[DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---

Wed Aug 25 01:03:17 EDT 2010

The problem is your not working with a"MAGICAL BRICK WALL"  Then you could
talk about string theroy and the 11 dimensions and hitting the wall that
isn't really solid it all because of all the space between the sub atomic
partcles and the effects of Dark matter and that all objects in the universe
are constanly moving away from each other and accelerating as they move away
and that atomic particle make up less the 1 percent of the universe and the
rest is dark matter.
Boyd

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 8:01 PM, <wkooiman at earthlink.net> wrote:

> There's nothing magical about a "brick" wall.  The term brick wall is used
> to describe a fixed immovable wall.
>
> Immovable means when you hit the wall at 60mph, it pushes back with an
> equivalent force.
>
> If your car weighs 3,000 lbs and you hit a fixed immovable wall at 60mph,
> the damage to your car is exactly the same as if you hit a stack of bricks
> head-on that was moving towards you at 60mph - assuming the stack of bricks
> weighs 3,000 lbs.
>
> It's also exactly the same as what would happen if two identical cars hit
> head-on, with each one going 60mph.  (as proven on Myth Busters)
>
> Of course, there are many assumptions.  For instance, there's no such thing
> as an immovable wall.  It will move some, but the assumption is the movement
> is so small, we can ignore it.  Also, crumple zones, velocity (vectors), and
> so on.
>
> Keep in mind, I don't have a PhD in Physics.  I'm just stating how I think
> it would work.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Tony DiGiovanna <tonydigi at optonline.net>
> >Sent: Aug 24, 2010 6:34 PM
> >To: wkooiman at earthlink.net, 'boyd casey' <boyd411 at gmail.com>
> >Cc: 'Asa Jay Laughton' <asajay at asajay.com>, detomaso at realbig.com
> >Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---
> >
> >No.  I didn't say 120.
> >Once the brick wall is moving, it is no longer the classical fixed "brick
> wall."  It's another moving object of mass.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: wkooiman at earthlink.net [mailto:wkooiman at earthlink.net]
>  >Sent: Monday, August 23, 2010 8:35 PM
> >To: boyd casey; Tony DiGiovanna
> >Cc: Asa Jay Laughton; detomaso at realbig.com
> >Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---
> >
> >No.  (not 120mph)
> >
> >There's nothing magical about a brick wall, moving or not.  The
> assumption, though, is the brick wall is not movable, so when you hit it,
> you must absorb 60mph worth of kinetic energy.
> >
> >A head-on collision simulates hitting a brick wall.  You are forced to
> absorb all of your kinetic energy (probably 1/2 of the total).
> >
> >Remember, when you push on a wall, it pushes back with the same force.
> >
> >I'm assuming the same is true with kinetic energy.  When you hit a wall at
> 60mph, it hits you back with the same amount of energy.  It doesn't matter
> if the wall is moving or not.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >>From: boyd casey <boyd411 at gmail.com>
> >>Sent: Aug 23, 2010 6:08 PM
> >>To: Tony DiGiovanna <tonydigi at optonline.net>
> >>Cc: Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com>, detomaso at realbig.com
> >>Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---
> >>
> >>There almost as bad as those trees that are always jumping out and
> hitting
> >>drunk drivers!
> >>Boyd
> >>
> >>On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 6:50 PM, Tony DiGiovanna <tonydigi at optonline.net
> >wrote:
> >>
> >>> Depends on the Mass of the Brick wall.
> >>> If the wall is same mass as car, then yes.
> >>> If the wall is more massive than car, then worse.
> >>>
> >>> I hate when massive brick walls drive the wrong way on the Interstate.
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:
> detomaso-bounces at realbig.com]
> >>> On
> >>> Behalf Of Asa Jay Laughton
> >>> Sent: Monday, August 23, 2010 3:12 PM
> >>> To: detomaso at realbig.com
> >>> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---
> >>>
> >>> My stirring spoon seems to be stuck in the pot...
> >>>
> >>> So, if a brick wall were traveling at 60 MPH, and you were traveling
> >>> at 60 MPH and had a head on collision, would -that- be a collision at
> >>> 120 MPH?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Asa Jay
> >>> :)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Quoting Julian Kift <julian_kift at hotmail.com>:
> >>>
> >>> >
> >>> > A car is designed to absorb impact in a crash through a 'crush'
> >>> > zone, what you see in the two car head on are both cars deforming
> >>> > and disipating the force of the impact equally as they are designed
> >>> > to do. On the other hand a brick wall is.... well a brick wall and
> >>> > the single car has to abosrb and disipate all the energy so I would
> >>> > expect the two scenarios to be very similar in resulting damage.
> >>> >
> >>> > Try propelling two bricks (or rigid objects) at each other at 60 mph
> >>> >  and see if they react the same as a singel brick propelled at the
> >>> > wall.....
> >>> >
> >>> > Julian
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >> From: wkooiman at earthlink.net
> >>> >> To: detomaso at realbig.com
> >>> >> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2010 20:16:54 -0500
> >>> >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Slightly off topic, but a head-on collision isn't car1 speed + car2
> >>> speed.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> 60mph car head-on with 60mph car isn't like hitting a wall at
> 120mph. It
> >>> >> was proven very dramatically on myth busters.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> I believe it's more complicated than that. It's has to do with the
> total
> >>> >> force. Car1 speed * car1 weight + car2 speed * car2 weight = total
> >>> force.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Force applied to car1 = total force/car1 weight.
> >>> >> Force applied to car2 = total force/car2 weight.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> It they're both going 60mph and they're both the same weight, it's
> just
> >>> like
> >>> >> they both hit a wall going 60mph. (assuming they head dead-on,
> glancing
> >>> >> blows change everything)
> >>> >>
> >>> >> If car1 is 3,000 lbs and car2 is 30,000 lbs (big rig), car1 is going
> to
> >>> be
> >>> >> much worse than head-on, and the 18-wheeler will have much less
> damage.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> I just made up those formulas, but I bet they're correct or at least
> >>> close.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> BTW, the wheel that went through the windshield was probably going
> >>> >> effectively 120mph, simply because the windshield wouldn't have
> slowed
> >>> the
> >>> >> tire down much at all.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> -----Original Message-----
> >>> >> From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:
> detomaso-bounces at realbig.com
> >>> ]
> >>> On
> >>> >> Behalf Of boyd casey
> >>> >> Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 7:11 PM
> >>> >> To: Art Stephens
> >>> >> Cc: JDeRyke at aol.com; detomaso at realbig.com
> >>> >> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---
> >>> >>
> >>> >> I have heard of several incidents where wheels came off of vehicles
> and
> >>> the
> >>> >> vehicle that lost the wheel did ok but the errant wheel killed the
> >>> driver
> >>> of
> >>> >> the car it hit. This has happened more then once in recent memory.
> The
> >>> one I
> >>> >> remember more clearly the wheel cam e off a car on an interstate and
> >>> crossed
> >>> >> the median. As you know the speed in a head on is car +car b + speed
> of
> >>> >> impact so a car traveling at 60 mph and a loose wheel traveling at
> 60
> >>> mph
> >>> >> and bouncing through the windshield and landing smack in someones
> lap at
> >>> 120
> >>> >> mph effective speed, it's not a pretty picture!. When I was in
> college
> >>> >> (Loyola in New Orleans) I was driving a VW "Super Bug" from my
> fathers
> >>> Ford
> >>> >> dealerships used car lot when I noticed a VW wheel Passing me on the
> >>> left!
> >>> >> The left rear wheel came off and the next thing I knew I was sliding
> to
> >>> a
> >>> >> stop and the wheel was making great time on it's own! Luckily it
> didn't
> >>> hit
> >>> >> anyone. I was always having problems with the cars that I was given
> to
> >>> drive
> >>> >> from the cheapest used car inventory. And every time I had a problem
> I
> >>> got
> >>> >> downgraded to an even cheaper car until finally I was relegated to
> the
> >>> >> status of pedestrian!
> >>> >> Boyd
> >>> >>
> >>> >> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 6:43 PM, Art Stephens
> >>> >> <artstephens at verizon.net>wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> > When I crashed my car, one of the rear wheels with broken upright,
> >>> half
> >>> >> > shaft and disc brake assembly attached, was found days later in a
> >>> gully
> >>> >> > about a quarter mile past the car!
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > ----- Original Message -----
> >>> >> > From: <JDeRyke at aol.com>
> >>> >> > To: <detomaso at realbig.com>
> >>> >> > Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 12:15 PM
> >>> >> > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] speaking of wheels falling off---
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > > I've also had a 'memorable' experience with OTHER PEOPLE'S
> wheels
> >>> >> falling
> >>> >> > > off. Commuting to work one morning in N CA in my modified
> Corvair, a
> >>> >> > > cement
> >>> >> > > pumper truck on its way to a job site broke a rear axle flange
> off,
> >>> >> > > freeing a
> >>> >> > > gigantic 'flotation' tire, wheel & brake drum at 50 mph on the
> >>> freeway.
> >>> >> > He
> >>> >> > > was some ways behind me and I saw the accident in my mirrors,
> but as
> >>> >> race
> >>> >> > > announcers say, in heavy traffic 'I had nowhere to go' except to
> >>> lean
> >>> >> > > away.
> >>> >> > > The 250-lb assembly bounced off guard rails and hit my drivers
> door
> >>> a
> >>> >> > > glancing
> >>> >> > > blow that knocked the 2500-lb car sideways half a lane, in spite
> of
> >>> the
> >>> >> > > traction from the same size tires I run on the Pantera. The
> wheel
> >>> >> finally
> >>> >> > > stopped in the median-strip Oleander bushes. Lucky me- I was the
> >>> only
> >>> >> car
> >>> >> > > it hit!
> >>> >> > > The dent in my car was a foot deep but luckily was confined only
> to
> >>> the
> >>> >> > > door.
> >>> >> > > A gigantic traffic jam occurred between my banged up car and the
> >>> >> concrete
> >>> >> > > truck tipped at an angle across 2 lanes. Once he saw I wasn't
> hurt
> >>> or
> >>> >> > > angry,
> >>> >> > > the truck driver (also the business owner!) was very apologetic
> but
> >>> was
> >>> >> > > MUCH
> >>> >> > > more worried about the full load of concrete he was to have
> >>> processed,
> >>> >> > > rapidly setting up behind us in a second truck (pre-cell phone
> >>> days).
> >>> 2
> >>> >> > > hrs
> >>> >> > > later I drove the beat up car into work and got no crap about
> being
> >>> >> late.
> >>> >> > > His
> >>> >> > > business insurance bought me a new door and a full paint job.
> FWIW-
> >>> J
> >>> >> > > DeRyke
> >>> >> > > _______________________________________________
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> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
> >>> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> >> ----
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >
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> >>> >> > 23:35:00
> >>> >> >
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> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
> >>> ******************************************************
> >>> http://www.racingagainstautism.com
> >>> http://www.teampanteraracing.com
> >>>
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