[DeTomaso] Torque question

Tue Aug 24 19:08:25 EDT 2010

Dear Chuck,
Thanks for you informative e-mail. I was at the wheel repair company this
afternoon picking up my repaired wheel and the owner of the company ( who
was a very nice young entrepreneur) explained the Hub centric adapter rings
and said he could make me four to match my wheels to my hubs which are
apparently only off by a few MM. So I am going to see him this week. My
replacement parts came yesterday and I picked up my wheel at lunch time and
I was able to get my wheel hub / bearing assembly and the CV joint
reassembled this afternoon so I should have the car completely back together
tomorrow.
Boyd

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 6:42 PM, Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net> wrote:

> Dear Boyd,
>
>
>             I don't know if this will answer your question, but here goes.
> One set of wheels is Etoile and work fine, but they were not hub centric.
> IIRC, Mike Drew clued me to a company that makes any size plastic sizer
> thingee to fit the wheel center to make it hub centric.  I had a set made
> and they make taking the wheels off and on easier.  There was no problem
> with the actual wheel fitment on the hub or wheel studs or with
> ride&handling.
>
>            The other car is an old BMW that now wears M3 wheels.  The
> fronts are aftermarket and the rears are true M wheels.  The darn thing had
> a vibration that would not go away until my brother gave me a pair of the
> same plastic sizer thingees to use in the front aftermarket "M" wheels.  He
> claimed that they worked on his car with the same wheel set up.  He was
> right.  The front vibration went away.  He told me that they needed the
> thingees in the situation of "new" M wheels on an old BMW hub.   It worked.
>
>             So based on my limited experience, if all you need to make your
> wheels hub centric is a set of the plastic thingees, then they're cheap and
> they may work with a lot less expense than the new set of $500 centers.....
> Good luck.
>
>
>                       Warmest regards,  Chuck Engles
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: detomaso-bounces at realbig.com [mailto:detomaso-bounces at realbig.com]
> On
> Behalf Of boyd casey
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 11:18 AM
> To: Julian Kift
> Cc: Jack Deryke; De Tomaso List
> Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Torque question
>
> I am still trying to get a straight answer to that question (hub centric vs
> lug centric) The vendor said to me "around the time we made your wheels we
> were transitioning from lug centric to hub centric construction. I need to
> go back and check the records on yours. If they are "Lug centric" I can
> supply you with adapter rings to make them "Hub centric". So that answer
> leads me to believe that they are "Lug centric' When I pick up my wheel
> from
> the repair shop I am going to compare the back of the wheel to the hub and
> see if they are hub centric. My wheels are three piece so I can (possibly )
> have my wheel centers reworked to be hub centric , or my hubs or bite the
> bullet and get four  new centers that are hub centric at $500 ea. What are
> your thoughts on adapter rings to make lug centric wheels hub centric? What
> should I do differently if the wheels are in fact Lug centric? Did you see
> my answer about the studs? they are not off the shelf Pantera parts they
> are
> 12mm x 1.75" 10.9 steel  , and 12mm x 1.5 rh thread. And the lug pattern is
> the same as stock  Panteras 4 x 114.3, 4.5 lug diameter. The 1.75" long
> studs are also long enough to provide more then adequate thread engagement.
> Boyd
>
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 12:00 PM, Julian Kift
> <julian_kift at hotmail.com>wrote:
>
> >  Boyd,
> >
> > Like you said in another thread opinion's are like assholes, so why
> expect
> > to get a singular torque answer to this question?
> >
> > Forget the torque for now, are your wheels hub centric or stud centric?
> > That question directlly relates to the duty the studs have to perform and
> > perhaps the type of stud to be used. Is the Chrysler hub assembly
> designed
> > for use in a hub centric application or stud centric in it's normal use?
> >
> > Here's Tirerack's asshole on torque settings....
> > http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=107
> >
> > Quoting a torque setting of 75 ft/lb and then saying go 100 ft/lb is a
> > little ludicrous, this is not a situation where you want to go that
> > bit extra for 'safety'.
> >
> > Julian
> >
> >
> > > Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2010 11:26:41 -0400
> > > From: boyd411 at gmail.com
> > > To: JDeRyke at aol.com
> > > CC: detomaso at realbig.com
> > > Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Torque question
> >
> > >
> > > I haven't gotten enough response to actually qualify as a "consensus" I
> > have
> > > been forwarded numerous sources that showed anywhere from 56 to 75 ft
> > lb's.
> > > That was my problem in the first place! The vendor that sold me my
> wheels
> > > said the spec was 75 ft lbs but he would go for 100 as long as it was
> by
> > > hand, and done in the proper star pattern. I have 19" x 13.5 wheels on
> > the
> > > rear and 335/30/zr19 tiers so there is quite a bit of mass in the wheel
> I
> > > would rather err on the side of safety (as long as I am no "over
> > tightening"
> > > and risking damage to the aluminum wheel or pulling out the studs. I
> > don't
> > > think I have the strength ( even with leverage) to pull a 12 mm 10.9
> stud
> > > with a head the size of a nickle through a steel hub. I found out that
> > the
> > > hub/bearing assemblies are commercial products used on passenger cars.
> > There
> > > are too many manufacturers to list but I found them by Timken bearing
> (a
> > > company and product I know and am comfortable with)
> > > And they are extremely well made and have very precise tolerances. They
> > gave
> > > the hub outer diameter as 5.72834645669291".
> > > The studs are 1.75" long, 10.9 steel, 12mm x 1.5 thread and the lug
> > pattern
> > > is 5 lug 114.3, bolt diameter 4.5. So they are the same lug pattern as
> > > Pantera, some fords and mustangs, Toyota MR2 and a handful of
> > Chrysler's..
> > > So the lugs are the same diameter and thread pattern as stock pantera
> but
> > I
> > > think they studs are longer. They are definitely not "off the shelf"
> > Pantera
> > > parts. The hub / bearing assembly comes already assembled with the
> studs
> > in
> > > Place. I can send you a photo if you would like or even better here is
> a
> > > link to a Hub /bearing assembly with the same specs ( it has a picture
> > front
> > > and back and all the dimensions and pertinent
> > > info.http://mibearings.com/wheel-bearing/513089.html#Specificaions
> > > Thanks again for all your help and support . It is* Really
> Appreciated*.
> > >
> > > Boyd
> > >
> > > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 2:51 AM, <JDeRyke at aol.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > In a message dated 8/23/10 1:46:35 PM, boyd411 at gmail.com writes:
> > > >
> > > > What is the consensus of what the lug nuts should be torqued at?
> > > >
> > > > Boyd, I forgot to ask: are they stock '71-'74 Pantera wheel studs? Or
> > > > something else?
> > > > THanks- J DeRyke
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