[DeTomaso] Wrong Slave? Re: Clutch woes in Asa's garage

[Asa Jay Laughton]

Okay, so as I'm in the garage bleeding the darn thing again for the 
upteenth time (without the benefit of Dan Courtney's Blonde, Brunette or 
Redhead), I'm standing there running Chuck's video through my head again 
and again and it suddenly struck me.... (not that this fixes my 
problem), but in his video, the piston on the slave returns -into- the 
cylinder without the benefit of the external spring being hooked up. 

So if there is an internal spring on the piston, AND the pushrod rides 
free (i.e. not attached to the piston), then how in the hell does it 
return?  If the piston returns and the pushrod is not physically 
connected to it, how is it the pushrod returns along with the piston?  
The only logical explanation for that, is the ZF Bellhousing still has 
the shaft springs on it that assists in the return of the throw out.  I 
don't have that, so mine will never do that.

Now to Mike's thinking below.  It takes a GREAT DEAL of pressure against 
the internal spring of my slave to push it in.  Of the two, the slave is 
MUCH stronger than the master.  I adjusted my lever arm counterclockwise 
one tooth from the photos posted earlier.  With no adjustment to the 
pushrod (i.e. short as possible), the spring pressure on the piston now 
pushes the pushrod against the lever arm to the point the throw out is 
-still- against the pressure plate fingers.  Even with the system bled 
of air.  So I'm thinking to myself, this is never going to change.  No 
matter what I do, the spring is always going to push the piston out as 
far as the spring pressure will push it, which is damn near to the end 
of the cylinder.

As for the snap rings, I have -both- the exterior snap rings than hold 
the cylinder in the bracket (which apparently I don't need as the darn 
thing is frozen), what I do NOT have is any internal snap ring inside 
the cylinder.  The cylinder consists of the following parts (in my case):
- Cylinder housing
- Spring, interior
- Piston (dual cup)
- Bleed screw
- Fluid feed connection
- Rubber boot

see... no snap ring on the inside and no groove either.  The kit I got 
from Napa today comes with a piston, a new rubber boot and a snap ring.  
Somebody else's comment earlier indicated there was a snap ring in the 
slave cylinder, was that incorrect?

I'm probably going to order up a new long-throw slave from Precision 
ProFormance on Tuesday.  And I might throw in a new bracket too since I 
can't seem to get this one apart.

The thing that bugs me, is that heavy spring inside the cylinder.  Is 
that right or is this just plain the wrong slave for this application?  
No other markings on it that I can find.

Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA

1971 Mach I Mustang  [ASA JAY]
1973 Pantera L 5533  [ASASCAT]
    
******************************     
http://www.asajay.com
http://www.teampanteraracing.com
  



MikeLDrew at aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 9/6/09 19 35 39, asajay at asajay.com writes:
>
>
>   
>> Chuck's video of the slave movement is -nothing- like what I am able to
>> get, especially with the external spring removed.  If I remove the
>> external spring, I can't seem to get nearly any movement of the piston
>> back into the cylinder.  I honestly am beginning to believe this is why
>> my clutch was burned up to begin with.
>>
>>     
>
> That may very well be.   You should very easily be able to compress the 
> piston in the slave cylinder by hand, feeling only moderate resistance from the 
> spring.   You did say that your slave cylinder is a Brand X unit, not a 
> Pantera part or even an aftermarket Pantera part.   It sounds to me like you 
> may have struck upon the fundamental problem.
>
> For now I'd leave the existing master alone, and go and fetch yourself a 
> replacement slave.   The long-throw units are more expensive but not THAT much 
> more expensive ($139.95 now), so I'd suggest getting one of those.   Since 
> your existing one has no snap rings (if I recall correctly?) then don't 
> forget to order those too.
>
> If your existing slave is well and truly fused into the bracket, I'd spritz 
> it with penetrant, then if necessary, use a press to pop them apart.
>
> Don't break the bracket. :>)
>
> Mike
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