subject? I still want to go with a roll cage
>> someday
>> > but
>> > > as I mentioned until I can do it right I want to use a harness bar so
>> I
>> > can
>> > > use a 6 point harness.
>> > >
>> > > Boyd
>> > >
>> > > On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 4:08 PM, michael frazier <red3644 at hotmail.com
>> > >wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Just for what it's worth...
>> > > > The normally used vendor bars mount the shoulder belts higher on the
>> > > > inside than the outside. No big problem, I just am aware of it
>> > sometimes
>> > > > when everything is snugged down and really tight. I have those
>> Scheel
>> > > > seats you see in some cars. They came out decades ago but are really
>> > pretty
>> > > > good seats.
>> > > > The headrests get in the way if your wearing a helmet so I took them
>> > out.
>> > > > The corner edge of the bar is now a couple of inches behind the base
>> of
>> > your
>> > > > skull
>> > > > waiting for an excuse to put a deep crease in the back of your head.
>> > Check
>> > > > that out and see how it works with your seat. The headrests go back
>> in
>> > when
>> > > > I'm
>> > > > not wearing a helmet. There are some reallt good cages out there now
>> > but I
>> > > > haven't seen one that I would feel comfortable driving without a
>> tight
>> > 4
>> > > > point harness.
>> > > > All the front cross bars are too close to my forehead. My solutions
>> > > > are...Don't put a cage in my car unless it's really a full time
>> track
>> > car.
>> > > > As for the harness bar,
>> > > > I noticed that a straight line between the 2 mounting bolts run
>> across
>> > the
>> > > > firewall just above the hump. I'm gonna make on using a thickwall
>> round
>> > bar
>> > > > with some
>> > > > simple mounts on the end. That sould put it a little lower relative
>> to
>> > the
>> > > > seatback and both shoulder belts will be level. Just stuff I notice
>> > while
>> > > > I'm dinking around
>> > > > with other things...like gussets in my control arms. :)
>> > > >
>> > > > Michael Frazier Marfa-Presidio Open Road Race 16 OCT '10 --- They
>> still
>> > > > have open slots!
>> > > > Gruppo Rompiculi Corsa
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > > Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2010 11:45:16 -0400
>> > > > > From: boyd411 at gmail.com
>> > > > > To: asajay at asajay.com
>> > > > > CC: don.thomas.cissp at gmail.com; JDeRyke at aol.com;
>> > detomaso at realbig.com
>> > > >
>> > > > > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] harness bar.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I actually want to install a roll cage. To do it right I need to
>> pull
>> > the
>> > > > > motor, trans axle and all the interior carpeting and the engine
>> hatch
>> > so
>> > > > it
>> > > > > can be modified for ease of removal (cut in half etc.) Since I
>> don't
>> > have
>> > > > > the time or opportunity to do either the roll cage or a descent
>> roll
>> > bar
>> > > > > now I want to install a harness bar as a temporary fix. I want to
>> get
>> > the
>> > > > > best harness bar I can get for the money. If I could get one of
>> the
>> > > > members
>> > > > > with a machine shop to fabricate one for me that would be great
>> and I
>> > > > would
>> > > > > prefer it immeasurable over a bar from the vendors. So if any one
>> out
>> > > > there
>> > > > > has the means and the inclination I would gladly compensate them
>> for
>> > > > their
>> > > > > efforts. I could provide photos and measurements so they could
>> > fabricate
>> > > > a
>> > > > > bar to the correct specifications.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Boyd
>> > > > >
>> > > > > P.S.
>> > > > > (Dawg thanks for you you advice and suggestion I hope someone
>> takes
>> > your
>> > > > > hint and offers to help me out)
>> > > > >
>> > > > > HBC :>)
>> > > > >
>> > > > > On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 9:10 AM, Asa Jay Laughton <
>> asajay at asajay.com
>> > >
>> > > > wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > > Yea....that's about what mine is.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Asa Jay.
>> > > > > > Sent using Elfen Magic.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > From: Don Thomas <dt at ieee.org>
>> > > > > > Sender: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com
>> > > > > > Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2010 22:12:46
>> > > > > > To: <JDeRyke at aol.com>
>> > > > > > Reply-To: don.thomas.cissp at gmail.com
>> > > > > > Cc: <detomaso at realbig.com>
>> > > > > > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] harness bar.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > 5/8" Thick ? (0.625")
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Really ?
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > JDeRyke at aol.com wrote:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Boyd, it seems the bolt spread between the shoulder harness
>> bolts
>> > > > varies
>> > > > > > a
>> > > > > > > little between Panteras. I don't use one but I installed a
>> Hall
>> > unit
>> > > > on a
>> > > > > > > '73 Pantera quite recently, and the bolts did not match up to
>> the
>> > > > > > predrilled
>> > > > > > > holes. The black painted bar is 5/8" thick x 1" wide steel bar
>> > stock
>> > > > with
>> > > > > > > bends on each end, but with some effort and a big vise, the
>> ends
>> > can
>> > > > be
>> > > > > > > cold-bent to change the spacing. So if what you get doesn't
>> fit,
>> > you
>> > > > need
>> > > > > > not slot
>> > > > > > > the holes. FWIW- J DeRyke
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>
>
>
>  --
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Michael L. Shortt
> Savannah, Georgia
> www.michaelshortt.com
> michael at michaelshortt.com
> 912-232-9390
>
>
> This email is protected by the Electronic Communications Privacy
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-- 

Michael L. Shortt
Savannah, Georgia
www.michaelshortt.com
michael at michaelshortt.com
912-232-9390

This email is protected by the Electronic Communications Privacy
Act, 18 U.S.C. Sec. 2510-2521, is confidential and may be legally
privileged.  If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified
that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this
communication is strictly prohibited.  Please reply to the sender that you
have received this message in error, then delete it.  Thank you