[DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
Peter Kovacs
peter-kovacs at sbcglobal.net
Thu Nov 19 21:12:21 EST 2009
....and even if the mortgage originator explained the terms in detail (which rarely happened), buyers often took the plunge anyway because they were so sure that the value would go up $100k the next year and the terms of the mortgage were irrelevant compared to the profit they would make.
Peter Kovacs
209 345-6708
209 436-2000 fx
________________________________
From: "pantdino at aol.com" <pantdino at aol.com>
To: detomaso at realbig.com
Sent: Thu, November 19, 2009 4:22:48 PM
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
The key here was that the bad mortgages were being bundled and sold as AAA-rated instruments. Had they been accurately described as "worse than junk" few people / institutions would have bought them and the game would have ended because the banks would not have been able to sell them on.
The notion that "the instruments were too complex to understand" or that "no one could have done anything" is nonsense and is insulting because it assumes people are dumb enough to believe it.
-----Original Message-----
From: Mad Dog Antenucci <teampantera at yahoo.com>
To: Daniel Miller <classicmusclecars at att.net>; pantdino at aol.com; detomaso at realbig.com
Sent: Thu, Nov 19, 2009 4:12 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
Someone said a while back there was plenty of blame to go around......and I agree.....Greed drove allot of decisions.....those who were not just unqualified for the loans, but those in banks who wrote the loans, those who reviewed and approved the loan packages, the appraisers, inspecters, no regulations and Greenspan who was part of the problem during Clinton and Bush years recently said, he doesn't think he could have done anything to stop it!!!
Which takes us back to putting some of these people in jail might be a good start.
Mad Dawg Antenucci
Team Pantera Racing
The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing
www.teampanteraracing.com
From: Daniel Miller <classicmusclecars at att.net>
To: pantdino at aol.com; detomaso at realbig.com
Sent: Thu, November 19, 2009 3:58:48 PM
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
Actually even most regular mortgage bankers knew what was going to come down the pike. I know several and they told me repeatedly that it was going to be ugly when the loans all started changing terms. And they dealt with John Q. Public every day. But they still made the loans, knowing what they were doing, and made lots of money and.... well we all know the rest. Dan Miller in San Diego.
________________________________
From: "pantdino at aol.com" <pantdino at aol.com>
To: detomaso at realbig.com
Sent: Thu, November 19, 2009 1:22:50 PM
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
My feeling is that some people should go to jail.
My understanding is that the grade BBB loans made to people with no proven income were rebundled as AAA -rated instruments and sold to pension plans and investors.
In my simple-minded thinking that is fraud and someone should go to jail.
Likewise the CEOs who walked away with hundreds of millions of dollars and ruined the economy. They knew what would happen. They should do time
Jim Oddie
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Green <kenn_green at yahoo.com>
To: detomaso at realbig.com; pantdino at aol.com
Sent: Thu, Nov 19, 2009 1:00 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
Jim,
It's easy to skim a very small percentage of a huge amount of money.
The problem is that the system allowed people to place huge bets, and leave the game with others holding the bag. I doubt that the people who lost millions in the last year had any idea that their "investments" were being gambled to make or insure loans for over priced property bought by people who clearly could not afford what they were buying. The way it was explained to me is that killer is that the FED loaned money to lenders and the lenders loaned that money and exposed all of us to huge losses.
For example, I suspect that the president of Lehman Brothers had a bonus program that paid him something like $500,000,000 over the past 9 years if he met certain goals. The risks taken were not part of the formula. He conveniently ignored warnings that it wasn't a good idea to guarantee loans that were almost certain to go into default. I don't know if he broke any laws, but what he did to make huge bucks probably destroyed the financial security of millions of other Americans. I'm sure the hundreds of millions he made have helped him to live with what he did.
I suspect that what happened could be explained to the nation (and damn well should be) but the government is protecting someone. If someone else can explain what happened better, I'd appreciate it.
Ken
--- On Thu, 11/19/09, pantdino at aol.com <pantdino at aol.com> wrote:
From: pantdino at aol.com <pantdino at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
To: detomaso at realbig.com
Date: Thursday, November 19, 2009, 12:23 PM
"Down here that means that you
work for what you have"
I'm just curious-- does the "working for what you have" idea apply to the 1000 Goldman Sachs employees who each got $1 Million "bonuses" this year? Does everyone feel the work they do is so difficult and contributes so much to society that that kind of money is justified?
My feeling is that just because people have figured out a legal scam to make them rich does not mean it is OK.
Jim Oddie
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Lewis <lotus0005 at hotmail.com>
To: cuvee at sbcglobal.net; detomaso at realbig.com
Sent: Wed, Nov 18, 2009 4:22 pm
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
Curt, I am in Texas, and I only have one friend/acquaintance who admits to
eing a Democrat. We are solid middle class. Down here that means that you
ork for what you have, and don't want your money going to those who might not
hoose to work as hard.
My comment to my one Dem friend, Carl, is, why do I get hundreds of email
orwards that put down or make fun of the Dems, but so far he has only sent me
ne of the other.
I know the commentator won't let us go too far with this thread, but I am
eally confused about "who" is a Dem - they seem to be a strange crew of
edfellows. How can you be a serious Catholic and be Pro-chose?
And, as to Panteras, I have a question about wheels - 17's & 18's.
--Bill
> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 10:26:53 -0800
From: cuvee at sbcglobal.net
To: detomaso at realbig.com
Subject: [DeTomaso] Very little Pantera content
OK... first let me say I'm not looking for a pissing match! I don't care what
ide of the fence your on.
Just asking a simple question....hows Pres. B.O.s Hope and Change working for
ou?
Working or Not Working?
Now the Pantera content...Hope and Change has cut my Pantera activity down to
lim and none.
Curt
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