[DeTomaso] Has anyone used Marino's Offset Front Bushings toIncrease Cast
Thomas Tornblom
Thomas.Tornblom at hax.se
Thu Mar 11 11:22:53 EST 2010
Julian Kift skrev:
> Thomas,
>
> That sounds more like it from the offset bushings, +1 degree total from
> stock. I don't believe you can get the previously reported 1.5
> degress each top and bottom from them, there simply isn't sufficient
> movement fore and aft within the mounting tabs to provide that.
>
> This discussion has me curious to what I actually acheived with the dual
> mod, so I'll have to measure at some point. Certainly the a-arm mod
> provided a .75" rearward movement of the upper ball joint as I used .75"
> aluminum stock to make up the new spacer.
If the distance between the upper and lower ball joint is 12"
(guesstimate), then moving the upper joint .75" will result in a change
of about 3.6°.
So by modifying the upper A-arm, and moving the upper joint .75"
backwards, I'm looking at around +6.6° of caster, which perhaps is a bit
excessive, but I should be able to adjust it by moving the shims around.
>
> Julian
Thomas
>
> > Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:49:02 +0100
> > From: Thomas.Tornblom at hax.se
> > To: teampantera at yahoo.com
> > CC: detomaso at realbig.com
> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Has anyone used Marino's Offset Front
> Bushings toIncrease Cast
> >
> > Checking the protocol from the front end adjustment after installing the
> > offset bushings, I see that I now have a tad over +3° of caster.
> >
> > Unfortunately I don't know what it was before installing the bushings.
> >
> > I can't say I notice any increased steering effort after installing
> > these, as well as not noticing any major improvement w.r.t. tram-lining.
> >
> > I have 285/40 Yokohama AVR1:s in the front, on the factory 10" GT5 rims.
> >
> > Thomas
> >
> > Mad Dog Antenucci skrev:
> > > 6.5 to 7? its gotta be huge.
> > > you are my new hero.....obviously you didn't ready Jack or Mike's
> comments ;-)
> > >
> > > Mad Dawg Antenucci
> > > Team Pantera Racing
> > > The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing
> > > www.teampanteraracing.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>
> > > To: Jack Deryke <jderyke at aol.com>; teampantera at yahoo.com; De Tomaso
> List <detomaso at realbig.com>
> > > Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 12:21:17 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Has anyone used Marino's Offset Front
> Bushings toIncrease Cast
> > >
> > >
> > > I too notice no increased steering effort and that's on a GT5 wide
> body with 10" wheels and 275 width tires and around 6.5 to 7 degrees of
> caster. I can assure you my overall driving experience is improved by
> ~1000% as before the mod I would keep both hands firmly on the wheel
> because if it hit a pothole or seam in the asphalt it would rip the
> wheel from your hands.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > IMHO if you need to be able to turn with one finger then it's time
> for a Toyota.... just remember that one finger steering effort ain't
> gonna do shite when the accelerator pedal decides you need to be going WOT.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Julian
> > >
> > >> From: JDeRyke at aol.com
> > >> Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:41:04 -0500
> > >> To: teampantera at yahoo.com; detomaso at realbig.com
> > >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Has anyone used Marino's Offset Front
> Bushings toIncrease Cast
> > >>
> > >> In a message dated 3/10/10 9:11:52 AM, teampantera at yahoo.com writes:
> > >>
> > >>> I keep hearing about 'increased steering effort' but at 5.5
> degrees I
> > >>> don't see much increased in traffic or parking difference over 2+.
> > >>>
> > >> In vehicle steering systems, when the car is turned you actually
> lift the
> > >> whole front of the car a few thousandths of an inch. If you have
> more caster,
> > >> the height you must lift the weight is more. This weight aids the
> > >> self-centering effect and is valuable at high speeds. Most drivers
> nowadays are used
> > >> to one-finger power steering and thus the extra weight in a
> Pantera with
> > >> extra caster is noticable. Whether this bothers a driver depends
> on whether
> > >> they -A- have corrected the bad scrub radius of the stock 7" front
> wheels, and
> > >> -B- are not very strong. Going above 'some speed', the amount
> lifted is more
> > >> gradual for a given turn thus less apparent.
> > >> Worst example of caster is a road grader: they run about 15
> degrees caster
> > >> and when those things turn 90 degrees, the tires lay over almost
> onto their
> > >> sidewalls. To compensate, the steering ratio is VERY slow so the
> weight
> > >> lifted with the steering wheel is not overpowering. Chopper
> motorcycles with
> > >> raked-out forks are another; some extreme bikes will lay over the
> tire so far
> > >> they scuff the rim edge in a sharp turn.
> > >>
> > >> Generally, the wider the front tires, the more caster a car needs to
> > >> prevent tram-lining and 'hunting'. The stock Pantera's 2.5 or so
> degrees worked
> > >> fine when the cars had 185-70 x 15 front tires. FWIW- J DeRyke
> > >> _______________________________________________
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> > Real life: Thomas Törnblom Email: Thomas.Tornblom at Hax.SE
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