[DeTomaso] ZERO PC - Maxim #1: People vote their pocket book! NPC

Sun Nov 7 15:42:03 EST 2010

I don't want to make this more complicated then it already is but.
 Where do you come up with the statistic that says 40% of Americans pay no
income tax? That's the kind of statement that demands documentation.
I am a strong believer in the capitalist system and I am heavily invested in
the stock market. I don't have a problem with a corporate officer receiving
substantial compensation when they have done a good job and made the company
and share holders a fair return on their investment. What drives me crazy is
when CEO's get obscene golden parachutes for running a company into the
ground. AIG comes to mind. Back in the 70's a friend of mine worked for
eastern airlines. The company went into bankruptcy and Frank Boreman (the
astronaut) was the CEO. He raided the companies pension fund and depleted it
leaving the pilots and all the other employees with no pensions, yet Mr.
Borman walked away with several million dollars in a golden parachute. The
list of these examples is endless. If the company makes money the share
holders should make money and the corporate bigwigs should make money. If
the company loses money or worse goes broke the Board members shouldn't be
rewarded. In fact they should be required to keep a substantial amount of
their net worth in stock so if the company fails they will suffer along with
the rest of the share holders. Like wise their compensation should be tied
to increases in the stocks value in the form of stock options not by taking
huge cash payments or raiding corporate coffers or pension funds.

Boyd

On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Ken Green <kenn_green at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Guys,
>
>     Just to add one hopefully neutral point, the profits in a business are
> from two sources:
>
> 1)  the money you make for your personal labor
>
> 2)  the return on your investment.
>
>     Personally, I think the million plus a year compensation some corporate
> officers receive is totally unjustified, and a lot of people work just as
> hard and are just as smart, and make a fraction of that.  But if someone
> builds a business over many years and has a huge personal investment in it,
> I don't a problem with them benefiting from their investment.  You might
> work 20 years and not make much, and then do really well the last 10 years
> to build for retirement.
>
> Ken
>
> --- On Thu, 11/4/10, Rob Dumoulin <rob at dumoulins.net> wrote:
>
>
> From: Rob Dumoulin <rob at dumoulins.net>
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] ZERO PC - Maxim #1: People vote their pocket book!
> NPC
> To: "Larry Finch" <fresnofinches at aol.com>
> Cc: detomaso at realbig.com
> Date: Thursday, November 4, 2010, 10:16 AM
>
>
> Emotions at the door.
>
> Wow Larry.  That sure was an anti-capitalistic view on corporations. It
> sure
> sounds familiar.  As an owner of two small businesses and a business
> analyst
> consultant for many very large corporations that all of you have done
> business with, I have an opposing opinion. Based on your response, I'm
> assuming you have never run a business. Sorry if that is an incorrect
> assumption.
>
> A common fallacy that "takers" or "have not" mentalities hold is that all
> businesses should be taxed, especially ones that make lots of revenue (not
> profit, which is a difference). Running a business and paying payroll
> requires a business plan.  In that plan is how to make enough money to make
> the venture survive or hopefully grow, and keep investors interested
> (others
> or yourself if you own the business). Companies don't really pay taxes.
> Introduce unions demands and taxes and in order to meet the business plan,
> you have to raise your prices or cut your expenses. Cutting expenses
> incorrectly has the opposite effect by reducing your ability to raise
> revenue.  Raising costs in this way make US businesses not able to compete
> globally.  Like it or not, Unions have killed education quality and the US
> auto industry already.  Let the free market manage wages and let OSHA
> handle
> the safety concerns.
>
> I have often heard people cry out that companies should be taxed for moving
> jobs overseas.  Remove the existing taxes and they would have little reason
> to move jobs overseas.
>
> About to rejoin my emotions at the door.
>
> Rob
>
> On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 11:33 AM, Larry Finch <fresnofinches at aol.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Maxim #1: People vote their pocket book!
> > ----------
> >
> > Not really true.
> >
> > People vote what they 'feel' is their pocket book.
> >
> > This feeling is easily manipulated by demonizing the one Special Interest
> > that ultimately
> > DOES (and historically always has) improve the bottom line for the
> workers
> > ---- Unions.
> >
> > While at the same time martyrizing the diametrically opposed Special
> > Interest that
> > has arguably zero interest in improving the workers position if it
> > interferes in any manner
> > with the unbending goal of profit-at-any-cost ---- Corporations.
> >
> > The use of buzzwords such as higher taxes, government restrictions,
> > government regulations, Union Bosses
> > and other phrases solely designed to appeal to emotions have (sadly) been
> > shown to be very effective in
> > moving the Common Man (which is certainly most of us) to think (and vote)
> > as if he is somehow
> > protecting and improving his own position when in fact he is only
> > benefiting the corporations.
> >
> > The in-your-face examples of how true this is are sadly hidden (by
> design)
> > from most voters by the cloud of
> > buzzword phrases heaped onto us with now nearly unlimited
> > Corporation-funded advertising campaigns.
> >
> > NAFTA - Free (not Fair) Trade - outsourcing - downsizing - Pension
> Raiders
> > - part-time employment with
> > thus no benefits - privatizing -  Military Industrial Complex - tax
> > loopholes - offshore registering of Corporations -
> > S&L scandal - Wall Street Greed...........
> >
> > The evidence is obvious this all is designed to benefit Corporations,
> and
> > none of it ever "Trickles Down" to the Common Man.
> >
> > But the Common Man is easily swayed with slickly-packaged,
> > demographically-tuned appeals to his emotions.
> >
> > And if this continues there will be no Common Man left to remember what
> the
> > American Middle Class used to be.
> >
> > Larry
> >
> > P.S. - If you respond to this, try leaving your emotional, name-calling
> > rants at the door. I did.  ;-)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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